Dogman
Mentor
Isn't a big "compact" camera a contradiction in terms?
My initial enthusiasm for Micro 4/3 due to the small size of the cameras and lenses waned with the increases in features, lens speed and size.
Personally I would prefer better ergonomics with smaller size. I don't really see the attraction of increasing the size of a camera to add features when I don't use most of the features already there. I'd like to see a camera company make a serious camera for photography only. Thus far only Leica has done this but the cost makes it an abstract choice for most of us.
My initial enthusiasm for Micro 4/3 due to the small size of the cameras and lenses waned with the increases in features, lens speed and size.
Personally I would prefer better ergonomics with smaller size. I don't really see the attraction of increasing the size of a camera to add features when I don't use most of the features already there. I'd like to see a camera company make a serious camera for photography only. Thus far only Leica has done this but the cost makes it an abstract choice for most of us.
Huh? .......
ptpdprinter
Mentor
Does disabling deep dive menus, and the features they control, for example, make the camera physically any smaller? Or does is just make the software smaller?
I`m not sure, but I think you misunderstood my original post. I was saying that there are many big cameras out there to choose from, so why would we want the few smaller cameras we have to be bigger?
ptpdprinter
Mentor
I am all for smaller cameras and lenses. I am just not sure that simply disabling features is going to get us there, or that increasing features is what has gotten us where we are now. For example, I think the newly introduced Zeiss ZX1 is all wrong.
I agree with that...
markjwyatt
Well-known
Looks really nice. Sounds like it will cost similar to a Leica Q2 (~$5k). The leaf shutter is interesting (but only 1/1000 s). For $5k, I might consider the Fuji GX50 route (but consider the lens cost...). In the latter case so much for compact.
markjwyatt
Well-known
Easiest solution for OP: Take a Ricoh GR III or a Zeiss ZX1, or whatever, and add a phone to it! Use the large rear LCD as the smartphone desktop. as well as for the camera.
benlees
Well-known
To be honest, I think the camera manufacturers are way ahead of you. Bigger sensors in bigger bodies (or "semi-professional" bodies) has been their MO for awhile. As soon as the iphone took off... They didn't really have a choice did they?
As far as presenting something big as the new compact; an easy challenge for modern marketing. Selling conformity as vibrant individualism is old hat for them, after all.
As far as presenting something big as the new compact; an easy challenge for modern marketing. Selling conformity as vibrant individualism is old hat for them, after all.
Honestly, Sony just needs to make an APSC version of the RX1R II about the size of the Ricoh GR. Despite it being a Sony, I think it would do well.
al1966
Feed Your Head
I think that for compact cameras to remain somewhat relevant they need to offer things you can not get from a phone. So greater zoom ranges, bigger sensors tuned more for bad light and lossless files are some areas that could help. I won't now use a camera without some form of eye level viewfinder and am surprised more makers don't offer this especially on expensive models.
michaelwj
----------------
Does coat-pocketable mean that it fits in a coat pocket, or that is comfortable and practical to keep in a coat pocket?
The X100 series fits in my coat pocket... just. Without the hood. Is it comfortable? No way! It’s too heavy, causes my coat to sit uncomfortably, and is a PITA to get in and out.
I think the X100 size is a great size, small but comfortable to hold. I think it is the sweet spot for a bigger sensor compact camera. Likewise the RX1 series. I find the RX100 series start to get to small to be comfortable, and a bit to big and awkward to fit in a pocket.
I think for some, as long as it fits, they are good to go. But for others, just because it fits doesn't mean it's comfortable. I hate when I have something big and heavy in my pocket and it swings and sways with my stride while walking.
emraphoto
Mentor
Im going to be the dissenting voice here. The ultra compact camera is designed to perform 1 or 2 functions. Take photos or shoot video. As a result, the interface is refined for these activities. A phone has many tasks to perform and this impacts the camera interface. I would gladly move to a phone however i find them fiddly and slow to operate/respond. Compared to something like the GR... Well, im in the GR camp to date.
olifaunt
Well-known
You know, the perfect cameras already exist. They were made in the last century, they are in any size you want, they give you much better pictures than digital, and you can still buy them.
emraphoto
Mentor
How do you determine 'much better' exactly?
Ambro51
Collector/Photographer
A friend of mine has a working wet plate studio in Gettysburg. He images a lot of period reenactors, and maintains a Costume closet that ordinary folks can dress 19th century. His main camera is an Anthony studio 8x10 on a large stand. One time he had a family who dressed up for a tintype. The snooty 10 year old know it all daughter pointed to the camera and said “What’s That!”?!! “. “A Camera” was the reply. She assumes a disbelieving stance and says “Nuh uh! Where’s its phone???”
raid
Dad Photographer
I would say that it is more important to make the compact cameras "better" overall. Use better lenses and better software. Have DNG images and higher resolution images. The size should not be too small. The camera should fit easily in the hand.
The Ricoh GR III gets it as right as can be expected IMO. Jacket pocketable and high quality. It's not perfect, but it is closer than most. The latest Sony RX100 VI seems cool on the surface, but then the 24-200mm zoom is F4 by 40mm. Couple that with a 1" sensor usable to about ISO 800, it is a great sunlight camera and an ok still life low light camera (due to IS). For me, that is not enough. I would love to see more cameras made in this sector and made with the one big advantage digital has over film in mind; HIGH ISO APSC or larger sensors. I'm hoping we still will.
Huss
Mentor
And breaks after one use?