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Optics Theory - This forum is aimed towards the TECHNICAL side of photographic OPTICS THEORY. There will be some overlap by camera/manufacturer, but this forum is for the heavy duty tech discussions. This is NOT the place to discuss a specific lens or lens line, do that in the appropriate forum. This is the forum to discuss optics or lenses in general, to learn about the tech behind the lenses and images. IF you have a question about a specific lens, post it in the forum about that type of camera, NOT HERE.

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Old 04-04-2019   #41
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Old 04-04-2019   #42
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Originally Posted by bushwick1234 View Post
the faster focusing X100F, which is not giving me the "perspective" concern you mention.
The X100 will give you exactly the same perspective distortion if you point it at the same subject from the same spot. As will any camera/lens with the same field of view.

This is one of the most baffling threads I've read on RFF...
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Old 04-04-2019   #43
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This thread is funny.

Maybe you can help me? I took a head shot portrait of my wife with a 15mm lens. To fill the frame I had to get really close, but now their nose looks really big? I'm going to return the lens, it's obviously faulty. I'm also going to sue for compensation because my wife was upset with the photo.

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Old 04-04-2019   #44
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Originally Posted by bushwick1234 View Post
Am not closed to opinions. And I am not saying Fuji is bad. After I tossed my X-T1 along with the 23mm f/2 I purchased again the X100, but this time the faster focusing X100F, which is not giving me the "perspective" concern you mention.
And after researching a bit I found out that the 23mm f/2 has indeed a tendency to distortion (trying to avoid the term flaw and issue). I should have done the research before I bought the camera-lens combo.
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Originally Posted by nickthetasmaniac View Post
The X100 will give you exactly the same perspective distortion if you point it at the same subject from the same spot. As will any camera/lens with the same field of view.

This is one of the most baffling threads I've read on RFF...
I think the 100F doesn't have the distortion because it focuses faster. The photo can be taken before the distortion appears.
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B&h
Old 04-04-2019   #45
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B&h

Nobody is mentioning the fact that B&H took back the lens and camera after an unknown period of time (months?). That is great customer service which should be acknowledged as such.
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Old 04-04-2019   #46
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Nobody is mentioning the fact that B&H took back the lens and camera after an unknown period of time (months?). That is great customer service which should be acknowledged as such.
Assuming that any it is actually the truth. Just like the lens distortion, we have no evidence of it occurring.
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Old 04-04-2019   #47
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Quote:
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I think the 100F doesn't have the distortion because it focuses faster. The photo can be taken before the distortion appears.

D**n... I've got to get one of those!!
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Old 04-04-2019   #48
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Old 04-04-2019   #49
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lol, did B&H take back the camera/lens that you said you purchased last year, despite there being no problems with it except your misunderstanding about distortion?
Quote:
Nobody is mentioning the fact that B&H took back the lens and camera after an unknown period of time (months?). That is great customer service which should be acknowledged as such.
Great customer service, fine. But B&H are not philantropists. So, other customers, somehow, are paying for such capricious behavior.
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Old 04-05-2019   #50
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Quote:
Originally Posted by michaelwj View Post
I think the 100F doesn't have the distortion because it focuses faster. The photo can be taken before the distortion appears.
This made my day. One of the funniest comments I've read on the RFF in a long, long while.
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Science FTW!
Old 04-05-2019   #51
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Science FTW!

Quote:
Originally Posted by michaelwj View Post
I think the 100F doesn't have the distortion because it focuses faster. The photo can be taken before the distortion appears.
Perfect explanation!
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Old 04-05-2019   #52
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Old 04-05-2019   #53
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Quote:
Originally Posted by nightfly View Post
I think from a practical perspective, you might be better off using a full frame camera which will allow you to use a less wide angle lens to get the same angle of view with less of what you are perceiving (and I agree) as distortion.

I understand the technical arguments here and they are probably technically correct.

