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Adobe Caves In
Old 09-04-2013   #1
willie_901
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Adobe Caves In

Adobe just announced a $9.99/mo Creative Cloud subscription for photographers. This price is good until 12/31. The offer opens on 9/17.

You must be a registered Photoshop CS3 or above owner. You only get Photoshop CC, Lightroom 5, Behance ProSite access and 20GB of storage space.

Supposedly, this price is good indefinitely or until your CC account lapses.

Now I am not in anyway promoting, approving or disapproving this new option for photographers to use Adobe products.

I think it's interesting for a few reasons. Perhaps PS 6 standalone new sales and upgrades were way below Adobe's internal forecast. Or the number of CC new adapters was low. It's also possible LR 5 new and upgrade sales suffered because photographers decided to abandon Adobe sooner rather than later. And, just think how much bad PR Adobe could have avoided if they introduced this option on day one?

Since switching from LR and PSE to the CC photography package would be a business expense, and the price is attractive, I may buy an old licensable CS 3 DVD and join. I really haven't decided. I am not of a frame of mind to spend the time, money and energy to completely abandon the LR ecosystem so moving to other platforms never was an option for me. Before this option, I refused to lease software I would never use (the non-still photography CC apps). Also, I wonder how Adobe will shuffle things around to get me to pay more than $9.95/mo in two to three years own the road.

The fundamental disadvantages of CC vigorously described here and elsewhere have not changed. I doubt Adobe has learned anything either. Otherwise this would have happened from day one, or shortly after it became obvious Adobe alienated a large portion of their photographer customer base with their take it or leave it (and get left behind) marketing strategy.
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Old 09-04-2013   #2
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Ahh ... a new type of software patch!
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Old 09-04-2013   #3
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Yep, capitalism works. Not enough takes at your current price, so down it goes. Probably should have been at this price from the get go....
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Old 09-04-2013   #4
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And what price do they offer to folks in the antipodes?
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Old 09-04-2013   #5
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And what price do they offer to folks in the antipodes?
Good point! LOL
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Old 09-04-2013   #6
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Cloud computing. Cloud-cooc-oo-land computing. Digital is ephermal, my friends. Why not make it even more ephermal? A few years ago a firm was selling gold coins and bars. And for a very modest fee you could store your gold purchased from them in their super vault. Guess what? The company went south, your gold went south and some sneaky folks are sleeping on a gold trmmed cloud. And don't even get me started on Photosnot.
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Old 09-04-2013   #7
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If Adobe goes 100% CC I'll go 100% somewhere else. I use LR5 for 90+% of my editing. I only use CS for cloning mostly.
I understand their point. It's hard to cough up enough money for a full retail copy of CS6 so this way they think they can get more people on board and keep them there.
I would hate to go somewhere else as I have been a loyal Adobe customer for years.
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Old 09-04-2013   #8
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I discovered today that the Adobe Professional version also includes CS5. I have it on my office computer! The cost of the package (forever) is $96.

Why would you pay each month?
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Old 09-04-2013   #9
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Started using Photoshop with version 4 back in the 1990's. Use Photoshop CS3 daily and coughed up the bucks for CS6 for "future proofing". That's it for me and Adobe.

I think they've shot themselves in the foot with this cloud thing.

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Old 09-04-2013   #10
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For anyone with an older version of photoshop, this is a really good deal.

There has been a lot to like in the last few upgrades.

While I hate the idea of paying rent, I still think this is a good buy since it includes LR as well as PS.

Their switch to subscription had me balking and feverishly trying to get some level of expertise with Capture One 7 to avoid the forced monthly charge. I can't really think CO7 can replace Ps yet...but it's 90% there. This is a relatively bearable monthly fee to keep me using both apps for a while. If CO7 improves enough, I can leave adobe in a heartbeat...
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Old 09-04-2013   #11
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I wonder whether Adobe modelled how much they could make if they had dropped the price of Photoshop years ago. It's such a good product that, priced more reasonably, it might have generated profits far in excess of what they have made. Instead they sold Photoshop Lite a.k.a Elements, which had fewer features.

I suspect they could have had a market monopoly if they had lowered their prices.

Sony made the same mistake with Beta, and Apple with the Mac. Great products, both.
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Old 09-04-2013   #12
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When I just checked, the price seemed to be $19.99 per month, if you sign up for a year. Is there a secret password or something?
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Old 09-04-2013   #13
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ChipMcD View Post
When I just checked, the price seemed to be $19.99 per month, if you sign up for a year. Is there a secret password or something?
OP says the price is effective on/after 9/17.
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Old 09-04-2013   #14
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Here is the Adobe page:

http://blogs.adobe.com/creativelayer...raphy-program/
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Old 09-04-2013   #15
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Quote:
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I wonder whether Adobe modelled how much they could make if they had dropped the price of Photoshop years ago.
you better believe it.

Adobe has some of the best mathematicians and forecasters in the world on their staff.
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Old 09-04-2013   #16
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Although the thought of resisting is tempting, at some point OS upgrades ( Mavericks and Win 8.1 will be interesting tests ) are going to break the current standalone versions of PS.
I don't see Adobe issuing patches.

