Old 05-24-2018   #81
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Interesting 70mm is mentioned again. I virtually ran into a gentleman on IG while browsing B&W IR pictures. Pointed him at the 70mm thread in forum and to check the bulk rolls from Maco. Made his day as that film is his favorite.

IIRC he has the A70 back and only needed the canisters, bulk loading by hand in darkroom. Cheap MF envy.

I came from experimenting with a single roll of Aerochrome Color IR, that'll be gone real soon and it was quite an interesting material. B&W is essentially quite plenty and rather simple to manufacture. Color's where the suffering is at.

(OT)
Dave mentioning the 2020 recession rumors had me browsing bad stuff late at night and a bit of a suboptimal sleep the other day. I'm alert as over here there's another real estate bubble paired with bottom wages inherited from '08. Got an Econ PhD friend in NY so I'll be tuned, told me there's quite a bit of talk about it. (/OT)

Thinking that over summer to fall, whenever color becomes apathic and the weather gives no grief for staying indoors, I'll get into B&W and HP5+ seems a great well balanced material... Kodak film has had quite a hike and Ilford has a balanced distribution and pricing.


I'm curious about the Fomapan, cheapest B&W around and seemingly decent. GP3 coming back is good news but even china sources prices it at Ilford levels...


Quote:
Also the trend I recognized over the past year is that mucho 120 cameras are being sold for no money. It is almost like when you could buy a user Nikon F3 for $75.00 or a F5 for $250.00, but this time it is 120 cameras.
That's interesting. Too bad the cash flow and credit is slow for the upcoming period. Medium to Large format it's where's at.


I've seen P645, RB67, Bronica, etc quite cheap. I even recall Ken Rockwell (gasp) recommend the P645 last decade as a great 120 option, over the Yashica 124. That TLR I see quite hyped lately but don't know if it hiked prices a lot.
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Old 05-24-2018   #82
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Jorde,

On the other hand Pentax 67 II's with the AE metered prism are not available. Here in the U.S. there is no supply and the ones on EBAY are from Japan.

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Old 05-24-2018   #83
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Originally Posted by Calzone View Post
Jorde,



On the other hand Pentax 67 II's with the AE metered prism are not available. Here in the U.S. there is no supply and the ones on EBAY are from Japan.



Cal

Yeah, the good stuff went or soared. P67 and 105mm, Mamiya 6&7; to less extent Rolleiflex 2.8 and Hasselblad. These all appreciated quite a bit!
Forget about the wedding Contax 645 and 80 f2.

On 35mm the unsexy midrange AF SLRs are great value IMO. Nikon N90 for $20 in the US... Though I'd appreciate, I have no need for a MF heavy F4. OTOH it doesn't have the finesse of a Manual classic of course.

BTW it was funny as the F4 got quite a few youtube reviews clustered in a short period last year. Hype up...
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Old 05-24-2018   #84
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I have just found out the the Foma factory in Czech Republic now has an online shop. Incredibly cheap compared to buying from other outlets. I've just got a 10 brick of 120 and 30m of fomapan for €59
https://fomaobchod.cz/
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Old 05-24-2018   #85
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Originally Posted by Prest_400 View Post
Interesting 70mm is mentioned again. I virtually ran into a gentleman on IG while browsing B&W IR pictures. Pointed him at the 70mm thread in forum and to check the bulk rolls from Maco. Made his day as that film is his favorite.

IIRC he has the A70 back and only needed the canisters, bulk loading by hand in darkroom. Cheap MF envy.

I came from experimenting with a single roll of Aerochrome Color IR, that'll be gone real soon and it was quite an interesting material. B&W is essentially quite plenty and rather simple to manufacture. Color's where the suffering is at.
Yeah it's definitely cheaper to go the 70mm route. I've got most of the materials but haven't shot nor developed yet... the Vision3 65mm (movie stock) film was pretty popular in China (while I was working there for 2 years)... I got a hand of one canister on ebay... probably comes down to almost $2-2.50 a roll (once I cut it down to 62mm and hand roll it to a 120 spool). Results in my opinion are better than cinestill. And prefer the colors and tonality compared to portra film. Lots of work in the process of rolling up the film though... May be the only color film I'll play around with now...

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Old 05-24-2018   #86
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Originally Posted by freeranger View Post
I have just found out the the Foma factory in Czech Republic now has an online shop. Incredibly cheap compared to buying from other outlets. I've just got a 10 brick of 120 and 30m of fomapan for €59
https://fomaobchod.cz/
FR<

Thanks for sharing this.

