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Aging And Photography
Old 06-04-2008   #1
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Aging And Photography

Hi Folks,

Just in case I went mistaken with the language, let me clarify I mean to invite your opinions about what happens, or may happen, with your photography as you go older and older.

Half an hour ago I was watching TV, a certain documentary about last years battles in the West Bank, and I throwed several curses to myself for not being able to be there and photograph, as I did some 15 years ago.

After some moments I made sense of my present situation, and everything went back to place. By no means my health allows me to run at will, by no means I can sell a minimum amount of pics enough for a salary even if I could run, i.e. disattend my present job. And if you want it harsh and comic, (just kindly don't abuse my openess) I am not sure I can live far from a bathroom.

If you want it smoother, already my eyes and glasses keep me upset, my overall steadyness is not improving, etc, etc.

For some of us, perhaps most, I don't know, when we cross the fifties life seems to become a prison, whose walls slowly moove inwards.

After giving it some thought, I think we can divide the issue into two aspects. First the general approach, then the concrete how to.

As for the general approach, in very general terms I smell I am very wrong.

If I re-read what I have written so far, it seems I mix between aging and passivity while there is no necessary absolute correlation. Aging should or could bring more wisdom, and with more wisdom
a man could accept what he cannot change, but also take more advantage of what he can take and didn't see before.

Because in my opinion life is never a one direction road, but very much like a byke. It needs the reflexes of a man at his twenties, but also the reasoning of a man at his fifties.

As for the concrete side, I have not the slightest idea about how aged photographers among us, or in general, perform their craft.

I think that if you read between the lines you can perceive some fear. Fear is to be clearly identifyied and then fought. So I have exorcised mine out and put it on your table to deal. Of course, this thread is not about me but about us.

Since in the Western culture aging is falsely identifyied with shame, my PM box is open for any member unwilling to publicly participate in this thread.

Cheers,
Ruben

Last edited by ruben : 06-04-2008 at 14:35.
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Old 06-04-2008   #2
BillP
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Ruben, I have read this four times now, and I am honestly not sure that I understand what you are trying to say, and what responses you are seeking. Please can you be more clear, less obtuse?

Regards,

Bill
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Old 06-04-2008   #3
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BillP View Post
Ruben, I have read this four times now, and I am honestly not sure that I understand what you are trying to say, and what responses you are seeking. Please can you be more clear, less obtuse?

Regards,

Bill

Hi Bill,

You may be quite right, since I am asking about things I am not clear about at all.

Perhaps I could brief it all by asking how to regard and deal with the limitations of aging, which I am starting to feel in the beloved area of photography.

Hope this helps,
Ruben
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Old 06-04-2008   #4
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Interesting subject Ruben ... when I was thirty six I would quite happily have put my camera in someone's face for a good street pic ... but at fifty six I'm not comfortable doing it!

On the physical side I am luckily in much the same shape as I was at that age but the eyes are the critical part ... and they have lost a lot. I struggle in poor light and older rangefinders with vague contrast seldom make it out of my cupboard!
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Old 06-04-2008   #5
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Dear Ruben,

Yes, age limits our options.

So does fear (especially fear of age) -- but fear can be overcome, and age can't.

There's an old saying among fencers: old age and cunning [or 'old age and treachery'] can overcome youth and enthusiasm.

As you get older, you can't do quite the same things (including running as far, staying as far from a bathroom) but you may be able to achieve the same things in different ways.

For example, on Monday , insh'Allah, my wife and I hope to leave on a motorcycle tour on the bike we have had for 25 years. The way we ride now, the places we stay; they will be different from how they were 25 years ago. But it's still motorcycle touring. And we're still together.

Likewise, if we have the money, and can get visas, and all the other practicalities, we intend to be in Dharamsala for the 50th anniversary of Lhasa Uprising day.

I'll take different pictures from what I took on the 25th anniversary, but with any luck, old age and cunning will make up for my lack of youth and raw enthusiasm (I use the word 'raw' with some feeling).

Cheers,

R.

Last edited by Roger Hicks : 06-04-2008 at 14:58.
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Old 06-04-2008   #6
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ruben View Post
Hi Folks,

Just in case I went mistaken with the language, let me clarify I mean to invite your opinions about what happens, or may happen, with your photography as you go older and older.

