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View Poll Results: Sell it all?
Sell everything and replace with MP a la carte. 59 39.60%
Don't do it! 35 23.49%
Just sell some and keep the most used gear. 40 26.85%
Sell it all and repaint my M2. 15 10.07%
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Sell everything and get an MP a la carte?
Old 12-15-2016   #1
twhittle
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Sell everything and get an MP a la carte?

Seeing as it is the new year soon, I was interested in your opinion of what I should do:

After ammassing quite a lot of gear and having lots go through my hands I'm thinking of selling everything. I would replace it all with one MP a la carte.

Currently on rotation I have: Mamiya 7ii with 80/4, Fujifilm GA645, Rolleiflex iib, Pentax 67 with 105/2.4 and 135/4 and 200/4, Canon T90 with 50/1.4, Nikon FE with 85/2 and 50/1.8, Contax T2 and Leica M2 with 50/2.8 and 35/2.

I would sell everything except the two Leica lenses and order an MP a la carte in black paint, original vulcanite, 35/50/90 frame lines and original script. It would almost be a straight swap if I do this.

So what should I do?
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Old 12-15-2016   #2
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No 35mm film camera will give you the image quality of medium format. So, I would not sell the entire lot.
Besides, what does the expensively modified MP offer you that the M2 doesn't besides a meter?
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Old 12-15-2016   #3
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Robert Lai View Post
No 35mm film camera will give you the image quality of medium format. So, I would not sell the entire lot.
Besides, what does the expensively modified MP offer you that the M2 doesn't besides a meter?
I am happy with 10" X 8" prints from the Leica. I do love the bigger negs but I don't need it.

The M2 frame counter constantly annoys me as does the flash sync.
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Old 12-15-2016   #4
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Absolutely to sell all of it. But it will cover 1/5 of the MP cost.
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Old 12-15-2016   #5
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If you really want an MP then sell everything and get one. I'd just keep one of the MF cameras though.
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Old 12-15-2016   #6
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You're living my dream! I'd say go for it (but keep the Pentax 67).
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Old 12-15-2016   #7
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I'd keep the P67 and one of the 35mm SLRs, or whatever you use the most.
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Old 12-15-2016   #8
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If it was me I would have kept the M2 with the 35 and 50 + Contax T2 and sell everything else.. if you want to 'upgrade' the M2 I think you should look at getting an M4 instead of an MP.
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Old 12-15-2016   #9
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If you like 'pretty', consider a mint M6 Millennium edition body at a much lower cost.
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Old 12-15-2016   #10
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It is possible to have too much stuff sometimes. You could upgrade the M2 with PC style flash plugs but a nice new MP is a tempting choice. It also makes deciding which camera to take a lot easier.
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Old 12-15-2016   #11
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Let me understand this. You want to sell lots of really good gear, including several fine medium format cameras, just so that you can get an automatically resetting film counter, and a PC flash synch port with hot shoe? And also the internal meter.

I'd think about this lots and lots if I were you. Then think about it some more before you do this. Someday you'll reach for the Mamiya 7ii and it won't be there because you sold it.

I've done enough things like this in my life that I KNOW you will regret this.
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Old 12-15-2016   #12
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ko.Fe. View Post
Absolutely to sell all of it. But it will cover 1/5 of the MP cost.
False, if he sold everything he would pretty much cover the cost of the MP for sure.

It's a really tough call. I talked a friend of mine into doing something similar about 2 years ago but he had amassed an M4, M4-2, M4-P, a couple M lenses and a couple LTM lenses that he didn't use and traded it all for a brand new MP and a 35/2 and later picked up a 28/2.8 and 50/1.4 (all ASPH). He doesn't regret his decision at all but he has zero intention of selling any of it and has all but stopped buying 35mm gear since he bought all of that. It really comes down to whether you *want* to have a brand spanking new camera that you know for sure that you'll never trade/sell otherwise it's not worth it. Having one camera that will always be a constant in your bag is a nice feeling. If you don't know whether it'll be something that you'll hold on to you might as well sell it all and buy the mintiest M4 or M6 Millennium or something that you can find so you won't lose a lot of resale value later on.