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Old 05-24-2018   #87
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DK,

From Dan: and for everyone.

https://www.macodirect.de/en/film/in...le-perferation

85 Euro for 30.5 meters. Includes VAT so less for U.S.

Cal

POSTSCRIPT: For some reason when I copied Dan's link you only get their website, but if you go to Dan's 70mm thread and click on the link in Post Number 39 the 70mm 30.5 meter double-perf comes up. I suggest bookmarking it.
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Old 05-24-2018   #88
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Originally Posted by freeranger View Post
I have just found out the the Foma factory in Czech Republic now has an online shop. Incredibly cheap compared to buying from other outlets. I've just got a 10 brick of 120 and 30m of fomapan for €59
https://fomaobchod.cz/
Hmm.. Looks like they won't deliver to the US? That's such a pity. Really good price on these
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Old 05-24-2018   #89
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Try this one:

https://www.macodirect.de/en/film/in...le-perforation

DSC05891 by Nokton48, on Flickr

DSC05901 by Nokton48, on Flickr
One stop bracketed test of Rollei 400s 70mm, developed in Rollei Supergrain dev
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Old 05-24-2018   #90
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Originally Posted by DKimg View Post
Yeah it's definitely cheaper to go the 70mm route. I've got most of the materials but haven't shot nor developed yet... the Vision3 65mm (movie stock) film was pretty popular in China (while I was working there for 2 years)... I got a hand of one canister on ebay... probably comes down to almost $2-2.50 a roll (once I cut it down to 62mm and hand roll it to a 120 spool). Results in my opinion are better than cinestill. And prefer the colors and tonality compared to portra film. Lots of work in the process of rolling up the film though... May be the only color film I'll play around with now...

Dom, how do you cut your 70mm film down to 62mm?
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Old 05-24-2018   #91
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Here is the 120 Foma Retro Soft, ordering it directly from Foma:

https://fomaobchod.cz/blackwhitenega...1%5D?ItemIdx=0

I am emailing them to see if they will sell direct to the USA.

They do take VISA so they should do it!
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Old 05-24-2018   #92
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FWIW, I'm a hobbyist, and "back to film" from digital over the past 15 months. Much of the help has come from this website and Photrio (APUG) through which I've gotten into Leica M's and Rolleiflex. I also have a MF Rolleiflex SLR but my daily shooter is now the Rolleiflex TLR 3.5E. I bulk load 35mm, but shoot mostly 120. I've standarized on Ilford Delta 400 for B&W and Kodak Portra 400 for color, and develop both on a Jobo CPE2+ which has settled a lot of minor quality issues. I shoot very little digital though I haven't sold off my Sony yet. I think about it.

I find the digital aesthetic is crisp and unnaturally sharp. Maybe it's my aging eyes... but it's so sharp it hurts. Seriously. There's a line on sharpness where it's good, but beyond that, like any substance, it becomes toxic and unnatural. I think it's just me. So as long as my eyes can handle it (for focusing) and my body can stand to develop my own negatives, I'm sticking with film for creative work. Snaps in digital are fine if I have to... and sometimes there's no choice. But if it's for keeps even setting aside all the above snobism, film is more fun. So my car wears a Catlabs "Shoot more film!" bumper sticker... and I'll never be a hipster.

I don't resent Kodak or Ilford or anyone, and while I may worry about price increases a little, I'm okay if prices continue to rise. Price increases likely will not change my preferences.... much, but simply call on me to do some long term planning. So far, I've had to figure out what I like and what I don't and I've had my hands full with that over the last year and solving the technical challenges inherent to that process. But with that behind me, the wide open country is settling down to a few real keepers.

Film isn't a wave and won't be. But one-by-one, I think folks are beginning to engage with it and give it a chance, and some (like me) might find it becomes a preference. So for all that, it's not better... it's just more fun... and gets me out of the house..
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Old 05-24-2018   #93
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I figure that B&W while be the last film type standing (which is why I'm surprised that Fuji is dumping their B&W films). By the same token, I fear that color slide film will be the first type to disappear.


I'm an old slide shooter (35mm and now mostly 120), so I dread Fuji dropping their color transparency films.


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Old 05-25-2018   #94
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dave lackey View Post
Dom, how do you cut your 70mm film down to 62mm?
I haven't cut 70mm down to 62mm.. it's something I can do but only if it spools to 120 roll. The Vision film is 65mm so I just measure it down to 120 format and then cut 1.5 mm on both sides to reel up properly.
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Old 05-25-2018   #95
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DKimg View Post
I haven't cut 70mm down to 62mm.. it's something I can do but only if it spools to 120 roll. The Vision film is 65mm so I just measure it down to 120 format and then cut 1.5 mm on both sides to reel up properly.
Ah, my mistake...certainly, I was thinking of my own ambition to cut film down to which ever format I am working with. I was wondering how you actually slit the film with a slitter like the HolgaMod slitter or do you have a nice setup in a darkroom? Charles has the best slitter so far, just wondering about a tabletop setup.