Well, let's see. I'm 54. I suppose I could still hump a steel monorail, a bag and a tripod up the side of a mountain if I really wanted to -- but I don't really want to anymore. As for being away from a bathroom, I don't shoot urban stuff, so it isn't a problem -- the world is my toilet. I think the problem is that I'm becoming cynical more than anything else. I am less willing to hump stuff up these mountains on the off-chance that I'll see something worth shooting.
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Old 06-04-2008   #7
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Rueben:

Twenty-five or so years ago I used to do some rock climbing with a friend about 10 years older that I was. He used say, "I can still do this on Saturday like I used to, but now I hurt until Thursday rather than Monday." Now I resemble that remark. I also watch where I put my feet more carefully, but with tri-focals even that is tricky at times. Keep up the good fight.
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Old 06-04-2008   #8
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A 73 year-pld man climbed mount Everest this year and I know a 91 year-old who's like a guru to me and he skates, plays tennis, paints and his mind is sharp and his memory fully intact.

At the same time I see men in their 50s who seem to have already given up and my grandfather by the time he was 60, he had become sentimental and he worried about dying - which he did before he should have.

So, in the end of the day its all about will power, and how one thinks... For example I know that when I reach my 50s I will shoot mainly landscape and take portraits.
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Old 06-04-2008   #9
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Well, Ruben I understand. I wish I had taken more images, but more, I wish I had the diligence that I have now to try to take better photos. Now I mess around with an image until I can't decide anything. But I like that because I have learned patience, and tried in my sloppy way to get better and better. For the people that don't understand Ruben, watch 'Zorba the Greek.'
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Old 06-04-2008   #10
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I guess it was about 7 or 8 years ago now that I had a bout with prostrate cancer. My urologist, oncologist, and I won with the aid of focused radiation and iodine seeds. About 1 year ago, I learned that there is often a consequence of that and I went through a very hard time getting over that. In my case, if I thought I needed to go, I had best be on my way, not thinking I would go when convenient. That was for #1 or #2. If fact, needing to do one meant the other needed to be taken care of as well. I don't mean to be indelicate, but just to let everyone know there is a light at the end of the tunnel. Being in those straights can be more than uncomfortable, as it can be very embarassing.

A little over a year after that, (the original treatment) I underwent triple bypass surgery. Actually, going through a house fire about 20 years ago hurt my desire to engage in photography more that the health problems. I haven't given it up, but it isn't the focus it once was. Even that has been changing lately. I am now 66 years old. God willing I will see another grandchinld and a great grandchild enter this world in August.

Cheer up Ruben! Make what you can of it. Besides whatever friends and family you have where you live, you have friends here at RFF who look forward to your threads and posts.

As to photography, if you can't walk as far, take whatever transportation is available. If you can't hold a camera as steady, use a tripod. If you can't carry as heavy a kit, make you kit smaller.

Good points you bring up Ruben. I hope my comments don't sound trite. We do go through trials, but however we get through them, we come out at the end of the tunnel. Hopefully able to do something we still enjoy.
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Old 06-04-2008   #11
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Quote:
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Dear Ruben,

So does fear (especially fear of age) -- but fear can be overcome, and age can't.

R.
This is good.

I'm a "Boomer" the moniker given to people usually now in their '60s. In the 60s and 70s We boomers had issues with people over 30, didn't we? In the 1960s we laughed at people who are our age now.

I couldn't imagine what it would be like to be over 60, now I do.

There are physical issues now, I'm not as agile, I don't have the nice physical form of a man in his 20s, girls don't look at me the same, my reflexes are slower etc. etc.
There are mental issues too, I think, but here is where I'm doing better. I'm wiser, much, much wiser.

Not smarter....wiser.

I realize now that aging is part of the deal, if you live long enough, if you weren't killed by the stupidity (OK, lack of wisdom) of your youth, here you are. Our human's innate creativity will see you through the rest of your life if you let it. Let it!
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Old 06-04-2008   #12
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oftheherd, I had a deal like that, bad, but the only thing that has changed is I can't play my Gibson S-1 (Ron Wood) anymore. Not physically play, I can't pick it up anymore, now I play my old noname classical guitar.
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Old 06-04-2008   #13
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Christ, we're a sorry bunch! But...read on...

My MS has been in and out of remission for the past few years, leaving my vision colour deficient, no feeling in my trigger finger, occasional spasms that make me drop my camera, or collapse in front of pretty subjects, wet myself, and it's all pretty depressing....

So...here's my grandfather, taken last week (4x5, tri-x)



He's 94, has battled cancer twice, will loose to the third round soon and he knows it, lost his hearing, lost both wives, his only daughter, and all his brothers and sisters.

