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Old 07-06-2017   #241
ColSebastianMoran
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A different twist on this question:

Overrated kit: My previous kit, previously highly rated, but feels very inferior when the next generation appears.

Examples:
- Nikon F, F2 once the compact FM & FE appeared.
- Nikon D70, once the D200 & D300 appeared
- Pana Lumix LX-1, once the LX-5 appeared
- Polaroid folders, once the SX-70 appeared

Some kits stand the test of time, others feel very obsolete when next generation appears.
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Old 07-06-2017   #242
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I'm with TerryMcC - I found the M240 completely unpleasant to use and would always default to my M9s. In the year or two that I had the M240 I might have used it 20 times, it was so porky and ungainly, the add-on EVF was hopeless except for tripod and macro use (certainly not good enough to replace an optical VF for normal usage) and the colour output was not a patch on the M9's. I sold the M240 earlier this year just at the beginning of its huge deflation.
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Old 07-06-2017   #243
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Yashica Mat- Mamiya 330+220- RB67 only so so- Rollieflex TLR not too bad

Settled on Leica- Nikon F2- Zone 6 4x5 for film

Leica + Nikon Pro cameras for digital
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Old 07-06-2017   #244
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Olympus XA. Couldn't focus with that tiny viewfinder and dim patch. Never could get used to the focus lever.


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Old 07-06-2017   #245
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Quote:
Originally Posted by seagrove View Post
The AF on the F4S I found to be severely lacking and ended up with two F100 bodies with MB-15 drives..
That shows how different our experiences can be. I consider the AF on my F4s to be very good even when I compare it to my other AF SLRs like the F5 or the EOS1n.
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Old 07-06-2017   #246
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Originally Posted by Merlijn53 View Post
Digital in general. I did my best, but it never convinced me.
Happy back to analog for a year now and not planning to look back.
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Old 04-05-2018   #247
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Quote:
Originally Posted by gfeucht View Post
OK. I'll be crucified for this, but:

35mm Summicron ASPH. There. I said it.

I wanted to replace my ltm Ultron 35mm 1.7 because of its .9m close focus and tried three copies of the 'cron ASPH. All were both softer and had serious focus shift. I ended up buying the Zeiss 2.0 Biogon which was sharper than everything else, no distortion, and had zero focus shift.

I really wanted to and expected to love the 'cron, but it just wasn't great at all.
Got to agree about the 35mm Summicron ASPH. Wanted to love it, everyone said how AMAZING it was, but it just didn't work for me. Found it rendered way too "heavy", too dark, too much contrast, the blacks were really heavy. Not terrible on my M9, but with Tri-X and the old AgfaPan, I just did not like the way it rendered. Luckily I sold it when it was still pretty new and got most of my money back from it.

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Old 04-05-2018   #248
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The Leica M8 that I bought new, partly swayed by Leicaís promise of an upgradable sensor. Terrible camera - buggy, fragile and unreliable with lengthy turnaround for repairs, not to mention refusal by Leica to accept responsibility for a fault (early shutter death). I wasted my money and was treated shabbily. And Leica renenged on its upgrade promise.

I will never buy another new Leica product, and warn off friends and colleagues.
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Old 04-05-2018   #249
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Whole Nikon stuff. Tried again every few years.
Everything works in the wrong direction, fewest of all in lens compatibility and no Nikon lens is something to write home about.
Pricy bodies while doing not more than others.
Every Canon, Pentax, Minolta, Fuji or even Cosina and Chinon does the job but Nikon stays a hassle. For me. Even the digital ones.
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The Pentax SPF...
Old 04-05-2018   #250
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The Pentax SPF...

I shot with this camera in the 70s and 80s and just loved it so a few years ago I decided to build up a kit starting with a black body Pentax SPF (with working meter) to which I added the SMCT 28 f/3.5, 35 f/3.5, 55 f/1.2, 105 f/2.8 & 135 f/3.5. Even went so far as to upgrade the finder screen with a split screen version (which I had in my original)... but time had moved on... I love the lenses, but could not bond with the body, in particular the finder...

Sometimes it's best to move on ; )
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Old 04-05-2018   #251
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Leica CL (film). It felt poor quality and wasn't pleasant to use... so I didn't.

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Old 04-05-2018   #252
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Anything Sony...

