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Leica Screw Mount Copies Classic Leica Copy forum as listed in the book 300 Leica Copies, including but not limited to Nicca, Leotax, Honor, Canon etc. At one time there was a major part of the camera industry just trying to make a lower cost copy/dirivitive of the original Leica.

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Old 05-25-2019   #81
David Hughes
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I forgot to add that - compared to the 7S - the FEDs have another advantage "No Mercury Batteries Required"...


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Old 05-25-2019   #82
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I forgot to add that - compared to the 7S - the FEDs have another advantage "No Mercury Batteries Required"...


Regards, David
7s works in fully manual mode (no battery required), then it works fine with LR/SR batteries or a simple voltage reducing adaptor is a simple solution (I use those for OM1). Fed’s advantage (if we try to find such) might be multi-lens capability and smaller size.
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Old 05-25-2019   #83
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Different beasties but all rather fun. After a day out with the Leica III, an M3 and a Rolleiflex, I think the Zorki would provide the viewfinder of the M3 (a bit less good) and the lens capability of the III, so it strikes me as a good compromise. But I must have had at least ten people come up to me to chat about the Rolleiflex, and, again, be offered darkroom equipment and a full Mamiya RZ67 kit of lenses. It's one of many reasons why I like funny old cameras - you get to talk a lot!

Now to a lot of developing...
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Old 05-25-2019   #84
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Different beasties but all rather fun. After a day out with the Leica III, an M3 and a Rolleiflex, I think the Zorki would provide the viewfinder of the M3 (a bit less good) and the lens capability of the III, so it strikes me as a good compromise. But I must have had at least ten people come up to me to chat about the Rolleiflex, and, again, be offered darkroom equipment and a full Mamiya RZ67 kit of lenses. It's one of many reasons why I like funny old cameras - you get to talk a lot!

Now to a lot of developing...
You canít beat Rolleiflex when it comes to getting attention, I experienced that many times.
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Old 05-25-2019   #85
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Different beasties but all rather fun. After a day out with the Leica III, an M3 and a Rolleiflex, I think the Zorki would provide the viewfinder of the M3 (a bit less good) and the lens capability of the III, so it strikes me as a good compromise. But I must have had at least ten people come up to me to chat about the Rolleiflex, and, again, be offered darkroom equipment and a full Mamiya RZ67 kit of lenses. It's one of many reasons why I like funny old cameras - you get to talk a lot!

Now to a lot of developing...
I have no idea why you are spending time to get FSU RF if you have working III. Any FSU RF LTM is just bad copy or simply ugly and bad function camera comparing to III. Zorki VF has nothing to do with M3 VF.
If you need best 50 mm VF ever made get SBOOI.

III, M3 and Rollei is one if not the best set for film. FSU will add nothing to it. But J3, J-12, Orion-15 and Russar are great lenses on film Leica.

I have Zorki from serviced by one of the best, if not best service person for FSU LTM RF (he is not available for outsiders). It lasted few months with frequent use and now has typical FSU LTM uneven exposure. I can't re-adjust it.
In opposite my Australian buddy Lynn has LTM Leica which comes to him with unknown service history as working and it just keeps on working.

The FSU LTM RF were made for soviet service centers. It was government job. No matter if you spend one month with just one camera. This is what FSU RF LTM is. You have to have time to fix it....
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Old 05-25-2019   #86
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Fair points Ko.Fe, well made.

The III is generally reliable but misses the odd shot. It was serviced a year ago and came from a top London dealer. Ultimately, I find focussing slow and very difficult in low light. I took it out to photograph old cars of the same age as the camera, and they were going nowhere quickly.

I am increasingly uncomfortable using the M3 for street photography - it is too recognisable now and too valuable. I am entirely unbothered about carting round a piece of Soviet kit, if nothing else, it looks like a fine defensive tool!
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Old 05-26-2019   #87
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...

