Go Back   Rangefinderforum.com > Cameras / Gear / Photography > Leicas and other Leica Mount Cameras > Leica M Film Cameras

Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread Display Modes

Old 05-10-2012   #81
EZfan
RF Shooter
 
EZfan's Avatar
 
EZfan is offline
Join Date: Feb 2009
Location: The Lone Star state
Posts: 100
Quote:
Originally Posted by Araakii View Post
The price should be right. Most people who say otherwise here would still be grumpy even if the price was $3000. They want everything for $500.
well said
__________________

Camera/lens accumulator and seasonal painter.
________________________


<img src=http://www.rangefinderforum.com/forums/image.php?type=sigpic&userid=28907&dateline=1235974840 onload=if(this.width > 1024) {this.width=1024;this.alt='Click here to see a large version';} onmouseover=if(this.alt) this.style.cursor='pointer'; onclick=if(this.alt) window.open('http://www.rangefinderforum.com/forums/image.php?type=sigpic&userid=28907&dateline=1235974840'); border=0 />
  Reply With Quote

Old 05-10-2012   #82
EZfan
RF Shooter
 
EZfan's Avatar
 
EZfan is offline
Join Date: Feb 2009
Location: The Lone Star state
Posts: 100
Quote:
Originally Posted by enenrf View Post
I'd rather buy a Noct. F0.95 ASPH.
The Noct 0.95 is not an APO designation.
__________________

Camera/lens accumulator and seasonal painter.
________________________


<img src=http://www.rangefinderforum.com/forums/image.php?type=sigpic&userid=28907&dateline=1235974840 onload=if(this.width > 1024) {this.width=1024;this.alt='Click here to see a large version';} onmouseover=if(this.alt) this.style.cursor='pointer'; onclick=if(this.alt) window.open('http://www.rangefinderforum.com/forums/image.php?type=sigpic&userid=28907&dateline=1235974840'); border=0 />
  Reply With Quote

Old 05-10-2012   #83
Araakii
Registered User
 
Araakii is offline
Join Date: Jun 2011
Posts: 507
Quote:
Originally Posted by EZfan View Post
well said
It's actually a vicious cycle. Because people constantly demand lower prices, companies have to outsource all the manual work overseas to 3rd world countries. So the consumers get the prices they want. But suddenly, all these people doing manual labor in the US are no longer needed. So they are laid off and have no income. So in turn they demand even cheaper prices so they can afford the same standard of living they were so used to. And not only that, they laugh at other countries where wages are high and people seem to enjoy their lives more.
__________________
My Flickr
  Reply With Quote

Old 05-10-2012   #84
redisburning
-
 
redisburning is offline
Join Date: Feb 2011
Posts: 1,581
I disagree.

they don't laugh. they pretend nothing else exists. self deception is strong in the West.
  Reply With Quote

Old 05-10-2012   #85
maddoc
... likes film.
 
maddoc's Avatar
 
maddoc is offline
Join Date: Dec 2006
Location: 名古屋
Age: 53
Posts: 7,297
Quote:
Originally Posted by Araakii View Post
It's actually a vicious cycle. Because people constantly demand lower prices, companies have to outsource all the manual work overseas to 3rd world countries. So the consumers get the prices they want. But suddenly, all these people doing manual labor in the US are no longer needed. So they are laid off and have no income. So in turn they demand even cheaper prices so they can afford the same standard of living they were so used to. And not only that, they laugh at other countries where wages are high and people seem to enjoy their lives more.
Yup. It is called "capitalism", very few win and the majority is paying for that.
__________________
- Gabor

flickr
pBase
  Reply With Quote

Old 05-10-2012   #86
JayM
Registered User
 
JayM is offline
Join Date: Mar 2011
Location: Tucson, AZ
Age: 35
Posts: 296
Man the race to the bottom sucks and all but I think Leica's efforts to fight it are too heroic at times.
__________________
Show me your film leaders and I will tell you what you are.
  Reply With Quote

Old 05-10-2012   #87
Araakii
Registered User
 
Araakii is offline
Join Date: Jun 2011
Posts: 507
Quote:
Originally Posted by JayM View Post
Man the race to the bottom sucks and all but I think Leica's efforts to fight it are too heroic at times.
The best thing about luxury brands is that the stuff is actually very good. They have all the design and engineering talents in the world. Imagine you are a world class designer and have to design for wal-mart so they can produce 1 million copies of your stuff for $10 each in Vietnam.
__________________
My Flickr
  Reply With Quote

Old 05-10-2012   #88
Nikon Bob
camera hunter & gatherer
 
Nikon Bob's Avatar
 
Nikon Bob is offline
Join Date: Aug 2004
Posts: 3,630
What was the original question? Oh yea, NO I don't think so.