Any Nikon DSLR except the Df

However, just because I was disappointed doesn't mean they are not great cameras.
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Old 04-05-2018   #253
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Nikon DF. Just a fat, reskinned D600 with less of the features and a low rez D4 sensor. Dials which look like metal feel plastic and hollow. Had high hopes to be able to use it to focus manual AI/AIS lenses but Nikon did not improve the focus screen at all, so it had poor MF accuracy. My D750 had much better MF (and way better AF), and the D850 now has incredible manual focus abilities. There is absolutely no play in the RF confirmation dot. With the DF the light would come on to indicate correct focus, and stay on for a while even though you could be adjusting focus.

Really disappointed with the terrible reliability of my M-E, and the shoddy and untruthful service by Leica. Would never buy another new digi Leica because of that.
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Old 04-05-2018   #254
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The Olympus Trip. Shot a film with one, just an average camera, never got it why it has such a big fan club.
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Old 04-05-2018   #255
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Lubitel 166+ Moscow Olympics edition. Focus screen does not help to focus. Rough mechanism. Became really unreliable after the 3rd roll through it (bought NOS), winding the film unevenly relying in a 12 exp roll giving only 6...
Shame cuz it actually made cool pics.
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Old 04-05-2018   #256
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Any digital. Yes it's more convenient, but always found that any decent shot I got with it, I would end up just regretting I didn't get it on film. That's not a digital vs film thing, just personal preference.

As for specific cameras, the two low points for me were an Olympus OM-G and a Yashica 124G. They're both just poorly made and spending a hair bit more can get you a lot more camera.
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Old 04-05-2018   #257
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Huss View Post
Nikon DF. Just a fat, reskinned D600 with less of the features and a low rez D4 sensor.
You say that as if the D4 sensor is horrible...which is completely untrue. Sure, it had the D600 AF, but not everything else. It was fat...

Quote:
Originally Posted by Huss View Post
Dials which look like metal feel plastic and hollow.
Come on...no different than the film cameras....

Quote:
Had high hopes to be able to use it to focus manual AI/AIS lenses but Nikon did not improve the focus screen at all, so it had poor MF accuracy. My D750 had much better MF (and way better AF), and the D850 now has incredible manual focus abilities. There is absolutely no play in the RF confirmation dot. With the DF the light would come on to indicate correct focus, and stay on for a while even though you could be adjusting focus.
Completely fair....
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Old 04-05-2018   #258
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The Agfa Isomat Rapid - plastic, odd film, square format. I replaced it with a Zenit 3m, and never looked back.
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Old 04-05-2018   #259
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Lubitel 166+ Moscow Olympics edition.

The fact that someone had high enough hopes for a Lubitel that they could be disappointed with the actual experience.....somehow I find that charming.
Sorry that hopes were dashed, always a bummer.
Take some solace in that D850, which should soothe away all sorts of pain.
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Old 04-05-2018   #260
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I love this thread! It shows that everything is hated by somebody. Some of my personal favorite cameras and lenses are mentioned as disappointments.

So without further adieu (ado, add dew) my biggest disappointments ever in my nearly half century of photography were the Nikon F3 and FM. Coming from several years using the amazing and totally reliable F and F2 Nikons, I jumped immediately to the F3 and FM when first released. The F3 was the most unreliable camera I've ever owned. It just stopped working so often and went back to NPS so regularly (without any remedy), I stopped using it and sold it for next to nothing. I told the buyer of the problems because I really felt guilty selling him that POS. The Nikon FM: The motor drive for the FM was so unreliable I removed it and smashed it on the sidewalk following one of many assignments on which the miserable POS stopped working and jammed up the camera. Without a motor, the FM was more reliable but never felt like a "real" Nikon--light duty and cheap feeling. As for the smashing incident, I never felt better about doing something so totally wrong in my life. It was a mercy killing.

I've been sorta-kinda disappointed with Olympus Micro 4/3 gear. I've owned a fair to middling bit of it over the years and I've done some fine photos with the cameras. But I made better photos with the old Olympus Standard 4/3 gear that Micro 4/3 replaced. Why, I dunno. I guess I bonded with the old DSLRs more. Despite that, I still shoot sometimes with an OMD EM1 on occasions, mostly with adapted Oly 4/3 lenses. The results are always excellent but the shooting experience doesn't really please me. Can't really put my finger on it.

