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Old 01-05-2012   #81
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Lets see how Fuji brings out their interchangeable lens camera.. I have always liked their s-pro series, but they were some odd products that required some fiddly diddly. Great results though nonetheless. But I seriously hope they will make it right this time!

Oh and for those who asks why no 35mm equiv fov? Because they already have x100 to cover it and expect people to buy the x-pro as the main camera and x100 as a street semi wide second body.
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Old 01-05-2012   #82
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Oh ... can't help then I also find it slightly unfortunate they skipped this focal length in the beginning. Looks a bit to me like a management decision. Still believe they come out with a 35mm later. Not uncommon tactics.
I think they just listened to the internet. When the X100 came out, a lot of people here and elsewhere stated "Not for me. Come back with a 50mm version". Now they start with 50mm and it's wrong again.
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Old 01-05-2012   #83
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You guys realize there will be Leica adapters available in no time ?

Cool camera. Watch for M9 sales.

And regarding pricing, check out what an M8 still fetches on the used market.
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Old 01-05-2012   #84
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Originally Posted by Shade View Post
Lets see how Fuji brings out their interchangeable lens camera.. I have always liked their s-pro series, but they were some odd products that required some fiddly diddly. Great results though nonetheless. But I seriously hope they will make it right this time!

Oh and for those who asks why no 35mm equiv fov? Because they already have x100 to cover it and expect people to buy the x-pro as the main camera and x100 as a street semi wide second body.
The existance of the x100 in my eyes is a short term excuse for the lack of the 35mm equivolent lens. Yes, today they do not want to undermine the x100, but it has to hard to sell one camera at these prices, much harder to sell two, and 35mm is such a fundamental focal length. The question I would guess is, will there be an x200 or x300? When that line is dropped in favor of the xPro thingy the 35mm equivolent lens will be offered.
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Old 01-05-2012   #85
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You guys realize there will be Leica adapters available in no time ?

Cool camera. Watch for M9 sales.

But how would they work with the zoom finder? I doubt frame-lines and level of zoom will be selectable by the user, so that would leave the EVF. How would you focus them? I've not head focus peaking mentioned for this particular camera.

Despite being a different price point I agree that will impact on M9 sales.
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Old 01-05-2012   #86
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But how would they work with the zoom finder? I doubt frame-lines and level of zoom will be selectable by the user, so that would leave the EVF. How would you focus them? I've not head focus peaking mentioned for this particular camera.

Despite being a different price point I agree that will impact on M9 sales.
We haven't heard anything about that camera, really. But the registration distance seems short enough - that's all that matters.

It's the first digital camera with optical viewfinder and interchangable lenses with registration distance shorter than a Leica.

With the success of u4/3 and NEX with adapted lenses, Fuji would be silly not to offer software access to frameline selection or contrast focusing. It's just a software problem. Or include focus confirmation in the adapter ....
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Old 01-05-2012   #87
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I can't see how this will have an effect on M9 sales. If you want a mechanical RF full frame camera, there is still only one. Plus, remember, some people care more about the dot than photos. Leica will be fine since they operate in the luxury zone (and not the consumer zone).
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Old 01-05-2012   #88
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ferider View Post
You guys realize there will be Leica adapters available in no time ?

Cool camera. Watch for M9 sales.

And regarding pricing, check out what an M8 still fetches on the used market.
I do - but I'm not sure how fluid it plays together with the optical viewfinder. Such a FL should be provided as a native lens. I'm ok with adapters for e.g. macro stuff or other applications where I have enough time to get around the adaptation oddities.
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Old 01-05-2012   #89
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I only commented on the used market, jsrockit. Real "Leica-men" buy new anyway.
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Old 01-05-2012   #90
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I can't see how this will have an effect on M9 sales. If you want a mechanical RF full frame camera, there is still only one. Plus, remember, some people care more about the dot than photos. Leica will be fine since they operate in the luxury zone (and not the consumer zone).
Agree with the Lux zone (no pun intended). Sadly, the Leicas were pretty much the only game in town so far along with the Epson, when it comes to rangefinder like photography in ones and zeros.
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Old 01-05-2012   #91
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We haven't heard anything about that camera, really. But the registration distance is short enough - that's all that matters. With the success of u4/3 and NEX with adapted lenses, Fuji would be silly not to offer software access to frameline selection or contrast focusing. It's just a software problem. Or include focus confirmation in the adapter ....
True.

However the one thing I can't get my head around is; with adapted manual focus lenses, how can you parallel correct the frame-lines on the optical viewfinder when the camera has no idea how what distance the lens is focused at?
Leica, Epson and Voigtander do it because they have a roller that physically connects with cam the lens. I doubt this camera will have such a roller and all the other cameras operate with an EVF so are in effect more like SLRs.