I am looking for some method that is easily repeatable.
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Old 05-25-2018   #96
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70mm to 120 film slitter by Nokton48, on Flickr

This is from the internet, this Guy is slitting 70mm film and reloading it as 120.

Looks home made
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Old 05-25-2018   #97
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Ah, my mistake...certainly, I was thinking of my own ambition to cut film down to which ever format I am working with. I was wondering how you actually slit the film with a slitter like the HoldaMod slitter or do you have a nice setup in a darkroom?

I am looking for some method that is easily repeatable.
I have a cutting board that is slightly longer than a length of a 120 film. Don't hold me to it but I think you need a minimum of 800-850mm of film negative length to reel onto a 120 spool. I've setup tape guidelines to measure the length and the width of the film negative so I can cut it down. It's not an easy process to do in complete darkness. And honestly haven't found another method that works. Seems like most people want to keep this process on the hush hush... I know there's an easier method..
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Old 05-25-2018   #98
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Related...

Here is Charles' excellent DIY for slitting 120 down to 127.

I guess perforated film requires trimming both sides...
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Old 05-25-2018   #99
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I guess perforated film requires trimming both sides...

Yes Dave that's right. Perforated requires cutting both sides, and it's not quite wide enough to cover the full 6cm. You get sprocket holes on both sides.

I have 70mm respooled 120 film I have bought on Ebay, Kodak High Speed Infared, and Kodak Aerographic 2405. Used to be about $8 a roll.

But you can get unperfed 70mm. That's fairly easy to get. Rollei has fresh Maco 25 70mm unperfed.

https://www.macodirect.de/en/film/bl...m-unperforated
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Old 05-30-2018   #100
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Maybe it is good for the financial health of Kodak and Ilford that the market shares will shift to those left. Maybe not.

This thought is only partially correct. Ilford can be helped by Fuji's cancellation of Acros, but not Kodak. Ilford is a financially stable firm, that is reliant upon film sales to grow their business.



Kodak, in contrast, is a financially sick company, whose primary business is commercial printing. Upon emergence from bankruptcy, Kodak realigned their business away from film and towards commercial printing. Yes, they still produce film, but it was declared by their CEO to be a non core business and even tried to sell their film production infrastructure to the big Hollywood studios. Smartly, they declined to make this purchase and instead signed a 5 year deal to buy a certain amount of motion picture film. I believe that contract will be expiring in the near future.


Reading Kodak's financial reports each quarter shows a company that has not reached stabilization. Further, the impact of still photography film on Kodak's finances is virtually nil. They need hundreds of millions of dollars in new sales by 2019 due to the expiration of their class A shares of stock, which they are contractually obligated to re-buy at $17.50/share (it's barely $5 today).



What should have happened is that Kodak should have exited film production, thus making Fuji's film business more profitable, enticing them to stay in the business. Since Fuji is a fully profitable company, their long term future is not in doubt. Kodak's future is very much in doubt and you can see by the short holding of Kodak's stock (over 30% of all their shares are held short). Millions of dollars are betting that Kodak's future is very very dim. Kodak has survived long enough to kill off Fujifilm. A Pyrrhic victory to be sure.


Personally, I'd like to replace my Acros shooting with TMAX 100, but I will never again buy any 120 film from Kodak due to backing paper issue. Such a shame.
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Old 05-30-2018   #101
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. By the same token, I fear that color slide film will be the first type to disappear.


I'm an old slide shooter (35mm and now mostly 120), so I dread Fuji dropping their color transparency films.


- Murray

Peel apart instant film was the first to disappear.
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Old 05-30-2018   #102
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I wonder: Is that really a big thing? I don't know anyone who has one, nor have I ever seen one that I know of. Or maybe I'm just not the target audience. I know there are some members (HHPhoto? Skiff, I think, or maybe they're the same person?) who like the Instax system but it seems like a niche within a niche, so to speak. But I might be completely wrong.

INSTAX camera sales are up to 6 million/year. Along with that are film sales of 10 million packs a year. INSTAX is HUGE for Fujifilm.
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Old 05-30-2018   #103
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INSTAX camera sales are up to 6 million/year. Along with that are film sales of 10 million packs a year. INSTAX is HUGE for Fujifilm.