Did some lens testing with it on the A7s on tripod with measurements done with a tape measure. There's about a cm of front focussing at 1m at f1.5, largely gone by f2. At 5, 7 & 10 meters, F1.5 is slightly out but all the other apertures are absolutely spot on.

...
This is why shimming is sometimes required. Only 1cm off for a Jup-3 actually is pretty good. Many were 4-5cms front focusing.

The Sonnar has focus drift as per the design, and the closest focus wide open is set to agree with the Contax standard that Zorki and FED cameras are made with, not the Leica standard which is a wee bit shorter.

The idea is to shim for wide open closest focus, and when focusing further away, let the increasing DOF cover any focusing inadequacies.
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Old 05-26-2019   #88
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Fair points Ko.Fe, well made.

The III is generally reliable but misses the odd shot. It was serviced a year ago and came from a top London dealer. Ultimately, I find focussing slow and very difficult in low light. I took it out to photograph old cars of the same age as the camera, and they were going nowhere quickly.

I am increasingly uncomfortable using the M3 for street photography - it is too recognisable now and too valuable. I am entirely unbothered about carting round a piece of Soviet kit, if nothing else, it looks like a fine defensive tool!
I find the old and new Leicas to be no different from any other camera in that they all need regular servicing and bad wear and tear take them beyond the servicable point. Alas, you don't get a log book with them - unlike aircraft - so what can we do? So far I've scrapped two, one old and one newish as they were past the point they could be helped.

BTW, I'm shocked, shocked*, that you have no SLR in your line up.

My classic film line up is the Leica CL, Olympus XA and Pentax ME super. The problem is that each of the three have a few closely following them in the order of merit and then there's digital...

Regards, David


* This is a reference to a scene in the film "Casablanca" btw.
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Old 05-26-2019   #89
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This is why shimming is sometimes required. Only 1cm off for a Jup-3 actually is pretty good. Many were 4-5cms front focusing.

The Sonnar has focus drift as per the design, and the closest focus wide open is set to agree with the Contax standard that Zorki and FED cameras are made with, not the Leica standard which is a wee bit shorter.

The idea is to shim for wide open closest focus, and when focusing further away, let the increasing DOF cover any focusing inadequacies.
I would love to have this widely known but alas...

The strange thing is that CZ lenses are seen as perfect and Jupiters spoilt by those wicked Soviet workers. A great pity as I know someone who took a J-8 to bits and measured everything against a Sonnar and decided that they were exact copies.

Regards, David
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Old 05-26-2019   #90
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I got the Casablanca bit!

I do have more than the odd SLR, but yesterday was an historic motorsport event and I like to shoot the cars with old cameras. Ko.Fe can rest assured none of them are, or will be, FSU as I started with a Zenit 38 years ago and I see no reason to return.

But my SLR line up has a Leica R7, a Nikon F2 and lenses, plus some highways and byways that I need to sort!
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Old 05-26-2019   #91
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Fair points Ko.Fe, well made.

The III is generally reliable but misses the odd shot. It was serviced a year ago and came from a top London dealer. Ultimately, I find focussing slow and very difficult in low light. I took it out to photograph old cars of the same age as the camera, and they were going nowhere quickly.

I am increasingly uncomfortable using the M3 for street photography - it is too recognisable now and too valuable. I am entirely unbothered about carting round a piece of Soviet kit, if nothing else, it looks like a fine defensive tool!
M3 is under 1K$ camera. Not really valuable.
Been recognized on the street is part of the honest, humanist photography.
HCB was acting like hunting crane bird and GW was just plowing through.

You'll be better served with Bessa L or R for the street than any FSU.

The only thing which bugs me with film M is cost of the service. But at lest it is still more less obtainable comparing to FSU.

If you really want to try it, get half a dozen of FED-2 and make one working.
Use Jay Fedka Zorki service pages as instructions for rehaull.
eBay has curtains material for it. And here is one guy from Ukraine who sells instructions video how to fix fed-2 as well.
Fed-2 has tinted vf and film is advancible with one stroke of index finger, on late models. It is the only FSU LTM RF which is beautiful, the rest is ugly ducklings.
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Old 05-26-2019   #92
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I got the Casablanca bit!

