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How is a old film Nikon F rig...no meter...not a "rangefinder?"
Old 10-06-2019   #1
BobBill
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How is a old film Nikon F rig...no meter...not a "rangefinder?"

Or, for that matter, Old Korelles, Pearls, Pentax67s, etc.

Answer likely someplace; just too lazy to search.

Was going to post as thread, but might the ? might hijack the thread, so...
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Old 10-06-2019   #2
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Waaalll, 'spose it may be said of any rig using rangefinding tech to determine focus, n'est-ce pas?
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Old 10-06-2019   #3
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How many Nikon F rigs can fit inside a VW Beetle? Why is the color green so darn green? (There, weird thread hijacked)
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Old 10-06-2019   #4
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Smile

The Nikon F is not a RF camera because it is an SLR Camera.
No joking here
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Old 10-06-2019   #5
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xav...just stirring...got a "note" for playing with old bods and idea occurred...figured it was already discussed here. I had to sneak off to digital due to skin reaction to chems...miss the old ways. Digee seems very complicated, and the auto part makes it too easy at the same time. I have maybe tweny rolls of BW to process yet and chicken...some is way old too, so one of these days. I still mis my F, though.
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Old 10-06-2019   #6
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Strange you should ask because I've been looking for a Nikon F or F2 non-metered camera just today... Already have an FM3A so it must be GAS.
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Old 10-06-2019   #7
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It depends on the finder screen used. Currently my chrome F has the A screen which has a small split image spot in the center that might be called a rangefinder if you stretch the definition of rangefinder. My black 64 F has a G2 screen which has no split image spot so it is in no way a rangefinder. The G2 works well with my eyes but for critical low light focusing, nothing beats my M6 .85 Joe
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Old 10-06-2019   #8
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My “RF” F2 is used with a Nikon 21mm/4 via mirror lock-up.
Now this rig is close to being a RF unit.
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Old 10-06-2019   #9
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Try eBay, just to get feet wet, lot of camera brand/bods.

I figured an attendee would pick difference 'tween rangefinder and SLR, but seems they both do same thing...like a Graphlex? One useds split other melds images...some leave distance up to photog...interesting. Figured topic would have been beaten to death here.
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Old 10-06-2019   #10
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Sorry, have no clue what happened rendering a duplication.
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Old 10-06-2019   #11
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Quote:
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Figured topic would have been beaten to death here.
No, the answer is so obvious no one asked the question before.
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Old 10-06-2019   #12
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Maybe; maybe not. No dumb questions. It occurred to me...so I asked. I'm dim! What the hey?
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Old 10-06-2019   #13
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Quote:
Originally Posted by raid View Post
My “RF” F2 is used with a Nikon 21mm/4 via mirror lock-up.
Now this rig is close to being a RF unit.
Or f5.6 with the distance set at 8-10 feet you have a box camera.
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Old 10-06-2019   #14
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Do we have today established that almost any camera can be viewed as a RF camera!
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Old 10-06-2019   #15
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BobBill View Post
xav...just stirring...got a "note" for playing with old bods and idea occurred...figured it was already discussed here. I had to sneak off to digital due to skin reaction to chems...miss the old ways. Digee seems very complicated, and the auto part makes it too easy at the same time. I have maybe tweny rolls of BW to process yet and chicken...some is way old too, so one of these days. I still mis my F, though.
Here is one shot BW developer.
https://filmphotographyproject.com/c...-bw-developer/

My digital rangefinder camera is just like my M4-2. Same size, shape, shutter speed dial and same lenses. Instead of inserting film, I have ISO selection via direct button.
And my digital rangefinder has same rangefinder as film rangefinder, which is combining of two images, not combing of the same image split in half. Can't use this thing in SLRs. It doesn't provide same confidence with focus as rangefinder does.
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Old 10-06-2019   #16
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All is relative.
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Old 10-06-2019   #17
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Quote:
How is a old film Nikon F rig...no meter...not a "rangefinder?"
Ask your mother, maybe she knows.
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Old 10-06-2019   #18
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Quote:
Originally Posted by charjohncarter View Post
Or f5.6 with the distance set at 8-10 feet you have a box camera.
true dat, true dat
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Old 10-06-2019   #19
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When Ernst Leitz travelled to New York Oskar Barnack gave him the UR Leica to use. Barnack s advice “use depth of field and let focus take care of itself”.
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Old 10-06-2019   #20
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Isn't this similar to a rangefinder camera?

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Old 10-06-2019   #21
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Quote:
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Isn't this similar to a rangefinder camera?
There is nothing rangefinder about it. It is an SLR with an accessory viewfinder on the hot shoe.
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Old 10-06-2019   #22
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Of course, but it is a point and shoot rig.
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Old 10-06-2019   #23
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How is an old car...no auto transmission...not a "motorcycle?"
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Old 10-06-2019   #24
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This thread is meant to joke about it all.
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Old 10-06-2019   #25
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Quote:
How is a old film Nikon F rig...no meter...not a "rangefinder?"
I'll go one better, why is Nikon F ?!
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Old 10-06-2019   #26
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Quote:
Originally Posted by raid View Post
Isn't this similar to a rangefinder camera?

