thegman
Mentor
Could you name a couple?
I'm pretty set on a GF670 for a 'normal' lens, but for wide, I can't find much. Does not need to be as small as the Lomo, but I want easy handheld, not an SLR or TLR.
Chriscrawfordphoto
Real Men Shoot Film.
If you want a medium format point-n-shoot, the Fuji GA645 series cameras are what you want. Used ones cost about what the lomo does, but give FAR, FAR better image quality. They're autofocus, autoexposure point-n-shoot cameras, though you can switch them to manual.
thegman
Mentor
Hi Chris,
Yes, I very much like the look of the zoom one, although, generally, I'd prefer not so much electronics, and I'm not sure I want 6x4.5 either. They do look excellent though.
aizan
Mentor
just do an ebay completed items search and set the maximum price to $450, let's say.
Archlich
Well-known
I'll buy any number of the SWC they have at $450. Is there any?
Sid836
Well-known
Dare you compare a GF670 to that Lomography crap? In any way, quality wise, size wise, functionality wise, durability, take a pick!
It has a build in light meter, far more accurate than the one LCA 120 has.
It does not need a back.
It has a lens of far better quality (and character)
It is not a zone focus one. Have you ever tried zone focusing in 35mm? How many times have you failed focusing properly? What makes you thing that zone focusing in the shallowness of the medium format would be cool?
Have in mind that missing a frame or two in 35mm is not big deal, but in 120 missing one means a lot.
You're must be kidding, or know nothing of what else one can buy for $430 or even less.
DominikDUK
Well-known
1. Failing at zone focussing a 25-20mm lens is really hard to do, even the best AF can be wrong btw. The Hassy Superwide allows you to mount a ground glass back but then you can't shoot. The normal finder is a classic viewfinder sans distance calculating or rangefinder help and it costs several hundred to thousands dollar more.
2.Regarding the build quality sorry guys but if you buy an old Folder severals things can be off not only the lens but also the focussing mechanism, the bellows, the standart, etc...
3.The lens of the LC-A well the examples of pictures I've seen so far range from crappy to good some seem to have heavy vignetting I guess wide open+ flash and some have no vignetting at all. There are also plenty of people who like vignetting.
4. The price well it is expensive, but it is also the only super wide angle camera in this price class all others are either much more expensive or not 6x6 but 6x4.5. If you like square you can get the Fuji/Voigtländer or a Mamiya 6 both are much much much more expensive.
5. It's a new analogue photoproduct rejoice instead of diss
6. I won't buy it but can imagine that plenty of people will.
7. Nikos have tried the camera yet or are you just assuming because the AE of the LCA might just be good or even as good as the GF670, on the build quality you are probably right allthough at the beginning there were plenty of QC issues with the 670 and if anything the LCA should be compared with th GF670W. Also the lens of the LCA is much wider than the GF670W's. So basically you are right they shouldn't be compared the only camera that directly compares to the LCA is the Hasselbald SWC which is no doubt much better but lacks an exposure system and costs several thousand $ more.
2.Regarding the build quality sorry guys but if you buy an old Folder severals things can be off not only the lens but also the focussing mechanism, the bellows, the standart, etc...
3.The lens of the LC-A well the examples of pictures I've seen so far range from crappy to good some seem to have heavy vignetting I guess wide open+ flash and some have no vignetting at all. There are also plenty of people who like vignetting.
4. The price well it is expensive, but it is also the only super wide angle camera in this price class all others are either much more expensive or not 6x6 but 6x4.5. If you like square you can get the Fuji/Voigtländer or a Mamiya 6 both are much much much more expensive.
5. It's a new analogue photoproduct rejoice instead of diss
6. I won't buy it but can imagine that plenty of people will.
7. Nikos have tried the camera yet or are you just assuming because the AE of the LCA might just be good or even as good as the GF670, on the build quality you are probably right allthough at the beginning there were plenty of QC issues with the 670 and if anything the LCA should be compared with th GF670W. Also the lens of the LCA is much wider than the GF670W's. So basically you are right they shouldn't be compared the only camera that directly compares to the LCA is the Hasselbald SWC which is no doubt much better but lacks an exposure system and costs several thousand $ more.
btgc
Mentor
Went through sample pictures once more. Slap me if you want but I can't like heavy vignetting for this price. For eur20 I wouldn't blink.
Sid836
Well-known
Have you ever tried a wide lens missfocused in medium format? Do you believe that just because its lens is wider it will work the same way as wide lenses in 35mm?
Well, I have the 35mm f/3.5 Sekor on my Mamiya 645 and it is not hard to focus as you say. When I do focus incorrectly in close ranges it is quite obvious even at f/8.
As for the AF, I do not own a medium format AF camera with such a wide lens, but my Nikon F100 with the ultra wides of mine has never misfocused.
The point is that there are quite many of a way higher quality than that of the LC-A 120.
You have to admit though that it is a very expensive vignetting to like it that much.
I am amazed of how much some are willing to pay for something of low quality just because of being super wide. It could be of course that I am wrong and $500 are too much for this just for me.
Don't expect matrix or spot metering on that camera. It will have the same filthy light meter of the classic LC-A with a new silicon cell. What do you really expect from a meter like that, that cannot be considered at least center weighted.
If all that matters to you is the field of view of your camera, and all you will ever need is that wideness of the LC-A, and you don't care of the quality of your photos, and you always let the camera decide on the exposure, then that camera might be more than enough for you.
But in that case, a 35mm tinny point and shoot is far better than a larger 120 (just 12 exposures per film) point and shoot camera (o.k. have zone focusing as a plus).
DominikDUK
Well-known
No it will act like a 38mm lens that it is, plenty of people are able to zone focus with that focal length or even a bit longer ones. Is it perfect no.