So unless a sub $100 alternative takes the world by storm, I will reluctantly sign up on 12/31.
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Old 09-04-2013   #17
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Quote:
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Although the thought of resisting is tempting, at some point OS upgrades ( Mavericks and Win 8.1 will be interesting tests ) are going to break the current standalone versions of PS.
I don't see Adobe issuing patches.
I don't see any recent versions of Photoshop not working on the next few major versions of OS X. I believe that I'm correct in saying that the only older versions of Photoshop/CS applications that won't run on recent Mac systems are applications that were compiled to run only on older PowerPC processors.

I've had very few problems using older applications as I've upgraded to the last few Mac systems running on Intel processors. I may be proved wrong but I wouldn't worry too much about CS5 and CS6 (and probably CS 4) apps running on Mavericks.

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Old 09-04-2013   #18
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Apparently CS3 will also work on the latest (Mountain Lion 10.8) systems:

http://blogs.adobe.com/photoshopdotc...-released.html

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Old 09-04-2013   #19
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This is not caving in. It's just a temporary attempt to lure photographers.
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Old 09-04-2013   #20
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this is not caving in at all. when adobe released the Creative Cloud, they said they realized that photographers have different needs and they would release something for them. for the time being Lightroom can still be purchased off cloud.

however they did screw over the people who signed up for $20/mo for Photoshop CC only. i hope they get this deal too.
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Old 09-04-2013   #21
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ChipMcD View Post
When I just checked, the price seemed to be $19.99 per month, if you sign up for a year. Is there a secret password or something?
The new price goes into effect on September 17, when a new version of Lightroom is being released.

This offer is available to customers who own a previous version of Photoshop or Photoshop Extended, version CS3 or later (CS3.x, CS4, CS5.x, or CS6). Requires an annual commitment with monthly billing. Valid from September 17, 2013, through December 31, 2013, in countries where Creative Cloud is purchased directly from Adobe.com.
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Old 09-04-2013   #22
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I'm on CS6 and LR 4, and will stay there for as long as I can. Lightroom is my go-to processing program, and I only use PS maybe once a year. Premiere Pro and After Effects will handle footage from just about every current mid to higher end video camera like the Canon C300 and Red Epic, so if I upgrade video gear, I can quite safely buy secondhand gear. With any luck!
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Old 09-05-2013   #23
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... it's a matter of the principal, they have not altered the principal just reduced the price.

I will not rent software ... it changes it from capital-expendature to a fixed-cost, and if Adobe get away with this cash grab everyone else will follow them.
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Old 09-05-2013   #24
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ChipMcD View Post
When I just checked, the price seemed to be $19.99 per month, if you sign up for a year. Is there a secret password or something?
That may not be for everybody or everywhere - here in Germany, their only current deal seems to be a "60% discount offer" of 24.99€ (around $33) a month...
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Old 09-05-2013   #25
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I simply do not trust loading and storing my images elsewhere..so easy to bring in a cost factor.I use simple photoshops.i work with JPEG.Picassa is fine.
I have noticed the more "professional cameras"
require rather than need.
This is ridiculous.I tried a few, one light balancing for daylight was so blue, another had weird magenta blacks. My cheap Canon Point and Shoot has really good color.
An outside drive went turtle last week.Never dropped or banged. Sits on desk. There will be a change in my shooting.I will focus more on using film.
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Old 09-05-2013   #26
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People are aware that the software is client side right? That you're not actually streaming it from Adobe's servers and you only need to be online once every three months?
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Old 09-05-2013   #27
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People are aware that the software is client side right? That you're not actually streaming it from Adobe's servers and you only need to be online once every three months?
... yes, we realise it isn't really a cloud service, just a marketing excuse to police their cash-cow's income stream
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Old 09-05-2013   #28
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Currently investigating how I can make Darktable do the stuff I use LR3.4 for.

My LR3.4 is fine for scanned and Ricoh GXR-M files, I only need something newer for the D600 files and if I can get Darktable do it, I'm not buying Adobe anymore.

Currently it seems that the edit on a single image can be stored as a 'style' in Darktable and subsequently applied to other images. That is the one (important!) LR thing I was missing in DT...
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Old 09-05-2013   #29
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I think PS is the finest photo processing program available anywhere. I am flirting with LR as it is out of CC at least for now. The reason being I will not pay double and rent rather than buy.

$10 monthly is no more than the upgrade price was so I will consider it.

We will have to do something as CS6 will not support new camera raws at some point and you know you will buy a new camera sometime. I have not warmed to LR yet. I really dislike the library concept, imports and exports. PITA.

All that and I will eventually buy a new computer and CS6 will not be available for download. Although I did save a rough or unopened download file on a spare drive on the Mac Pro. No telling how that will work out though in 5 years.
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Old 09-05-2013   #30
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Use of the continuously updated Photoshop and Lightroom for $9.95/mo forever seems fair to me. The products are tremendously valuable to me (avid amateur photographer). I have been upgrading as new versions come out and it seems like I'm paying $100 for each product every year or so. I'll take this special Adobe deal.
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Old 09-05-2013   #31
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Folks...
Please note that no where on that Adobe "special deal" does it state that the $10 per month is ad-infinitum. Adobe can (and likely will) jack that price back up to where they want it once they get enough people on the service.