I do have more than the odd SLR, but yesterday was an historic motorsport event and I like to shoot the cars with old cameras. Ko.Fe can rest assured none of them are, or will be, FSU as I started with a Zenit 38 years ago and I see no reason to return.

But my SLR line up has a Leica R7, a Nikon F2 and lenses, plus some highways and byways that I need to sort!
I'm amazed, no one these days seems to have seen it or even recognise the title; same goes for L&H etc, etc. A great shame...

As for matching the camera to the subject, this is what I often shoot and cameras of that vintage are a bit beyond me. Or rather the repairs and plates are.




I wish I still had my R5 it worked well at airshows; like a superior P&S.

Regards, David


PS An old car photo for you, taken in the car park at an airshow:-


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Old 05-26-2019   #93
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...Fed-2 has tinted vf and film is advancible with one stroke of index finger, on late models. It is the only FSU LTM RF which is beautiful, the rest is ugly ducklings.

I wish you hadn't mentioned that version. I can see more expense coming along...


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Old 05-26-2019   #94
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Very nice David - that must be Old Warden I assume! You are just a bit before really portable cameras with that era.

The reason I take the Rolleiflex is that I go to the Bugatti Owners Club Prescott Hillclimb. That opened in 1938 and the great Ettore Bugatti himself was photographed at that event taking photos with his Rolleiflex.

By coincidence, this original Bugatti works racing car was present in 1938 and back in 2018.

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Apart from that have a Rolleiflex 3.5F, the odd Minolta XD7, Hasselblad 500cm, a Topcon Super D and an Intrepid 5x4 large format (not the half of it but I am clearing them out, honest).

I do all my own black and white developing at home.
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Old 05-26-2019   #95
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Yup! It's Old Warden a mecca for old cars, old bikes, old aircraft and old cameras. Edit and old gits...


Regards, David
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Old 05-31-2019   #96
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Another Jupiter 3 on its way back to the vendor, with haze and fungus that the 100% positive feedback Ukranian seller somehow overlooked.

The English seller of the Zorki 3 I returned didn't bother to refund so Ebay did so. It must be me, but as a source of stuff it's become so poor.

However, a Zorki 4 with Jupiter 8 arrived and I've just put a 24 roll of HP5 through it testing all the shutter speeds and absolutely no issues. It's a bit lower rent than the 3, the shutter speed is fiddly to set and the shutter goes off like a pistol crack, but every image has been fine. I didn't get much of a chance to shoot wide open as it has been sunny plus a 400iso film. But it's sharp enough.

Back lane in Plymouth's Barbican. HP5+ in Ilfosol 3

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Film amateur with a few rangefinders - Leica III, M2/M3, Werra 3 and Zeiss Super Ikonta 534/16 medium format.

Apart from that have a Rolleiflex 3.5F, the odd Minolta XD7, Hasselblad 500cm, a Topcon Super D and an Intrepid 5x4 large format (not the half of it but I am clearing them out, honest).

I do all my own black and white developing at home.
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Old 05-31-2019   #97
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If you're intent on trying out FSU gear, I would suggest a Zorki-6 as perhaps the most ergonomic variant, and the Fed-3 as the most indestructible.

Fedka in NYC sells the J-3. Might be more $$ than the Ukrainian sources on ebay, but your chances of getting a winner are much, much, much greater.

Oh, just looked and I see you're in UK. Fedka is not as attractive an option now, expense-wise.
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Old 05-31-2019   #98
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Sadly not, but I think I've exhausted my enthusiasm for now.
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Film amateur with a few rangefinders - Leica III, M2/M3, Werra 3 and Zeiss Super Ikonta 534/16 medium format.

Apart from that have a Rolleiflex 3.5F, the odd Minolta XD7, Hasselblad 500cm, a Topcon Super D and an Intrepid 5x4 large format (not the half of it but I am clearing them out, honest).

