A new Leica for less...
Old 05-30-2019   #1
Philip Whiteman
Registered User
 
Philip Whiteman's Avatar
 
Philip Whiteman is offline
Join Date: Mar 2007
Posts: 179
A new Leica for less...

... than 160. I was looking out for a nice M6, only to discover that people are "rediscovering film" - and are prepared to pay 2,000 for a clean black or chrome body, it would appear. So instead I bought...

... an as-new R4, in its original box with the instructions and boxed neck strap. Not only that, but it's one of only 8,000 chrome ones made, and has the cast (not screen printed) Leica red dot logo and much brighter screen fitted to R5s and the similar R4S MOD2 - so it ticks both the user and collector boxes.

One more R Leica secret: the generally looked-down-upon Japanese 35-70 f3.5 Vario-Elmar (yours - and mine - for 300) actually produces images that are, as my own tests confirm, difficult to distinguish from the 50mm f2 Summicron.

Of course an M is an M and a 28mm f2.8 Elmar/50mm f2 Summicron/90mm f2.8mm combination will produce slightly better results - but ending up with a camera that despite its Minolta (fine camera maker) and Japanese (ditto for lenses) origins will do at times an almost indistinguishable job is for me, at least, thought provoking
  Reply With Quote

Old 05-30-2019   #2
leicapixie
Registered User
 
leicapixie is offline
Join Date: Jun 2011
Location: Toronto.Canada
Posts: 1,577
The best of luck, enjoy making great exposures.
The R4 has a bad reputation, to electronic problems.
This late in 'game' perhaps one with no faults.
I use the Minolta versions and strangely some Minolta lenses,
behave very similar to my Leitz lenses..flare, bokeh, that Collapsible Summicron look.
  Reply With Quote

Old 05-30-2019   #3
peterm1
Registered User
 
peterm1's Avatar
 
peterm1 is offline
Join Date: May 2006
Posts: 5,380
Quote:
Originally Posted by Philip Whiteman View Post
... than 160. I was looking out for a nice M6, only to discover that people are "rediscovering film" - and are prepared to pay 2,000 for a clean black or chrome body, it would appear. So instead I bought...

... an as-new R4, in its original box with the instructions and boxed neck strap. Not only that, but it's one of only 8,000 chrome ones made, and has the cast (not screen printed) Leica red dot logo and much brighter screen fitted to R5s and the similar R4S MOD2 - so it ticks both the user and collector boxes.

One more R Leica secret: the generally looked-down-upon Japanese 35-70 f3.5 Vario-Elmar (yours - and mine - for 300) actually produces images that are, as my own tests confirm, difficult to distinguish from the 50mm f2 Summicron.

Of course an M is an M and a 28mm f2.8 Elmar/50mm f2 Summicron/90mm f2.8mm combination will produce slightly better results - but ending up with a camera that despite its Minolta (fine camera maker) and Japanese (ditto for lenses) origins will do at times an almost indistinguishable job is for me, at least, thought provoking


I do not know why the Leica 35-70mm f3.5 is looked down upon other than for the fact that it was a Minolta design (which of course in part the camera was too as you say). I have been recently researching the Minolta original of the lens recently and it performs brilliantly based on all reports and the images I have seen, which is presumably why Leica chose it as the basis for one of their SLR lenses. They were keen to find suitable lenses to bulk out their SLR range (where there were noticeable gaps at the time - Leica being a small firm with limited development finds for new lenses) and I could not imagine them tarnishing their reputation by choosing any old tosh and badging it as a Leica.

The Minolta original is BTW quite cheap to buy and I may get one as a walk about lens. Though I have recently bought the Olympus f3.6 35-70mm of similar vintage I am keen to try that lens for myself. The only issue with the Olympus being that it is comparatively very large for an Olympus OM lens. other than this it also performs well too.

