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120 film RF Folders 120/220 Format Folding Rangefinders, including the various classic Zeiss Ikontas, Voigtlander Bessas, and their Ruskie copies.

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classic 120 folder, without hood
Old 03-03-2014   #1
msbarnes
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classic 120 folder, without hood

Does anybody use a classic 120 folder without a hood?

What I want to know is if these lenses are flare-resistant. I would probably get a single-coated Tessar lensed folder (like a Zeiss Ikonta) to carry for scenes, but I would prefer to not attach a hood before every exposure.
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Old 03-03-2014   #2
farlymac
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As long as you don't point it towards a light source, or have the sun raking across the front, you should be alright. And cloudy days should be fine. But I usually try to have a hood on my folders as long as it doesn't interfere with the operation (being able to see the distance scale for one thing).

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Old 03-03-2014   #3
KoNickon
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The scarcity of hoods for these cameras means that I have to manage without a hood a lot of the time -- sometimes it's an odd size so there isn't a generic hood size that works. So as farlymac said, just be mindful of the tougher lighting situations.
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Old 03-03-2014   #4
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I can't really add to the advice above other than maybe a hand or hat outside of the lens viewing area may help without the need for a lens hood. Otherwise, just do the best you can. As was said, if you aren't shooting into the sun or have light across the lens, you will be fine. Sometimes even then you will get nice photos.
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Old 03-03-2014   #5
GaryLH
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I have push on lens hood for a couple of my folders, but I really don't use them much. I find that a hand in the right place works fine. Sometimes I have turned the lighter 6x6 folders upside down or sidewise so that the bed acts as a light shield depending on direction of sun.

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Old 03-03-2014   #6
sevo
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Clean single-coated Tessars do pretty well without hood. Indeed, cleaning will improve the average used folder lens far more than a hood could...
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Old 03-03-2014   #7
GaryLH
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Quite true.. One of the first things I always end up doing. It is surprising how much can accumulate over time.. Just shine a flashlight thru w/ shutter set to B

Gary
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Old 03-03-2014   #8
Thomas78
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I use my folders almost completely without a hood.

I have not yet seen any severe problems but I try not to point the lens directly to the sun. Here in Germany we have often an overcast sky, so that I do not miss it to often.


If you like you can take a look at the "folder section" of my flickr account:


http://www.flickr.com/photos/2649936...7632640264915/


Regards,
Thomas


Edit:

Two Images taken with te same camera with uncoated lens:

Phote took in the shadows:

Super Ikonta 530/2 with Tessar 105 mm f/3.8 (uncoated), Fomapan 100 in Rodinal 1:50


Super Ikonta 530-2_03_Fomapan 100_001 von thomas.78 auf Flickr


And here some Flare

Super Ikonta 530/2 with uncoated Tessar 105 mm f/3.8, Fomapan 100, HC 110 H, 10 min, one agitation every 15 s.


Super Ikonta 530-2_02_Fomapan 100_004 von thomas.78 auf Flickr

Last edited by Thomas78 : 03-03-2014 at 11:39. Reason: adding two samples
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Old 03-03-2014   #9
Ko.Fe.
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Moskva-2 and Bessa 66, lenses are coated at both of them.
Zeiss Nettar 515, uncoated lens.
No hood, no problems with all three of them.
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Old 03-03-2014   #10
mbisc
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Somewhere, I have a hood for my Bessa II (single-coated Color-Skopar), but I don't really use it.

Here is an example:

Sanchi - Great Stupa and West Torana (8x10 Print) by nbg90455, on Flickr
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Old 03-03-2014   #11
pakeha
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i have a Moskva 4 and use a generic hood attached with a step ring these are easy to find,
have found that a mamiya 330 hood will push on also.
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Old 03-03-2014   #12
Frank Petronio
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Moderate flare is part of the charm isn't it? If you wanted ultimate image quality you'd use something else....
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Old 03-03-2014   #13
Steve M.
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"If you wanted ultimate image quality you'd use something else"...