Bob
__________________
<a href='http://www.rangefinderforum.com/photopost/showgallery.php?cat=500&ppuser=557'>My Gallery</a>
  Reply With Quote

Old 05-10-2012   #89
ark8012
Registered User
 
ark8012's Avatar
 
ark8012 is offline
Join Date: Nov 2009
Location: Pebble Beach, CA
Posts: 196
No, it is too much for 50mm and there are a lot of good lenses in 50 with a fraction of the price.
  Reply With Quote

Old 05-10-2012   #90
leicapixie
Registered User
 
leicapixie is offline
Join Date: Jun 2011
Location: Toronto.Canada
Posts: 1,577
I was stunned! A monochrome only body, a 50mm lens with a price tag to simply stifle any questions..The fact that Leica is selling M9 at 3 times their sales projection figures is a testament of finding the right market.
The camera for me is totally stupid! I do a lot of B/W. I have a darkroom. I guess future buyers will be there as more companies are liquidated, workers laid off and the cEO can afford these trinkets with his/her severance bonus.
I still thing the camera is a dead idea. Like bleached bones in the sand, dead.
Time will see who was right.
  Reply With Quote

Old 05-10-2012   #91
edftwin
Street Wanderer
 
edftwin is offline
Join Date: Apr 2011
Posts: 123
Whatever camera and lenses that Leica release, there will be people buying, it might not be you, but somebody else who has got the money and willing to spend on luxurious stuff.
__________________
Photoblog http://edftwin.tumblr.com/
  Reply With Quote

Old 05-10-2012   #92
Jubb Jubb
Registered User
 
Jubb Jubb is offline
Join Date: Mar 2011
Posts: 471
Quote:
Originally Posted by Araakii View Post
The price should be right. Most people who say otherwise here would still be grumpy even if the price was $3000. They want everything for $500.
No, i think $3000 would be a fair price for the lens, it would be relative to the rest of the Summicron ASPH range. However $7195 is absolutely insane.
You could buy two summilux 50's for that!!!

This really pi$$es me off, i was set on purchasing the new ASPH 50 'cron. Now I am going to have to look used, and all those prices are going to be jacked up too.
  Reply With Quote

Old 05-10-2012   #93
tbarker13
shooter of stuff
 
tbarker13's Avatar
 
tbarker13 is offline
Join Date: Aug 2006
Location: St. Louis
Posts: 1,669
There must be some internal rule with Leica that every item it produces must be priced higher than any preceding item.
But as for the original question, I can't imagine a world where I would pay that much for any lens - let alone a lens that offers absolutely no added value for my photography.
  Reply With Quote

Old 05-10-2012   #94
PhotoMat
Registered User
 
PhotoMat's Avatar
 
PhotoMat is offline
Join Date: Aug 2006
Posts: 520
I would ask myself: "Will a $7000 lens markedly improve my photography over what I currently use? Am I being held back professionally by my lowly, five-year old Summicron?"

Obviously, the answer is a resounding "Hell No!"

This lens is nothing more than an object of desire -- people will buy it because they want it, not because they need it. I have yet to see a reasonably equipped photographer whose skill or personal vision is limited by their equipment.
__________________
www.natural-light.com
  Reply With Quote

Old 05-10-2012   #95
bob338
Registered User
 
bob338's Avatar
 
bob338 is offline
Join Date: Jan 2007
Location: Sausalito, CA
Posts: 1,213
Quote:
Originally Posted by tbarker13 View Post
There must be some internal rule with Leica that every item it produces must be priced higher than any preceding item.
Summarit line?
  Reply With Quote

