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BLACK PAINT M's Post a pic of yours
Old 10-31-2014   #1
nobbylon
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BLACK PAINT M's Post a pic of yours

It's been asked so many times so hopefully the membership can help.
How does the finish differ on BP cameras? I'm not talking repaints here, only originals.
If you have an original please post a pic of it in decent light and try to convey the actual finish ie roughness or smoothness of the paint, sheen etc.
Looking for Early M3 to later M3, M2, M4, any special edition LHSA cameras and if you are fortunate enough early MP's. Leicaflex SL's also as I believe there were 2 different paint finishes used in the run.
No modern MP's please. Ps serials out if you like. The paint is the only interest along with year of manufacture.
thanks all john
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Old 10-31-2014   #2
Erik van Straten
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This camera of course is not mine, but I think it is an interesting example of a very early black M Leica, in fact the earliest black M I know of. It was a very small run of five cameras.

M3 - 746576.

Erik.

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Old 10-31-2014   #3
Erik van Straten
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The next series of black M Leicas are the famous black MP's. About 150 are made.
The paint on these cameras is very dull and thin.

This camera is not mine, of course.

Leica MP 28

Erik.

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Old 10-31-2014   #4
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Interesting that the MP is that dull a finish. Also interesting that the glossy finish of that early M3 is not polished by wear as evident by the glossy paint between the windows which never get polished.
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Old 10-31-2014   #5
Erik van Straten
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In 1958 Leitz introduced the M2 that was also made in black, the same finish and paint type that was used on the MP: dull and thin. The first run of black M2 was 500 cameras.

This is my early black M2. Clearly can be seen that the brass first was etched in a dark, brown tone - "bruniert" in German - and then painted.

Erik.

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Old 10-31-2014   #6
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Quote:
Originally Posted by nobbylon View Post
Interesting that the MP is that dull a finish. Also interesting that the glossy finish of that early M3 is not polished by wear as evident by the glossy paint between the windows which never get polished.
The dull black paint gives the cameras an ascetic look, almost unattractive. I like it however. The paint of the modern MP is far too shiny in my opinion.

Erik.
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Old 10-31-2014   #7
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i want to get my M5 black-painted... was trying to find pictures of *ANY* online just to see what they looked like (AFAIK there was not a single factory BP M5) and was having a really hard time of it.
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Old 10-31-2014   #8
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Little wear on this one. It must have been much harder paint.
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Old 10-31-2014   #9
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Took me a while to find the link but I posted a comparison in this thread between the paint and engravings on my black paint M4, the above TTL and my Leica II.
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Camera position: In general as shown in Fig. H and J, but according to requirements other positions are also possible or more practical.
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Old 10-31-2014   #10
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Please post those here Philipus as they are exactly what I'm looking for. That M6ttl shot clearly shows the orange peel surface nicely.
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Old 10-31-2014   #11
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Is that your motor converted M4 or a different one?
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Old 10-31-2014   #12
Erik van Straten
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Spicy View Post
was trying to find pictures of *ANY* online just to see what they looked like (AFAIK there was not a single factory BP M5) and was having a really hard time of it.
There is a picture of a black paint M5 factory prototype in Paul-Henry van Hasbroeck, The Leica [...], 1983, page 180/181.

Erik.
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Old 10-31-2014   #13
Erik van Straten
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Towards the early seventies Leitz offered a service for those who were not happy with the flaking and bubbling paint on their early black M2's. All the black parts were replaced by new ones and the original number was engraved, but slightly higher than the old ones from the fifties. The type of paint was the same of that of the M4 and Leicaflex SL.

These restored cameras are very beautiful in my opinion.

This is my example.

Erik.

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Old 10-31-2014   #14
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Erik van Straten View Post
Towards the early seventies Leitz offered a service for those who were not happy with the flaking and bubbling paint on their early black M2's. All the black parts were replaced by new ones and the original number was engraved, but slightly higher than the old ones from the fifties. The type of paint was the same of that of the M4 and Leicaflex SL.

These restored cameras are very beautiful in my opinion.

This is my example.

Erik.

Ah so that is how the larger Mx numbers came about?

And I completely agree, Erik. A very beautiful camera indeed.
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Camera position: In general as shown in Fig. H and J, but according to requirements other positions are also possible or more practical.
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Old 10-31-2014   #15
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Speaking of black paint, at the LP Foto auction in Stockholm on 6 December there are a few interesting objects. I don't think I am allowed to post the images directly but here are a few links:

Leica IIIf three crowns

Leica IIIg three crowns

Leica IIIg three crowns

Leica M2 brassed

Leica M2 very clean

Leica M3 brassed

Leica M3 brassed

Leica M3 very clean

Leica MP39* almost unbelievably brassed and worn

cheers
Philip
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Camera position: In general as shown in Fig. H and J, but according to requirements other positions are also possible or more practical.
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Old 10-31-2014   #16
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Erik van Straten View Post
Towards the early seventies Leitz offered a service for those who were not happy with the flaking and bubbling paint on their early black M2's. All the black parts were replaced by new ones and the original number was engraved, but slightly higher than the old ones from the fifties. The type of paint was the same of that of the M4 and Leicaflex SL.

These restored cameras are very beautiful in my opinion.

This is my example.

Erik.

Agreed Erik, these are the nicest of the non brassed and beat up originals. Very nice camera. john
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Old 11-01-2014   #17
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The main disadvantage of the M4-2 is that it does not brass well, the black chrome is ugly.