Personally, if it can be adapted, I think this camera may be no better than most of the other EVF options on the market as far as mounting non-Fuji lenses goes.

Of course I'm sure they are very clever people at Fuji who may prove me wrong.
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Old 01-05-2012   #92
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The only thing I can think of is that the camera would somehow take a focus distance reading from the sensor (reverse focus peaking?) & then feed it back to the framelines.

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True.

However the one thing I can't get my head around is; with adapted manual focus lenses, how can you parallel correct the frame-lines on the optical viewfinder when the camera has no idea how what distance the lens is focused at?
Leica, Epson and Voigtander do it because they have a roller that physically connects with cam the lens. I doubt this camera will have such a roller and all the other cameras operate with an EVF so are in effect more like SLRs.

Personally, if it can be adapted, I think this camera may be no better than most of the other EVF options on the market as far as mounting non-Fuji lenses goes.

Of course I'm sure they are very clever people at Fuji who may prove me wrong.
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Old 01-05-2012   #93
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Trying to adapt M lenses onto this camera is like sticking your M lenses into a Contax G.

Doesn't make sense.
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Old 01-05-2012   #94
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The only thing I can think of is that the camera would somehow take a focus distance reading from the sensor (reverse focus peaking?) & then feed it back to the framelines.
Good point.
I wondered that myself, but I thought contrast detect focusing only has distance data because the position of the lens elements is fed back from the lens to the camera thus providing the focal distance.

Without that it surely contrast detect would simply tell you if it is in focus or not, not what the distance is.

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Old 01-05-2012   #95
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Trying to adapt M lenses onto this camera is like sticking your M lenses into a Contax G.

Doesn't make sense.
This is what I suspect.
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Old 01-05-2012   #96
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Don't get me wrong Bob. This is the first digital camera that interests me, and I will be totally OK using optimized Fujinon lenses on it. They will be smaller, have more than enough IQ, and can be supported by in-camera lens corrections, etc.

You, Archlich and me might not understand why we should use an M mount lens on u4/3, NEX or new Fuji. But the market is there (just search for "Leica adapter" on ebay) and I'm sure Fuji will enable it, is all I was saying.

This will be the first "affordable" M9 competitor (even though camera and lens kit will easily sell north of US 2k, I'm sure), and it will be better than the M9 in some departments (low light sensitivity & close focus, for instance); it will change RFF, too, I'm afraid.

Off to load my Hasselblad with Tmax
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Old 01-05-2012   #97
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Off to load my Hasselblad with Tmax
I'm with you there. I think it looks a very promising camera, but I wouldn't want to spend too much on something that is just a backup to my medium format gear and would mainly be used for holiday snaps.

Spare any Tmax?




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Old 01-05-2012   #98
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Users might be forced to use the EVF if they want to have M-glass on this body. Might not be worth the hassle for OVF workarounds on Fuji's end, when the EVF presents the same option as folks have had with u4/3 and NEX cameras.
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Old 01-05-2012   #99
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The difference is that the Contax G never had an EVF for SLR-like framing/focusing. I don't think anyone is going to be buying this camera primarily to use Leica M/LTM lenses, it's just a nice side benefit & can help users fill some focal length gaps given the limited initial lens offerings. For the same reasons, it would be nice for the M10, whenever it comes out, to have live view capability.

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This is what I suspect.
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Old 01-05-2012   #100
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There will definitely be folks buying it (or hoping to buy it) primarily for M-lenses. Not enough (per many previous arguments) for Fuji to design the camera around their desires, but more than a few.
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Old 01-05-2012   #101
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Not sure I sign on to the logic of avoiding a 35mm for this camera to avoid conflict with the X100.
I prefer 35mm to 50mm, but the interchangeable lenses and the virtual certainty of an eventual 35mm release are enough for me.
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Old 01-05-2012   #102
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I only commented on the used market, jsrockit. Real "Leica-men" buy new anyway.
Haha, true...
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Old 01-05-2012   #103
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Trying to adapt M lenses onto this camera is like sticking your M lenses into a Contax G.

