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Business / Philosophy of Photography Taking pics is one thing, but understanding why we take them, what they mean, what they are best used for, how they effect our reality -- all of these and more are important issues of the Philosophy of Photography. One of the best authors on the subject is Susan Sontag in her book "On Photography."

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Old 02-17-2013   #1
Carterofmars
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Does the world appreciate photography anymore? I mean the final result; the art.
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Old 02-17-2013   #2
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Not really in the mainstream IMO. It's all instagram and cheese that seems to dominate to my eyes. There's plenty of great photography out there to see but it's not obvious ... you have to look.
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Old 02-17-2013   #3
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Quote:
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Not really in the mainstream IMO. It's all instagram and cheese that seems to dominate to my eyes. There's plenty of great photography out there to see but it's not obvious ... you have to look.
Keith!
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Old 02-17-2013   #4
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Keith!
good to hear from you
Cheers,
Brett
Thanks Brett ... hope all is well in your part of the world.
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Old 02-17-2013   #5
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I still see regular notices of exhibitions, I see new books of images coming out. Image sharing is a huge business. I think people still appreciate good photography as art.

I think that a lot of what is going on right now is a re-discovery of photography and the various forms, some good, some certainly not as good. But I think its wrong to assume that because we may not enjoy something ourselves automatically means it is not art.
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Old 02-17-2013   #6
pakeha
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yes, ah, no, gee i dunno
Our National Museum is intending to show a lot more.The local art galleries are showing more.We even have a photographer`s cafe here.
There is perhaps far more around these days and it is so much more accessible.
Is it seen as Art? I suspect not by the majority.
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Old 02-17-2013   #7
George Bonanno
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When are you guys going to wise up and realize that photography is not art ? It's simply a mechanical, chemical and or digital reproduction of reflected light.
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Old 02-18-2013   #8
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When are you guys going to wise up and realize that photography is not art ? It's simply a mechanical, chemical and or digital reproduction of reflected light.
Are you serious?
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Old 02-18-2013   #9
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Carterofmars View Post
Does the world appreciate photography anymore? I mean the final result; the art.
The "world"? . . . as one lumped group, the world doesn't appreciate anything !

The "art"? . . . what is that, other than an extremely arguable term ?

But, in general . . . the mass of people in the world absolutely love photography and sharing pictures, but they (in general) don't appreciate really great paintings, photos, computer creations.

Footnote: read around this forum. Many photographers don't appreciate the "final result" . . . they love a specific process of image making, and will dislike an image because of how it was created.

Yikes, that went on a bit, huh !


PS: you should move this to the "Philosophy" sub-forum.
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Old 02-18-2013   #10
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Carterofmars View Post
Does the world appreciate photography anymore? I mean the final result; the art.
Wow... a question as old as photography itself... and it implies that it once did.

Alfred Steiglitz spent his life trying to get the world to appreciate photography.

I think you have to be satisfied that you, and perhaps a group of your friends do. And you can influence people you know.
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Old 02-18-2013   #11
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Originally Posted by George Bonanno View Post
When are you guys going to wise up and realize that photography is not art ? It's simply a mechanical, chemical and or digital reproduction of reflected light.
Exactly, just like culinary.
It's just a mix of organic material and chemical, subjected to heat and pressure.

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Old 02-18-2013   #12
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Exactly, just like culinary.
It's just a mix of organic material and chemical, subjected to heat and pressure.

Or writing. Shakespeare's plays and Pratchett's novels are just words, put in order, right? There's no real skill involved.

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Old 02-18-2013   #13
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Originally Posted by George Bonanno View Post
When are you guys going to wise up and realize that photography is not art ? It's simply a mechanical, chemical and or digital reproduction of reflected light.
When are you going to realize that you lost this debate ONE HUNDRED YEARS AGO?

I'm serious. What makes George Bonanno so much smarter and more knowledgeable about what is art than the curators of the Museum of Modern Art, the Metropolitan Museum of Art, the Art Institute of Chicago, and the countless other art museums that have large collections of Photography, which they clearly label as art?
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Old 02-18-2013   #14
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I think the world loves photography in general.

Whether it "appreciates" photography, in the sense of "appreciating art" is an ongoing question mark.

G
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Old 02-18-2013   #15
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Carterofmars View Post
Does the world appreciate photography anymore? I mean the final result; the art.
Well . . . I think that your question has uncovered at least one person here who does not appreciate photography as art.
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Old 02-18-2013   #16
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Chriscrawfordphoto View Post
When are you going to realize that you lost this debate ONE HUNDRED YEARS AGO?

I'm serious. What makes George Bonanno so much smarter and more knowledgeable about what is art than the curators of the Museum of Modern Art, the Metropolitan Museum of Art, the Art Institute of Chicago, and the countless other art museums that have large collections of Photography, which they clearly label as art?
'Cause he's from New Jersey?

Easy, Chris... George's post has sarcasm dripping from each letter. I was quite amused.
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Old 02-18-2013   #17
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Not really in the mainstream IMO. It's all instagram and cheese that seems to dominate to my eyes. There's plenty of great photography out there to see but it's not obvious ... you have to look.
i think, photography gets more appreciation nowadays then e.g. 10 years ago. i wouldn't divide into mainstream and art. people, who are interested in art, are also influenced by mundane trends.
some years ago young intelligent people were more interested in music, literature, film or natural science. now with the general hype they of course also get into photography.