However I also get that to you the images don't look right. Because a 23mm lenses feels distorted where a 35mm lens would feel more "normal" and less distorted.

This bugs me about APS-C and smaller also.
Thanks. Will try FF.
There are several lens reviews about this specific Fujifilm XF 23mm lens that point in the same direction and they mention the "higher order" distortion issue that can be only partially corrected with PS or other external software.
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Old 04-05-2019   #54
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Quote:
Originally Posted by LCSmith View Post
I am not an expert on lens design or on Fuji lenses. So, for all I know, you may be right.

What I do know is that tilting the camera does not cause undulating lines, like those green subway rails. In all discussions of lens distortion that I have seen, that is exactly what they are talking about -- curved lines that should be straight.
That is what it seems to me LCSmith.
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Old 04-05-2019   #55
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Quote:
Originally Posted by KenR View Post
Nobody is mentioning the fact that B&H took back the lens and camera after an unknown period of time (months?). That is great customer service which should be acknowledged as such.
Pedro
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Old 04-05-2019   #56
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Quote:
Originally Posted by nickthetasmaniac View Post
The X100 will give you exactly the same perspective distortion if you point it at the same subject from the same spot. As will any camera/lens with the same field of view.

This is one of the most baffling threads I've read on RFF...
Not all 23mm are built equally. Not all lenses in the same focal length are built equally. I thought you guys knew that.
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Old 04-05-2019   #57
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bushwick1234 View Post
Thanks. Will try FF.
There are several lens reviews about this specific Fujifilm XF 23mm lens that point in the same direction and they mention the "higher order" distortion issue that can be only partially corrected with PS or other external software.
You get tons of good advice (and some ridicule..) and choose to listen only to the one person who says buying more gear is the solution? Suit yourself. This is an expensive and slow way to learn, but I suppose it will work. Or you could learn about perspective. Pay some attention to what your own eyes see. If that's not enough, there are lots of resources on the internet and in libraries, some for photographers, probably more for drawing.
Do you know what theses higher order distortions are? If there are any, they wouldn't be visible in the examples you posted. But in any case they are automatically corrected in camera for JPEGs and in LR for lenses that LR has profiles for (like this one, I'm sure). These reviews were likely written when the lens first came out and there were no LR profiles yet.
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Old 04-05-2019   #58
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Originally Posted by bushwick1234 View Post
Not all 23mm are built equally. Not all lenses in the same focal length are built equally. I thought you guys knew that.
We do know that, no one in the thread has said otherwise.

But perspective distortion will be the same for both...
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Old 04-05-2019   #59
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Old 04-05-2019   #60
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bushwick1234 View Post
Thanks. Will try FF.
There are several lens reviews about this specific Fujifilm XF 23mm lens that point in the same direction and they mention the "higher order" distortion issue that can be only partially corrected with PS or other external software.
The curvature that isn’t in your images is the most basic distortion (actually the only true lens distortion). So called “higher order” distortions aren’t actually distortions, but aberrations and include coma, astigmatism, spherical and chromatic aberration.
The distortion that is visible in your image is called perspective distortion and has nothing to to with the lens and everything to do with the angle the picture was taken at (as in not at normal incidence to the object).
You definitely should try full frame. I hear it is excellent, and you know what they say about a fool and their money...
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Old 04-05-2019   #61
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bushwick1234 View Post
Thanks for the suggestions, but I returned the lens already. And the camera as well.
DXO is not for free, right? And there are many lenses that don't have distortion at all. Isn't it a paradox to have to purchase extra software to correct lens design flaws? To me the heavy distortion displayed by this lens is a serious flaw.
I predict you will be returning a lot of lenses and cameras.
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Old 04-05-2019   #62
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Quote:
Originally Posted by retinax View Post
You get tons of good advice (and some ridicule..) and choose to listen only to the one person who says buying more gear is the solution?