Old 05-10-2012   #96
dougi
Registered User
 
dougi is offline
Join Date: May 2004
Location: Sydney
Age: 50
Posts: 74
Hmm, I wonder if Leica will bother to release a firmware update for the M8 (do they even remember those?) to include corrections for this new lens. Perhaps they will claim it doesn't need any.
__________________
x-pro 1, x-100, m8, k5, lx5, bessa R2, FED3, ep1,
35mm Summicron ASPH, 28mm M-Hexanon, 50mm F1.5 VC, 75mm F1.8 VC, 15mm F4.5 VC
  Reply With Quote

Old 05-10-2012   #97
Araakii
Registered User
 
Araakii is offline
Join Date: Jun 2011
Posts: 507
Quote:
Originally Posted by PhotoMat View Post

This lens is nothing more than an object of desire -- people will buy it because they want it, not because they need it. I have yet to see a reasonably equipped photographer whose skill or personal vision is limited by their equipment.
Just as real photographers are never limited by their equipment, real buyers are also never limited by their cash, like some other people here.
__________________
My Flickr
  Reply With Quote

Old 05-10-2012   #98
seakayaker1
Registered User
 
seakayaker1's Avatar
 
seakayaker1 is offline
Join Date: Mar 2010
Location: Seattle, WA
Posts: 1,917
Quote:
Originally Posted by seakayaker1 View Post
NO!


. . . . . . and I mean it.
Quote:
Originally Posted by rover View Post
Are you sure?

Yes I am sure, having had several hours now to contemplate how I could ever justify buying a Summicron 50/2 for $ 7195.00 has left me baffled and bewildered. Pure insanity!

I did leave myself a little wiggle room with the ". . . . . . and I mean it" statement, but that wiggle room is now gone.


. . . . . . and this time I really mean it.
__________________
______________________

Life is Grand! ~~~ Dan
M Monochrom ~ M-P (240), M6 TTL & MP ~ Mamiya 7 II ~ GF1 ~ K5IIs
~ Rolleiflex f3.5 with Carl Zeiss 75mm Planar (type 4) ~
The hardest part of starting a new project is starting it ~ Keith Carter
Flickr Sets: http://www.flickr.com/photos/[email protected]/sets/
  Reply With Quote

Old 05-10-2012   #99
FrozenInTime
Registered User
 
FrozenInTime's Avatar
 
FrozenInTime is offline
Join Date: Mar 2009
Location: Here and there
Posts: 1,740
Quote:
Originally Posted by tbarker13 View Post
There must be some internal rule with Leica that every item it produces must be priced higher than any preceding item.
"In economics, the Total Revenue Test is a means for determining whether demand is elastic or inelastic. If an increase in price causes an increase in total revenue, then demand can be said to be inelastic, since the increase in price does not have a large impact on quantity demanded"



Supply is also pretty much inelastic, so they now seem to unashamedly to set prices to equal maximum profit for the number of units they can produce - as opposed to cost plus profit.

Given those rules, they could sell an item with $1,500 costs including amortized overheads and R&D for $7,500 ... because they can

The Summarit line is a special charity case, with the long term plan of hooking punters on the line ... which leads eventually to maximized return.
__________________
It's the weird colour scheme that freaks me. Every time you try to operate one of these weird black controls, which are labeled in black on a black background, a small black light lights up black to let you know you've done it.
  Reply With Quote

Old 05-10-2012   #100
braver
Registered User
 
braver's Avatar
 
braver is offline
Join Date: May 2009
Posts: 322
Quote:
Originally Posted by Biggles View Post
I've never paid that much for a car.
My M6 was only a few gas tanks cheaper than my car...both are cheaper than my laptop. Priorities!

That said, Leica predicted that to improve the 50 summicron something like this would be needed. Well they proved their point, the original cron is so good you need to pull out all the stops, add APO, and you end up with something like this. This is the best 50mm they know how to build. While the original 50 cron is a lens everyone could own for their Leica, this is a lens almost noone can own.

They proved their point and I'm glad they did. I hope it kicks every other 50mm in the but.

That said, my opinion is that image quality has been good enough since 1960 (I shoot Tri-X). I like my pre-asph 50 lux, but would like an asph for the close focus (not for perfomance). This cron I don't see any use for.
__________________
Koen - portfolio - flickr - 1X.com
Leica M6 TTL .58, 28 Elmarit asph, 40 Summicron-C
  Reply With Quote

Old 05-10-2012   #101
Lss
Registered User
 
Lss is offline
Join Date: Aug 2010
Posts: 1,799
If 7k was pocket change to me, then I probably would at least try it. A 50/2 is firmly in the most-used lens category for me, and this new APO is most likely the best there is. While there probably would not be any significant perceptual difference in most photos compared to the 50/2 I currently have, it doesn't hurt having the best lens. Of course, handling also matters greatly.