So what's he doing? In the last 6 months he's raised over $10,000 for a new-born that needed a liver transplant, helped a middle-aged woman start up a home-based business, weekly transporting a gentleman with ALS to the hospital, organized a drug rehab for another unfortunate soul, organized a social event for a recent widow, travelled one last time by train to Banff, and probably a whole bunch of other things I don't know about yet.

What I'm catching on to is to keep doing what I want to do until I bloody well drop dead.
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Old 06-04-2008   #14
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ruben View Post
Half an hour ago I was watching TV, a certain documentary about last years battles in the West Bank, and I throwed several curses to myself for not being able to be there and photograph, as I did some 15 years ago.

As for the concrete side, I have not the slightest idea about how aged photographers among us, or in general, perform their craft.

Since in the Western culture aging is falsely identifyied with shame, my PM box is open for any member unwilling to publicly participate in this thread.

Cheers,
Ruben
Hello Ruben,
I've read many of your posts, and I know fear is not your demon. I'm 52 myself, and so I appreciate your musings on age. I'm not sure I'm as fearless as you, however. In any case, I know 30 year olds who are old, and 60 year olds who are not. It's all about attitude. Technique trumps strength most of the time, just as Roger said. Keep up your street shooting. Be smart when soldiers challenge you about it, but not too smart. Get some combat pics if you can. Be reasonably careful about it. But not afraid.
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Old 06-04-2008   #15
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Ruben I know exactly what you are speaking about. There was a time 30 years I could run the streets of Manahttan all night with a co-pilot looking for the one news worthy shot. Damn what fun. Nikon F and F2 hanging off me. Now it seems photography as we lived and breathed it is CTD...circling the drain. I will continue to take the time and love to fondle the wonderufl images still to be shot.
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Old 06-04-2008   #16
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Quote:
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... In the 60s and 70s We boomers had issues with people over 30, didn't we? ...
I heard a TV commercial yesterday with a great line. It must've been aimed at boomers: "Never trust anyone over 90."

I think it was for medicine.
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Old 06-04-2008   #17
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Ruben: We are the same age. We are also, I think, from the same ethnic tradition. Which means we have a tendency to kvetch about our problems and limitations. Which is OK, unless it keeps us from fully living life.

I would suggest that you concentrate on what you can do rather than on what you can not. Some things we can't do anything about. And some things we have to deal with, but we can push against the barriers, and try to make ourselves able to do more.

You may have to take different kinds of pictures than you did when you were 25. Or the same kind of pictures, but of different subjects. You may need to use a different camera--I know of some people who gave up manual cameras and went to autofocus at a certain age. I also found that cameras with diopter adjustments in the viewfinder (or the Megaperls magnifier for Leica, some other RFs and Nikon SLRs) can bring the world into focus again.

See the eye doctor at least once a year. Our eyes change a lot in our 50s. Some people who think they can't see well any more simply need new glasses more often than before. I have to get new lenses about every 9 months right now.

Also, sometimes a change of diet or lifestyle can help a lot. If you smoke, stop (or at least reduce it as much as you can). If you don't get regular exercise, start taking walks every day and gradually increase the length. Walking with your camera helps both the exercise and the photography.

You might check with a doctor to see if you are lactose intolerant, and if so, avoid milk products or use a Lactase enzyme when you eat them. (this is a common problem among our tribe). Raw onions or garlic might not work for you any more. Less coffee and more water sometimes helps.

You may not be able to be a 25-year old photojournalist, but you can still be a happy amateur photographer. Maybe you should create a project for yourself. Something like, "I'm going to post a picture on RFF every week." Or "I'm going to document daily life in my neighborhood." Whatever interests you.

Hope this is helpful
--Peter
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Old 06-04-2008   #18
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Oh well, this topic is far more interesting than average gear related battle (if it doesn't cover something specific I need to solve right now to use camera).

I'm approaching 40 and this week have visited two different doctors and will see one of them on Saturday again. Well, I'm not going to fall into "hurts that and there". Just to position myself as being somewhere in between.

I want to tell that moments when I feel "something changed not to better side" are great in matter, they make me to mobilize and appreciate anything I can do. When everything is fine, unfortunately, days pass by and I take them like granted. It's not so. I yet have to learn true value of days.

If life would ask me today what I would like to have, I'd want to keep clarity of mind in my old years.

