Old 11-19-2017   #1
danielsterno
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https://leicarumors.com/2017/11/19/l...ber-21st.aspx/
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Old 11-19-2017   #2
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Oh great, they took a cue from Olympus and brought back the exact name of a 40-50 year old model so now web and forum searches will be a mess, and conversations will be always subject to miscommunication over whether the topic is analog or digital. Can't they let their little Minolta love child rest in peace???
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Old 11-19-2017   #3
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I suppose I'll have to be more specific when I post pics from my CL... And the CL is in my signature too. No, its not the digital mirrorless version.

Didn't Zeiss create similar confusion when they made the Zeiss Ikon? The "new" Zeiss Ikon, not the numerous vintage ones available all over Ebay.
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Old 11-19-2017   #4
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they couldn’t come up with a less bumpy top plate? 80% hate, 20% love.
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Old 11-19-2017   #5
DrMcCoy
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Quote:
aps-c
whyyyyyyyyyyy
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Old 11-19-2017   #6
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While the CL/CLE has a cult following, rightly so IMHO, if what's picture in the link is accurate..........meh

Fuji XE-3 Shōsha (勝者) (Winner)

B2 (;->
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Old 11-19-2017   #7
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$4,000? Where's the market for this?

Reminds me of the Nikon Coolpix A ($1000 when released).
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Old 11-19-2017   #8
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$4,000? Where's the market for this?
In their boutique shops... and it will sell.
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Old 11-19-2017   #9
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The name is going to create a lot of confusion.
Just like the M-P and the MP (film camera).

I wonder when they're going to call the next boring digital camera the Leica "M3"?
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Old 11-19-2017   #10
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I was excited by the thread title, "great, they are reintroducing the classic compact film Leica". Then, as soon as I saw what the new 'CL' was, I lost all interest.
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Old 11-19-2017   #11
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Maybe they should have called it the 3L, because it does have a somewhat Barnack looking body.

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Old 11-19-2017   #12
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Not after the terrible customer service and pathetic repair service I experienced with the M9 I owned. If I wanted a mirror less in apsc I'd buy a Fuji and lenses or FF a Sony and lenses.

Never will buy another Leica digital product or new analog item.
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Old 11-19-2017   #13
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In their boutique shops... and it will sell.
Of course it will because "Red Dot."

Nikon's Coolpix A did not sell.
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Old 11-19-2017   #14
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looks remarkably similar to my 1f. where is CL coming from??
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Old 11-19-2017   #15
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at least they didn't call it "Pajero"
(some will understand)
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Old 11-19-2017   #16
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another camera the world doesn't need.
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Old 11-20-2017   #17
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Looks like a X2 with its flash stuck open.

Why Leica! Why!

I agree should have been a 3L or TL3
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Old 11-20-2017   #18
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another camera the world doesn't need.
Ok, but that is all cameras then...
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Old 11-20-2017   #19
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Yeah, you still can paint...
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Old 11-20-2017   #20
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What is the real differentiation between this new camera and the existing TL? I realize the TL doesn't have a built-in viewfinder (although an add on EVF is available) and is quite modern in its look and control scheme. Just seems weird to me to produce the same product with a few different "features".

I'll be honest, when I read digital CL, I was thinking about (and hoping for) a cheaper full-frame Leica M
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Old 11-20-2017   #21
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What is the real differentiation between this new camera and the existing TL? I realize the TL doesn't have a built-in viewfinder (although an add on EVF is available) and is quite modern in its look and control scheme. Just seems weird to me to produce the same product with a few different "features".
Not much but enough to make it seem a little more traditional.

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I'll be honest, when I read digital CL, I was thinking about (and hoping for) a cheaper full-frame Leica M
Yeah this continues to be everyone's dream... but it is never happening. Cheap and Leica M are not synonymous.
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Old 11-20-2017   #22
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Your experience is the first thing I thought of when I saw this.

Or just buy something else.
Precisely what I did. It amazes me that people will buy from a company with that abuses customers like Leica does. Not my problem.
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Old 11-20-2017   #23
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Every new rumor or actual product from Leica Camera AG generates exactly same reaction.
Which is "Leica is bad in quality and awful in service, but expensive".

How it is different from many other expressive and nice objects? Landrover comes to my mind. Same prestige, same pleasure, same "quality", same "service". But people keep on buying it, for prestige, pleasure and few for actual hard use. Just like with Leica.

Cheap Leica means MiC. For labor and parts. As of now it means working fine, service is in quick shoveling of parts and it could be made in millions. Do you really need this Leica? Why? Want to buy from Amazon or even Walmart?
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Old 11-20-2017   #24
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They could have at least gold plated it...***...were they thinkin..? No ones gonna buy it...w/o gold plating..
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Old 11-20-2017   #25
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Every new rumor or actual product from Leica Camera AG generates exactly same reaction.
Which is "Leica is bad in quality and awful in service, but expensive".

How it is different from many other expressive and nice objects? Landrover comes to my mind. Same prestige, same pleasure, same "quality", same "service". But people keep on buying it, for prestige, pleasure and few for actual hard use. Just like with Leica.