Quote:
Originally Posted by Chriscrawfordphoto View Post
When are you going to realize that you lost this debate ONE HUNDRED YEARS AGO?

I'm serious. What makes George Bonanno so much smarter and more knowledgeable about what is art than the curators of the Museum of Modern Art, the Metropolitan Museum of Art, the Art Institute of Chicago, and the countless other art museums that have large collections of Photography, which they clearly label as art?

is photography art? of course you can label it as art. but that doesn't mean, that it has the same freedom and possibilities as other crafts labeled under the term art like literature, painting, film, music.
it will never offer the same possibilities, freedom, depth and width of narrative.
i tend to concur siegfried kracauers view, that a photography is the better the less "arty" it is.
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Old 02-18-2013   #18
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Carterofmars View Post
Does the world appreciate photography anymore? I mean the final result; the art.
I don't know. Can't get a rise out of anyone in the Critque forum anymore.

Good to hear from you again, Keith.

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Old 02-18-2013   #19
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The Mona Lisa has been labeled as "Art"...I see it as a nice painting...that doesn't make it any less being "Art"...just because I don't get it doesn't mean it isn't...
Some people see Dogs Playing Poker as "Art"...
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Old 02-18-2013   #20
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When are you guys going to wise up and realize that photography is not art ? It's simply a mechanical, chemical and or digital reproduction of reflected light.
Just like painting.

Phil Forrest
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Old 02-18-2013   #21
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Just like painting.

Phil Forrest
Haha, nice Phil.
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Old 02-18-2013   #22
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Carterofmars View Post
Does the world appreciate photography anymore? I mean the final result; the art.
If you broaden your question, you will see the answer.

For eg, does the world appreciate painters anymore?
Does the world appreciate sculptors anymore?
Does the world appreciate glass blowers anymore?

The answer is yes....what does the fact that glasses and sculptures can be churned out via injection moulding.....same with all having a camera in hand (aka phone)....

Greater access to artistic tools does not mean that art ceases to be appreciated
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Old 02-18-2013   #23
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Oh yes, it just has to be good. And that takes time, patience, skill, technical knowledge, composition know how, understanding of light, and feeling for your craft. I still believe that many of the masters of photography could take a picture of an LA freeway and have a winner.
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Old 02-18-2013   #24
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Are you serious?
Yes Jay I am serious. When I arrive in Manila will you welcome me in open arms or shun me because of my view ?
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Old 02-19-2013   #25
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I'm starting to think that trolling can be a form of art.
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Old 02-19-2013   #26
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The world appreciates photography, but quantity over quality. And like if you only eat in a fast food restaurant you will forget how tastes can be. You go for the strong effects.
robert
PS: of course we cannot assume it as a general statement, there will always be (small) spaces for quality.
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Old 02-19-2013   #27
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Surely this is an argument which is impossible to resolve? If an unmade bed can be art, then surely so can a photograph. Some will say "it's just an unmade bed", and some will say "it's just a photo of a bloke walking down the street". If that's how it makes you feel, then it's not art to you. If you feel it's art, then it is to you.

It's not a unilateral decision anyone can make. Nobody can demand that you consider something art. Nobody can say that your work is not art.
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Old 02-19-2013   #28
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Listen to what an 11 year old knows from the Simpsons. My son it was who quoted to me Stewie Griffin's acerbic take on black and white film photography in Family Guy. Everyone is smarter. Photography has never been so appreciated as now, including the art. My two kids took photos before they were ten with camera phones with an eye that I still didn't have when I was 40. Whether it's the 4 million for the Gursky or the number of photographic exhibitions or the books or ebooks or the net generally or RFF in particular, good photography, photographic art, never had it so good.
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Old 02-19-2013   #29
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Carterofmars View Post
Does the world appreciate photography anymore? I mean the final result; the art.
The art? Sure, when it comes to sunsets, rainbows, and pretty things (calendar photos). However, the world thinks of photography as just a way to keep memories, get news, or to photograph what you like (new car, food, etc). Once you start getting conceptual and get away from the purely aesthetic, you lose a large majority of the population.
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Old 02-19-2013   #30
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Yes Jay I am serious. When I arrive in Manila will you welcome me in open arms or shun me because of my view ?
Welcome of course. And we will talk about John Szarkowski, Stephen Shore, John Berger, Susan Sonntag, and perhaps many others about photography beyond the fstops/composition/developing/which-lens-is-better/M9vsXP1 stuff.
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Old 02-19-2013   #31
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Photography is more than just about tools and techniques:

Years ago John Szarkowski wrote about how to look at photographs:
http://jnevins.com/szarkowskireading.htm

Stephen Shore's Nature of Photography, condensed:
http://www.carrieacosta.com/class/ad...hotographs.pdf

Two of just so many essays on how to *appreciate* a photograph beyond than just being a mere product of medium and technique, or of films and sensors, or of lenses and shutters.
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Old 02-19-2013   #32
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Quote:
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Does the world appreciate photography anymore? I mean the final result; the art.
It is my observation that the world at large, that is, the average layperson, doesn't appreciate or understand much of anyting except:

1. TV schedules
2. Celebrity Gossip
3. FOOTBAHHHHLLLLL
4. Fattening desserts

Anything beyond that is the purview of the intellectual, the artist, or the philosopher. Perhaps also the engineer and the mechanic.
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