I do all my own black and white developing at home.
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Old 05-31-2019   #99
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If you're intent on trying out FSU gear, I would suggest a Zorki-6 as perhaps the most ergonomic variant, and the Fed-3 as the most indestructible.

Fedka in NYC sells the J-3. Might be more $$ than the Ukrainian sources on ebay, but your chances of getting a winner are much, much, much greater.

Oh, just looked and I see you're in UK. Fedka is not as attractive an option now, expense-wise.
Z-6 s with sharp tooths on stiff realese. With advance travel way too long. It looks nice, but I have sore index finger after couple of rolls with it.
And I never made FED3 working again .
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Old 05-31-2019   #100
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Another Jupiter 3 on its way back to the vendor, with haze and fungus that the 100% positive feedback Ukranian seller somehow overlooked.

The English seller of the Zorki 3 I returned didn't bother to refund so Ebay did so. It must be me, but as a source of stuff it's become so poor.

However, a Zorki 4 with Jupiter 8 arrived and I've just put a 24 roll of HP5 through it testing all the shutter speeds and absolutely no issues. It's a bit lower rent than the 3, the shutter speed is fiddly to set and the shutter goes off like a pistol crack, but every image has been fine. I didn't get much of a chance to shoot wide open as it has been sunny plus a 400iso film. But it's sharp enough.

Back lane in Plymouth's Barbican. HP5+ in Ilfosol 3

That Zorki 4 and J-8 did alright.

Once you find a good Zorki 4 and a good J-8 lens combo, I would say they would be keepers and worth using.
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Old 05-31-2019   #101
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In fact more than alright. Next time I'll use Tmax400 but I had a 24 exposure HP5 to use up.

That Jupiter 8 is more than capable.

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Apart from that have a Rolleiflex 3.5F, the odd Minolta XD7, Hasselblad 500cm, a Topcon Super D and an Intrepid 5x4 large format (not the half of it but I am clearing them out, honest).

I do all my own black and white developing at home.
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Old 06-01-2019   #102
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However, a Zorki 4 with Jupiter 8 arrived and I've just put a 24 roll of HP5 through it testing all the shutter speeds and absolutely no issues. It's a bit lower rent than the 3, the shutter speed is fiddly to set and the shutter goes off like a pistol crack, but every image has been fine. I didn't get much of a chance to shoot wide open as it has been sunny plus a 400iso film. But it's sharp enough.

Back lane in Plymouth's Barbican. HP5+ in Ilfosol 3

It looks as though you've found your FSU kit, at last, Charles. It's looking good!

As it happens, I was in Plymouth yesterday, but I have to admit that I didn't notice anyone sporting a Zorki/J8 combo, surrounded by a small group of curious photographers, all wanting to know what that 'strange camera' is!
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Old 06-01-2019   #103
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Alas I had returned to South Bucks by then, but given I'd been in with it to see Russell at Soperfect on the Barbican, most long term residents there probably thought it was far too normal!

It's a great camera to shove in the bag, not worrying too much about its value or looks, and just getting on with photography. Very functional indeed!
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Film amateur with a few rangefinders - Leica III, M2/M3, Werra 3 and Zeiss Super Ikonta 534/16 medium format.

Apart from that have a Rolleiflex 3.5F, the odd Minolta XD7, Hasselblad 500cm, a Topcon Super D and an Intrepid 5x4 large format (not the half of it but I am clearing them out, honest).

I do all my own black and white developing at home.
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Old 06-01-2019   #104
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Alas I had returned to South Bucks by then, but given I'd been in with it to see Russell at Soperfect on the Barbican, most long term residents there probably thought it was far too normal!

It's a great camera to shove in the bag, not worrying too much about its value or looks, and just getting on with photography. Very functional indeed!
Hah! I've resisted the temptation (so far, at least) to visit Soperfect... I fear that such a visit would be detrimental to my bank balance. Also, arriving home with yet more camera gear (a.k.a. "clutter"), would probably not be a popular move with the Missus!

