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optional EVF for NEX5N/5R/5T/F3 fragile?
Old 10-05-2016   #1
kuuan
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Lightbulb optional EVF for NEX5N/5R/5T/F3 fragile?

When the NEX5N came out I remember many voices maintaining that its optional EVF, the FDA-EV1S, sticking out like that must be extremely fragile.
Please have a look at my NEX5N:


Sony NEX5N + fragile(??) EVF
by andreas, on Flickr[/url]

a 100% crop showing the wear



I have been using this camera heavily since 6 years now and its EVF always has been mounted. I don't use a neck strap but a waist pouch into which the camera has to be a bit 'forced' in and out, I put it 'sideways' which every time puts lateral pressure on the EVF. The EVF continues to be working just as well as it did day 1!

Interestingly most of the criticism of the EVF had come right after it had come to the market, at a time nobody possibly could have had much experience with it yet. I don't say that it can't break, of course there must be some out there who did have their EVF breaking, just as there are people out there that had their camera breaking..

I believe that the harsh criticism had been a decisive factor why Sony decided to go for the mock prism design for their A7 series of cameras, rightfully figuring that this 'traditional' design is more readily accepted. Sony also never developed any new, optional EVF nor cameras that take an optional, moveable EVF again but the now also discontinued direct successors of the 5N.

Personally I really dig the advantages of a moveable EVF, mind something that an optical VF can't offer: It not only enables taking photos of all kind of angles, specially low angles without having to force ones neck while sometimes even having to lie down. Tilting it, usually to abt. 40 degree, also drops the camera so that one always can look down into the EVF and that always keeps one's neck relaxed. Furthermore this lower position enables one to lock ones upper arms against the side of one's trunk which makes for a more stable position than having to lift the camera up to look into a fixed VF which leaves one's arms dangle free! Many people are aware of the less stable position if one uses a camera at arm's length, using the LCD, and I wonder why not more people have become aware or defend the more stable, 3 point instead of just one point support a moveable EVF enables.

Hoping that future models again shall offer moveable EVFs I won't tire to point at their advantages


...
later edit: some interesting comments and elaboration on my part following the publication of the above at my flickr: https://www.flickr.com/photos/kuuan/...in/photostream
and yes, I better had called this thread "a chorus of praise for moveable electronic viewfinders", but I don't dare to edit the title, I remember the head of another forum getting mad whenever someone did, because it screws up finding threads with search engines, he says
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Old 10-06-2016   #2
Peter Jennings
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I used a 5N with EVF for about a year and never had any problems with it. I loved it. I eventually sold both to get a 6 with fixed EVF, and then sold that a year later and got an A7. I've had no problem with the EVF on any of them, but I have missed the ability to flip up the EVF from time to time.
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Old 10-06-2016   #3
Larry Cloetta
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I just this week picked up a NIB 5N with all original accessories off of eBay for $200 to replace a NEX 5 of mine which was stolen. I did have the optional EVF for an RX1 (both also stolen) and liked it for the reasons you mentioned, so I thought I would take a look and see how much a used FDA-EV1s for my new 5N would cost.
LOL. Two listed on eBay now, one for $600 BIN, and another at auction already bid up to $300 with a day to go. Hmmmm.
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Old 10-06-2016   #4
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Quote:
Originally Posted by kuuan View Post
I believe that the harsh critizism had been a decisive factor why Sony decided to go for the mock prism design for their A7 series of cameras, rightfully figuring that this 'traditional' design is more readily accepted. Sony also never developed any new, optional EVF nor cameras that take an optional, moveable EVF again but the now also discontinued direct successors of the 5N.
The high-end NEX cameras (and current a6xxx) have a similar form factor as the NEX-5 series. Of course, they are slightly larger to accommodate the integrated EVF.

Sony has since released the RX1 cameras that have an optional EVF. I have the RX1R with the EVF, and I use the EVF very little. Often when traveling I even leave it home. While the optional EVF has some advantages, it is also frustratingly inconvenient for many people. This and the added cost at purchase (when bought separately) are the main reasons people don't like them. Some certainly are worried about the EVF being potentially fragile, but it shouldn't be a major concern.
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Old 10-06-2016   #5
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Peter Jennings View Post
I used a 5N with EVF for about a year and never had any problems with it. I loved it. I eventually sold both to get a 6 with fixed EVF, and then sold that a year later and got an A7. I've had no problem with the EVF on any of them, but I have missed the ability to flip up the EVF from time to time.
Peter I am happy for every photographer who voices his like for the flip up function of the EVF. I hope they will be heard

