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Old 09-11-2018   #41
NickTrop
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Cameras are like PCs in the 90's. Wow -- did you see the clock speed of that new AT PC? And it can have 512 KB of ram! And a 100 MB hard drive! The the bus speed is xxx mbps! It has a 56k built-in dial-up modem! I'm ditching my XT!

Now? Meh. Whatever. What's on sale will do... great deals on last year's model.

PC tech has matured. So have cameras. Nobody cares.
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Old 09-11-2018   #42
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If they re-release the Mamiya 7ii i would be interested.
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Old 09-12-2018   #43
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Originally Posted by ptpdprinter View Post
Not jaded, just not overawed. It seems the camera bodies are still playing catch-up to Sony, though I can see the attraction if you are already a Canon or Nikon owner. Tribalism is strong.
This.

Digital camera technology has matured, as happened with personal computers and, later, mobile phones. A decade ago, 2 years passing - a typical camera generation - meant a huge leap in camera performance and features; today, 2 years results in evolutionary not revolutionary advances.

I bought my first digital camera in 2000, a Fuji 2700. It had 2 MP and created only JPG files, yet a review described it as “Resolution is extremely high ... probably the ultimate portable digicam”. Three years later I bought a Canon 10D, a sophisticated 6 MP digital SLR with quality and features that rivalled 35mm film (the Fuji wasn’t even close), and can hold its own today if you’re not making massive prints (unlike the Fuji, which is far surpassed by even the cheapest phone).

As a digital camera user, it was necessary to upgrade regularly. If you didn’t, you were at a disadvantage - and it showed, either in print quality or significantly inferior or missing camera features (my Canon 10D was awful above ISO 400).

Things are different today. I no longer feel compelled to upgrade my camera regularly to the latest technology. I bought my last new camera in 2012, a Nikon D800E, and replaced it this spring - 6 years later - with a Sony A7R II. A 6 year interval. Note that despite the long interval between cameras, I didn’t buy the latest A7R III model. There is no noticeable difference in image quality between my Nikon and the latest cameras.

The reason I upgrade now is not because of better features or image quality but for changes in preference. For example, I bought the Sony because I wanted an electronic viewfinder and in-camera image stabilisation.

I cannot ever see myself buying another digital camera because of improvements in image quality or features, simply because these no longer occur to any worthwhile extent.

I think digital cameras are now in the same place that film cameras were in the 1980s, where the existing technology cannot be improved significantly, only replaced by something new - my guess would be the demise of still photography in its entirety, being replaced by video and virtual reality.

Presumably camera manufacturers have a new game plan, because people no longer buy an expensive new camera every couple of years. I’d like to know what this plan is...

My first digital camera, below. The technology is obsolete, and even the language: when did you last hear the word “digicam”? Most people once again simply use “camera”, since “film camera” is unlikely to be meant today.

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Old 09-12-2018   #44
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bhop73 View Post
I'm not really jaded, I just don't care. The cameras I currently own are all I want or need.
This.

Quote:
Originally Posted by teddy View Post
I don't care about digital technology any more when it comes to cameras.

The more digital stuff that comes out, there more I love my Leicas, Rolleiflex, Hasselblads, Olympus , Pentax, etc etc..
And this.
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Old 09-12-2018   #45
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@RichC - you're so right about the march of progress and the slowing of technological advancement. My first digital camera (digicam, haha) was the Canon S45, a 4mp silver brick which I thought was pretty darn good. It actually was good, and with careful exposure and shooting raw can produce some decent images, but less money will buy a Ricoh GR these days. I have a Canon 30D which still takes decent pictures and a 5D Mark II which I occasionally break out if a client wants good images. Funnily, as the years have gone by, my Lightroom and compositions skills have improved, so I'm able to take much better images now than I could when I first got them.

I've got more gear than I really need, which is part of the 'meh' feeling I get about new gear announcements. Even the M10 didn't get me very excited because I'm still happy with my M9, eight years on.
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Old 09-12-2018   #46
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Not Jaded

I’m not jaded, my appetite's not faded
Bring on the new toys, the shiny objects
The things that are supposed to turn us on
They won’t compare to what we’ve loved
Not today, not tomorrow, give it ten or fifteen
Then we’ll see

Jaded’s for the other guys, the wise guys
The camera snobs of yesteryear
The camera gear boys that swear by the big “L”
That tell everyone else to go to hell
Who swear that sharp ain’t sharp
Unless they say it is so

Lou Reed wasn’t Jaded, he was a rock ‘n’ roll...
Animal
He wasn’t afraid to experiment, to try new things
Like Bowie, he had a new kind of song to sing
Changes, Ch-ch-ch-ch-changes that’s what David said
Bring on the new cameras, new blood to be bled
That’s what he said, that’s what he said

Just having fun with words,
Mike
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Old 09-12-2018   #47
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Quote:
Originally Posted by NickTrop View Post
Cameras are like PCs in the 90's. Wow -- did you see the clock speed of that new AT PC? And it can have 512 KB of ram! And a 100 MB hard drive! The the bus speed is xxx mbps! It has a 56k built-in dial-up modem! I'm ditching my XT!