But I can't spend 7k on any lens, so the question is pointless for me.
__________________
Lasse
  Reply With Quote

Old 05-10-2012   #102
retow
Registered User
 
retow is offline
Join Date: Jun 2007
Posts: 271
Yes, because I could turn around and sell it for USD 10000. Have a look at evil bay.
  Reply With Quote

Old 05-10-2012   #103
Jockos
Registered User
 
Jockos's Avatar
 
Jockos is offline
Join Date: Jun 2011
Location: Sweden
Age: 31
Posts: 985
They really killed off the 'lux with this. With a clean 8000 ISO, the demand for high speed should decline dramatically, leaving this new 'cron king of the hill!
  Reply With Quote

Old 05-11-2012   #104
abumac
Registered User
 
abumac's Avatar
 
abumac is offline
Join Date: Oct 2006
Posts: 362
For this amount you can buy a Summilux 50 Asph + a 2.0/28!
__________________
Regards

rw

http://blog.reiner-wandler.de
  Reply With Quote

Old 05-11-2012   #105
Speedfreak
-
 
Speedfreak is offline
Join Date: Dec 2011
Posts: 220
Quote:
Originally Posted by J J Kapsberger View Post
Will you pay $7,195 for the new 50 'cron Asph?
Hahahaha...
  Reply With Quote

Old 05-11-2012   #106
matt335
Registered User
 
matt335's Avatar
 
matt335 is offline
Join Date: May 2008
Location: Australia
Posts: 491
I read the reviews and it looks impressive. I have always marvelled at leica technology. This lens has stretched my imagination beyond all reasoning.
__________________
kind regards, Matt
www.mattsutton.com.au
  Reply With Quote

Old 05-11-2012   #107
Araakii
Registered User
 
Araakii is offline
Join Date: Jun 2011
Posts: 507
Quote:
Originally Posted by matt335 View Post
I read the reviews and it looks impressive. I have always marvelled at leica technology. This lens has stretched my imagination beyond all reasoning.
Since I much prefer the 75mm lux over the 75mm apo cron, I don't think I will like this lens. But if I were interested in it, the price wouldn't be an issue. It's all about priorities and I value lenses above other spendings.
__________________
My Flickr
  Reply With Quote

Old 05-11-2012   #108
alexnotalex
Registered User
 
alexnotalex is offline
Join Date: Jun 2010
Posts: 447
would?yes + could?no = will?no

will?squirrel for birth year model.
and will?enjoy the mystique
__________________
burning reflected light onto chemical film. It's real
M3 + Rigid Summicron, Nikon D40 and an iphone for that digital look. my Flickr
  Reply With Quote

Old 05-11-2012   #109
OwenStegemann
Registered User
 
OwenStegemann's Avatar
 
OwenStegemann is offline
Join Date: Jul 2009
Location: Oakland, CA.
Posts: 79
No I won't. I suppose I could in theory save up that kinda cash, but I would spend the money on travelling wayyy before I would on a lens. It would make for more interesting photos as well. This one is for the well to do cat/purebreddog/flowerbokeh Flickr explore Allstar photogs methinks.
  Reply With Quote

Old 05-11-2012   #110
alistair.o
Registered User
 
alistair.o's Avatar
 
alistair.o is offline
Join Date: Jul 2010
Posts: 698
Quote:
Originally Posted by rover View Post
I am not a member of Leica's target market.
I am as a rule! But since I have started living on morphine as a 'vital' part of my daily routine, my gullibility has slowly faded away man...
__________________
Best Wishes - Alistair
________________

  Reply With Quote

Old 05-11-2012   #111
Cron
Registered User
 
Cron is offline
Join Date: Jun 2006
Location: Vienna
Posts: 568
definitely NO!
But this is only me!
__________________
see some pics here:
http://www.flickr.com/photos/smallrf/
  Reply With Quote

Old 05-11-2012   #112
BobYIL
Registered User
 
BobYIL's Avatar
 
BobYIL is offline
Join Date: Sep 2009
Posts: 1,262
I have six 50mm Summicrons; a collapsible, two DR, two V.3 and a V.4 (tabbed). For B&W film, especially tones, I do not think any other Summicron could serve me better than the DR. I like the collapsible for its portability + bokeh. For sharpness the V.4 is outstanding, fitting perfectly to digital.

