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Considering a not too fast small and very modern 35mm - any recommendations?
Old 1 Week Ago   #1
krötenblender
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Considering a not too fast small and very modern 35mm - any recommendations?

Hi,

a little bit different that most here, it seems, I like clear (clinical, some may say) sharp rendering on a digital M.

For one of my next trips I consider buying one to accompany my Zeiss Distagon ZM 35/1,4 on the M10. Sometimes it's just too big and heavy and not the fastest to focus. I prefer focussing tabs over Zeiss' focussing knobs, but I can live with them, if I have too.

Any recommendations for clean/clinical extra sharp and at the same time small and light 35mm? 2,0-2,8 is okay for me, and I'm looking at the two Zeiss Biogons, maybe a Leica Summarit (the new ones, either 2,5 or 2,4) or something Voigtländer has to offer. I think, the 7artisans and similar are not what I'm searching for.

The Biogon 2,0 is a little big, but much smaller than the Distagon and I read many good things about it's image quality. The Biogon 2,8 seems to have a more classical rendering, if I read correct. Also I was sometimes surprised by the quality of Voigtländer-Lenses, but not so sure about the Color Skopars regarding my requirements.

So, what are your thoughts? Any recommendations?

Thanks in advance,
Stephan
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Old 1 Week Ago   #2
Larry Cloetta
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Zeiss 35mm F/2.8 C-Biogon checks off all your boxes, and I imagine you will get others recommending same.
Sold mine about 3 years ago, friend at the time told me I would regret it. So true. Will probably be the only thing I ever buy a second time after having once, and then sold.
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Old 1 Week Ago   #3
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https://www.rangefinderforum.com/for...d.php?t=167382

I like it.
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Old 1 Week Ago   #4
nickthetasmaniac
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Voigtlander 35/f1.7 Ultron (VM)

Size may not quite fit the brief, but rendering certainly does...
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Old 1 Week Ago   #5
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Is budget a problem? Are you set on f2? There's also the Nokton Classic 35mm f1.4, either single- or double-coated. I have one and like it a lot. It may not be "clinically" sharp, but it delivers sharpness where you want it and a nice OOF area. A few weeks ago I was talking to an old employee at Central Camera and he confirmed to me what I suspected already: this CV lens is probably a copy of a previous version of the Summilux (you know, the improved one from the late 60s).
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Old 1 Week Ago   #6
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- Zeiss 35mm f/2.8 C Biogon
- Voigtlander 35mm f/2.5 Color-Skopar
- Voigtlander 35mm f/2 Ultron
- Leica 35mm f/2.4 Summarit-M
- Konica 35mm f/2 UC-Hexanon with LTM adapter

There are other lenses to look at, but they are larger and/or have a more vintage look. I wouldn’t write off the 7artisans or Kipon Iberit options.
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Old 1 Week Ago   #7
SolaresLarrave
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There's a Konica 35mm f2 KM mount, larger than the UC and not needing an adapter. I have one. Only problem: they don't come 'round easily or cheaply because they weren't made for long (only for the Konica Hexar RF camera).
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Old 1 Week Ago   #8
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Quote:
Originally Posted by aizan View Post
- Zeiss 35mm f/2.8 C Biogon
- Voigtlander 35mm f/2.5 Color-Skopar
- Voigtlander 35mm f/2 Ultron
- Leica 35mm f/2.4 Summarit-M
Yep...and even the Voigtlander 35mm 1.4 is small too.
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Old 1 Week Ago   #9
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Zeiss 35f2.8 C Biogon! Reed Reviews rates it as sharpest 35mm lens he has tested. Mine lives on my MP240 for travel. Get the CV lens hood and save $40 over the Zeiss-identical.
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Old 1 Week Ago   #10
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Other than size, it’s really hard to beat that Distagon 35/1.4. So I’d vote for the C Biogon...
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Old 1 Week Ago   #11
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The C-Biogon is quite clinical.


The CV 35mm f2.5 is also clinical, but probably not as sharp as the Zeiss. It is, however, quite small and affordable.
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Old 1 Week Ago   #12
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New Ultron 35 f2.
But anything is small after Cosina Zeiss. Even ASPH Cron. Or ASPH Summarit 35 2.5 without hood. It was made for digital Leicas.
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Old 1 Week Ago   #13
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Quote:
Originally Posted by benlees View Post
The C-Biogon is quite clinical.


The CV 35mm f2.5 is also clinical, but probably not as sharp as the Zeiss. It is, however, quite small and affordable.
They are both modern lenses with modern multi-coating and if by 'clinical' you mean that subjects are rendered with good resolution and microcontrast at the focal plane of their respective widest aperture, without veiling flare of uncorrected spherical aberrations or washed-out, desaturated colors, then you're spot-on.

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Old 1 Week Ago   #14
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The CV 35/2.5 has almost identical diagram to the 35/2.8 C-Biogon (or should I say it the other way around, since the CV is a couple years older). They also perform very, very similarly. I've compared it against the Summarit 35/2.5 and found myself preferring the former.