Cheap Leica means MiC. For labor and parts. As of now it means working fine, service is in quick shoveling of parts and it could be made in millions. Do you really need this Leica? Why? Want to buy from Amazon or even Walmart?
Because people usually don't complain much when there is a warranty attached to it. Also, there are many very expensive things out there that do perform and hold up will over time. The 911 isn't a cheap car in any spec but they are very reliable. Toyota trucks and SUVs from 10 years ago are still over $20k with over 100k miles because they are reliable. The problem with Leica is they make a product that is extremely similar to others on the market with well below average customer support with well above average prices.
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Old 11-20-2017   #26
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Because people usually don't complain much when there is a warranty attached to it. Also, there are many very expensive things out there that do perform and hold up will over time. The 911 isn't a cheap car in any spec but they are very reliable. Toyota trucks and SUVs from 10 years ago are still over $20k with over 100k miles because they are reliable. The problem with Leica is they make a product that is extremely similar to others on the market with well below average customer support with well above average prices.
Porsche had it problems too. Remember the class action lawsuit over the intermediate shaft bearing failure. Porsche did an engine redesign and put a copy machine bearing in supporting the intermediate shaft. Failure of the bearing resulted in total destruction of the engine. This problem occurred in engines generally having less than 40,000 miles. It took a class action lawsuit to get Porsche to make good on replacing engines that had been trashed.

I'm an ex Porsche owner that was very lucky with no issues in over 125,000 miles but I backed out of buying another new one last year because of the way they treated customers. If I'm spending $150,000 for something I expect the company to stand behind it without a fight. Same goes for Leica.
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Old 11-20-2017   #27
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And Toyota has had lots of engine sludge problems over the years. Besides the point, though. Except for a discussion on perceived ideas and the marketplace...

What does this new Leica bring to the table of 24MP interchangeable lens aps-c cameras? Just a red dot. That might be enough!
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Old 11-20-2017   #28
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to me its Leica's lack of competitive ingenuity in 2017, they need a Steve Jobs type who understands their products and brand AND who understands who their customer is, what that customer wants and how to beat the Sony/Fuji competition for that very same market niche! And at a realistic price.....
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Old 11-20-2017   #29
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Your experience is the first thing I thought of when I saw this.

Perhaps it would be a good idea to book a sensor replacement at the time of purchase, so you will be 'in the queue' when it breaks, and have a chance of getting the camera back within nine months?

Or just buy something else.

Hey, only 1% will have sensor failure! Just like what someone claimed that's what Leica told them about the M9!
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Old 11-20-2017   #30
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Hey, only 1% will have sensor failure! Just like what someone claimed that's what Leica told them about the M9!
Wouldn't you love to know the true numbers.

With my M9 the sensor failed causing magenta splotches in the image. It wasn't corrosion as most were. My problem started about three months or so after buying it new. Then I started having RF problems that required severAl trips back and a problem with my 90 Apo that worked perfectly on my film bodies but wouldn't work with my M9. It doesn't make sense because it's just a mechanical linkage and you'd think if it worked on 3 M film bodies it'd work on the M9. All other lenses worked on both film and digital except the 90. I forced Leica to replace it and it worked perfectly on the M9 after that. ???
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Old 11-20-2017   #31
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Huss..you got that backwards...
Its a 99% failure rate..
And a 1%..well...you know...
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Old 11-20-2017   #32
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to me its Leica's lack of competitive ingenuity in 2017, they need a Steve Jobs type who understands their products and brand AND who understands who their customer is, what that customer wants and how to beat the Sony/Fuji competition for that very same market niche! And at a realistic price.....
Uhmmm, I think they know their customers very well and that's why they opened boutique stores. If you've ever experienced a Leica boutique store, you'd know this product is perfect for them. I think many of us think Leica caters to us... that we are their target customer. However, many of us are not... and Sony and Fuji are not its competition. Luxury brands are its competition. Sure, we love the M. We love the Leica of old. But Leica is never going to compete on price with mass produced products.
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Old 11-20-2017   #33
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I wonder how it will compare to the x70, at 5x the cost.
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Old 11-20-2017   #34
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No thanks, I'm good. I'm happy with my Fuji X20 and my D-Lux 6.
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Old 11-20-2017   #35
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But Leica is never going to compete on price with mass produced products.
leicas are mass produced, and who knows, maybe someday its strategy will change and it will return to being a non-luxury brand.
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Old 11-20-2017   #36
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The rumored camera looks nice, a TL model with built in viewfinder and a more 'standard' control setup. Looks like it will be a nice camera, particularly if it can use all the existing TL lenses.

Of course it's expensive ... did you really think they'd sell it for Fuji prices? Who cares? If you can only afford the Fuji, buy the Fuji.

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Old 11-20-2017   #37
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If you can only afford the Fuji, buy the Fuji.
Yeah, screw the plebs who can't afford the Red Dot, right?

Who cares what the camera brings to the table in terms of capabilities or quality of output - if you've got the money, obviously you buy the Leica. A Fuji is just so pedestrian.

FWIW I wouldn't buy either.
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Old 11-20-2017   #38
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It's called Leica IIIdi ...


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Old 11-20-2017   #39
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leicas are mass produced, and who knows, maybe someday its strategy will change and it will return to being a non-luxury brand.
seeing as how the Leica is only producing M10 bodies at a rate of 40-150/week, I wouldn't say they are mass producing the good stuff.
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Old 11-20-2017   #40
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The top LCD looks neat. Hope we could see it on the X-Pro 3.
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