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Fuji film price hike in the offing
Old 02-25-2019   #1
Larry Cloetta
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Fuji film price hike in the offing

https://petapixel.com/2019/02/25/fuj...ls-day-really/

Am only posting this to enable those who like Fuji film to stock up now at what are now effectively sale prices.
All the moaning about Fuji film prices and business model has been done to death already. We get it.
But if you just want to quietly buy some Fuji film, because you like it, and get on with your life while others are braying like wounded donkeys, now is a good time.
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Old 02-25-2019   #2
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Thanks for the heads-up - I hadn't seen this.

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Old 02-25-2019   #3
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I wonder what that super special raw material(s) is. It forced Fuji to triple the price of films in recent years while Instax has remained unaffected.
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Old 02-25-2019   #4
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Damn! That’s steep!

X-Tra will see about 1$ price hike.
Velvia 50 will see over 5$ price hike. So 23$ a roll?!
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Old 02-25-2019   #5
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Some thoughts about that:
1. In the past manufacturers had to raise prices because of increased raw material costs and decreasing demand. The latter was always also mentioned by Fujifilm in their statements. But it is not said in this current statement anymore. That is a good sign!
2. Kodak and Ilford have increased prices in the last three years, Fujifilm had not. Now they have to.
3. Despite the crash in demand in the time from 2004 to 2016, lots of film prices are still cheaper than in 1999/2000, when film was at record sales if you consider inflation. That such a situation cannot be sustainable for film manufacturers in the long term is obvious.
4. The CEO of Adox has often explained that the film price level in the whole industry is much too low and not sustainable. He said film prices must be 20-30% higher to get enough revenue to invest in new machinery, maintenance and products.
5. Because of 4. and the fact that raw material price increases in the midterm affect all manufacturers generally (maybe some more, some less), it is quite likely that the other film manufacturers will follow in the future.
6. Higher prices are the much much better alternative to discontinued products.

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Old 02-25-2019   #6
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Curiously I seldom see Kodak announcement about film price hikes. Yet their prices do rise...
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Old 02-25-2019   #7
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I wonder at what price point film aficionados will lose their enthusiasm. I am only shooting black and white film and the prices still seem reasonable.
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Old 02-25-2019   #8
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ptpdprinter View Post
I wonder at what price point film aficionados will lose their enthusiasm. I am only shooting black and white film and the prices still seem reasonable.
Good question, and I imagine we're approaching that threshold for many with this announcement. But for those that love and rely on Velvia 50 for instance there just isn't anything else that delivers what it does so you have to pay to use your preferred tool.

I'm glad this announcement gives those interested some time to react and stock up.
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Old 02-25-2019   #9
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I still shoot a bunch of color film but usually I shoot Kodak Portra films. I just placed an order for some more Kodak Portra 800, which is pricey but certainly still affordable.

I still have a small stockpile of slide films but I have pretty much quit buying it from Fuji since they discontinued Provia 400X. I will pick up a few more rolls of Ektachrome to play with some more but my go to ISO 100 color film has become Ektar 100. Since I don't project any longer Ektar 100 satisfies my need for high color saturation.

EDIT - I do agree with Jan, prices are going to keep rising and almost certainly need to to keep film production sustainable. However, knowing it needs to rise doesn't make it any more pleasurable when it happens.
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Old 02-25-2019   #10
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Quote:
Originally Posted by brbo View Post
I wonder what that super special raw material(s) is. It forced Fuji to triple the price of films in recent years while Instax has remained unaffected.
Maybe whale bone or whale oil for gelatin?
https://www.photrio.com/forum/thread...rocity.153198/

This (anti-whaling organization) article notes that Fujifilm "hold current patents related to image recording using whale oil..."
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Old 02-25-2019   #11
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Japan appears prepare to resume commercial whaling in 2019 though who knows if whale gelatin is still a component in current emulsions.

https://www.cnn.com/2018/12/25/asia/japan-withdrawal-international-whaling-commission-intl/index.html
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Old 02-25-2019   #12
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ted Striker View Post
Let's be real here. Gelatin comes from cows, not whale. There arent enough whales harvested worldwide to base an industry off their use.
Be real? I think Japan is one of the few, if not only, countries still conducting commercial whaling. They recently withdrew from the International Whaling Commission:
https://www.nytimes.com/2018/12/26/w...ithdrawal.html
https://www.bbc.com/news/world-asia-46682976
https://www.npr.org/2018/12/26/68014...t-banned-pract