And you, Ruben, are brave in context of bringing up what matters to you ("speak about it, don't hide" approach). Also I appreciate widening areas about what people with cameras could talk - I think it matters a lot.
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Old 06-04-2008   #19
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Quote:
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I heard a TV commercial yesterday with a great line. It must've been aimed at boomers: "Never trust anyone over 90."

I think it was for medicine.
Chris: A couple of years ago, I saw a TV ad for an optical company--I think they make progressive lenses for glasses. It showed a bunch of aging "boomers" holding a demonstration in front of what looked like a courthouse, with columns. They were holding signs. One sign said "Free the Presbyopic Six."

Another said "I can't read this sign, either."

Too close to home for comfort!

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Old 06-04-2008   #20
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This has been inspiring. Thank you. We can all give thanks for auto-focus. Without it, where would we be?

/T
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Old 06-04-2008   #21
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We can all give thanks for auto-focus. Without it, where would we be?
still with scale focus, not ? At least, it doesn't hunts and always agrees with photographer where to focus on
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Old 06-04-2008   #22
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Try scale focus with a 75mm lens on an Epson R-D1 in a theater? I'm afraid it just doesn't work. Neither do my eyes - very well.

/T

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Old 06-04-2008   #23
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That's true - our deceases dictate also our choice of gear, subjects and shooting habits. Agreed.
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Old 06-05-2008   #24
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Ruben, you have raised an interesting question to which there are no real answers. For my part, as my physical faculties decrease, fortunately slowly over time, my relative wisdom seems to have increased such that I recognise some of my limitations. I have never had to deal with a debilitating illness or physical deformity and my mind and memory are still good. Whether I would recognise any decline in either is a moot point. I am fortunate in that I am still able work and also enjoy working.

My photography has become my personal window on the world: a means of self expression, of recording precious moments in time. Precious to me as they are reminders of people, places, events, or just feelings engendered by just "being there". Will I ever have enough photographs of say my grandchildren? Probably not, but the fact that I have some, is in itself way ahead of what many others might be able to enjoy.

I have gone back to using the cameras which I aspired to in my youth, but could never afford, and am building the darkroom which I always wanted, but never had time for. Perhaps age brings a Ludditic sense of clinging to the past. Whereas I have a DSLR, it only comes out on special occasions whatever they might be such as my son's wedding.

Ruben, whilst you breathe and think, you live. Enjoy it, as it may be a long way ahead of what comes second. Age brings with it the luxury of self reflection, but also gives the benefit of not taking yourself too seriously.
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Old 06-05-2008   #25
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My photography is different from what it was when I was younger, and there are times when I do not have the energy to cross the street for what seems to be a good picture. The eyes have been refurbished, but there is a general slowing down and perhaps a trace of unsteadiness. I advise other ageing people to accept their limitations, but I know how difficult that is to do. Ageing affects more than photography, of course.
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Old 06-05-2008   #26
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There is something about me that hasn't ever changed. This thing that doesn't move is sometimes a problem and at other times an asset. It is a problem when I slip into nostalgia and talk to myself about "the good ole days". It is an asset when I recognize that the "I" that wants to make photographs or work with video or make films can always learn from the present and work with whatever is nearby.

No matter how I slice it the present with all of the scary stuff brought to bear by an aging body is where I am like it or not so why fuss about it.

Actually the present has in many ways made expressing myself easier so why not make use of the new ways of working that extend my capabilities by taking up some of the slack for diminishing faculties.

I believe that the greatest enemies of life are the selective remembering of the past and fretful anxiety about the future; both of which I work to avoid with some success but of course nothing is perfect. "Abandon All Hope of Fruition" is a slogan I am trying to embrace fully these days in the hope that I will learn to die well.
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Old 06-05-2008   #27
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Hi, Ruben...

Reflexes of a man in his 20's and reasoning of a man in his 50's....what a great topic for discussion and I thank you for posting this thread.

Oh, where to start...

I am now 58 but I am just now maturing in my photography, both film and digital. I feel I have the technical knowledge but also, I look at things entirely differently than I did, say 10 years ago. I "see" things without realizing it sometimes whether it be subject matter, light, or composition and I find myself amazed...I only hope my photography can reach the average level of some of the photographers on this forum!

That said, the physical aspects of aging were getting to me last year with complications from computer work (nerve damage) taking away about 50% of the use of my left arm and surgery has not yet corrected that...soooo, while recuperating, I went on a diet and started power-walking 5 miles a day after work. I have lost 47 pounds and have a BMI of 23 and feel wonderful! In fact, I am in better shape than I was in my 20's. Shooting sports action with my D2X and telephoto lens is now much easier.