Also, whether you decide to keep one or all of the MF systems that you have is really based on how much you'll end up using it. Having something around that's just gonna sit on the shelf isn't really worth it. The good thing about all that stuff is that it's all very common and will be easy to buy again if you have sellers remorse.
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Old 12-15-2016   #13
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Keep one MF Camera and one 35mm.
I would stay with the Leica lenses get a used leica M6 or MP if you dont like the M2 and keep the Mamiya M7 with it. Thats all i would need.

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Old 12-15-2016   #14
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I get selling everything to get one item you want to treasure. But from a photographic perspective, nothing anyone makes at the 35mm level matches any of your MF gear. Even at 10 by 8 print sizes.

If it was me, I'd get an M5 or M4 to get those frame lines and the resetting film counter, and keep one MF camera. But if you really want the MP the way you want it, do what makes you happy.
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Old 12-15-2016   #15
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Yes. You have to have an MP. The shiniest, most expensive Leica takes the best pictures. An M4 is completely incapable and will only let you down.

/sarcasm

The pride of ownership feeling you'll get from a shiny new MP will wear off. You will miss a Pentax 67 or medium format in general. IMO you can't go wrong with a freshly overhauled M4 and a Rolleiflex 2.8F in a bag. Plus meterless Leica's force you to use better technique a la a Sekonic.
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Old 12-15-2016   #16
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I bought two excellent condition MPs and sent them to Leica to refit to my requirements. Black frame counters, vulcanite and 24/35/50 framelines. You might like to consider doing the same. It was a much cheaper option than ordering a-la-carte but with the exact same outcome. I've really enjoyed owning them, and because they are so portable, I rarely use my MF cameras despite their better image quality.
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Old 12-15-2016   #17
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You could get a black repaint M4 and have a tech change the camera to bring up only the frame lines you want. A much cheaper alternative to an MP a la carte. Should you ever want to sell, the M4 will likely hold its value more than an MP a la carte. Pocket the difference and buy 35mm lens(es) and/or keep some of the MF gear.
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Old 12-15-2016   #18
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Pete B View Post
I bought two excellent condition MPs and sent them to Leica to refit to my requirements. Black frame counters, vulcanite and 24/35/50 framelines. You might like to consider doing the same. It was a much cheaper option than ordering a-la-carte but with the exact same outcome. I've really enjoyed owning them, and because they are so portable, I rarely use my MF cameras despite their better image quality.
Pete
Plus one.

I had a black paint MP with the 0.85 finder that I found used. I had the 75mm frames stripped out and had it overhauled. Saved lots of money and had the camera I always wanted.

Also know that my camera when bought used was already covered in Griptac which I really liked. Mine came "boxed" and displayed gentile brassing. It was new enough for me.

Good luck.

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Old 12-15-2016   #19
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Don't know the fella sellin' this BP MP (link) but if you can convince him to sell abroad you might be able to keep one of the MF cameras. I for one wouldn't like to be without an MF camera.

Or, get yourself a black M4P or M4-2 from this shop and sell the M2.
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Old 12-15-2016   #20
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Quote:
Originally Posted by brennanphotoguy View Post
False, if he sold everything he would pretty much cover the cost of the MP for sure.

It's a really tough call. I talked a friend of mine into doing something similar about 2 years ago but he had amassed an M4, M4-2, M4-P, a couple M lenses and a couple LTM lenses that he didn't use and traded it all for a brand new MP and a 35/2 and later picked up a 28/2.8 and 50/1.4 (all ASPH). He doesn't regret his decision at all but he has zero intention of selling any of it and has all but stopped buying 35mm gear since he bought all of that. It really comes down to whether you *want* to have a brand spanking new camera that you know for sure that you'll never trade/sell otherwise it's not worth it. Having one camera that will always be a constant in your bag is a nice feeling. If you don't know whether it'll be something that you'll hold on to you might as well sell it all and buy the mintiest M4 or M6 Millennium or something that you can find so you won't lose a lot of resale value later on.

