Go Back   Rangefinderforum.com > Cameras / Gear / Photography > Classic Film RangeFinders & Other Classics > 120 / 220 film RF's

120 / 220 film RF's 120 / 220 format rangefinders including Fuji, Koni-Omega, Mamiya Press, Linhof 6x7/6x9 cameras, Mamiya 6/7 among others, but excluding the 120 folders and the Voigtlander 667 cameras that have their own forums.

Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread Display Modes

The Koni-Omega 58mm/60mm Lenses (Yes, again!)
Old 09-15-2008   #1
JRG
Registered User
 
JRG is offline
Join Date: Mar 2007
Posts: 395
The Koni-Omega 58mm/60mm Lenses (Yes, again!)

Mr. Google and I have checked the archives here and elsewhere regarding the wide-angle lens for the Koni-Omega RF system. To review quickly, there were two such lenses, a 60mm f/5.6 and a (later) 58mm f/5.6. The issue is whether these were in fact the same lens.

It's a popular belief that they were. Here's a sample RFF thread where the consensus seemed to arrive at that position. (And there are some interesting hypotheses as to why the designation was changed from 60mm to 58mm.)

http://www.rangefinderforum.com/foru...ad.php?t=10841

Further, the article at Camerapedia says this: "There is a 58mm f/5.6 wide-angle lens. The actual focal length is 60mm but for various reasons is marked 58mm."

(http://www.camerapedia.org/wiki/Koni...List_of_lenses)


Now thanks to Mr. Butkus, there are complete user manuals available for most of the K-O cameras. Here's the manual for the early K-O Rapid cameras:

http://www.butkus.org/chinon/koni-om...mega_rapid.htm

And here's the manual for the later K-O M and Rapid M cameras:

http://www.butkus.org/chinon/koni-om...ega_system.htm

And finally, here's the manual for the Rapid 100/200 series:

http://www.butkus.org/chinon/rapid_o...ga_100-200.htm

(Thanks, Mr. Butkus!)

On p.17 of the K-O Rapid manual (first Butkus link), you'll find lens diagrams and descriptions for the available lenses. In the M/Rapid M and 100/200 manuals (2nd and 3rd Butkus links), the same information appears on p. 21 of the file.

OK, here's the deal: The Rapid manual shows the lens diagram for the 60mm f/5.6: The design is six elements in four groups (6/4). The M/Rapid M and 100/200 manuals show the lens diagram for the 58mm f/5.6. The design is eight elements in four groups (8/4).

Both designs are of a symmetric type, but 8/4 is different enough from 6/4 to support the conclusion that the design was re-computed when the lens description changed from 60mm to 58mm. And in that case, the Camerapedia claim about the 58mm lens,

"... The actual focal length is 60mm but for various reasons is marked 58mm."

would seem to be wrong.

Thoughts?
  Reply With Quote

Old 09-15-2008   #2
raid
Dad Photographer
 
raid's Avatar
 
raid is offline
Join Date: Nov 2005
Location: Florida
Posts: 30,777
I sold my 58mm lens with finder many years ago, so for me this is academic.
__________________
- Raid

________________


http://raid.smugmug.com/
  Reply With Quote

Old 09-16-2008   #3
KoNickon
Nick Merritt
 
KoNickon is offline
Join Date: Aug 2005
Location: Hartford, CT USA
Age: 61
Posts: 3,107
Wow -- a great piece of sleuthing. I have the Hexanon version, and I think it's the 58mm (8 element) version, but I would have to confirm.

It would be very interesting to see a comparison between the 6 and 8 element versions.
  Reply With Quote

Old 09-16-2008   #4
JRG
Registered User
 
JRG is offline
Join Date: Mar 2007
Posts: 395
Quote:
Originally Posted by KoNickon View Post
Wow -- a great piece of sleuthing ...
Thanks, but all I did was stare at the owner's manual for a bit. (And there are other interesting tidbits to be found there, but I haven't yet finished my "sleuthing" on that front.)