Kind of a pyrrhic victory to be sure. Film is booming! But we're dropping Acros and maybe next year Velvia and Provia too. But Instax is "film" too so its all good!
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Old 05-30-2018   #104
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INSTAX camera sales are up to 6 million/year. Along with that are film sales of 10 million packs a year. INSTAX is HUGE for Fujifilm.
If they sell 6 million cameras and only 10 million packs of film, no one is shooting much.
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Old 05-30-2018   #105
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If they sell 6 million cameras and only 10 million packs of film, no one is shooting much.

That's 100 million shots on film.
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Old 05-30-2018   #106
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That's 100 million shots on film.
Yes, but for each camera sold, they sell less than two packs of film. Not high usage was my point. Seems like a try it and abandon it type of thing. Maybe it's the expense. I remember being (too) judicious with my SX-70.
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Old 05-30-2018   #107
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My retirement job has been servicing enlargers in school darkrooms here in Sydney Australia.
I have 80 schools still teaching B&W film photography in Sydney.
The rationale is : learning photography with film gives a much better grounding than digital (which can be taken in photography 102) You always get a result with digital but you don't know why.
With film you can see if you have under or over exposed instantly after Develop and fix.
I still use 35,120 and 4x5 and process to print myself.
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Old 05-30-2018   #108
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I will mention my friend Louis Mendez was a big user of pack film (Polaroid), flash bulbs, and now that Fuji FP-100 is costly has adapted an Instax wide to his Crown Graphic.

I also see that he has resurrected some old Polaroid to utilize some of the new Polaroid films that are available.

Louis had 4 kids from 4 different women, never married, and sent all four kids to college shooting street portraits. He is an urban legend and back in the day hung out with W. Eugene Smith during the "Jazz Loft" era.

Here is a man who has dug in. 70 plus years old. He is out there every day shooting.

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Old 05-30-2018   #109
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Louis Mendez: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Louis_Mendes
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Old 05-30-2018   #110
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Yes, but for each camera sold, they sell less than two packs of film. Not high usage was my point. Seems like a try it and abandon it type of thing. Maybe it's the expense. I remember being (too) judicious with my SX-70.

I'm sure there is some level of abandonment with cameras like this. Those that remain probably shoot quite a lot of film. Fujifilm earns more from INSTAX than they do from their digital cameras.
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Old 05-30-2018   #111
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Peter,

Thanks for the link.

I'll check with Louis. Wikipedia reports only two children. Louis told me 4.

Also one day I met up with Louis at the Park Ave Armory. He asked if I was going to hang out for a while, so he hands me his camera and says, "I'll be back in twenty minutes or so; hold onto my camera and watch my wheelie; I'm going to get some lunch; want anything?

So I find myself doing a Louis Mendez impersonation suddenly, and I got mobbed.

"You're not Louis," some woman leaving the Armory show said to me like I stole his identity.

"Where's Louis?" a few people said.

One guy rather aggressively wanted to know what I was doing with Louis' gear and stood watch like a soldier waiting to see if I was telling the truth that he went for some lunch.

Anyways this was a powerful experience. Louis is a widely known and loved walking tourist attraction. Every year he invites me to go down to NOLA for Marti Graws.

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Old 05-30-2018   #112
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Peter,

Thanks for the link.

I'll check with Louis. Wikipedia reports only two children. Louis told me 4.

Also one day I met up with Louis at the Park Ave Armory. He asked if I was going to hang out for a while, so he hands me his camera and says, "I'll be back in twenty minutes or so; hold onto my camera and watch my wheelie; I'm going to get some lunch; want anything?

So I find myself doing a Louis Mendez impersonation suddenly, and I got mobbed.

"You're not Louis," some woman leaving the Armory show said to me like I stole his identity.

"Where's Louis?" a few people said.

One guy rather aggressively wanted to know what I was doing with Louis' gear and stood watch like a soldier waiting to see if I was telling the truth that he went for some lunch.

Anyways this was a powerful experience. Louis is a widely known and loved walking tourist attraction. Every year he invites me to go down to NOLA for Marti Graws.

Cal
It's always a pleasure to run into Louis when I visit the City - he is a indeed a moving landmark and treasure.
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Old 05-30-2018   #113
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Here&rsquo;s a good article from May 15 summarizing the history, current state and sales impact of Instant photography.

Quote from article:

Fujifilms Instax is among the best-selling cameras on the market. No qualifiers needed. In its 2016 fiscal year (ending March 2017; fiscal year 2017 numbers aren&rsquo;t available yet), Fujifilm sold 6.6 million Instax cameras and printers; the company says it plans to sell 7.5 million this fiscal year. For comparison, the entire digital camera market&mdash;point-and-shoots, DSLRs, mirrorless lens cameras, Canons, Nikons, Sonys&mdash;sold 18.91 million units in 2017.

https://www.theringer.com/platform/a...tax-fuji-kodak




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