The only other disappointment I can recall were my attempts at using large format cameras. I owned two 4x5 Wista outfits over the years (the first was stolen and replaced by the second). Nothing wrong with the cameras or the Schneider, Rodenstock and Fuji lenses I used but I just never really felt comfortable using them. At the time I shot with them, I also carried a Leica M4-P and I always ended up with better photos with the Leica. Not technically better but just more interesting photos. I guess I'm a snapshooter at heart.
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Old 04-05-2018   #261
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Originally Posted by Larry Cloetta View Post
The fact that someone had high enough hopes for a Lubitel that they could be disappointed with the actual experience.....somehow I find that charming.
Sorry that hopes were dashed, always a bummer.
Take some solace in that D850, which should soothe away all sorts of pain.
I really wanted it to work out in that stone age utilitarian way. Something so simple and basic had to be solid, right? Even the film door was just a friction fit. And this was a new item, a special commemorative edition no less! So this would be la creme de la creme!

Wellll ...no.

Guess i just gotta go back to using my 60th Anniversary Rolleiflex 2.8 GX. Jeesh.
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Old 04-05-2018   #262
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Got a Werra 3 recently and was excited about it. Thought I’d found a unknown gem. For a 50s camera, it looked so modern and innovative. After getting it I really wanted to like it, but was just too disappointed with the crappy rangefinder and noisy shutter. I shot one roll with it and just had no desire at all to shoot another. The pictures were great, though!
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Old 04-05-2018   #263
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Come on...no different than the film cameras....


.
Nah the knobs on my Fm2 feels rock solid in comparison. Same with the Fe2, F , F2 etc
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Old 04-05-2018   #264
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Mamiya 645, and Mamiya c330, Mamiya RB67. Could never get into medium format. It just seemed a clunky compromise between my prefered 35mm Nikon/Leica and 4x5 Sinar.

Just my opinion, not trolling, I know others will disagree, and more power to ya if you enjoy it.
Same. Maybe if I had a Hassy or Rollie SLR. Used a 500C once. Not pleased.

Zone 6 4x5 is honey
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Old 04-05-2018   #265
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Quote:
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Nikon DF. Just a fat, reskinned D600 with less of the features and a low rez D4 sensor. Dials which look like metal feel plastic and hollow. Had high hopes to be able to use it to focus manual AI/AIS lenses but Nikon did not improve the focus screen at all, so it had poor MF accuracy. My D750 had much better MF (and way better AF), and the D850 now has incredible manual focus abilities. There is absolutely no play in the RF confirmation dot. With the DF the light would come on to indicate correct focus, and stay on for a while even though you could be adjusting focus.
One man's nightmare . . .

I just love the Df. Only use non-AI & AI lenses with mine. Have the magnifying eyepiece and have no problem with focus, even with these 60 year old eyes. Love the feel of the dials & knobs. Don't know about the auto-focus performance because I don't use AF lenses. And I love the D4 sensor on the Df just as much as I love it on my D4.

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Old 04-05-2018   #266
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One man's nightmare . . .

I just love the Df. Only use non-AI & AI lenses with mine. Have the magnifying eyepiece and have no problem with focus, even with these 60 year old eyes.
Not sure how the magnifying eyepiece helps as the focus screen is only accurate down to about f2.8.
Any wider than that is hit and miss.

Nikon should have put in a proper screen with split image and microprism. Or at least matched the mf performance of the much older F6, which is much more accurate than the DF. They didn't because they sourced the cheaper hardware from the D600.

p.s. your Day 24 Heart of Darkness photo is something else. Reminds me of Brando in Apocalypse Now. I mean that respectfully and from an artistic POV.
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Old 04-06-2018   #267
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Hmmm, it would help if we knew about all the cameras; some might have been brand new, some refurbished by the factory, some refurbished by the seller (as ebay say) and some bought from a bloke in the pub or worse...

I'd shudder if they all turned out to be brand new.

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Anything digital indeed!
Old 04-06-2018   #268
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Anything digital indeed!

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Originally Posted by xia_ke View Post
Any digital. Yes it's more convenient, but always found that any decent shot I got with it, I would end up just regretting I didn't get it on film. That's not a digital vs film thing, just personal preference.

As for specific cameras, the two low points for me were an Olympus OM-G and a Yashica 124G. They're both just poorly made and spending a hair bit more can get you a lot more camera.
+1. No - +100! After a decade years of being seriously into digital, and a major investment in several top-level D cameras, first Canon, then Nikon, I too am finding that I feel the same.

For technical reasons, the gremlins have done me in! I find I cannot post anything beyond the first two sentences (I tried to edit the rest but left the original two unedited). I will return and try to post later - have saved a copy.