A 2011 article on the collaboration. http://forum.mflenses.com/the-leica-...on-t77452.html
  Reply With Quote

Old 05-30-2019   #4
Ko.Fe.
Kostya Fedot
 
Ko.Fe.'s Avatar
 
Ko.Fe. is offline
Join Date: Jul 2013
Location: MiltON.ONtario
Posts: 7,120
You could pay 2K$ for film M only if you are willing to. But you don"t have to. Where are plenty of film M for much less. But I guess Leica label and new neck strap was on higher priority
  Reply With Quote

Old 05-30-2019   #5
CharlesDAMorgan
Registered User
 
CharlesDAMorgan is online now
Join Date: Apr 2018
Location: South East UK
Posts: 550
The Minolta 35-70mm constant aperture zoom is excellent. Especially when it cost me 50 and the black XD7 I put it on another 50.

But I also have an R7 and an R4s - really nice cameras and with a great suite of R lenses available. Plus of course, much closer focussing but slightly less than silent shutters. Great exposure system too.

Well done on your find!
__________________
Film amateur with a few rangefinders - Leica III, M2/M3, Werra 3 and Zeiss Super Ikonta 534/16 medium format.

Apart from that have a Rolleiflex 3.5F, the odd Minolta XD7, Hasselblad 500cm, a Topcon Super D and an Intrepid 5x4 large format (not the half of it but I am clearing them out, honest).

I do all my own black and white developing at home.
  Reply With Quote

Old 05-30-2019   #6
David Hughes
David Hughes
 
David Hughes's Avatar
 
David Hughes is offline
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 7,369
I thought that the deal that resulted in the M5 and CL in the 70's was that Leica gained Minolta's electronic and mass production expertise and Minolta gained from Leica's lens expertise. Both seem obvious - I'm glad to say - looking at and using samples from both makers.


Regards, David
  Reply With Quote

Old 05-30-2019   #7
Steve M.
Registered User
 
Steve M. is offline
Join Date: Jun 2009
Posts: 3,321
I shot the R cameras for years because I preferred shooting a SLR to a rangefinder. Still do, but I switched from the Leica cameras to Nikons using the Leica R lenses w/ an adapter. Compared to the Nikons, the R series cameras are slow, loud, and lack the metering options that the Nikons have. The R4 and R5 are sorta cute though for sure, they just under perform badly compared to the Japanese cameras. Leica had trouble competing w/ the other SLR cameras on the market and dropped the R lineup many years ago due to lack of sales.

You're right about the R lenses, they are superb, especially the R 90 Elmarits and Summicrons.
  Reply With Quote

Old 05-30-2019   #8
xayraa33
rangefinder user and fancier
 
xayraa33's Avatar
 
xayraa33 is offline
Join Date: Feb 2004
Posts: 5,845
One can make great photos with almost any camera or lens.

I still use my Praktica LTL camera with its 50mm Zeiss Tessar lens and the 30mm Lydith lens and even sometimes venture out to 135 mm world, with the all manual f2.8 Pentacon lens, known and admired for its fine bokeh.
__________________
My Gallery
  Reply With Quote

Old 05-30-2019   #9
Austintatious
Registered User
 
Austintatious's Avatar
 
Austintatious is offline
Join Date: Nov 2005
Location: Shadow of Pikes Peak, USA
Posts: 405
I have the "cousins" of the Leica camera and lens you have. The Minolta XD-11 and the Minolta version of the 35-70 f3.5 lens. Both for just under $200. Very happy with the results from this camera.
__________________
My gallery

RF's : Bessa-R ,FED II, Olympus 35RC , Kiev 4AM,Argus C-3
Other :Minolta XD-11, Minolta SRT102, Pentax Spotmatic ,Nikon N80, Yashica-Mat 124G, Rolleicord Va
Digital :Nikon D7100, Sony NEX 6, Panasonic LX-5
  Reply With Quote

Old 05-30-2019   #10
David Hughes
David Hughes
 
David Hughes's Avatar
 
David Hughes is offline
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 7,369
I would have said that the R's are big and heavy but practical - well I liked my R5 but couldn't afford Leica's prices for a needed repair. I got my money back selling the lenses and have enough bargain (street market and charity shop) SLR's.

They, Minolta, Olympus and Pentax make bodies and leses that are just as nice etc and then there's Tokina for zoom lenses...

In real life and for most people I doubt if Leica's quality etc are needed. You've only got to look at the size prints are done these days to see why but slides are another matter.

