Old 11-25-2016   #81
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Not strange at all!

I missed your age as mine is shown with my real name and location.
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Old 11-25-2016   #82
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Thanks.

Hope you had a wonderful Thanksgiving.

My wife just turned 62 in November. We celebrated our 39th anniversary in August.

Take care.
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Old 11-25-2016   #83
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I believe the issues much talked about here are because of additional work at B & H for shipping and subsequent possible screwups with fines in a declining market.
Additional work ? Put item in box. Attach computer printed label (with customs form like they did with my previous orders). Have USPS (or whoever buyer chooses) pick up item for ground delivery.

Ground shipping is not rocket science, sorry but their excuse doesn't pass the sniff test as all my shipments came via Purolator GROUND then Canada Post ground. Large boxes of film AND chemistry.

and their free shipping to Canada wasn't out of the generosity of their heart. They know we will buy more just to meet the free delivery threshold so they win as well by pulling more dollars from our pocketbooks. I would gladly pay fair ground shipping rates if they understood the gravity of this decision and offered surface shipping again.
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Old 11-25-2016   #84
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Originally Posted by skopar steve View Post
Come on Tim, don't sugar coat it. Tell us how you really feel. What Tim said about the big retailers doing in the local stores is certainly true in my neck of the woods. Just was not enough volume to carry the variety of darkroom supplies a B&H type store can.

Fortunately, I have an outlet from a major photographic retailer (Hunts) that is 45 mins away and will stock what I need, so long as I do my part and go there and buy it. A bonus is I get to fondle all kinds of new and used gear.
Dear Steve,

Consider yourself lucky to have a Hunt's nearby. I've dealt with them several times and if tortured could not come up with anything bad to say about them.

I live in Central PA along with easily 1,000,000 other people within the radius of an hours drive. We still have a dedicated camera store or two, but none that are accessible to me during the hours which they are typically open.

When you sell a specialty good, or service, it would make sense to me that you would be open when your average customer would have time to shop for those goods or services? Our camera shops are 9-5 M-F, with the odd one or two having Saturday morning hours, though both of them are easily more than an hour's drive for me.

Consumers made this current market. I guess I'll never understand why so many of them bitch about what they made?

A nicer fellow than me named Bill Clark said pretty much exactly what I said in my original post a few posts back, though he said it much more politely than I could ever say it.

Here's your chance boys!

Put up or shut up.

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Tim Murphy
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Old 11-25-2016   #85
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Originally Posted by Tim Murphy View Post


Consumers made this current market. I guess I'll never understand why so many of them bitch about what they made?

A nicer fellow than me named Bill Clark said pretty much exactly what I said in my original post a few posts back, though he said it much more politely than I could ever say it.

Here's your chance boys!

Put up or shut up.

Regards,

Tim Murphy
Tim,
Sure, when I lived on Chicago's north side in the 70's darkroom chems were just an extra stop on the 'EL', but in 1978, when I moved to the pacific northwest, oh boy, things changed. The rush of life with a young family and the loss of my young wife to cancer set me back for quite a while. Finally, in 1989 I decided to drag out the Nikkor tanks and the B22 and get back into developing and printing. By that time the closest place with chemicals was a 130 mile round trip so it was mail order from Freestyle all the way. This is 1989 mind you. Now days I have no idea how far I'd have to go to get chemicals. I bet that I'm not a rare fellow still doing film with no local source for materials. Would not be surprised if this wipes out 90% of B&H's liquid chemical sales. Then they will just close them out entirely.
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Old 11-25-2016   #86
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Tim,
Sure, when I lived on Chicago's north side in the 70's darkroom chems were just an extra stop on the 'EL', but in 1978, when I moved to the pacific northwest, oh boy, things changed. The rush of life with a young family and the loss of my young wife to cancer set me back for quite a while. Finally, in 1989 I decided to drag out the Nikkor tanks and the B22 and get back into developing and printing. By that time the closest place with chemicals was a 130 mile round trip so it was mail order from Freestyle all the way. This is 1989 mind you. Now days I have no idea how far I'd have to go to get chemicals. I bet that I'm not a rare fellow still doing film with no local source for materials. Would not be surprised if this wipes out 90% of B&H's liquid chemical sales. Then they will just close them out entirely.
Dear zuiko,

I apologize for how I came off with my remarks, especially after hearing you explain your life experience.