You know.. similarly to how drug dealers normally "give some away" to get the addict hooked...

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Old 09-05-2013   #32
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I'm looking into this as well and found from the program FAQ page the following....

"Will the cost of my Photoshop Photography Program membership increase?
Customers who sign up by December 31, 2013 will be able to continue their membership. This price is not a special introductory price for your first year only; it is the standard price for this level of membership. But if you cancel your membership in the future, you will not be able to re-join at this special price."

Link to FAQ page http://www.adobe.com/products/creati...ml#pslr-bundle

I agree with Col. Sebastian that this is a fair price point. It'll cost me hundreds to upgrade to CS6 and Lightroom 5, which will take over two years to break even. I also value the benefits of the continuously updated SW and fixes, the expansion of device usage if i decide to use the cloud (i have the choice and can store locally if I want).
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Old 09-05-2013   #33
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What is the product upgrade cycle time for PS and LR?
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Old 09-05-2013   #34
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When I read that, I DO NOT read them saying that the price will stay the same for ever, for X number of years, etc. It is 'the standard price' but no time frame is given. What special legal language am I missing that says that $9.95 will be my price forever, for ten years, or for any specific period of time?



Quote:
Originally Posted by Sunti View Post
I'm looking into this as well and found from the program FAQ page the following....

"Will the cost of my Photoshop Photography Program membership increase?
Customers who sign up by December 31, 2013 will be able to continue their membership. This price is not a special introductory price for your first year only; it is the standard price for this level of membership. But if you cancel your membership in the future, you will not be able to re-join at this special price."

Link to FAQ page http://www.adobe.com/products/creati...ml#pslr-bundle

I agree with Col. Sebastian that this is a fair price point. It'll cost me hundreds to upgrade to CS6 and Lightroom 5, which will take over two years to break even. I also value the benefits of the continuously updated SW and fixes, the expansion of device usage if i decide to use the cloud (i have the choice and can store locally if I want).
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Old 09-05-2013   #35
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Quote:
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What is the product upgrade cycle time for PS and LR?
Adobe likes to do their upgrade cycle annually (if memory serves correctly) - the question to the end user is, how often do YOU "need" these upgrades?

How old (or new) is your current digital equipment? Often new cameras will have new RAW files which will not be supported by older versions of the software

How much do you need the new functionality that, perhaps, Photoshop or Lightroom will offer? Do you need to have that new "brush" for example? Or does the current software do the job?

Specifically for those last set of questions; if you sign up with the CC service then regardless if you want/need those items, you're getting them.

For example - myself, I currently don't need anything further than what I currently have (CS 3 and LR 4.x) but if I sign up for CC... I'm getting a bunch of stuff I either don't need or don't want currently. So, for me currently, signing up for CC would be a waste of money.

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Old 09-05-2013   #36
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Folks...
Please note that no where on that Adobe "special deal" does it state that the $10 per month is ad-infinitum. Adobe can (and likely will) jack that price back up to where they want it once they get enough people on the service.

You know.. similarly to how drug dealers normally "give some away" to get the addict hooked...

Cheers,
Dave
The $10/month rate is advertised as the regular rate for those subscribing before the deadline. This rate may go up with time but it is distinguished from a special rate for just the first year, as is the case with academic subscriptions for CC. The special rate for students and educators is for the first year only.

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Old 09-05-2013   #37
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The $10/month rate is advertised as the regular rate for those subscribing before the deadline. This rate may go up with time but it is distinguished from a special rate for just the first year, as is the case with academic subscriptions for CC. The special rate for students and educators is for the first year only.

Tom
True enough Tom!

I guess my point was that this price means, really, nothing. Those folks signing up before the deadline could, in fact, face a price increase directly after the deadline; unlikely though that may be there's no stipulation stating that it won't actually go up directly after the deadline either. Of course doing such a thing would be completely underhanded and nasty but my point is, why should anyone really "trust" Adobe to do anything that would be "good" for a customer - after all, they are in the business of making money just like any business and after seeing this cloud fiasco and the resulting brouhaha I would exercise a very measured amount of caution before signing up. Caveat Emptor and all that..

Cheers,
Dave
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Old 09-05-2013   #38
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The only time I've ever seen this happen is in cheesy after school specials on tv.

[quote=dcsang;2213301
You know.. similarly to how drug dealers normally "give some away" to get the addict hooked... [/QUOTE]
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Old 09-05-2013   #39
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Quote:
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The $10/month rate is advertised as the regular rate for those subscribing before the deadline. This rate may go up with time but it is distinguished from a special rate for just the first year, as is the case with academic subscriptions for CC. The special rate for students and educators is for the first year only.

Tom
The one time purchase fees for students and educators are forever. This is different from the monthly fees being discussed here.
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Old 09-05-2013   #40
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Raid,

I haven't checked with my university. Are there one-time purchases of CC available for students and faculty like there are (were?) for CS6? I was referring to a monthly fee plan for students and faculty. The monthly fee for CC is described as being a special rate for one year only.

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