All in all, I do not think that "aging" will affect my photography negatively, but, rather positively. My mindset now is to do what I like personally in addition to paying projects. One of those personal endeavors is to create a bridge to my future family generations by handing down my images for my grandchildren and their children to "see what I saw through the lens"...I cannot think of a better way to connect with people I will never know.

Now, if I can only stop thinking about getting older, I will be all right...
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Old 06-05-2008   #28
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Great photo!
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Old 06-05-2008   #29
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Nice thread, Ruben. 2 sayings come to mind: Growing old is not for the faint(weak) of heart, and: The older we get, the greater we were.

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Old 06-05-2008   #30
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Hi, Roger...

Interesting that you and your wife are going on a motorcyle tour...enjoy! My wife and I did that all the time until recently with her health turning bad and she could no longer tolerate it. We rode all over the southeast on my Harley. Little did I know how bloody uncomfortable that was until I bought the BMW K1200LT...but it was too late for her to continue riding. What a pity as it was so comfortable.

Motorcyle touring is so fun...

Enjoy, be safe, and keep your knees in the breeze!
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Old 06-05-2008   #31
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oftheherd, I had a deal like that, bad, but the only thing that has changed is I can't play my Gibson S-1 (Ron Wood) anymore. Not physically play, I can't pick it up anymore, now I play my old noname classical guitar.
Are you referrring to the house fire? The health problems only slowed me down some for a while, and were inconvenient. The house fire, at least in my case, was different. So many memories gone up in smoke.
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Old 06-05-2008   #32
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Enjoy, be safe, and keep your knees in the breeze!
Dear Dave,

Thanks for the good wishes.

I'm sorry to hear about your wife's health. Is it likely to improve again? To the point where she can go touring? Frances has pseudopolyarthritis but it seems (we hope!) to be going away slowly...

But this sort of thing is why I always advise younger friends: DO IT NOW, while you still can, because you never know what the future may bring.

Cheers,

Roger

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Old 06-05-2008   #33
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Originally Posted by Roger Hicks View Post

But this sort of thing is why I always advise younger friends: DO IT NOW, while you still can, because you never know what the future may bring.

Cheers,

Roger
I couldn't agree more. In fact I have been writing in other threads about this. The short and simple fact in my case is that I started looking for lighter cameras. Went through quite a few and now settled on an Agfa Super Silette with Apotar and other light medium format equipment. No more carrying lens from 15mm to 500mm and many bodies. The time is now spent on thinking about each picture before pressing the shutter. I may be getting older, but the fun in photography has not yet deserted me!
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Old 06-05-2008   #34
Sisyphus
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Thanks for giving me an insight as to what I have to look forward to one day, which is not too far off.

Hope all is well otherwise . . .
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Old 06-05-2008   #35
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Originally Posted by Sisyphus View Post
Thanks for giving me an insight as to what I have to look forward to one day, which is not too far off.

Hope all is well otherwise . . .

I wish biological young members of RFF would enter this thread and give opinions. Their viewpoint can ceirtainly contribute to enrich this thread.

Unless some of them have done it and I missed it (out of senility ? ).

Cheers,
Ruben
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Old 06-05-2008   #36
BillP
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Okay, let me take a run at this.

First the basics. I am 46, and sound of wind and limb. I am not as fit as I was in my 20's but then in my 20's I wasn't really into photography as I am now, so I cannot directly compare.

I do not feel slowed, bowed or restricted by age. Far from it. I feel that I am more willing and able to take my time, to take a risk, to pre-visualise and to get the shot I want. I am no more or less likely now to cross the road to get a shot than I was ten years ago. Where age (or experience?) has had an impact is in my willingness to lug 12lbs of camera kit around all day. I am now more likely to carry a single rangefinder body and one or two lenses, and to pick and choose my shots, than to carry a "do-it-all" SLR with primes (for speed) and zooms (for convenience) carrying focal lengths from 18 to 300mm.

In short, therefore, age is not an issue for me.

Ask me again in ten more years!

Regards,

Bill
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Old 06-05-2008   #37
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Well, this is my 40th year of existence, and I must admit hitting the big four-oh was tough. I've been athletic most of my life except during my University years where I spent all my time in books. A few months after turning 40 I was having a hard time with my left foot, both running and cycling. Turns out I have osteoarthritis in the phalangial joint (caused by the very exercises I was doing to keep healthy). Now I have custom orthotics (which people at work refer to as "grandpa shoes"), but they only negate some of the pain and certainly provide no cure. Ultimately, surgery will be required to fuse the joint. Oh joy.