Just to be overly pedantic about it;
That has become a 'focus by scale, viewfinder camera.'

For instance, my Olympus Pen is the same type, it has a reversed Galilean viewfinder with projected bright frame, and focusing by scale down to 2 feet.

The Holga 120n is a viewfinder type 6X6 with focusing by symbols on the lens.

As I said, overly precise definition.

Edit; If I hook a 50 ft. tape measure to my camera's strap lug and measure the distance to the subject, has it become a 'rangefinder' camera because the tape measure is attached to the camera?

I know....stir the pot.
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Old 10-06-2019   #27
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I've always considered my F to be a folder.

My F2 however is a TLR.
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Old 10-06-2019   #28
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LOL! Wacky thread.

The Nikon F is a single lens reflex camera. Stripped of its metering prism finder and fitted with a 21mm lens that requires mirror lockup to fit, and the matching viewfinder, it's ... still an SLR camera that you've disabled the reflex mirror and focusing system on.

The Nikon F can never be a rangefinder camera. It just isn't. It doesn't have a rangefinder ...

I think I'll take the Polaroid One-Step that my friend gave me out for a walk now. It *must be* a rangefinder camera, eh?

G
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Old 10-06-2019   #29
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Weren't some of the early Alpa 35mm reflex cameras also equipped with a built in range/viewfinder?

Alpa experts, stand and be recognized.
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Old 10-06-2019   #30
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Quote:
Originally Posted by zuiko85 View Post
Weren't some of the early Alpa 35mm reflex cameras also equipped with a built in range/viewfinder?

Alpa experts, stand and be recognized.
I seem to recall that's true, but they're not Nikon Fs ...
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Old 10-06-2019   #31
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"Answer likely someplace; just too lazy to search." Clearly BobBill does not understand what a "rangefinder" camera is and is too lazy to search (his words). Really? Is he suggesting any camera you can focus is a rangefinder camera? Or is he just trying to start a flame war? This brings to my mind the head exploding mad world we live in at the moment where anything is what you define it to be, simply because that is what you want to call it.

But that aside here is the thing. Finding focus (AKA "distance" or "range" to the subject) is achieved in entirely different manner as between an SLR camera and a rangefinder camera. Sure they both "range" on a subject - they both focus and with an SLR if you wish to, you can also then read off the scale on the lens what the distance to the subject is. Just like you can with a rangefinder lens.

But that entirely misses the point because these different camera types do it in an totally different manner using entirely different technologies. One where it is done through a single viewing lens (this is what SLR refers to) and one which uses a separate view finder lens with a mechanical rangefinder sitting in the light path collecting light from two horizontally separate windows.

To say an SLR is a Rangefinder is rather like saying a monkey has two legs and a chicken has two legs, therefore a monkey is a chicken (and can lay eggs?). In other words it makes the most fundamental error of logic that can be made: i.e. Lumping two disparate things together and calling them the same simply because they share some common features - in this case, the ability to focus a lens.

PS What is the relevance of "no meter". It has no relevance whatsoever to the question of what is a rangefinder. As it happens back in the day rangefinders had no meters but neither did early SLRs. Simply because the technology to build a meter into a camera had not yet matured. Again it makes the "Monkey/Chicken" mistake but even more so as it's not even relevant to the question asked.
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Old 10-06-2019   #32
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I think it was just a slow day and the OP was trying stir up the pot.

Apparently, it worked.

Anyway, I took his post with a large grain of salt, ie, non serious.
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Old 10-07-2019   #33
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Quote:
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... almost any camera can be viewed as a RF camera!
So all of them are view cameras?
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Old 10-07-2019   #34
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My Polaroid SLR 690 has a sonar rangefinder. :-)
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Old 10-07-2019   #35
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A battleship has a rangefinder for its artillery. I suppose that makes it a camera. Its a bit heavy to carry about though.
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Old 10-07-2019   #36
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Isn't Nikon F just a modified Nikon SP ?
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Old 10-07-2019   #37
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Quote:
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Isn't Nikon F just a modified Nikon SP ?

And there is where the OP's question comes full circle, because to make an F, you have to remove the rangefinder from an SP.


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Old 10-08-2019   #38
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Old 10-08-2019   #39
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And there is where the OP's question comes full circle, because to make an F, you have to remove the rangefinder from an SP.


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Just like with Zenit (Zorki), which was released earlier than F.
And much earlier 135 format SLRs looks like they have same kind of origination.
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Old 10-08-2019   #40
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i bet all the Nikon designers and engineers who sweated bullets over the completely different shutter, auto-return mirror mechanism, auto-return aperture diaphragm, new lens mount, new body structures to support those bits, et al, are delighted to hear that the Nikon F is "just a Nikon SP with the rangefinder removed".

There are perhaps three minor parts that interchange between a Nikon SP and a Nikon F.

G
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