The lens that fits all OP's criteria is the new CV 35/2 Ultron ASPH. Small, modern, and has a tab. Period.
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Old 1 Week Ago   #15
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a tough choice. the biogon c is brilliant but i prefer the handling of the CV 35mm f2.5 and never felt let down by it's optical quality. never owned the new 35mm f2
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Old 1 Week Ago   #16
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I owned both the ZM 35/2.8 C Biogon and the CV 35/2.5. Tested a shot for shot comparison on Kodak Portra and could not tell one iota of difference across various scenes. People say the Zeiss is sharper but on film I do not see it. On a digital sensor probably but I only shoot film. The CV is cheaper and much better ergonomics to my taste given the tab is better but than the Zeiss bump.
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Old 1 Week Ago   #17
Richard G
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I’m sure I read here that there are no bad 35’s. Looks like the CV f 2.5 is your lens.
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Old 1 Week Ago   #18
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I'd strongly consider the new ultron 35mm f2 ASPH from voigtlander.
A few here like jonmanjiro have shown it to be sharp, low to no distortion, and seems to have good small ergonomics.
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Old 1 Week Ago   #19
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Hello,

thanks for all the answers and suggestions so far. I will summarize my thoughts to the answers so far.

I think, lens preferences are pretty different between photographers and style of shooting, so I tried to describe, what I'm aiming for. But even my wordings seems to be at least weak and ambivalent, because some of the suggestions just puzzled me...

Not sure, if my description of modern, "clinical" clear and sharp rendering was good, while small and light should not bee too hard to understand.

There are no (really) bad 35mm in this thread so far, as someone said. True, so don't feel insulted, when I reject your suggestion. They are good, but not necessarily, what I'm looking for.

So here is what I take so far:

Zeiss Biogon-C 35mm / f2,8:
I think, this meets my requirements pretty well, except that I'm not a fan of the Zeiss focusing knob. Best ergonomics for me is the Leica-Style focusing tab, that also can be found on many other lenses like Voigtländers. However, I could live with that, if the focus throw is right and doesn't have too much resistance. My Distagon for example is pretty heavy to focus, because of the moving lens-group of the design, and not so fast to focus, as I like sometimes. The Leica FLE is much better in that regard. Anyway, the Zeiss seems to be a good option, if I can handle its focusing.

7Artisans 35mm / f2.0:
I really don't know, where that suggestion comes from. Okay, it's small and has really good ergonomics and for it's price, you really can't say anything negative about it. I have it and it fits very well on the M10 with its weight and size. - But image quality...? Come on... When I wrote modern, I didn't mean just build in this millennium, I meant a modern lens architecture, really good coating and so on. The 7Artisans just does not have is. I had it with me on a short walk just yesterday and it is really sensitive on light situations. Look at the upper left corner of this (beware, its full size, 8.1 MB). As I said, it's a good lens for the price, but that... yuck... Also at infinity the RF-patch doesn't align with the lens. Not too important on a wide, but I just don't like it.

Voigtländer 35/f1.7 Ultron:
Well, I have the Zeiss Distagon 35mm / f1,4 and the lens I'm searching for should be a small and light companion to that to take with me on my next trip. The Zeiss is already a behemoth of a lens, why would I ever consider this tank as a small and light companion to it.
Also, I really hate its ergonomics like all Voigtländers with this type of focusing ring. With a tab I'm really quick, with such a focus ring it's the opposite. It's just unusable for me.

Voigtländer Nokton Classic 35mm f1.4:
Budget is not a concern and f2 is not set, faster is always good. However, the Nokton... I mean there is a reason why it has "classic" in its name, because that is what the essence of its character is. It's from the images that it produces the opposite of modern and nothing like what I'm searching for. I had this lens three times, I think. It was my very first Voigtländer lens, and I have to say, I really love it's size and ergonomics. In that regard, it's nearly perfect. Well, I don't really like the aperture-ring, but I'm pretty much using always the same aperture, when in a situation where I shoot a lot. And the focusing on that lens is really very well, I was quick with the lens liked how it felt on my Zeiss Ikon ZM and the digital Ms. But it is referred to as "King of flare" sometimes and this is a well earned title. Also it is pretty soft im many situations and just not modern in any way - for me, at least. Good lens, but not what I'm looking for.

Leica 35mm f/2.4 Summarit-M
I never had it, so far. But I had the modern 90mm Summarit and I had the feeling, that Leica really made a nice and modern lens family here. I guess, I have to look into it.

Konica 35mm f/2 UC-Hexanon
Would love to get one to try it out, I never had any Konica RF lens. Nut they seem nice. Hard to get, though. But it checks most boxes, small, light, focusing tab. Not sure about the crisp tack modern sharpness, I'm looking for. I've read, that it's a little softer that others wide open.

Voigtländer Color Skopar 35mm / f2,5
Well, I was indeed considering it. I had it once and I liked almost anything about it. I had the old version with the focusing pin instead of the focus tab of version 2. I also had the version 2 shortly, and I can't really say, why, but I just didn't bond with it. The old one however was really nice and the focusing pin worked surprisingly good for me. I can pin down focus with that one pretty quickly. So yeah, that is a good suggestion, that I already had in mind. I have to look into my old images however, because I think, it is also more of a classic rendering lens than I like. Very flattering to the subject.