My comments were not directed at you, nor to anyone else specifically.

My comments were meant in general for people who always seem to cry foul, especially when they have no actual skin in the game?

I have seen Henry Posner comment only a few times on all the photography message boards I visit, and the boards I visit are many. Most of the time people respect and understand his POV, even if they don't agree with it.

This time it's different. People have responded with quotes and print of actual orders calling him a liar.

I won't debate the accuracy of what was posted, I'll merely repeat what I said originally. It's a big bar and anyone who cares to can belly up. The door is still open for someone to put their money on the line to do a better job.

I apologize if I wasn't clear with that in my previous posts, but I still maintain that doing nothing more than simply complaining about a company that has done so much for photography in general over time isn't a viable solution to a problem.

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Old 11-25-2016   #87
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I'll just continue to use Freestyle for the chemicals - they are on the left coast as I, so shipping is a day or two quicker. But hopefully B&H and Adorama will continue to supply
cartridges for my beloved 14 year old Epson R2400......I keep my fingers crossed.
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Old 11-26-2016   #88
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I think it clear that B&H is only bottom line oriented and has no interest in supporting the people that built their business. It also clear they're phasing out analog. I think this is a way to sell existing inventory And then film and paper will be the next to go. This is just my opinion and only time will tell. Sadly B&H doesn't have the guts to tell the truth.

Considering the massive drop in sales of digital cameras in the past couple of years I believe this is why they've added guitars in hopes of saving the business. Looking at what's happening I wouldn't be surprised if they don't start selling refrigerators and washer drier sets. It really appears they're trying to become Best Buy. That's going to be tougher than the photo market given the competition from the big box stores.

Your thoughts.
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Old 11-26-2016   #89
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... I wouldn't be surprised if they don't start selling refrigerators and washer drier sets. It really appears they're trying to become Best Buy. That's going to be tougher than the photo market given the competition from the big box stores.

Your thoughts.
Especially if they don't ship by Ground. I can't imagine what sending a washer/dryer by air would cost.
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Old 11-26-2016   #90
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Adding a new product brand or a new line or genre whether or not it is "more lucrative" has no bearing n whether or not we will continue to offer darkroom products to the best of our ability and within the limits the law permits.


We are NOT "putting analog out to dry." We are conforming to imitations imposed on us by government regulations. We do the same with lithium batteries. I would guess you'd prefer a plane your loved ones were on did not explode due to an unsafe condition in a baggage hold.


Our site will tell you if an item is in stock in our Manhattan store. I urge you to check before jumping into your car.


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Old 11-28-2016   #91
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It is silly. The reason they cite, that plane crash in the 90s was caused by an exploding tire. But I guess some D-76 could have done the same thing.
Those of us with longer memories will recall that the ValuJet crash was caused by the on-board ignition of spare oxygen generators (they provide oxygen for passengers for those frightening events where the plane de-compresses and the masks drop down from the overhead) that were being carried in the cargo hold. The resulting fire quickly burned through the control cables and caused the aircraft to plunge into the Everglades.