Leica M4-2 in autumn by Eirik0304, on Flickr
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Old 11-01-2014   #18
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Strange thing is that for the black M3 Leitz did not have a restoration service like for the M2. However, clients could have their chrome M3's transformed into black paint ones. These transformed cameras are very rare, due to the high cost. They were often made to match the Noctilux 50mm f/1.2, a black finished lens.

The style of the engraved number will date the camera a bit. This one does not have any spaces in it's number, so it can date from the M5 era when the numbers were engraved into the accessory-shoe without spaces. The position, lower than the M3 indication, is a bit weird.

This is mine. The former owner sold the Noctilux 50mm f/1.2 seperately that was on this camera.

The type of paint is the same as on the black M4 and Leicaflex SL cameras.

Erik.



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Old 11-01-2014   #19
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Had.....

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Old 11-01-2014   #20
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My lhsa

Leica M6 TTL LHSA by Thomas O'Connell, on Flickr

Untitled by Thomas O'Connell, on Flickr
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Old 11-01-2014   #21
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Thanks to all contributing so far. C'mon ladies and gents! there must be more original BP M2, 3 and 4's out there!
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Old 11-01-2014   #22
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BP M4 from last enamel batch
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File Type: jpg 20141101145251.jpg (73.3 KB, 250 views)
File Type: jpg 20141101145405.jpg (51.4 KB, 118 views)
File Type: jpg 20141101145821.jpg (63.7 KB, 132 views)
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Old 11-01-2014   #23
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Wow that's heavily used M4. Do you know anything about its background?
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Camera position: In general as shown in Fig. H and J, but according to requirements other positions are also possible or more practical.
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Old 11-01-2014   #24
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Always sitting in the shadows watching, but I do love my nice old SL, similar to which Nobbylon posted.

I heard that the "black lens mount" was more rare?

I also have an old Leica 1a, which I had refurbished locally (older Leica whiz tech, loves mechanical, detests digital). Redid the shutter curtains, and repainted the black. I will run some film through it in due course, but right now it sits watching the other Leicas get used.
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Old 11-01-2014   #25
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For the purpose of aesthetics I think we should be including the black painted screwmounts (and earlier) in this thread. They truly are beautiful with well worn black paint.

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Old 11-01-2014   #26
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M3 as found at Camera West

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Old 11-02-2014   #27
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keep them coming!
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Old 11-02-2014   #28
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My BP M6TTL LHSA, Aki Asahi 4040 covering.



Leica M6TTL LHSA
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Old 11-02-2014   #29
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Keith View Post
we should be including the black painted screwmounts (and earlier) in this thread
Unlike the paint of black paint of the early screwmounts the grey paint of the wartime IIIc resembles the black paint of the early M's: same bubbling and flaking and the same dark etched undertone.

Erik.

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Old 11-02-2014   #30
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In keeping with Keith's fine shot, I decided to give this a go.
Gary

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Old 11-02-2014   #31
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OH, only originals, Nobbylon? No repaints? Glad I caught that, I was about to post a shot of one of mine that you repainted!
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Old 11-02-2014   #32
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Yep only originals please in this thread and please NO new MP's as they have their own thread and are of no interest to the original request.
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Old 11-02-2014   #33
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Worse GAS thread ever....
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Old 11-02-2014   #34
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Quote:
Originally Posted by gbealnz View Post
I'd make them bigger, but am struggling with how to? I uploaded them to my Flickr account, but the attaching of the link is seemingly beyond me, sorry.
Gary
You need to copy the link of the image itself. There may be different ways to do it but I always go to an image, press the "Download this photo" button (a down arrow and horizontal line in the lower right corner of an image), select "View all sizes", choose the appropriate size, right click and (on OS X) select "Copy image address". That's the link to insert into the insert image field using this button
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Old 11-02-2014   #35
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Quote:
Originally Posted by philipus View Post
You need to copy the link of the image itself. There may be different ways to do it but I always go to an image, press the "Download this photo" button (a down arrow and horizontal line in the lower right corner of an image), select "View all sizes", choose the appropriate size, right click and (on OS X) select "Copy image address". That's the link to insert into the insert image field using this button

Awesome Philipus, greatly appreciated. Just tried it, and it worked.
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Old 11-03-2014   #36
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Man, this thread is not fair for those of us who don't have any black paint Leicas currently.
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Three BP M4's made between 1969 and 1973......
Old 11-03-2014   #37
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Three BP M4's made between 1969 and 1973......

Alright - here's my stash of BP M4's, all were made between 1969 and 1973 (from what I can find on the web) - all are original BP cameras. One has a modern BP Leicavit MP, (my apologies to the OP, if you like, I can remove those images ), so you can see a comparison of modern black paint and original. As you can see, some are very glossy while others are a little duller.





















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Old 11-04-2014   #38
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jbrianphoto,
you have a great set there and thanks for posting ALL of those. The first M4 with the 21mm finder fitted is 'to me' what Leica black paint is about. Thick paint, semi-dull with deep script. thx J
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Old 11-05-2014   #39
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I have a fourth M4, but it is black chrome, so I didn't post a photo of it here.
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Old 11-05-2014   #40
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Quote:
Originally Posted by nobbylon View Post
jbrianphoto,
you have a great set there and thanks for posting ALL of those. The first M4 with the 21mm finder fitted is 'to me' what Leica black paint is about. Thick paint, semi-dull with deep script. thx J
Your very welcome. I really like the shiney paint. That's part of the fun of this business, the little differences.
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