Voigtländer 35mm / f2,0 Asph.:
I totally forgot about this new kid in town, when I was thinking about a 35. Besides the Biogon from Zeiss, it seems to be the best alternative currently. I have to look into it and see about it's image qualities regarding what I want. But it seems to be very modern, it's definitely small and light. I have to find some good image examples from it maybe some useful reviews (finding useful reviews is really hard... the expertise here on RFF is usually unmatched by anything else out there). How could I miss that lens...? I'm really attempted and the price seems to be okay. Also as I said for the Skopar, I can live with a focusing pin, I can focus pretty quick with it. Anyone here has some more experience with that lens?

Long post... But it's sunday, so what else is there to do, right? - Now I going a a little walk with the Zeiss Distagon behemoth, dreaming of a small companion to it.

Thank you all so far!
Stephan
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Old 1 Week Ago   #20
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Quote:
Originally Posted by krötenblender View Post
Voigtländer 35mm / f2,0 Asph.:
I have to find some good image examples from it maybe some useful reviews
Lots in the thread linked below, if you haven't seen it already. Optically, its as good as a Summicron ASPH IMO. Ergonomics are decent if you like/don't mind focus sticks, and the lens is very small.

https://www.rangefinderforum.com/for...d.php?t=167453
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Old 1 Week Ago   #21
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Quote:
Originally Posted by krötenblender View Post


[How could I miss that lens...? I'm really attempted and the price seems to be okay. Also as I said for the Skopar, I can live with a focusing pin, I can focus pretty quick with it. Anyone here has some more experience with that lens?
I just purchased the 35/f2 Ultron, having previously used the 35mm Color Skopar II for about five years. So far I really like it. Rendering is excellent, handling is excellent (despite the grumbles about the focussing stick) and build quality is a noticeable step up over the Skopar.
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Old 1 Week Ago   #22
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From personal experience I can recommend the 2.8 c Biogon, and the 2.5 Color Skopar. And I will add the 2.8 Leitz Summaron. I own these lenses and I doubt I'd ever part with any of them. The Color Skopar stays on my Leica IIIc, and is the only 35 I ever need on it. The Summaron has a deeply recessed front element so that I can get away without using a hood. And the Biogon is a very easy lens to shoot with, very ergonomic. I don't find it to be "clinical," just very sharp. If you don't need f/2, these will not disappoint.
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Old 1 Week Ago   #23
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jonmanjiro View Post
Lots in the thread linked below, if you haven't seen it already. Optically, its as good as a Summicron ASPH IMO. Ergonomics are decent if you like/don't mind focus sticks, and the lens is very small.

https://www.rangefinderforum.com/for...d.php?t=167453
Thank you for the link, I hadn't seen it before. Very nice examples from that lens, it's really tempting. I also like the pictures from Yokohama and Shinjuku, you and others posted. Reminded me of previous trips there (great memories of a walk with a few RFFers and also going to Kodoji) - will be there again in May 2020, which is just why I'm already searching for a lens...

What can you say about the need for a lens hood and which ones fit? Don't like the LH-12 really... The Haoge LH-VM13P mentioned in that thread look very good, but it's not available anywhere to me. Maybe if I try directly somewhere in Japan, when I'm there. The LH-6 from the Nokton will not fit because of different filter-thread-size, I guess? I don't like screw-ins, and want to find a bayonet-hood, that doesn't block the viewfinder too much.
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Old 1 Week Ago   #24
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Quote:
Originally Posted by krötenblender View Post
Thank you for the link, I hadn't seen it before. Very nice examples from that lens, it's really tempting. I also like the pictures from Yokohama and Shinjuku, you and others posted. Reminded me of previous trips there (great memories of a walk with a few RFFers and also going to Kodoji) - will be there again in May 2020, which is just why I'm already searching for a lens...

What can you say about the need for a lens hood and which ones fit? Don't like the LH-12 really... The Haoge LH-VM13P mentioned in that thread look very good, but it's not available anywhere to me. Maybe if I try directly somewhere in Japan, when I'm there. The LH-6 from the Nokton will not fit because of different filter-thread-size, I guess? I don't like screw-ins, and want to find a bayonet-hood, that doesn't block the viewfinder too much.
I was one of the RFFers on that photowalk. It was a fun day/night

I don't use a hood on the new Ultron as I prefer to keep the lens as compact as possible when I use it. But flare resistance is very good, so I don't think there's much need for a hood anyway.

FWIW if you really want a hood, the LN-4N hood for the Skopar 35/2.5 II fits (albeit more tightly than the standard hood) the new Ultron, so that's worth considering. Or if purchasing the Haoge LH-VM13P hood from Amazon is an option, there's this (link).
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Old 1 Week Ago   #25
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any voigtlander.
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Old 1 Week Ago   #26
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DanskDynamit View Post
any voigtlander.
Nope... wrong.
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