Now? Meh. Whatever. What's on sale will do... great deals on last year's model.

PC tech has matured. So have cameras. Nobody cares.
I agree completely Nick... this is how I feel.
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Old 09-12-2018   #48
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I’m actually excited by the new Nikon Z, but that’s about it.
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Old 09-12-2018   #49
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I was thinking more about it.

If I like street photography in galleries and museums on darkroom prints and if I'm still trying to pursue it on my own, then photakina is lingerie sale event and I'm cowboy. They might have odd booth with boots, but most likely they are going to be kinky.
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Old 09-12-2018   #50
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ko.Fe. View Post
I was thinking more about it.

If I like street photography in galleries and museums on darkroom prints and if I'm still trying to pursue it on my own, then photakina is lingerie sale event and I'm cowboy. They might have odd booth with boots, but most likely they are going to be kinky.
Haha, very eloquent...
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Old 09-12-2018   #51
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I am still waiting for Zenit to Launch that Full Frame Mirrorless digital camera that was promised to us before I get jaded.

https://petapixel.com/2017/08/21/zen...s-camera-2018/
Just so long as it's more reliable than Leicas (which doesn't seem that difficult to do) and you can still whack muggers over the head with it and it still works afterwards, just like a Zenit EM.
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Old 09-12-2018   #52
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I am almost completely jaded by and uninterested in most of the recently new camera announcements. I was in a well stocked camera shop last week with the full lines of Canon, Nikon, Sony, and Olympus and I found nothing of any interest.

With regard to increased resolution, I have beautiful 16″ by 20″ prints on my wall that I made with my 6MP Nikon D40. I don't need to print bigger than that, and my MacBook Air struggles with images files bigger than about 12MP anyway.

More importantly, I find I don't care for the look of the images from most of the newer super high dynamic range cameras. The images look overprocessed and have a sort of harshness (for lack of a better word) that I find unattractive. Maybe it's the way a lot of the users of these cameras process their images to show off the tremendous dynamic range of the sensors rather than make an attractive photograph, but I am noticing this very consistently. If I see an image on Flickr that has this look and I check the EXIF it is almost always from a Sony A7 series camera. (iPhone X photos have the same unpleasant look to my eyes.)

I'm also not excited by more features. In fact the only new cameras I find particularly appealing are the Leica M-10 and M-10P that have significantly _fewer_ features than their predecessors. And from what I've seen, files from these cameras do not have the "overprocessed" look that I dislike.

Now if the camera manufactures would produce new /updated versions of the CLE, FE, FM3A, OM-1n, 35RC, XA, K1000, KX, or GR1, then I might be excited.
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Old 09-12-2018   #53
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My GAS is cured. Nothing new will improve my photography.

Mirrorless makes me dizzy and I really do not see the advantage.

My Leica M`s are mirrorless already. Leica picture quality is always better when I compare with my Nikons. Leicas have tone separation the Nikons do not give and that can not be fixed with photoshop.
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Old 09-12-2018   #54
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The race to the top will have some casualties and more than a few detractors, apparently.
Anyway, where's my contax t3 sized, curved aps-c sensored, fixed focal e-35mm lens camera?! Technologically doable today but nada, zilch, not happening! lol
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Old 09-12-2018   #55
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Phones and cameras has been boring for a many years now. We don’t need new cameras but sony, nikon and the other brands need to trick us to belive that we do. I mean, some of the best photos ever taken are shot with old bad film, no lightmeter and bad lenses. And for the videographers, the movies that people have been making for the last years with dslrs are so good! The quality is better than a lot of old classic movies. We don’t need 4k, 8k, 16k and so on. But we think we do. We are no longer creators, we are technicians. We produce a lot of pictures and videos, but all look the same and 99% is crap. Not because people are bad photographers or videographers, it’s because people love the harware more than creating. I think that more than 50% of photographers today are not in to photography, they are in to cameras.
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Old 09-12-2018   #56
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Not because people are bad photographers or videographers, it’s because people love the harware more than creating. I think that more than 50% of photographers today are not in to photography, they are in to cameras.
And film photographers never upgraded their film cameras? Yet the film itself remained largely the same, so how were images any better? Who needs a built-in meter? Who needs an automatic diaphragm? Who needs auto exposure? Who needs auto focus? Who needs plastic fantastic? Yet someone bought all of the above. It kept the film camera industry alive for fifty years. But perhaps you would be satisfied with film cameras as they existed in the 1950s. Some people are.
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Old 09-12-2018   #57
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How about the camera phone release cycle and how each time a new one comes out the death of traditional cameras is imminent? I`d rather hear about the latest me too mirrorless than the latest phone with 5 cameras and software that slaps 16 images together to make something usable.
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Old 09-12-2018   #58
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Many years ago and I mean many years ago, I was in the process of buying a VW Beetle. My brother said that for not much more money, I could get a Ford Mustang. Faster, better handling, etc. My response was no because with all the features that Mustang has (speed), I would probably just wrap it around a tree, so I stuck with the Beetle. Nuff said.
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Old 09-12-2018   #59
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Yep - got me a used X-E2 a couple of years ago, using an X-E1 as back up. I haven't felt any GAS since then and can´t see any reason to upgrade until one of them gives in. As several of you have remarked: The market has matured.