I find if I type without posting for longer than a few minutes, the system some how logs me out. I then have to log in again, and of course my edited post(s) vanish into the outer universe...

Probably something I do wrong... If so, apologies.
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Old 04-06-2018   #269
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F3HP. Just felt incorrect in hand and the controls were counter-intuitive for me.
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Old 04-06-2018   #270
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Not sure how the magnifying eyepiece helps as the focus screen is only accurate down to about f2.8.
Any wider than that is hit and miss.

Nikon should have put in a proper screen with split image and microprism. Or at least matched the mf performance of the much older F6, which is much more accurate than the DF. They didn't because they sourced the cheaper hardware from the D600.
I think this is a case of YMMV. I use a 35mm f2.0, 50mm f1.4 and even my 50mm f1.2, wide open with my Df and though I may occasionally miss focus, the same thing happens for me with the same lenses on my F6. I don't own a D850 so can't comment on how that works, but of the Nikon DSLR's that I own, the only two I can reliably manually focus are the Df and the D700, I find them both pretty similar. Can't manually focus to save my soul on my D4, and was never so good with my D100 either.

Quote:
p.s. your Day 24 Heart of Darkness photo is something else. Reminds me of Brando in Apocalypse Now. I mean that respectfully and from an artistic POV.
Thanks for the kind words on that image. It's where I was at that stage of treatment, and when I downloaded the image from my M8, it did remind me of that iconic shot of Brando.

Best,
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Old 04-06-2018   #271
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The fact that someone had high enough hopes for a Lubitel that they could be disappointed with the actual experience.....somehow I find that charming.
That would be the camera world's equivalent to buying a Trabant, and finding it a disappointment.

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Old 04-06-2018   #272
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Sony NEX7

Baffling menu, even after months getting "used to it" , which I never did.
Clumsy user interface

Had to sell it...doubly frustrating 'cause the photographic results produced by this camera were excellent.
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Old 04-06-2018   #273
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Fuji X Pro 2. There is a lot to like, but ultimately I found the image quality disappointing - lots of instances of waxy skin that doesn't disappear when processing raw. Raw processed in Lightroom, Silkypix and Fuji's X Raw studio. I've now gone back to an X Pro 1.
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Old 04-06-2018   #274
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Like some of the other posters on this page, I never liked the Nikon F3. The film wind was certainly smooth, but I thought the metering readout and the metering pattern were much less useful than the equivalents on my F2A. And I do not use AE much.
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Old 04-06-2018   #275
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Agree with you Gerry, never bonded with the Nikon F3. Doesn't help that I bought mine used and right in the middle of a project the electronics went belly up and that was that. Actually, except for the partial roll of film wasted, I wasn't all that disappointed. Went back to my Nikon F and finished the project.

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Old 04-06-2018   #276
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Why I didn't read this thread before? It would have saved me a lot of time buying and selling stuffs. Fun thread to read.
This thread ought to be required reading for anyone joining RFF, especially those with GAS impulse control problems, before they dive into the Classifieds then wander astray (FM Buy and Sell, Get DPI Buy and Sell, eBay, Craigslist...).

Maybe the moderators can make it a front-page sticky with an "I Agree" pop-up where you check off "I have read about all the terrible gear choices and subsequent heartbreak suffered by my elders and betters in this forum, and accept responsibility for repeating their GASeous errors."

As for me, a tendency to fetishize desires and purchases (camera gear, but not only that) has led me in a gradual meandering twisted tangled fashion to wisdom. Yes, you can become wise, trying too much gear in multiple formats that gives indistinguishable results when the shooter and the shot is good (and ditto, when the shot is bad but the shooter believes the gear will transcend his limitations!). I've tried a fair chunk of gear mentioned in this thread, and had fun with everything, Olympus, Nikon, Leica, Fuji, old Zeiss, etc....

Wait! There was the Kiev 4A whose abraded focus wheel ripped my index finger, the Jupiter lens with focus harder to move than Sisyphus's stone, the body leaky as a sieve. But that wasn't over-rated kit! (Not generally under-rated either; the online caveats abounded.) I just couldn't afford a Nikon S2 yet, but later, when I could, I made that error of judgment too. I rarely met a camera I didn't like that didn't also have its true believers here, and since photography is not now and never will be my business, I guess I can afford my foolish avoidable mistakes.