Doesn't make sense.
I have to agree. I'll be using only its native lenses. However, there is one difference. The Fuji has manual focus rings on its lenses... I don't believe the G series lenses did (though I could be wrong).
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Old 01-05-2012   #104
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Looks simply incredible. 16mp with a new color array and no anti-aliasing filter. I think I'm finally sold!
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Old 01-05-2012   #105
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Hmmm, I wonder what type of shutter it uses. Leaf like the X100 or focal plane now?
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Old 01-05-2012   #106
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I dont get why they would stick to CMOS instead of CCD
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Old 01-05-2012   #107
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I think they just listened to the internet. When the X100 came out, a lot of people here and elsewhere stated "Not for me. Come back with a 50mm version". Now they start with 50mm and it's wrong again.
the fact is, no matter how natural 35mm feels, from time to time you just need/want 50... sometimes you feel a bit distant and 50mm for street shooter is de facto a tele-lens

personally, I always used 35mm and x100 was a natural choice, but,every now and then, I feel like doing more portraits, less docu on the streets, and I take my m6+50 if there was a x100 with 50mm ekv, I'd sell my m6 and buy that, for sure.
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Old 01-05-2012   #108
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Hmmm, I wonder what type of shutter it uses. Leaf like the X100 or focal plane now?
if there's a leaf shutter, lens prices will be, well, interesting
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Old 01-05-2012   #109
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Loving the way this looks. Can't wait to see how the camera performs. Particularly the longer FL lens. I want to see some portraits shot with it.
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Old 01-05-2012   #110
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I wonder when mere mortals might get their hands on one. 6 months?
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Old 01-05-2012   #111
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No 35mm-equivalent field of view lens? Fail!
Make that EPIC Fail!

Fuji, I didn't think you'd let idiots making decisions as important as that.
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Old 01-05-2012   #112
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I am wandering about the ergonomics of this camera.
Looking at the image from this French magazine article I am struck how awkward big the lens sticks out.
If the camera has the dimensions of a X100 I can only hold it between my fingertips. Recently I held the New Nikon V1 in my hands and found it very awkward.

Having a big lens sticking out makes it impossible to put it in your pocket. So you have to keep carrying it like a miniature SLR. Great on the one hand, SLR like performance on a smaller scale. But on the other hand how nice is is to actually handle the camera?

Time will tell, an amazing camera for sure!

Lets hope they will further develop the X100 as well...
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Old 01-05-2012   #113
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I just wonder why Fuji didn't announce it today with all the other umpteen cameras they announced

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Old 01-05-2012   #114
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Shoot at 28 and then crop to whatever focal length you want... Thats what Diado Moriyama has been doing for a long time.
That's why I'm not as worried about the 60mm long lens. It's a bit short for some specific needs I have, but 16mp gives me plenty of room to crop.
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Old 01-05-2012   #115
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Nice thing this new fuji,things are coming back to leica...the begining of the end to dslrīs and moving mirrors...

Nice effort on lenses specs they look quite fast but the thing is if theyīre going to be usable at full aperture.
I havenīt looked any x100 wo performance but people agree itīs enough.
My experience is with the elmarit from my gone x1 it was simply superb at 2.8, the 16mm lens of my current nex 5 dissapoints at 2.8 but for video itīs ok.

Very interesting device and wonder whatīs doing sigma with itīs foveon...

bye!
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Old 01-05-2012   #116
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I dont get why they would stick to CMOS instead of CCD
Been eons since i posted over here but htis announcement got me back

the answer is likely no live view option and no video with CCD. I would bet both features are there. personally i could live without either but mass market demands it. it's also quite possible this new micro lens array and no AA will address any issues people have ccd vs cmos.
Leica can stick to CCD because they are in a unique position in the market (though I thought the Leica evil rumours were going to be a cmos model)

anyway if it lives up to some of the initial hype I will probably dump some other gear and grab one of these with the 28 and 50 equivalents
for me the lack of 35 equivalent isn't as big a deal since i don't shoot at that focal length often and there is enough pixels to crop for it until they release one (as I certain they will - it's not like any brand releases a complete set of lenses day one)
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Old 01-05-2012   #117
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I am wandering about the ergonomics of this camera.
Looking at the image from this French magazine article I am struck how awkward big the lens sticks out.
Just like most fast 50mm lens on a Leica M.

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If the camera has the dimensions of a X100 I can only hold it between my fingertips.
It is rumored to be larger than the X100.

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Having a big lens sticking out makes it impossible to put it in your pocket. So you have to keep carrying it like a miniature SLR. Great on the one hand, SLR like performance on a smaller scale. But on the other hand how nice is is to actually handle the camera?
It's not a pocket cam. The X100 handles well... not sure why you think it doesn't.
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Old 01-05-2012   #118
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IR Focus maybe? Too silly?
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Old 01-05-2012   #119
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A lot can be done with hybrid VF and external focus. For example, frameline parallax correction for adapted lenses, or even project only a part of the EVF as hybrid "RF patch" into the viewfinder ....
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Old 01-05-2012   #120
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Upon thinking about this more, the Leaf shutter probably isn't going to happen if they want to allow users to use third party lenses... well, unless they rely on an electronic shutter for third party lenses.
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