Same goes for phones; I am using a Huawei Y625 that I bought for £50 more than a year ago. As I don't use my phone for games, there is no need to upgrade until it falls apart.


Kind of nice being able to focus on what I am doing, rather than on the tool
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Old 09-12-2018   #60
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About the only cameras that appeal to me are all at least 4-5 years old or older.
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Old 09-12-2018   #61
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Not jaded; one of the unexpected benefits of switching to film a decade back was that I suddenly found myself refreshingly indifferent to new or upcoming cameras and related technologies. It’s not that I don’t loosely follow new releases out of broader curiosity, but I’m absolutely happy with what I have (which happens to be 1950s tech, so right, who needs batteries?).
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Old 09-12-2018   #62
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In another few years, I might picked up a clean used Leica M10. Make that five+ years.

Video work is another thing entirely, as the technology of video is advancing much more quickly and better tech is moving in the cheaper and cheaper cameras. I'm still keen to get a GH5s, particularly after a weekend shoot with the GH4 and Voigtlander lenses still left me wanting better high ISO and dynamic range.

Stills photography cameras have been at a 'good enough' level for some years, now. I think this is what is fueling my 'meh' about all the new stuff which, in the past, would have sent me into paroxysms of excitement.
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Old 09-13-2018   #63
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Larry Cloetta View Post
Camera technology long ago passed the point where most any camera I could buy could do anything I could possibly ever need a camera to do, and then some.
+1.
Therefore I look at all the new cameras very, very relaxed.
I don't feel any need or pressure to buy anything. The money saved I can spend on travelling and making pictures.

The camera news are now more like a bit of 'entertainment' for me.....

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Old 09-13-2018   #64
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I hope they release 50 more Leica M versions and the market becomes so saturated that one day I might be able to afford a second hand M9 or M10.
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Old 09-13-2018   #65
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Originally Posted by ptpdprinter View Post
And film photographers never upgraded their film cameras? Yet the film itself remained largely the same, so how were images any better? Who needs a built-in meter? Who needs an automatic diaphragm? Who needs auto exposure? Who needs auto focus? Who needs plastic fantastic? Yet someone bought all of the above. It kept the film camera industry alive for fifty years. But perhaps you would be satisfied with film cameras as they existed in the 1950s. Some people are.
Well, a lot of us are happy with the M2 and M3 and they don't get more 50's than that...

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Old 09-13-2018   #66
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my newest camera is from 1988, I couldnt care less about the new digital world.
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Old 09-13-2018   #67
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I owned a Pentax 6x7 and Lenses.
It was a wonderful camera, giving outstanding results!
The lenses are superb, a tad less than Hasselblad's Zeiss,
BUT the film runs in a straight line..
The end exposure to my eyes better..
The weight, size and bulk was way too big for me!
Now we see monster size lenses and huge bodies!
On smaller formats..the images all over sharpened,
looking like comics, color that cause bleeding of the eyes,
Sorry, using the latest digital is a simple,
"Is that all?".
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Old 09-13-2018   #68
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This is reminding me of Peggy Lee singing “Is that all there is”.

Is that all there is, is that all there is
If that's all there is my friends, then let's keep dancing
Let's break out the booze and have a ball
If that's all there is


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Old 09-13-2018   #69
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If you have the gumption to memorize how to navigate most of the settings in the CSM on a modern digital camera, they can be powerful instruments.