Also, whether you decide to keep one or all of the MF systems that you have is really based on how much you'll end up using it. Having something around that's just gonna sit on the shelf isn't really worth it. The good thing about all that stuff is that it's all very common and will be easy to buy again if you have sellers remorse.
The only reason I'm keeping MF and some other film cameras is because I'm emotionally attached. Two folders were from our relative who wanted to come to Canada, but passed away too early. Plus Canadian Brownie made in Toronto.
Two ELC Leica cameras, both were taken care of by recently passed away good person.
One film camera I won in contest, one like my wife and MiL have then they were on low income. Couple of more like this...
Emotional, cultural if not spiritual ties...

Mamiya 7ii with 80/4 - 2000.
Fujifilm GA645 - 400.
Rollei flex ? iib - 200.
Pentax 67 with 105/2.4 and 135/4 and 200/4 - 1500.
Canon T90 with 50/1.4 - 200.
Nikon FE with 85/2 and 50/1.8 - 300
Contax T2 - 500.
Leica M2 -500.

It is 5600, based on ebay prices, before fee is taken.
MP a la carte is about the same.

Sell, sell it all. If no emotional strings are attached just fire sell it all!

I have no idea, why some are so attached to MF. Same as OP, I do 8x10 and Leica gives it nice and easy with very special character of the Leica lens, which most of MF gear has not. Most boring in the character of lens rendering prints I ever seen are from those Japanese MF cameras. They are sharp and ... nothing else. Yes, I also printed from IIb cord (flex) lens and it is also nowhere near to Leica rendering.

Sell it all! Support Leica!
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Old 12-15-2016   #21
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Used body, tweaked to your preferred frame lines and new glass.

New body customized to you might be hard to sell if you need to.

B2 (;->
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Old 12-15-2016   #22
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ko.Fe. View Post
The only reason I'm keeping MF and some other film cameras is because I'm emotionally attached. Two folders were from our relative who wanted to come to Canada, but passed away too early. Plus Canadian Brownie made in Toronto.
Two ELC Leica cameras, both were taken care of by recently passed away good person.
One film camera I won in contest, one like my wife and MiL have then they were on low income. Couple of more like this...
Emotional, cultural if not spiritual ties...

Mamiya 7ii with 80/4 - 2000.
Fujifilm GA645 - 400.
Rollei flex ? iib - 200.
Pentax 67 with 105/2.4 and 135/4 and 200/4 - 1500.
Canon T90 with 50/1.4 - 200.
Nikon FE with 85/2 and 50/1.8 - 300
Contax T2 - 500.
Leica M2 -500.

It is 5600, based on ebay prices, before fee is taken.
MP a la carte is about the same.

Sell, sell it all. If no emotional strings are attached just fire sell it all!

I have no idea, why some are so attached to MF. Same as OP, I do 8x10 and Leica gives it nice and easy with very special character of the Leica lens, which most of MF gear has not. Most boring in the character of lens rendering prints I ever seen are from those Japanese MF cameras. They are sharp and ... nothing else. Yes, I also printed from IIb cord (flex) lens and it is also nowhere near to Leica rendering.

Sell it all! Support Leica!
This is def off topic but if you don't see character in Pentax 67 lenses you are blind as a bat. Bruce Weber and I strongly disagree.
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Old 12-15-2016   #23
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There is certainly a very different look to medium format. Typically, the depth of field is much shallower. This is not a look that you can replicate by opening up a Summilux to f/1.4, however.

Don't forget that with the leaf shutter models, you have flash synch all the way to 1/500. With any Leica M, the flash synch speed is 1/50. Try that on a sunny day with ISO 400 film when you want some fill flash.
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Old 12-15-2016   #24
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SaveKodak View Post
This is def off topic but if you don't see character in Pentax 67 lenses you are blind as a bat. Bruce Weber and I strongly disagree.
It is not off-topic since this is big chunk of change for MP and MF is glorified here.

I have seen Pentax 67 and its lenses. I'd rather fly like a bat with M, than slow plow like a pig with this rig.
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Old 12-15-2016   #25
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Do not sell everything. You will just end up buying it again or something similar. I will give you better then even odds that just about everyone here has done something similar and bought more photo equipment after selling everything at least once. I know I have done it a couple times in 50 years of playing with cameras.