As for "just getting on with photgraphy"... I entirely agree. I got very tired of the obsession with technical perfection of recent years, and have returned to simple film photography - for the most part - for enjoyment.
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Old 06-01-2019   #105
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I've bought a few things there but of late have been decidedly miserly. Some intriguing clutter there though!

I have reached the point where if I like the look, however flawed, I'll shoot that. It tends to be a much cheaper pursuit too.
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Apart from that have a Rolleiflex 3.5F, the odd Minolta XD7, Hasselblad 500cm, a Topcon Super D and an Intrepid 5x4 large format (not the half of it but I am clearing them out, honest).

I do all my own black and white developing at home.
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Old 06-01-2019   #106
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Some intriguing clutter there though!
Please... don't tell me any more [fingers in ears, whistling].

I'm ignoring all such talk!
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Old 06-17-2019   #107
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Finally, got a very good looking Zorki 3M arrive this morning, shutter curtain perfect, all speeds seem to work, the Jupiter 8 it came with is free of most rubbish and the whole thing looks to be good. Except the Russian seller forgot to put the film spool in. He's immensely apologetic and will send one forthwith, hey ho!

The 3M incorporates the slower speeds on the main shutter dial, so no more than normal troublesome low speed linkage at the bottom of the camera. It's a handsome camera.
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Film amateur with a few rangefinders - Leica III, M2/M3, Werra 3 and Zeiss Super Ikonta 534/16 medium format.

Apart from that have a Rolleiflex 3.5F, the odd Minolta XD7, Hasselblad 500cm, a Topcon Super D and an Intrepid 5x4 large format (not the half of it but I am clearing them out, honest).

I do all my own black and white developing at home.
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Old 06-17-2019   #108
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Did you check curtains and slow speeds?
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Old 06-17-2019   #109
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Curtains checked and entirely good, slow speeds sound ok but when I get the spool I'll check with a film in.

I don't trust anything FSU at this stage!
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Film amateur with a few rangefinders - Leica III, M2/M3, Werra 3 and Zeiss Super Ikonta 534/16 medium format.

Apart from that have a Rolleiflex 3.5F, the odd Minolta XD7, Hasselblad 500cm, a Topcon Super D and an Intrepid 5x4 large format (not the half of it but I am clearing them out, honest).

I do all my own black and white developing at home.
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Old 06-17-2019   #110
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Your from III should work in it. I have Leica LTM spool in my Zorki.
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Old 06-17-2019   #111
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Good point! Needless to say the Leica III broke down on the weekend, so it can be spared easily.
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Apart from that have a Rolleiflex 3.5F, the odd Minolta XD7, Hasselblad 500cm, a Topcon Super D and an Intrepid 5x4 large format (not the half of it but I am clearing them out, honest).

I do all my own black and white developing at home.
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Old 06-17-2019   #112
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I guess a warning is needed for this thread as it ends with a Zorki 3 being superior to a Leica III; cue several rants...


Regards, David
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Old 06-17-2019   #113
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To celebrate the triumph of Soviet Camera over bourgeois fascist Leica, I'm listening to Leonid Kharitonov singing The Cliff with the Red Army choir. Ponderous revolutionay song that that psychopaths in the Kremlin used to blub their black hearts out to, but what singing, what a voice.
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Apart from that have a Rolleiflex 3.5F, the odd Minolta XD7, Hasselblad 500cm, a Topcon Super D and an Intrepid 5x4 large format (not the half of it but I am clearing them out, honest).

I do all my own black and white developing at home.
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Old 4 Weeks Ago   #114
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Ko.Fe. is offline
Join Date: Jul 2013
Location: MiltON.ONtario
Posts: 7,122
You must be under influence...

It is old Russian song. Written by ex-military, lawyer and bureaucrat.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Alexander_Navrotsky
He served as suppressor of revolution in Poland.
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