If I would be looking for a better lens for digital I would rather be going with the Summilux asph. provided that the new Summicron was offered for the same price.

(But I accept that for some the price tag tells better than what their eyes see or logics dictate..)
  Reply With Quote

Old 05-11-2012   #113
Austerby
Registered User
 
Austerby's Avatar
 
Austerby is offline
Join Date: Feb 2007
Location: Fircombe
Posts: 1,066
Wasn't it always the case that, prior to the ASPH, the Summicrons were always a "better" lens than the Summiluxes, as far as overall sharpness etc went.

Isn't this just restoring the Summicron to it's natural position as the "best" lens available?

I won't be buying one (unless I can afford the M9M to go with it) but am really looking forward to seeing what capable photographers can do with it.

Unfortunately I fear the most capable photographers won't be able to get hold of one...
__________________
Austerby
  Reply With Quote

Old 05-11-2012   #114
Chriscrawfordphoto
Real Men Shoot Film.
 
Chriscrawfordphoto's Avatar
 
Chriscrawfordphoto is offline
Join Date: Apr 2007
Location: Fort Wayne, Indiana
Age: 43
Posts: 8,890
Quote:
Originally Posted by rover View Post
I am not a member of Leica's target market.
Same here. I'm a photographer
  Reply With Quote

Old 05-11-2012   #115
Teuthida
-
 
Teuthida is offline
Join Date: Aug 2011
Posts: 631
I'm more than happy with my Jupiter 8, thank you.
  Reply With Quote

Old 05-11-2012   #116
jsrockit
Moderator
 
jsrockit's Avatar
 
jsrockit is offline
Join Date: Nov 2009
Location: Santiago, Chile
Age: 45
Posts: 19,746
Quote:
Originally Posted by bob338 View Post
Summarit line?
What about it? They are still priced higher than most Zeiss lenses.
  Reply With Quote

Old 05-11-2012   #117
jsrockit
Moderator
 
jsrockit's Avatar
 
jsrockit is offline
Join Date: Nov 2009
Location: Santiago, Chile
Age: 45
Posts: 19,746
Quote:
Originally Posted by digitalintrigue View Post
I mean, compare the price of the 35 Summarit to the 35 Skopar, just for example.
Well, I know I'm in the minority here, but I believe the 35mm Summarit is better than the skopar and is a good Leica lens for the cash.
  Reply With Quote

Old 05-11-2012   #118
thegman
Registered User
 
thegman is offline
Join Date: Sep 2009
Location: Australia
Age: 39
Posts: 3,819
No, but one has to admire Leica's business savvy. They'll probably sell enough of these to make it worthwhile, and that's the point of being in business. They know they can't compete with Canon/Nikon, so they invent a sort of new market combining cameras with jewellery.

The price is way more than I'd pay, but if you buy a new car for $50k, you'll lose that much driving it out of the forecourt. At least with the lens, it's value will only drop a little.
__________________
My Blog
  Reply With Quote

Old 05-11-2012   #119
steveyork
Registered User
 
steveyork is offline
Join Date: Aug 2008
Posts: 682
Makes the Asph Summilux I purchased back in '05 seem like a pretty good deal now. They'll probably sell more then any us anticipate. I've been constantly amazed over the last several years at how willing amateurs are to shell out big $$ for new M9s, Summiluxes and Noctiluxes at these very high prices. Maybe Leica noticed too.
  Reply With Quote

Old 05-11-2012   #120
vitaly66
Registered User
 
vitaly66 is offline
Join Date: Jan 2006
Posts: 76
I bought one but had to send it back already. It was a pretty good lens except the autofocus feature seemed to be very slow.
  Reply With Quote
Reply


Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

vB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off



All times are GMT -8. The time now is 07:10.


vBulletin skin developed by: eXtremepixels
Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.6.8
Copyright ©2000 - 2019, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.

All content on this site is Copyright Protected and owned by its respective owner. You may link to content on this site but you may not reproduce any of it in whole or part without written consent from its owner.