Very true Frank, unless you're talking about a Bessa II or Bessa RF w/ a Heliar lens. Those cameras consistently blew my Hassy and Rolleiflex cameras away in IQ. But for close ups and portraits, a folder is not the best idea.

I always use a hood on everything except Retinas, where the sideways film door and small coated lenses do not seem to need a hood. Invariably, the best shot on a roll will be the one w/ flare, so better to have a hood and not need it than to need it and not have it. If your lens is cloudy inside, then even a huge hood will not help you.
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Old 03-03-2014   #14
shortstop
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Thomas78 View Post
I use my folders almost completely without a hood. I have not yet seen any severe problems but I try not to point the lens directly to the sun. Here in Germany we have often an overcast sky, so that I do not miss it to often. If you like you can take a look at the "folder section" of my flickr account: http://www.flickr.com/photos/2649936...7632640264915/ Regards, Thomas Edit: Two Images taken with te same camera with uncoated lens: Phote took in the shadows: Super Ikonta 530/2 with Tessar 105 mm f/3.8 (uncoated), Fomapan 100 in Rodinal 1:50 Super Ikonta 530-2_03_Fomapan 100_001 von thomas.78 auf Flickr And here some Flare Super Ikonta 530/2 with uncoated Tessar 105 mm f/3.8, Fomapan 100, HC 110 H, 10 min, one agitation every 15 s. Super Ikonta 530-2_02_Fomapan 100_004 von thomas.78 auf Flickr
Flare is necessary in this shot. I like it
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Old 03-03-2014   #15
GaryLH
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Plus 1, SteveM comment

Bessa 2 w/ Heliar is my favorite medium format camera followed by the perkeo w/ Skopar. Voigtlander did an amazing job w/ those cameras... Those old lenses from Voitlander are really good. The Rollei w/ 80 planar has better micro contrast, the Heliar IMHO has better overall iq in terms of tonal quality which to me is better for b&w.

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Old 03-03-2014   #16
GaryLH
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One of the things to consider is manufacturing tolerances back then versus now. The skill of the particular assembler plays a bigger roll in overall image quality then if it is a 3 or 4 or 5 element lens design. I have a no name folder w/ a 3 element design that beats my super ikonta w/ a Tessar. Sometimes it is both where the manufacturer has tighter qa tolerences then the norm..

I am not sure when modern qa ideas started to kick in, but I would think that in early days it was the skill that mattered more.

Gary
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Old 03-03-2014   #17
Ernst Dinkla
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Quote:
Originally Posted by msbarnes View Post
Does anybody use a classic 120 folder without a hood?

What I want to know is if these lenses are flare-resistant. I would probably get a single-coated Tessar lensed folder (like a Zeiss Ikonta) to carry for scenes, but I would prefer to not attach a hood before every exposure.
I often wonder whether a quality multi coated filter could improve an uncoated or single coated lens on flare reduction.

I have the hoods for all my single coated folder lenses but rarely use them.

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Old 03-03-2014   #18
sevo
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ernst Dinkla View Post
I often wonder whether a quality multi coated filter could improve an uncoated or single coated lens on flare reduction.
No. Any filter adds extra glass/air surfaces, and as such, will add flare - a good multi coated one only very slightly, but still by a measurable, sometimes even visible, amount...
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Old 03-05-2014   #19
mbisc
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Frank Petronio View Post
Moderate flare is part of the charm isn't it? If you wanted ultimate image quality you'd use something else....
Yes and no -- I always want best IQ, but sometimes the required gear (Arca Swiss 4x5 on tripod) is not feasible, and then my folder has the best IQ given the circumstances.

Having said that, since I got a Medalist II, the old Bessa folder is not getting used a whole lot...
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Old 03-05-2014   #20
Thomas78
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mbisc View Post
...

Having said that, since I got a Medalist II, the old Bessa folder is not getting used a whole lot...
The Medalist II is indeed a very fine camera if you can accept its weight and size (and its ergonomy).
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Old 03-05-2014   #21
rwintle
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What KoNickon said way up there ^ ... I have no hood for my Nettar. Yes it flares, but not if pointed in the right direction.

It's got the Novar-Anastigmat lens if that helps.
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