Regards, David
  Reply With Quote

Old 05-30-2019   #11
Beemermark
Registered User
 
Beemermark's Avatar
 
Beemermark is offline
Join Date: Jan 2007
Location: Wilmington, NC
Posts: 1,665
Quote:
Originally Posted by leicapixie View Post
The R4 has a bad reputation, to electronic problems.

The early R4's had no end of issues. Off warranty Leica wouldn't touch them. After a disastrous start the issues were resolved and after that they were pretty good cameras.


https://camerapedia.fandom.com/wiki/Leica_R4
  Reply With Quote

Old 05-31-2019   #12
Jumillar
Never Settle
 
Jumillar's Avatar
 
Jumillar is offline
Join Date: May 2019
Location: Europe
Posts: 65
I'm no expert so you can take my thoughts with a pinch of salt but i always say you get what you pay for. But then again, hats off to you for managing to find a bargain price Leica and who cares if it needs some TLC or repair in the near future.. you only paid 160 for it, so cough up and get it looked at or sell it and probably get your money back. Hopefully everything is well and you enjoy using it whilst smugly knowing it didn't cost you a fortune.
I too have recently found (in my mind) a bargain Leica. My budget was 1000 for a M body which i planned on fitting with a legacy lens whilst i saved up for some Leica glass.
I managed to find a Leica M4-P chrome anniversary edition (mint condition in box) which i managed to negotiate down to 750 & then got a 50/f2 summicron from the same seller for 600 (discounted by 100) because i had already bought the M4-P.
Now i am fully aware (as i'm sure you are) that we have not bought what many consider to be classic Leica bodies, but for many of us nowadays the classic M camera is out of our price range, but why should this exclude us from joining the club.
Happy shooting
  Reply With Quote

Old 05-31-2019   #13
steveyork
Registered User
 
steveyork is offline
Join Date: Aug 2008
Posts: 682
Leicaflex SL are great cameras, and affordable.
  Reply With Quote

Old 05-31-2019   #14
wjlapier
Registered User
 
wjlapier's Avatar
 
wjlapier is offline
Join Date: Jan 2008
Posts: 1,677
Congrats on the find. Shoot it until it doesn't shoot anymore, then buy another.

I found a nice R7 for a good price ( I think it is ) and even though it's a tiny bit bigger than the R4,5, R-E, and 6 I'm ok with it. IMO, it's the glass and the one lens I have is all I need these days.
  Reply With Quote

Old 05-31-2019   #15
Huss
Registered User
 
Huss is offline
Join Date: Sep 2014
Location: Venice, CA
Posts: 7,256
Quote:
Originally Posted by Philip Whiteman View Post
... than 160. I was looking out for a nice M6, only to discover that people are "rediscovering film" - and are prepared to pay 2,000 for a clean black or chrome body, it would appear. So instead I bought...

... an as-new R4, in its original box with the instructions and boxed neck strap. ..
Nice, I bought an as new R-E for $170 after I bought a nice one for $200. USD not English pounds. At that price, why not have a spare?!
And an as new chrome R7 for $220.

These are gorgeous kameras to feel, fondle and USE!!!

Tip- using a soft release removes that long shutter action/delay.
  Reply With Quote

Old 05-31-2019   #16
raydm6
Registered User
 
raydm6's Avatar
 
raydm6 is offline
Join Date: Oct 2006
Location: North Central Massachusetts (USA)
Posts: 448
Quote:
Originally Posted by Huss View Post
...

These are gorgeous kameras to feel, fondle and USE!!!


...

The R4 was my 1st Leica. They *do* feel nice in the hand. Then, the M-bug hit me and I traded that, lens w/cash for an M6 & 35-cron v4 in 1985 and still have them
__________________
flickriver
  Reply With Quote
Reply


Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

vB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off



All times are GMT -8. The time now is 07:56.


vBulletin skin developed by: eXtremepixels
Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.6.8
Copyright ©2000 - 2019, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.

All content on this site is Copyright Protected and owned by its respective owner. You may link to content on this site but you may not reproduce any of it in whole or part without written consent from its owner.