I don't quite get the fascination with the MP a la carte. An M6 will do the same thing for 20% of the cost unless you are thinking MP as wearable jewelry. If you really want an MP, get a used one. They are not that hard to find mint.
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Old 12-15-2016   #26
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ko.Fe. View Post
It is not off-topic since this is big chunk of change for MP and MF is glorified here.

I have seen Pentax 67 and its lenses. I'd rather fly like a bat with M, than slow plow like a pig with this rig.
They are different cameras for different uses. I'd rather shoot a portrait session with a P67 than with an M. The whole point was you said that these Japanese MF lenses have no character which is completely wrong. The Mamiya 7 and RZ lenses, yes. They are razor sharp and are made that way for a reason but the P67 lenses have character for days.
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Old 12-15-2016   #27
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Quote:
Originally Posted by twhittle View Post
Seeing as it is the new year soon, I was interested in your opinion of what I should do:

After ammassing quite a lot of gear and having lots go through my hands I'm thinking of selling everything. I would replace it all with one MP a la carte.

Currently on rotation I have: Mamiya 7ii with 80/4, Fujifilm GA645, Rolleiflex iib, Pentax 67 with 105/2.4 and 135/4 and 200/4, Canon T90 with 50/1.4, Nikon FE with 85/2 and 50/1.8, Contax T2 and Leica M2 with 50/2.8 and 35/2.

I would sell everything except the two Leica lenses and order an MP a la carte in black paint, original vulcanite, 35/50/90 frame lines and original script. It would almost be a straight swap if I do this.

So what should I do?
I can't say what you should do. I've been there and done something like this in the past, however. More than once. And each time it was good.

Nowadays, I consider a similar move but since I already have the cameras that I would like to end up with (Leica SL and Leica M-D, Hasselblad SWC), I plan to sell everything else. :-)

G
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Old 12-15-2016   #28
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Originally Posted by brennanphotoguy View Post
They are different cameras for different uses. I'd rather shoot a portrait session with a P67 than with an M. The whole point was you said that these Japanese MF lenses have no character which is completely wrong. The Mamiya 7 and RZ lenses, yes. They are razor sharp and are made that way for a reason but the P67 lenses have character for days.
I have Jane Bown book of portraits. Just gave it to our elder daughter. Some portraits in this book are taken with Rolleiflex, but most with Olympus and prime tele lens at f2.8. After studying for several weeks, I realized why she switched to Olympus. It was allowing her to "dance" around object freely.
You know, I just ordered another book to study on portraits, which worth to look at.
It is called: "An Inner Silence: The Portraits Of Henri Cartier-Bresson".
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Old 12-15-2016   #29
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i think it's funny how some of these fine folks want to save your money...
i have thought many times how it would be nice to dump all my gear and re-start with one body and one lens...become a purist seeing only from one pov, say like from a 35mm lens...but then i realize that gear makes me happy along with a few good images occasionally...then again, the simplicity of having and carrying one body/lens is so appealing...
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Old 12-15-2016   #30
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Quote:
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i think it's funny how some of these fine folks want to save your money...
i have thought many times how it would be nice to dump all my gear and re-start with one body and one lens...become a purist seeing only from one pov, say like from a 35mm lens...but then i realize that gear makes me happy along with a few good images occasionally...then again, the simplicity of having and carrying one body/lens is so appealing...
What if he was talking about camera bags?
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Old 12-15-2016   #31
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I'd say go for it, but first see if it would be cheaper to have DAG or Sherry do the work on a new stock body unless you are after one of the a la carte serial numbers. FYI, the new a la carte 'configurator' on the Leica site no longer lists the .58 or .85 VF as an option, nor frame line selections. The M7 isn't included either, tho they say if you want an M7 to write them. I will miss the hours whiled away while prints were in the wash playing with the old configurator.

I currently have a camera in NJ for a "Re-Design". I emailed today to see if they had an updated estimate on a completion date and was told that the techs were gone for the day, at 3:20....