These days I run a day-care for aging cameras in a nice cabinet in a wall-papered study. I've seen it all, they tell each other, and I came from good people, I could have been a contender at Magnum, etcetera. They wish they could get out more, but the ******* who runs the place has eyes only for his RX1, his M-D 262, his Sigma SDQ. So it goes.
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Old 04-06-2018   #277
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That would be the camera world's equivalent to buying a Trabant, and finding it a disappointment.


That is one sexy car.
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Old 04-06-2018   #278
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All this F3 hate!

I have two mint ones - F3P and F3 Limited. What I don't like about them is the film wind lever. Much has been made about how smooth and light they are because they are on bearings or some such thing.. I hate it. It feels loose and floppy to me. But the cameras are transformed with the MD4 motordrive. Sure it becomes a ridiculous massive thing, but the handling is so good, and it makes it so much fun to use.
Also these models are made with real metal (titanium) so the prisms don't dent like a soda can. Seriously I have never seen as many dented heads on any camera as I have seen with the F3.
The super toight 80/20 meter pattern is groovy, the basic manual meter readouts not so much. And that flash sync speed? What is this, a Leica m3?!
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Old 04-06-2018   #279
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Posts: 170
Contax T2 ! Didn't like how it felt in the hands. The viewfinder is tiny and the results were just ok.
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Old 04-06-2018   #280
Robert Lai
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Robert Lai is offline
Join Date: May 2007
Posts: 1,627
You guys are hurting my delicate feelings with all this Nikon F3 hate, and Mamiya TLR antipathy.

I've had an F3 for over 35 years (bought it in 1983), and now an F3T.
It has always been reliable, the meter pattern has always been predictable. Auto exposure is spot on. I could always trust this camera to bring back the images. It has battery issues in cold weather, solved with the MD-4 and the NiCd battery back MN-2. I never dented my F3's prism either.

For dented prisms, I note that the Rolleiflex prisms seem to always have been in a demolition derby of some sort. It's rare to see one without some huge dent or crease in the prism body. There is a risk of element separation with the prism also.

Having been a Rolleiflex snob for a while, the Minolta Autocord and especially the Mamiyaflex C2 and C220 have opened my eyes as to what less expensive cameras can do. I find the Mamiya TLRs to be very versatile. Ok, they aren't as exquisitely finished as the Rolleiflex. But, a Toyota is still excellent and works great, even if it isn't finished like a Mercedes Benz. The Mamiya TLRs are super cheap, and the lenses are first class. I usually take out the Autocord or Mamiya TLRs outdoors. Less financial risk than bringing out a near mint white face Rolleiflex.

As for other people's disappointments -
Fuji medium format cameras give me first class results.
These include the folders: GS645, and the GF670.
The GF670 uses CR2 batteries that are apparently hard to find outside the USA. I ran out of batteries in Toronto, Canada, and could not find any place that would sell this battery.
Anyway, the meters on these cameras are super accurate. Lenses are first class.

The Zeiss Super Ikonta IV is a bit of a disappointment. Mine was overhauled by Henry Scherer, who put in a new selenium cell to make the meter accurate. It's a lovely camera, but the front cell focusing Tessar needs to be stopped down to achieve what I would consider true sharpness. it's in focus wide open, but has a bit of soft focus feel.

Kiev - I have a 1956 Kiev IIa, with the flash synch. The flash synch stays closed circuit after firing, until wound on to the next frame. Since I like to use flash bulbs, I have learned to always wind on when taking a flash shot. Mine had a shutter that tapered at 1/500 and 1/1250. A trip to Oleg in Russia, and now it has even exposure at all speeds. He found that the shutter tapes had frayed, and were rubbing against the shutter crate during the travel, leading to uneven exposure. This Kiev has new shutter tapes now.

The fun I had with the Kiev gave me the incentive to get a Henry Scherer overhauled Contax IIa color dial with Carl Zeiss (Stuttgart) 50 1.5 Sonnar. Oh, how sweet it is. That Sonnar goodness is just perfect for portraits. Ok, the Contax has no parallax correction, so I have to frame a little looser. But it is so compact and just so pretty to look at. Went ahead and got the 25mm CV, 35mm Biogon, 85mm Triotar, and 135mm Sonnar. These lenses do rock!

I do less in 35mm format now that I'm using my medium format cameras much more. But when I do reach for a 35mm camera these days, it is the Kiev or the Contax IIa. My Leicas sit there looking pretty.
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