Obviously I am a big fan of that function and when I handled a NEX6/A6000 series of camera I really missed it and never considered buying them.
Wanting a 'FF' sensor for the my many old, manual lenses I own I did get an A7, but only after I had accepted that there isn't any 'FF' model with a moveable EVF to come any time soon.
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Old 10-06-2016   #6
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Larry Cloetta View Post
I just this week picked up a NIB 5N with all original accessories off of eBay for $200 to replace a NEX 5 of mine which was stolen. I did have the optional EVF for an RX1 (both also stolen) and liked it for the reasons you mentioned, so I thought I would take a look and see how much a used FDA-EV1s for my new 5N would cost.
LOL. Two listed on eBay now, one for $600 BIN, and another at auction already bid up to $300 with a day to go. Hmmmm.
That there hardly are any used FDA-EV1 on the market should mean that those who still own it want to keep it. As I understand it has been discontinued a while ago, and new ones still sell for about the same as it did originally. Some 2 years ago it could be found for around 150 usd used, I guess this was the time when users 'upgraded' to NEX6/A6000 cameras.
How important an EVF is will depend on one's shooting style. I am using adapted, manual lenses and find it indispensable.
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Old 10-07-2016   #7
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Lss View Post
The high-end NEX cameras (and current a6xxx) have a similar form factor as the NEX-5 series. Of course, they are slightly larger to accommodate the integrated EVF.
major difference to mention in this discussion is that these EVFs are fixed!

Quote:
Originally Posted by Lss View Post
Sony has since released the RX1 cameras that have an optional EVF. I have the RX1R with the EVF, and I use the EVF very little. Often when traveling I even leave it home. While the optional EVF has some advantages, it is also frustratingly inconvenient for many people. This and the added cost at purchase (when bought separately) are the main reasons people don't like them. Some certainly are worried about the EVF being potentially fragile, but it shouldn't be a major concern.
there isn't any camera that is ideal for everyone and every use. I understand why a user will prefer either no VF and LCD only, optical VF, fixed EVF or whatever and for each user or use all else won't be ideal and possibly frustrating.

IMO a fixed lens AF camera well can do without VF, and many do. I just read through a thread at the Ricoh section of dpreview called "GRIII wish list" and surpsingly, even though a main feature of the Ricoh GR, another fixed lens camera, is it's small size and weight, it weighs approximately half your RX1, a majority is asking for an EVF. Some say it better be removable so that one could still enjoy the small size.

An optional VF has the obvious advantage that one can use the camera both with and without it, then offering a smaller form factor. This comes at a cost. Personally I pretty much always use manual lenses and for focusing always use the EVF and won't make use of the potential size advantage. If an integrated EVF means less cost, as long as it stays moveable, I'd prefer it to be integrated.

Mind that your RX1R, successor of the RX1, was announced June 2013. That was the last Sony camera that takes an optional EVF, I believe even the last that offers a moveable EVF and that was before Sony announced it's first A7 and A6000. All these have a fixed EVF! ( NEX6, also with fixed EVF, came a bit earlier ): I stand to my point that Sony seems to have abandoned the design of moveable EVFs and it looks to me that this is not limited to Sony. Many early mirrorless cams, producers being aware that an EVF overcome the design inherent limitation of an OVF of having to be fixed, had moving EVFs, late models hardly. I find that a pity.

What I try to do here is pointing out the advantages of a moveable EVF and, though of course not good for all and every camera, prove that there are users out there who really dig those! I am sure that these advantages, and producers realizing that there is a niche of users out there appreciating them, at some point will give moveable EVFs a resurgence. The design of e.g. Panasonic GX-7 is quite intriguing, unfortunately it offers too little diopter adjustment for me. More intrugiung even the design of Samsung NX30 with it's moveable EVF + hotshoe + integrated flash, but this producer is no more.

Any new camera offering a moveable EVF will be noticed by those who know and appreciate it's advantages. Imo at this point of time it could be a 'niche producers dream', so to say. I would not mind at all if it came from a niche producer like Ricoh ( the focus peaking of it's GXR imo is better than those of my Sonys NEX5N and A7 )
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Old 10-08-2016   #8
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I just love this articulated EVF....it has seriously added a most desirable dimension to my view of things,the tiltable LCD is usable as a substitute,but the EVF really gives enhanced clarity,for MF...I never use AF.
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Old 10-09-2016   #9
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Quote:
Originally Posted by kuuan View Post
What I try to do here is pointing out the advantages of a moveable EVF
I very much agree about its advantages, but for my own use this is with the qualification "as long as it is integrated". Actually even some clever detachable design would do, but so far I haven't seen one that isn't inconvenient. This is a problem with compact cameras, where not only compactness is sacrificed but also the balance and general handling suffer. I wouldn't mind a detachable, articulating EVF on a larger camera that would mostly live in the studio and/or on a tripod. This would likely be in addition to a fixed OVF/EVF.
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Last edited by Lss : 10-09-2016 at 20:17. Reason: Misleading choice of words
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