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Old 06-01-2013   #41
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Originally Posted by mugent View Post
A government in office will *never* get good poll ratings in the UK, the UK population just hates whoever is in office, as it's the politicians who are to blame for every failing of their lives.
Yes. But as I mentioned above, Thatcher had the second-lowest average approval ratings of any PM in the post-war era. Even by UK standards she was loathed. The question is not whether Thatcher legitimately held office but rather whether, as you asserted, she was elected twice by "large majorities." That assertion is at odds with the record.
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Old 06-01-2013   #42
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Originally Posted by semilog View Post
Yes. But as I mentioned above, Thatcher had the second-lowest average approval ratings of any PM in the post-war era. Even by UK standards she was loathed. The question is not whether Thatcher legitimately held office but rather whether, as you asserted, she was elected twice by "large majorities." That assertion is at odds with the record.
When I say large majorities, I mean it in a electoral seats sense. The popular vote is fairly irrelevant in the voting system the UK has. Very unfortunate of course.
I doubt I ever would have voted for Thatcher, but the system the UK had put her there, just like it put all the others there, I don't really like the singling out of a Thatcher as somehow evil (I'm not saying you did), when leaders such as Blair did far worse things.
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Old 06-01-2013   #43
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The OP was trying to show us his work and maybe sell a few copies, but the whole thread may get bounced for this kind of "discussion." That would be too bad for the OP, who did some very nice work there.
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Old 06-02-2013   #44
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I should have realised that a post mentioning Thatcher would generate a heated discussion. To try and steer it back to the pictures and zine, here is the photo of the two gentlemen in bowler hats...



You may have noticed that there is a third bowler hatted gentleman just behind. If you're very good and this thread doesn't get bounced I'll post a photo of him later on!

Cheers
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Old 06-02-2013   #45
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Originally Posted by sar-photo View Post
If you are interested in being notified of new releases, you can sign up for the mailing list on the home page.

Cheers
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Simon, I've tried this but got only a error message:
Error:Not a valid email
Used browser firefox.
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Old 06-02-2013   #46
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I voted for Thatcher in 1979, as just one of the many millions who were suffering from the out of control trade unions at the time. She did exactly what we wanted, which was to challenge the unions' quasi-governmental status and restore the balance in this country.

The problem was that her success went to her head, as it has a tendency to do with some people. Instead of stopping and restoring balance to the country, she conceived a desire to change Britain's character entirely from a social democracy to a capitalist economy. In the process she destroyed the lives of hundreds of communities from Land's End to John O'Groat.

It is hardly surprising that many millions of people expressed pleasure at her demise and were angry at the use of public money to celebrate her life, something not done since the death of Winston Churchill.
This is, IMO, a very good summary. Sadly, I too voted for her in 1979, but within a couple of years I was regretting having played even the tiniest part in getting her into power. We are still living with her wretched legacy.

I did not "celebrate her death" - I reserve that attitude for the very farthest extremes of despotism - but I certainly found the grovelling tributes to her somewhat nauseating.

Back to the OP... great set of shots, sar-photo!
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Old 06-02-2013   #47
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So now i know what a zine is
"Zines are self-published, small-circulation, often nonprofit books, papers, or websites. They usually deal with topics too controversial ....."

love the image of the two guys in bowler hats, so very, um..English
you planning on doing the George W. funeral?
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Old 06-02-2013   #48
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What kind of low class ignorant people are we raising today? You protest during their time in office, vote for the other guy sure, but to dance on their grave shows serious charachter flaws...
Courage comes in many forms, and a good test for a democracy is whether one can do exactly that.

One thing is to protest the celebration of somebody's legacy (which a state funeral was) and to dance on somebody's grave is another (like on May 2nd, 2011). When the boogeyman is done with, people celebrate, others protest the celebration.

Democracy's hot potato is actually a roasted radish: hard to please everyone with it.
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Old 06-02-2013   #49
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Originally Posted by sar-photo View Post
I should have realised that a post mentioning Thatcher would generate a heated discussion. To try and steer it back to the pictures and zine, here is the photo of the two gentlemen in bowler hats...

You may have noticed that there is a third bowler hatted gentleman just behind. If you're very good and this thread doesn't get bounced I'll post a photo of him later on!

Cheers
Simon
I like that shot, and the framing/cropping (what was it shot with?)
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Old 06-02-2013   #50
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Originally Posted by Gabriel M.A. View Post
I like that shot, and the framing/cropping (what was it shot with?)
It was shot on an X-Pro1 and obviously cropped a bit!
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Old 06-02-2013   #51
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Are you up for a zine swap?

I have a new one out this month:

www.thomaswhittle.bigcartel.com
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Old 06-02-2013   #52
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Al Patterson View Post
If you cannot find respect for the resident of the office, then you don't respect the office.
This point of view has always intrigued me. I see it a lot in US films/drama series, and didn't know if it was a view real people had, or was just invented for TV. I have always felt that a person should earn respect, and if say, Nixon did not earn respect, then he should not get it simply because he was elected into office.

Also, why should anybody respect the office? Politicians put together a system, maybe add some gravitas with a pseudo-military quality like in the USA, and respect naturally follows?

I'm not against the USA's form of government, and I'm not expressing a view on the quality of Presidents past or present. My only point is that politicians in the post don't deserve respect automatically, and the office itself does not deserve respect automatically.

Politicians are, in the UK, at least, public servants, it is they who should be calling us 'Sir' and 'Mr Electorate' or whatever, not the other way round, in my view.
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Old 06-02-2013   #53
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Originally Posted by thegman View Post
My only point is that politicians in the post don't deserve respect automatically, and the office itself does not deserve respect automatically.
Well, except for Reagan. And Nixon. And Bush2.