You may be thinking of the Concorde accident in Paris.
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Old 11-28-2016   #92
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I think we need to help them by notifying the NTSB and FAA that they're illegally shipping lithium batteries by air.
Well that'd be a plan except we're scrupulous about conforming to regs regarding lithium batteries. BTW Effective January 1, 2017, UPS will change its requirements for shipping lithium batteries by air.https://www.ups.com/content/us/en/ab...ry_update.html
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Old 11-28-2016   #93
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Well that'd be a plan except we're scrupulous about conforming to regs regarding lithium batteries. BTW Effective January 1, 2017, UPS will change its requirements for shipping lithium batteries by air.https://www.ups.com/content/us/en/ab...ry_update.html
Don't the same shipping rules apply for hazardous chemicals as for lithium batteries?
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Old 11-28-2016   #94
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I have seen Henry Posner comment only a few times on all the photography message boards I visit, and the boards I visit are many. Most of the time people respect and understand his POV, even if they don't agree with it.
Only a few times? I freely admit this is not one of my most-often frequented forums and I should probably spend more time here, but there are several hundred forums in my bookmarks. Some I visit almost daily, some weekly and some when it seems wise to do so (usually when a kind person emails a "heads-up" to me).

For example I've been active in dpreview since January 2000 where I've posted more than 6000 times. I started reading fredmiranda.com in June 2003 and have 2200+ posts there, and another 2000+ in photo.net.
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Old 11-28-2016   #95
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Don't the same shipping rules apply for hazardous chemicals as for lithium batteries?
Not quite. From UPS:
https://www.ups.com/content/us/en/re...ous/index.html
Within this there's a separate section on lithium battery regs and safeguards, which will change come January. In the meantime the battery rules include how much a battery is charged and whether it's shipped in the item it powers (a camera or camcorder) or not in but with it, like a camera battery packed in the box but not inside the camera.
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Old 11-28-2016   #96
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I guess I'll be using Freestyle from now on.
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Old 11-28-2016   #97
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Well that'd be a plan except we're scrupulous about conforming to regs regarding lithium batteries. BTW Effective January 1, 2017, UPS will change its requirements for shipping lithium batteries by air.https://www.ups.com/content/us/en/ab...ry_update.html
But unwilling to be scrupulous about shipping chemistry by Ground. Don't tell us again that you don't ship by Ground because many of us here regularly receive packages from you labeled as UPS Ground. Just as we have for years and years.

I get that I'm beating a dead horse. i don't know why I hold any desire to shop somewhere where my business is not valued or appreciated. Sure the savings was nice, but We can't live in the past. Future is now, and it is distinctly not analog.
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Old 11-28-2016   #98
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I got an 11kg order of sodium thiosulfate (not NH3) from a big pool supplier. It is used to de-chlorinate a pool that has been over treated. Also used in minuscule amts. to put into fish tanks for the same purpose but that is so weak as to be useless for us.

Still, keep it in the back of the memory bank for future reference.
Thanks....
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Old 11-29-2016   #99
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Wait, is Freestyle the last mail order company that'll ship chemicals?
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Old 11-29-2016   #100
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Wait, is Freestyle the last mail order company that'll ship chemicals?
No, in the US Unique does as well, and of course FotoImpex will ship here from Germany, often less expensively than one would think.
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Old 11-29-2016   #101
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No, in the US Unique does as well, and of course FotoImpex will ship here from Germany, often less expensively than one would think.
Midwest Photo (Columbus) also ships darkroom chemistry.
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Old 11-29-2016   #102
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Midwest Photo (Columbus) also ships darkroom chemistry.
Didn't know that, I will check them out. Thanks.
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Old 11-29-2016   #103
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Well, got my first shipment in a while from Freestyle. Called them Friday AM and was shipped same day for arrival today before noon via Fed Ex. I'm trying, for the first time, Formulary Liquidol paper developer. It is supposed to have good keeping qualities with mixed working strength solution in full gas tight bottles lasting at least a year. However working strength capacity per liter is less than Ilford MG paper developer. We'll see how that works out.