In all fairness to the many helpful replies, the OP got many replies filled with careful and correct explanations (that perspective distortion is not a lens distortion). The OP then ignored all this and said that the X100 didn’t have perspective distortion. Then said they’d try a bigger sensor to fix the “problem”. Then there might have been a teeny tiny bit of lighthearted well meaning ridicule.
There is a book by Amael Adams where he explains perspective and lens distortions very well called The Camera. He used LARGE FORMAT to get rid of it. Why stop at full frame?
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Old 04-05-2019   #63
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My large format pinhole photographs are even more distorted and the camera doesn't even have a lens! Let alone a Fuji one.

Perhaps I need an 8x10 one instead? Or perhaps it's possessed, and is there an exorcism plug-in in LR?

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Old 04-05-2019   #64
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Originally Posted by CharlesDAMorgan View Post
My large format pinhole photographs are even more distorted and the camera doesn't even have a lens! Let alone a Fuji one.

Perhaps I need an 8x10 one instead? Or perhaps it's possessed, and is there an exorcism plug-in in LR?
Obviously the hole is somehow defective. What type of pin did you use?
8x10 pffft. 11x14 as a starting point!
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Old 04-05-2019   #65
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Damn, it was a sewing needle, not a pin. I wonder if I can return it?
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Old 04-05-2019   #66
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Damn, it was a sewing needle, not a pin. I wonder if I can return it?
No wonder you have so much sewing distortion. It’s like the image is falling apart at the seams.
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Old 04-05-2019   #67
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Damn, it was a sewing needle, not a pin. I wonder if I can return it?
i heard there is a chance to exchange your hole somewhere beyond the sea of green.
(this cultural reference shows my age)
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Old 04-05-2019   #68
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No wonder you have so much sewing distortion. It’s like the image is falling apart at the seams.
Brilliant !

Looks like I haven't been stitched up then...
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Old 04-05-2019   #69
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also example of your "distortion"?
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Old 04-05-2019   #70
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Why has this thread incited such derision? I think you are all being a little hard on Bushwick.
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Old 04-05-2019   #71
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because he is obviously provoking people that wanted to help him understand that his lens has no distortion and to teach him basics...
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Old 04-05-2019   #72
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because he is obviously provoking people that wanted to help him understand that his lens has no distortion and to teach him basics...
I do not see any provocation on his part. Clearly he thinks there is an issue with the lens. I am not sure I disagree. Mocking his opinion is mean spirited and puerile.
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Old 04-05-2019   #73
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Not all 23mm are built equally. Not all lenses in the same focal length are built equally. I thought you guys knew that.
i see this as mocking and aggressive answer...
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Old 04-05-2019   #74
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If the OP doesn't like the Fuji 23mm f2, cool. Plenty of people out there use it and love it, despite any optical issues, which I believe are pretty minimal. Hopefully he finds a camera/lens that meets his needs and post some images for the community here to enjoy.


I'm still a bit confused by the whole thing, but I've also bought and sold lenses for reasons that probably don't make sense to anyone but me.
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Old 04-05-2019   #75
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Bushwick, here's a link to a helpful explanation of the difference between lens distortion (which I don't see in your example), and perspective distortion (which I do see in your example):

http://www.drewgrayphoto.com/learn/distortion101
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Old 04-05-2019   #76
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OP has returned the camera and lens. I think we are done here.
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Old 04-05-2019   #77
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OP has returned the camera and lens. I think we are done here.

Oops.. but I suspect he may find the problem cropping up in the replacement gear, given the deterioration of lens manufacturing these days.
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Old 04-05-2019   #78
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This sort of thread will continue to reappear as long as we live in the current physical model of the universe and have a shared sense of perspective, which leads to both converging lines at infinity and keystoning as a result of projecting usually wide angle fields of view on a 2 dimensional surface.
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Old 04-05-2019   #79
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There’s no way this wasn’t a troll thread.
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Old 04-05-2019   #80
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I was wondering about April Fool's, but maybe off by a day or two...
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