I love your Mexican Dress Shops zine Simon, I'll be ordering this one shortly.
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Old 06-02-2013   #54
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Truly excellent photographs, I love the shot with the bowlers!
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Old 06-02-2013   #55
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Sejanus.Aelianus View Post
I do apologise for my part in the hijack.

May I ask, how many of these 'zines you have made and how many copies of each? Rather a long time ago, I was involved in the production of small publications and they were a struggle to sell, even then. I'm curious as to whether or how you make it pay.
This is my fifth zine and each is limited to 100 copies. I design them and create the digital version which is sent to printers - so the printing is all I have to pay for. There are a few shops that stock them but most of my sales are over the internet.

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Simon
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Old 06-02-2013   #56
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May I ask what a zine is? I know photobooks with softcover that looks similar.
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Old 06-02-2013   #57
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Zines are self published, small circulation, limited edition booklets. They can contain text, drawings, pictures, photographs etc.

Cheers
Simon
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Old 06-02-2013   #58
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Great work Simon. I read a lot of comic art zines and love the format.
I feel that people should produce more photography zines. Holding something tangible is photography to me. I much prefer the printed medium.
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Old 06-02-2013   #59
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I've ordered one of the zines too. I'm interested in both the format and in your photography. Keep up the good work!
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Old 06-02-2013   #60
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I feel that people should produce more photography zines. Holding something tangible is photography to me. I much prefer the printed medium.
Luckily, people now are probably producing more zines (and self-published books) than ever!
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Old 06-02-2013   #61
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If anyone is interested in producing zines of their work under the Fistful of Books imprint please PM me - I'd love to produce zines of other peoples work!

Cheers
Simon
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Old 06-02-2013   #62
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as mentioned above, many folks supported her:

http://www.rollingstone.com/movies/v...ketch-20130415
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Old 06-02-2013   #63
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If you are interested in being notified of new releases, you can sign up for the mailing list on the home page.

Cheers
Simon
Thank you

I will sign up now.

I wanted to come back to this thread and offer a kind of apology, as is very obviously true, Thatcher is someone that people feel strongly about, and I very obviously went for the red rag.

Whilst I stand by everything I said, and if some people think it's not classy of me then I'm perfectly ok with that. That wasn't what the thread was started about. It was about the photography.

The work looks great, and congratulations on getting it put together in a great form and getting it out to people, rather than continue frothing at the mouth, I wanted to congratulate you on your project.
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Old 06-02-2013   #64
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Thank you

I will sign up now.

I wanted to come back to this thread and offer a kind of apology, as is very obviously true, Thatcher is someone that people feel strongly about, and I very obviously went for the red rag.

Whilst I stand by everything I said, and if some people think it's not classy of me then I'm perfectly ok with that. That wasn't what the thread was started about. It was about the photography.

The work looks great, and congratulations on getting it put together in a great form and getting it out to people, rather than continue frothing at the mouth, I wanted to congratulate you on your project.
Cheers! I understand that even after 20 odd years there are some parts of the country that are still feeling the aftershocks of her government. I appreciate you taking the time to apologise (although I'm not sure an apology was necessary as everyone is entitled to their opinion!).

Simon
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Old 06-02-2013   #65
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I, too, should apologise, though it was just an innocent query.

I shan't be ordering this zine, as the memories are too raw, but I am impressed with your reportage style, and fascinated by the zine format, which makes your images look like a feature from Picture Post.

I don't think my images are up to the mark yet, but I quite like the idea of small-scale self-publishing, so I may ask you for more info on the details. Meanwhile, I'll browse your other zines, and think about a purchase.

Thanks again for bringing this to our attention.
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Old 06-02-2013   #66
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The bowler pic initially struck my eye...but then I read on.
Regardless, very nice zine Simon!

So instead of discussing M. Thatcher, can we now discuss sepiareverb's new avatar?
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Old 06-03-2013   #67
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Here's the photo of the third bowler hatted gent...



Cheers
Simon
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Old 06-03-2013   #68
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Nicely observed.
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Old 06-03-2013   #69
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So, I assume the gents in bowlers work in the City, yes? This is some sort of unofficial uniform from what I can divine. One of those "there'll always be an England" things.

I like your photos. As for Mrs. Thatcher, I'll reserve judgment since I have never lived in the UK. (So I guess Tony Blair won't get a state funeral, or Mr. Cameron. What are the criteria, one wonders.)
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Old 06-03-2013   #70
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So, I assume the gents in bowlers work in the City, yes? This is some sort of unofficial uniform from what I can divine. One of those "there'll always be an England" things.

I like your photos. As for Mrs. Thatcher, I'll reserve judgment since I have never lived in the UK. (So I guess Tony Blair won't get a state funeral, or Mr. Cameron. What are the criteria, one wonders.)
There are those who would vote for giving either a state funeral RIGHT NOW. (Sorry: very old joke. For years now, Redmolotov -- www.redmolotov.com -- has been selling a T-shirt which said, "I wanted to give Thatcher a State Funeral years ago")

No connexion -- but I've been wearing Redmolotov T-shirts for a long time, including the one that says

BEEN THERE

DONE THAT

THIS IS THE T-SHIRT

Cheers,

R.
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Old 06-04-2013   #71
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Hadn't heard of redmolotov so I went to the site. I note one t-shirt available there says "STILL HATE THATCHER." Wonder if there was an uptick in sales of that one recently.
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