EK Double-XX frame tilt?
Old 12-07-2019   #1
Steinberg2010
Registered User
 
Steinberg2010's Avatar
 
Steinberg2010 is offline
Join Date: Aug 2010
Location: NC
Age: 28
Posts: 213
EK Double-XX frame tilt?

Curious to know if this is normal:

I shot my first roll of Double-XX last week through a new-to-me M4 as a test roll. The exposures all look good, but there's a slight consistent tilt to each frame at an angle on the long edge (so one end of the frame is closer to the bottom perforations than the other end). Is this caused by the slight difference in perforation shape?

Thanks in advance!

~S
__________________
末末末末末末末末末末末末末末末末末末末末末末

F3, 50mm F1.8 E, 105mm F2.5 (Pre-AI)

Leica M3, M5, 50mm Summicron, 40mm Summicron - C, 35mm VC PI, 35mm Summaron f3.5
  Reply With Quote

Old 12-07-2019   #2
Saul
fighting inertia
 
Saul's Avatar
 
Saul is offline
Join Date: Dec 2010
Location: Baltimore MD
Posts: 496
My guess: it's a camera issue.
  Reply With Quote

Old 12-07-2019   #3
Rob-F
Likes Leicas
 
Rob-F's Avatar
 
Rob-F is offline
Join Date: Mar 2007
Location: The Show Me state
Age: 79
Posts: 6,215
I haven't seen this when shooting XX in my M2, M5 , M7, or MP. (I haven't shot XX in my other Leicas.)
__________________
May the light be with you.
  Reply With Quote

Old 12-07-2019   #4
davidnewtonguitars
Family Snaps
 
davidnewtonguitars's Avatar
 
davidnewtonguitars is offline
Join Date: Feb 2016
Location: Beaumont, TX
Posts: 1,461
I guess a loading issue, a slight misalignment of the film across the gate. If the film leader is not cut deep enough, it rides too high on the tulip. Or, the film roll is not pushed all the way down.
  Reply With Quote

Old 12-07-2019   #5
Nokton48
Registered User
 
Nokton48's Avatar
 
Nokton48 is offline
Join Date: Dec 2006
Posts: 5,380
The perforations are smaller, to fit sprockets in Hollywood movie cameras, like Mitchell or Arriflex.

Sounds like a camera loading issue to me. +1 ^^
__________________
典he secret of getting ahead is getting started.
― Mark Twain
  Reply With Quote

Old 12-07-2019   #6
Steinberg2010
Registered User
 
Steinberg2010's Avatar
 
Steinberg2010 is offline
Join Date: Aug 2010
Location: NC
Age: 28
Posts: 213
Ok - the reason I was confused was that the tilt resets frame by frame. (E.g. the distance looks consistent across the roll with a similar amount of tilt on each frame). I will try another roll of a more standard stock to see if I can reproduce it!

~S
__________________
末末末末末末末末末末末末末末末末末末末末末末

F3, 50mm F1.8 E, 105mm F2.5 (Pre-AI)

Leica M3, M5, 50mm Summicron, 40mm Summicron - C, 35mm VC PI, 35mm Summaron f3.5
  Reply With Quote

Old 12-07-2019   #7
Guy Pinhas
Registered User
 
Guy Pinhas's Avatar
 
Guy Pinhas is offline
Join Date: Mar 2016
Location: Amsterdam
Posts: 130
Been shooting XX with either an M4, CL or my half frames and there was nothing unusual. So yeah, like everyone says, probably loading issue? Might help if you posted an image of a strip of six frames?
  Reply With Quote

Old 12-07-2019   #8
davidnewtonguitars
Family Snaps
 
davidnewtonguitars's Avatar
 
davidnewtonguitars is offline
Join Date: Feb 2016
Location: Beaumont, TX
Posts: 1,461
That would indicate the film strip is tracking at a slight tilt across the camera film gate or frame.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Steinberg2010 View Post
Ok - the reason I was confused was that the tilt resets frame by frame. (E.g. the distance looks consistent across the roll with a similar amount of tilt on each frame). I will try another roll of a more standard stock to see if I can reproduce it!

~S
  Reply With Quote

Old 12-07-2019   #9
Nokton48
Registered User
 
Nokton48's Avatar
 
Nokton48 is offline
Join Date: Dec 2006
Posts: 5,380
Maybe the roll wasn't taped straight on the spool??
__________________
典he secret of getting ahead is getting started.
― Mark Twain
  Reply With Quote

Old 12-07-2019   #10
Ambro51
Registered User
 
Ambro51's Avatar
 
Ambro51 is offline
Join Date: Jan 2016
Posts: 208
Yes now I see a difference in the perfs, the xx has a semi rounded top. Never noticed this before I thought this perf size was standardized in Edison’s day. Live and learn. I’ve shot this film a lot and never had any issues.
  Reply With Quote

Old 12-07-2019   #11
Phil_F_NM
Camera hacker
 
Phil_F_NM's Avatar
 
Phil_F_NM is offline
Join Date: Jun 2004
Location: Philadelphia, PA
Age: 43
Posts: 4,076
The perf is Bell and Howell which is superior to the Eastman Kodak perf because the BH perfs have rounded corners and don't tear as easily. This standard has been around since the 1920s when Bell and Howell ruled motion picture production and Eastman Kodak ruled film production. All the other film manufacturers basically had to adopt the BH perf size and shape if they were to be able to supply film for motion picture shooting, printing and final projection. Only motion picture film has these perfs.
Regarding your tilted frames issue, I'm really curious to see what the individual frames look like all the way out to the edge of the acetate. Sounds like the film is moving across the rails slightly sideways but in a repeatable fashion. I can't figure out how this would happen though.
Since the M4 is compatible with Leica reloadable cassettes, it could be an issue with the reloadables you used for the roll/s that have this issue. I had this problem with a Leica IIIf not wanting to play with a certain brand of reloadable cassette I was using years ago.
Phil Forrest
  Reply With Quote
Reply


Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

vB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off



All times are GMT -8. The time now is 12:54.


vBulletin skin developed by: eXtremepixels
Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.6.8
Copyright ©2000 - 2020, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.

All content on this site is Copyright Protected and owned by its respective owner. You may link to content on this site but you may not reproduce any of it in whole or part without written consent from its owner.