EDIT: It seems you might be able to specify VF magnification and frame lines, as they are listed as '0.72' and 'Standard' in the summary at the end.
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Old 12-15-2016   #32
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What if he was talking about camera bags?
i can hold all my gear in 2 really big bags...but i use one smaller bag to carry stuff for the day...
with one camera/lens you might never need a bag again...
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Old 12-15-2016   #33
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Seems to fit your wish list...
http://www.fotopia.com.hk/#!product/...a%20la%20carte
(except chrome not black paint)

FWIW, as an owner of an MP and an M2, I'd just keep the M2 (and all your other cameras) lovely as the MP is.
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Old 12-15-2016   #34
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Going to echo other commenters here and say find a used MP, then have the top plate swapped out from Leica. Cost to do this is about $1,000. I looked at doing the same a few years ago with my MP.

Also, keep the medium format. I've often debated about selling my Hassy since I don't use it as much anymore, but whenever I open it up and look through that waist level viewfinder, I can't get myself to get rid of it.
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Old 12-15-2016   #35
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That's great! Believe this is the first chrome MP I've come across with the classic script. This is what I was looking for a few years ago when I bought m MP.

Quote:
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Seems to fit your wish list...
http://www.fotopia.com.hk/#!product/...a%20la%20carte
(except chrome not black paint)

FWIW, as an owner of an MP and an M2, I'd just keep the M2 (and all your other cameras) lovely as the MP is.
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Old 12-15-2016   #36
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If I were to sell bunch of stuff to get an a la carte MP, the main reason would be to get 0.58 or 0.85 magnification VF. Re-covering is easy. Masking framelines can be done relatively cheaply by Don or Youxin. VF magnification change from 0.72 mag. camera is not really cost effective.

With that thinking, if I were the OP wanting a 0.72 magnification camera, I'd rather keep the M2. And use this opportunity (that I'm considering a consolidation) to sell some underused stuff and buy film or travel.
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Old 12-15-2016   #37
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Think about the end results. More format allows you to create different kind of pictures. The leicas are good with fast paced work. But when you have time, mf forces you to slow down interact w your subjects and when the light is right its so much better. Im on the opposite camp thinking of leaving leica and just shoot my mamiya 6/rollei combos. Final results matter use what you need to make them. Dont have to trim your tools too much, there will be time you want a diff kind of pic then switch around your tools. Get an mp though if thats what you like to have. It wears off though i have lot of friends who trade their mp for m6. I like metered leica, i hate overconfidence then have under exposed negs.
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Old 12-15-2016   #38
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As for the Leicas, keep the M2 for your 50mm, and buy a 0.58 MP for your 35. They both offer a similar eye relief with the viewfinder magnification, and there are no 135 frame lines in a 0.58. I use this as a two body travel combination and love it!
Sell whatever you don't use or want in order to add the MP, but that's entirely your choice.
Good luck!
Cheers
J



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Old 12-15-2016   #39
Nowhereman
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twhittle - I see no problem at all in selling the medium format stuff if you've decided that what you like is the "35mm aesthetic". Must say that I've never been interested in a medium format camera because I prefer the 35mm look.

Also, I've never wanted to buy used cameras, considering all the mechanical stuff that may need a CLA. But a couple of weeks ago, having mused vaguely about ordering a new M-A or MP, I came across a listing for a mint-looking single stroke M3 from a Japanese eBay vendor. I ended up buying it for $350 less than an EX++ listed M3 at Tamarkin, which is probably the correct classification for the M3 I got.

The camera came in three days: it works perfectly and looks great — there is only some scuffing on the top plate that wasn't visible in the eBay pictures; but I can't even see the scuffing unless I put on my reading glasses. The dealer said the camera had a CLA a month earlier: perfect viewfinder, easier and quicker to focus than my M6 (0.85x VF); perfect shutter; the smooth M3 film advance; and new vulcanite. Glad I didn't buy a new M-A, as I prefer the M3 viewfinder.

Incidentally, I don't think vulcanite is still available from Leica — you may want to check.
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Old 12-15-2016   #40
johnwolf
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Quote:
Originally Posted by twhittle View Post
....So what should I do?
It always amazes me that people will give purchase advice to someone they don't know and knowing little or nothing about the type of photography they do or what their creative intentions are. Take a long walk and contemplate your choices. Or make a list of pros and cons. Then follow your instincts and do what YOU think is best. No offense to your or anyone else here, but this is an important personal decision, and the only one who truly cares what you do is you.

John
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