Freestyle will probably be my go-to from now on.
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Old 11-29-2016   #104
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My Freestyle order should arrive tomorrow. Ordered Friday. Not two days, but doable, especially with so few clients anymore.
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Old 11-29-2016   #105
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Photo Formulary in Condon Montana...makes & ships chemistry
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Old 11-29-2016   #106
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Wait, is Freestyle the last mail order company that'll ship chemicals?
Adorama sells chemicals. Just received a shipment. The only thing the don't sell that I use or at least they don't list it is HC110. I can buy HC110 from Freestule for $28 per liter. Adorama's prices are the same as B&H too.
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Old 11-29-2016   #107
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We still have several local photo shops in Vancouver supplying developing chemicals. Primarily Beau Photo & Kerrisdale Cameras. I bought 1L HC-110 from Beau for $54 CDN (~$40 USD) last week.
I could have bought from USA but for ~$12 USD savings spread out over several years of usage it doesn't matter. Better to support the local shops when I can.
I'll still buy film from the US though because it's 30% cheaper. Probably from B&H. This developer shipping brouhaha doesn't matter to me.
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Old 11-30-2016   #108
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I buy all my darkroom chemicals and film online from Freestyle now.

Chris
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Old 11-30-2016   #109
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Not quite. From UPS:
https://www.ups.com/content/us/en/re...ous/index.html
Within this there's a separate section on lithium battery regs and safeguards, which will change come January. In the meantime the battery rules include how much a battery is charged and whether it's shipped in the item it powers (a camera or camcorder) or not in but with it, like a camera battery packed in the box but not inside the camera.
Maybe come January all digital cameras should be marked "store pick-up only". Lord knows, we all want to be so safe the attorneys and compliance departments can sleep at night....
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Old 11-30-2016   #110
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Apparently they are also shipping Xtol, should anyone need to stock up.
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Old 11-30-2016   #111
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I started purchasing chemicals and film from Adorama. I bought some liquid PMK pyro and Ilford FP-4 120. They shorted me 1 roll of FP4 so I called them. No problems to get another roll. They shipped it at their expense 2 day air. I told them no rush but the sent it air anyway. GREAT CUSTOMER SERVICE!

They sell xtol but not Hypan but they do sell Formulary TF4 and TF5 fixer.
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Old 11-30-2016   #112
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A lot of stuff that was listed as unshippable a few days ago is now available again. Makes me wonder if the lawyers identified a potential problem and they just shut down everything until they could differentiate between shippable and not.
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Old 11-30-2016   #113
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Maybe they were just putting some things on hold until they negotiated a new rate deal with USPS, UPS, et al. Places like B&H clearly don't pay what we pay for shipping.

D
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Old 11-30-2016   #114
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Just confirmed an order for 2x 5 litre jugs of Ilford Hypam & 250 - 11x14 sheets of Ilford Classic FB....shipping free to Canada. Fingers Crossed.
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Old 11-30-2016   #115
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A lot of stuff that was listed as unshippable a few days ago is now available again. Makes me wonder if the lawyers identified a potential problem and they just shut down everything until they could differentiate between shippable and not.
Or if pressure from unhappy customers persuaded them to take another look at their policy.........
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Old 11-30-2016   #116
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Maybe they were just putting some things on hold until they negotiated a new rate deal with USPS, UPS, et al. Places like B&H clearly don't pay what we pay for shipping.

D
No, they don't, I ship professionally and my rates are far lower than high street rates.
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Old 11-30-2016   #117
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Ok, now this is just strange. B&H shows 500ml size Ilford MG developer as store pickup only but they will ship the 5L size of the same item.
That don't make no sense.
I think Henry P gave up posting because he can't make sense of it either.
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Old 12-03-2016   #118
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Ok, now this is just strange. B&H shows 500ml size Ilford MG developer as store pickup only but they will ship the 5L size of the same item.
That don't make no sense.
I think Henry P gave up posting because he can't make sense of it either.
I don't know....he gave a whole lot of reasons for it to be a complete bogus job in the end since they now ship most everything again.

Why say anything, if what you're saying is nonsense? Same thing for the site chat guy who fed me the same line.
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Old 12-03-2016   #119
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Well, something clearly happened as most darkroom chemistry is shippable from B&H again...

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Old 01-12-2017   #120
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I just took a quick look at the chemistry section and most of it's shippable via to Canada save for HC110 (we get raped on that up here at $80 CAD per bottle). I'm not losing any sleep as I have Argentix as a backup.
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