But isn't it sort of puzzling that with all the discussion this issue has triggered, no one looked in the owner's manual?
  Reply With Quote

Old 09-16-2008   #5
KoNickon
Nick Merritt
 
KoNickon is offline
Join Date: Aug 2005
Location: Hartford, CT USA
Age: 61
Posts: 3,107
I'm amazed no one noticed this before you -- which doesn't detract from your perceptiveness. (Of course, why someone would be looking at the two different owner's manuals is another story! But thank goodness for Mr. Butkus, indeed.
  Reply With Quote

Old 09-17-2008   #6
Abbazz
6x9 and be there!
 
Abbazz's Avatar
 
Abbazz is offline
Join Date: Jun 2005
Location: Karori (Aotearoa)
Posts: 802
Quote:
Originally Posted by JRG View Post
But isn't it sort of puzzling that with all the discussion this issue has triggered, no one looked in the owner's manual?
This reminds me of the pixel peepers on some forums endlessly arguing about the image quality of the Super-Takumar 135/3.5 without ever realizing that there are two distinct variations of this lens, the earlier with 5 elements (product number 43540) and the later with 4 elements (product number 43541).

Cheers!

Abbazz
__________________
Il n'y a rien dans le monde qui n'ait son moment décisif, et le chef-d'œuvre de la bonne conduite est de connaître et de prendre ce moment. - Cardinal de Retz

The 6x9 Photography Online Resource

  Reply With Quote

Old 09-17-2008   #7
furcafe
Registered User
 
furcafe's Avatar
 
furcafe is offline
Join Date: Oct 2004
Location: Washington, DC, USA
Age: 52
Posts: 4,303
Everyone knows that real men, & you have to be a real man to lug around a Koni on a hot summer day, can't be bothered to read no stinkin' instruction manuals.

Quote:
Originally Posted by JRG View Post
But isn't it sort of puzzling that with all the discussion this issue has triggered, no one looked in the owner's manual?
__________________
Five a Second. Chicago's Bell & Howell Co. (cameras) announced that it would put on sale this fall the world's most expensive still camera. Its "Foton" will take five 35-mm. pictures a second, sell for $700. Bell & Howell, which has found that "families of both low and high incomes now spend over $550" for movie equipment, hopes to sell 20,000 Fotons a year.
--Facts And Figures, Time magazine, Monday, October 4, 1948
My Photoblog

My Flickr stream

My RFF Gallery

My Instagram
  Reply With Quote

Old 09-17-2008   #8
JRG
Registered User
 
JRG is offline
Join Date: Mar 2007
Posts: 395
Quote:
Originally Posted by furcafe View Post
Everyone knows that real men, & you have to be a real man to lug around a Koni on a hot summer day, can't be bothered to read no stinkin' instruction manuals.
Yeah, I s'pose that might be it ...
  Reply With Quote

Old 09-22-2009   #9
raid
Dad Photographer
 
raid's Avatar
 
raid is offline
Join Date: Nov 2005
Location: Florida
Posts: 30,777
I wish I had kept the 58mm lens. It was a good lens.
__________________
- Raid

________________


http://raid.smugmug.com/
  Reply With Quote

Koi-Omega Wides
Old 4 Weeks Ago   #10
randy stewart
Registered User
 
randy stewart is offline
Join Date: Sep 2018
Posts: 95
Koi-Omega Wides

I first got into K-O many years ago, buying the 60mm lens. This lens was not impressive, i.e., not critically sharp. I bought a 58mm, which is razor sharp. so much so that I suspect that my 60mm was also just a bad copy of the lens. The 60mm is a knock-off of the Angulon; the 58mm is based on the Super Angulon design. The sale values on the K-O bodies and lenses (except 135mm) are so low that I've kept my system rather than selling it off. Still good to go on a moment's notice.
  Reply With Quote
Reply


Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

vB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off



All times are GMT -8. The time now is 04:34.


vBulletin skin developed by: eXtremepixels
Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.6.8
Copyright ©2000 - 2019, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.

All content on this site is Copyright Protected and owned by its respective owner. You may link to content on this site but you may not reproduce any of it in whole or part without written consent from its owner.