Also, female whales are cows. So Fujifilm must only use female whales to make photographic film.
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Old 02-25-2019   #13
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ted Striker View Post
Japan has not been commercial whaling for decades. Only very recently did they announce that they would start that that up again. Fujifilm is certainly not using whale in their films.
Well, maybe now that they are restarting, they can kill some male whales for film. That way, we can all have a load of bull...
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Old 02-25-2019   #14
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Quote:
Originally Posted by maigo View Post
Japan appears prepare to resume commercial whaling in 2019 ...
Its probably due to the ongoing film resurgence....
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Old 02-25-2019   #15
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Quote:
Originally Posted by brbo View Post
I wonder what that super special raw material(s) is. It forced Fuji to triple the price of films in recent years while Instax has remained unaffected.
Demand is the special raw material... (sorry, could not resist).
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Old 02-25-2019   #16
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jsrockit View Post
Demand is the special raw material... (sorry, could not resist).
The special raw material is the bones of dead, curmudgeonly film photographers...
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Old 02-25-2019   #17
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ptpdprinter View Post
I wonder at what price point film aficionados will lose their enthusiasm. I am only shooting black and white film and the prices still seem reasonable.
For me, the price point is maybe $10-12 per roll... but that'd be if that's the cheapest.. like if Superia and Kodak Gold were that price, then i'd probably give up on film, or at least shoot a lot less. I don't really see the cheap stuff getting that expensive though. I currently stick with Portra 400 and Tri-X and it's been pretty reasonable.
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Old 02-25-2019   #18
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Maybe Fujifilm is just.... baleen the film market.
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Old 02-25-2019   #19
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Or maybe the are fishing to come Acros a Superia raw material...
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Old 02-25-2019   #20
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Makes no Sensia to me, but I'm just trying to keep it Reala...
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Old 02-25-2019   #21
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It's a shame, but that's just the Natura order of things...
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Old 02-25-2019   #22
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Hopefully it's not Eterna for the worse...
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Old 02-25-2019   #23
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Kodak and Ilford have been seeing constant film growth for over half a decade....who knows if Fuji has been in on that. I see no reason why not. That said, maybe Fuji feel that 5%-6% year over year volume growth in film still isnt worth it.
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Old 02-25-2019   #24
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ptpdprinter View Post
I wonder at what price point film aficionados will lose their enthusiasm. I am only shooting black and white film and the prices still seem reasonable.
It only depends on the average income.

Five bucks per 24 of c-41. Is my income limit.
I need ten rolls maximum per year, for kids practice.

Bw, once it is over 70$ per bulk, I will quit.
Well, one bulk per year, if kids are still interested.

I already struggle to buy paper. Once old stock which was given to me is over, I'll switch to liquid light emulsion. I like how trashy it looks
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Old 02-25-2019   #25
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Faintandfuzzy View Post
Kodak and Ilford have been seeing constant film growth for over half a decade....who knows if Fuji has been in on that. I see no reason why not. That said, maybe Fuji feel that 5%-6% year over year volume growth in film still isnt worth it.
I think Fuji just sees more profitability with their digital camera business, which Kodak and Ilford don't have.
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Old 02-25-2019   #26
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I think Fuji just sees more profitability with their digital camera business, which Kodak and Ilford don't have.
Their Instax profits dwarf their digital business.
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Old 02-25-2019   #27
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Faintandfuzzy View Post
Their Instax profits dwarf their digital business.
Yep in their Imaging Solutions division, Instax film profits absolutely dwarfs everything else.
So why is Fuji only raising prices on regular film? Because they know that Instax is used by people to have fun, goof around. They will lose interest in a hurry if prices of Instax are raised. But 'real' film is used by die-hards, artists, the faithful. Who will stick with it no matter what because it is film. So Fuji gouges them, cuz what are they (we) going to do? Go to digital?...
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Old 02-25-2019   #28
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Originally Posted by Faintandfuzzy View Post
Their Instax profits dwarf their digital business.
Interesting, I wasn't aware, but I guess that would make some sense. People love that it's the instant photos like digital, but in a film form, for the nostalgia/novelty feels.
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Old 02-25-2019   #29
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Hopefully it's not Eterna for the worse...