Mentally, I'm still pretty sharp due mainly to the fact that I'm employed as a senior research scientist in the field of bioanalytical chemistry. It is crucial for me to keep up to date on the latest techniques used in bioanalysis. However, in a recent life I was employed in core research, you know, pie in the sky ideas verified by computer simulation and molecular modelling. Real cutting edge stuff. Being on the applied side of research now is certainly a notch down, so I'm feeling the slope. I also find I am questioning my career choice more and more. I never used to look back, and now all too often I'm questioning my decisions. You know, should I have pursued an academic career instead, should I have left job X for job Y. In my current position, some days it just feels like I am rotting, wasting my time while life is passing me by.

Photographically, I gave up my Canon DSLR for a complete 4x5 system which my wife and I enjoy together. It takes two of us to carry the kit, which fortunately we are still able to do. We do not own a home, preferring instead to use our disposable income for travel and investment (with the intent of buying the home when we retire); we took three major trips last year and have already completed our first trip this year to Yosemite/Sequoia/Kings Canyon. The highlight last year was wading through Zion Canyon in the fall. What an adventure. As mentioned already, we made the concientious decision to not have a family nor buy a home so we can do all the things we want while we still can. Is this the right decision? Time will tell. There is an underlying fear that when one of us goes, the other will have no immediate family for support. When we both are gone, we will not have created a genetic legacy. Admittedly, this is a bit troubling.

But this is a rangefinder forum, so I digressed somewhat. I bought my first Leica last year (M6TTL) and just recently purchased an M8. Why? Simple. I wanted the Leica experience sooner rather than later (and while the company was still around to support their products), and I needed something for street photography which was not a PITA to lug around while retaining inconspicuous qualitites. Overall, I'm pleased I made the investment, but my Mamiya 7 is not seeing much activity these days since acquiring the M8.

So do I fear aging.....yes. Do I think about it often....yes. But I feel this is healthy, as denial would be much worse. Having said this, I also fear about Leica's future and do think about it often....
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Old 06-05-2008   #38
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Originally Posted by Tuolumne View Post
This has been inspiring. Thank you. We can all give thanks for auto-focus. Without it, where would we be?

/T
I think I have mentioned this before that I bought an old auto-focus body, because I was missing too many focuses with my 28mm and 20mm. But now the problem is I have to put on my glasses to read the window read out for fstop and shutter. Still, I've never been happier.
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Old 06-05-2008   #39
Roger Hicks
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Originally Posted by jplomley View Post
(1) A few months after turning 40 I was having a hard time with my left foot, both running and cycling. Turns out I have osteoarthritis in the phalangial joint (caused by the very exercises I was doing to keep healthy). . . (2) I also find I am questioning my career choice more and more. I never used to look back, and now all too often I'm questioning my decisions. You know, should I have pursued an academic career instead, should I have left job X for job Y. In my current position, some days it just feels like I am rotting, wasting my time while life is passing me by . . . (3) So do I fear aging.....yes. Do I think about it often....yes. But I feel this is healthy, as denial would be much worse. Having said this, I also fear about Leica's future and do think about it often....
(Numbers in bold added)

1 Yes, this is not unusual. Be glad it's not heart disease, which has afflicted remarkably many serious cyclists of my acquantance. Most of my fencing friends have knee trouble. Truly, (too much) exercise is bad for you.

2 Why? If I'd joined the Freemasons when I had the chance, it might well have done me some good. But I didn't, and that was 40 years ago: it ain't gonna change now. Besides, it might not have done me any good: as Umberto Eco said, all counterfactual conditionals are true. I'm glad, overall, that I took my father's advice and didn't join the lodge I was invited to join by one of his chums. My father was never a Mason either.

3 Denial is not the alternative to worrying.

Cheers,

Roger
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Old 06-05-2008   #40
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Roger,

For years now I have trained using the exercises in Ed Burke's book "Serious Cycling". Ed died not too long ago of a heart attack while cycling uphill. So your observations seem quite corroborative. I know on some uphill climbs it feels as though my heart is going to pound itself right of my chest. Now I wear a heart rate monitor to keep things in check and try never to exceed 85% of max. However, I must admit there is nothing like the endorphin rush after an exhaustive 100 mile ride (err, more like 50-60 these days).

Thanks for your feedback,

Jeff
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