My issue, is do I really need a 40 plus megapixel full frame camera?
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Old 09-13-2018   #70
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Someone needs to re-introduce the Radio-Camera.
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Old 09-13-2018   #71
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As someone that prefers the film aesthetic, a camera like the M2 does all that I could want. Lenses (new or old) are more interesting than new camera releases. I like the idea of the M10 (or similar), but I can't help but think the output will be just like any other digital camera. It would gradually erode away the pleasure I derive from photography. So personally.. I don't pay much attention to the latest Nikon, Canon, Fuji.. etc.

I'd like to see a digital Barnack - though I cannot commit to buying ;-)
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Old 09-14-2018   #72
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Anyone else jaded by all these new cameras?
I'm bored beyond belief. New cameras now just seem to get the fan boys excited so that they can claim theirs is better than the competition. It is so infantile. I stopped caring about digital cameras about 5 years ago and have enjoyed being out of that rat race ever since then.

Digital cameras are simply not important to me. At all.

My iPhone does all that I need if I want to shoot digital. I used to upgrade every year with digital cameras. Now I save thousands of dollars instead of spending them.
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Old 09-14-2018   #73
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In short, yes. I'm over it. With film cameras, they were released every decade, or maybe ever 5 years with huge upgrades. You could shoot a 500c the day the 501cm was released and still be considered a serious photographer.

Now, however, it seems like your camera matters as much as your images, at least in the eyes of the average person. Almost every single thing that is included in new cameras is something I don't need, and I can speculate that most people dont *need* all that stuff, either. It is just talking points to knock your rivals who shoot xxx instead of what you shoot, yyyy.

Is the Z or R series mirrorless wholly capable? I'm sure they are. I'd be happy to use either. I'd be happy using a nikon d700 or a canon 5d mk1, they are completely capable. But to read how people talk about cameras, if you don't upgrade the moment they come out, you're not good. it is frustrating.
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Old 09-14-2018   #74
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But to read how people talk about cameras, if you don't upgrade the moment they come out, you're not good. it is frustrating.
Only if you listen to them. Remember, most of the people saying that derive their income from links to camera and accessory sellers.
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Old 09-17-2018   #75
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The more I think about it the more I think I really do need a good set of Contarex lenses
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Old 09-17-2018   #76
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.. I like the idea of the M10 (or similar), but I can't help but think the output will be just like any other digital camera. . ..
The same can be said of film cameras.
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Old 09-18-2018   #77
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Well I was getting excited, being a 30 year Nikon user, but after studying all the new releases, thought about it and bought a low mileage Nikon Df, could not be happier, GAS over!

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Old 09-18-2018   #78
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Well I was getting excited, being a 30 year Nikon user, but after studying all the new releases, thought about it and bought a low mileage Nikon Df, could not be happier, GAS over!

http://filmisadelight
I like the Df but always have a hard time figuring out how to put the film in it.
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Old 09-18-2018   #79
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I must admit that I`m much less interested than I was although the advent of the Sony cams seems to be a worthwhile gamechanger .

Well …. they`ve been useful for me , other than that I continue to use my M and Pentax film bodies.
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Old 09-18-2018   #80
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Originally Posted by Ted Striker View Post
I'm bored beyond belief. New cameras now just seem to get the fan boys excited so that they can claim theirs is better than the competition. It is so infantile. I stopped caring about digital cameras about 5 years ago and have enjoyed being out of that rat race ever since then.

Digital cameras are simply not important to me. At all.

My iPhone does all that I need if I want to shoot digital. I used to upgrade every year with digital cameras. Now I save thousands of dollars instead of spending them.
That’s the thing - at this point in digital camera evolution, there is no point for the majority of users to upgrade bodies frequently. I’m shooting with what some would consider to be ancient DSLR bodies, and I’m happy. The Zs have the potential to replace a whole bunch of nonstandard gear for me, that’s what has gotten my interest.
__________________
"If you can control yourself and just loathe us quietly from a distance then by all means stay." - Joe

Leica: M-P Typ 240 - M6 - Leicavit M - RapidWinder - Motor M - 21 Super-Elmar - 28 Ultron - 35 Summicron ASPH - 40 Summicron - 75 APO-Summicron ASPH - 75 Summarit-M - 75 Color-Heliar - 90 Elmar-C
Nikon RF: S2 - S3 2000 - 35/2.5 - 50/2 - 50/1.4 Millennium - 105/2.5 - 135/3.4
X-Pro2, X-M1, X100s, NEX-7, dp0 Quattro, N1V1, N1V2, oodles of other stuff
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