AF does and will mis-focus in some situation again this is not a 21mm lens but a 38mm lens. The Nikon F100 has one of the best AF systems and even this one sometimes fails very rarely though
I agree it is very expensive for what it is, but there is no cheaper alternative in 6x6
There is no older folder except 6x4.5 ones with a real wide angle lens they all have 75mm and upwards lenses. The Mamiya 6 is upward a 1000€ sans lens where I live
Thousands if not millions of photographs were made with primitive meters and were correctly exposed. Most handheld meters are rather primitive too no matrix metering etc....
A lot of pro photographers use autoexposure without any thought to manual exposure or any other manual settings (I personally prefer manual )
What is Quality in a photo?
As I've said I won't buy it, but I also won't diss it because it was made for Lomography.
I am sure it will make many people very happy and it does promote the sale of film and that's all I care about.
nongfuspring
Well-known
There seem to be two arguments here:
#1 The camera is vastly overpriced and poorly made with a technically mediocre lens.
#2 There are no other options for 6x6 at this focal length, at this size, for this price.
These two statements are both true and don't contradict each other.
#1 The camera is vastly overpriced and poorly made with a technically mediocre lens.
#2 There are no other options for 6x6 at this focal length, at this size, for this price.
These two statements are both true and don't contradict each other.
DominikDUK
Well-known
Very well put +1
Sid836
Well-known
At that price range sharpness without that much vigneting and perhaps some distinct character that could make that "super" wide lens somehow to stand out and justify the price.
Which means that it may be worth something only if you are desperate for something in 6x6 at this focal length, at this size, for this price.
thegman
Mentor
I don't deny a great camera can be had for $450. I'm saying that a small, 6x6 camera with an ultrawide lens for $450 is a different matter.
I get that people think it's expensive for the build quality, and it is, but expensive for the capability? I don't think so, simple because it does not have any competition. Just to re-iterate, it's competition isn't 'medium format cameras' it's Small, Ultrawide, 6x6 cameras. Unless you're happy not having one of those things, it seems you'll pay more than $450.
DominikDUK
Well-known
Vignetting is a distinct character or do you mean OOF character, it does exhibit some coma. The lens might be many thing but characterless isn't one of them
All color image examples I've seen are either cross processed or they used bad film to give them more of the Lomo Hipster like look. One can use a center filter like in the LF world to counter the vignetting.
Ezzie
E. D. Russell Roberts
Excuse me if someone has already commented on this, but it looks like a dog's breakfast. The LC-A's not a bad looking camera, the original CX2 even better, but taking the same formula and just stretching it height wise does the 120 no favours.
I do happen to like my cameras to look the part, as well as doing their part. Shallow person that I am.
I do happen to like my cameras to look the part, as well as doing their part. Shallow person that I am.
JoeV
Thin Air, Bright Sun
There's a valid place for this new camera. The problem I've always had with classic plastic toy film cameras is limited exposure control, typically with two aperture settings and one fixed shutter speed, plus bulb.
As far as I know, the LC-A series are the only Lomo cameras with automatic exposure control, and even though it's automatic, it is far better than one shutter speed and two apertures on the others.
Given the cost of lab processing and printing color 120 film, this camera's cost could be justified merely by the shots you wouldn't ruin due to poor exposure.
As for the glass lens, I've been using the Holga GFN-120 for a while now. In the center of the image it's adequately sharp, while the vignetting is appealing to a certain style of documentary shooting that I employ. Definitely better than a plastic lens.
If I were in the market for a compact 120 street camera, this would be at the top of my list.
~Joe
As far as I know, the LC-A series are the only Lomo cameras with automatic exposure control, and even though it's automatic, it is far better than one shutter speed and two apertures on the others.
Given the cost of lab processing and printing color 120 film, this camera's cost could be justified merely by the shots you wouldn't ruin due to poor exposure.
As for the glass lens, I've been using the Holga GFN-120 for a while now. In the center of the image it's adequately sharp, while the vignetting is appealing to a certain style of documentary shooting that I employ. Definitely better than a plastic lens.
If I were in the market for a compact 120 street camera, this would be at the top of my list.
~Joe
B-9
Devin Bro
The more I want to hate it, the more I catch myself thinking of what I can unload to buy it...
Maybe I'll catch the end of the first release and get myself an early Christmas gift
Lomo says they won't ship until around the holiday season, perfect way to hide it from the girlfriend! I wonder if there is a gift reciept option?, I can imagine the hell Ide get if she saw the price! Shhh our little secret!
In all seriousness, I doubt there will be much to loose at the price.
Heck, even those old CCCP LC-A's are still fetching 100$, the newer LC-A+ Is going for nearly new prices used. I think there is some scrap of reason, that these will retain a fair amount of resale value.
Also, Lomo, we need a filter adapter, a Polaroid back, and a Krab housing before we admit your right!
Just my 2 cents!
Maybe I'll catch the end of the first release and get myself an early Christmas gift
Lomo says they won't ship until around the holiday season, perfect way to hide it from the girlfriend! I wonder if there is a gift reciept option?, I can imagine the hell Ide get if she saw the price! Shhh our little secret!In all seriousness, I doubt there will be much to loose at the price.
Heck, even those old CCCP LC-A's are still fetching 100$, the newer LC-A+ Is going for nearly new prices used. I think there is some scrap of reason, that these will retain a fair amount of resale value.
Also, Lomo, we need a filter adapter, a Polaroid back, and a Krab housing before we admit your right!
Just my 2 cents!
aizan
Mentor
come to think of it, the best alternative is an ipro with the wide angle lens, $50 + $85 respectively. and instagram is free.
DominikDUK
Well-known
If you can show me how to load the Ipro with 120 Film I can see the Ipro as an alternative.