Stop trying to Provia yourself, you just end up sounding full of Kodak. If I have to pay XTRA for film, so be it. I'd post some more personal film photos, but I don't want to aDox myself.
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Old 02-26-2019   #30
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Stop trying to Provia yourself, you just end up sounding full of Kodak. If I have to pay XTRA for film, so be it. I'd post some more personal film photos, but I don't want to aDox myself.
Archiver, I agree, this is no laughing matter. We can Ilford to lose any more emulsions. We have already been Delta blow with all the Fujifilm discontinuations.
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Old 02-26-2019   #31
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Maybe they will announce that the March sales were so good, they don't need to raise the price.
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Old 02-26-2019   #32
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Archiver, I agree, this is no laughing matter. We can Ilford to lose any more emulsions. We have already been Delta blow with all the Fujifilm discontinuations.
Aargh.......
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Old 02-26-2019   #33
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Maybe they will announce that the March sales were so good, they don't need to raise the price.
Or there will be so little film left at Fuji that they will raise prices much more (they said 30% was MINIMUM increase) to get even more money from die-hard film fans...

Let's wait and see.
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Old 02-26-2019   #34
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Because they know that Instax is used by people to have fun, goof around. They will lose interest in a hurry if prices of Instax are raised.

I'm already of the opinion that Instax is one of the more expensive formats. Well, maybe its not, because you don't have to send it in for processing, but its price has kept me away from it, even just to try it as a novelty.
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Old 02-26-2019   #35
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Well, this is bound to help Ektachrome sales, then, if you can't get Velvia or Provia. Good for Kodak. I do prefer the Fuji colors, though.
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Old 02-26-2019   #36
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Well, this is bound to help Ektachrome sales, then, if you can't get Velvia or Provia. Good for Kodak. I do prefer the Fuji colors, though.
I'm afraid Kodak might adjust its prices to match Fuji. Or be just a bit bellow (Kodak needs to sell film, Fuji doesn't).
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Old 02-26-2019   #37
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What's all this talk about low demand?

Don't people regularly post about non-Instax analog photography growing at exponential rates?
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Old 02-26-2019   #38
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What's all this talk about low demand?

Don't people regularly post about non-Instax analog photography growing at exponential rates?
Exponential? I don't know who's saying that. All I've read from manufacturers and fans alike are modest gains after hitting the painful bottom. In Kodak's case the lifeline of new interest is sufficient to reintroduce discontinued products and invest in quality marketing, but not enough for similar news from Fuji, who could be forgiven for wishing to focus on other areas of their business.

When people talk about low demand they're almost always looking to the past for a comparison rather than looking to the future. The correction that happened with digital cams and phones is still happening and the market has no choice but to right-size. Small players like Ferrania might be well suited to the future of film because their cost to produce film is matched to a smaller facility and smaller workforce that produces less product. (Perhaps the right amount of product, but I don't know.)

Fuji and Kodak have a more complex puzzle to solve due to existing facilities and a workforce designed to produce far more volume than is likely to be needed in the future. (Just my opinion.) That can work for a while but when those facilities need upkeep it can be an expensive dealbreaker. I'm hoping the challenges can be met by Fuji and Kodak because it would be a shame to lose all that history and talent those companies hold.
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Old 02-26-2019   #39
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I'm going to be the contrarian, I think Fujifilm is managing their exit strategy with their film business. Fujifilm Canada no longer lists or carries traditional film stocks in their distribution centre. There is speculation out there that Fujifilm is cruising on master rolls kept in cold storage and have not been making traditional film for some years now.

With the re-introduction of Ektachrome in 35mm and later on 120, I don't really have a reason to buy Fujifilm products and I'm spoiled for choice when it comes to black and white films and I would rather support film manufacturers who in turn support and engage with the film photography community.
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Old 02-26-2019   #40
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"Ted" is close to right, but it's not cost that's driving Fuji so much as desire to kill off the market and profit on its shrinking size the same way cigarette manufacturers did. This is the reverse of product introduction where you cut prices as the market increases. Here, they just ride the curve back up and allow higher prices to shrink demand. It works and it is very profitable, but that doesn't change the objective of exiting this end of the film business.
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