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eric kim goes open source...
Old 09-02-2013   #1
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eric kim goes open source...

http://petapixel.com/2013/09/01/eric...g-open-source/
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Old 09-02-2013   #2
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hoot! i applaud this approach, no matter how disruptive it may be.
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Old 09-02-2013   #3
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forgive me: what does open source mean?
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Old 09-02-2013   #4
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forgive me: what does open source mean?
In this context it means free. He is basically giving everyone acces to use his hi-res images on flickr.
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Old 09-02-2013   #5
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I hope this will work out for him, but it further enforces if it's on the internet it's free. That's ok with me, as long as we all know what it is and treat it accordingly. Not sure how he will make his "enough to get buy on" or to afford some of the latest gear or nice plane trips to exotic locations to talk with people like Alamby.
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Old 09-02-2013   #6
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It's sloppy use of terminology.

Open source usually means the raw source of a program can be read and used by others (within some licensing terms). The closest photography equivelent would be if people related photoshop psd files and let people use and modify them - the layers, the actions, the image data, etc - to produce new works.

Kim just set licensing terms on the output itself. Nothing wrong with that but open source is a weird terminology choice. It does market well to tech people I suppose.
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Old 09-02-2013   #7
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Hmm.. I read the article and the comments. Why does this guy generate so much hate? I think he has some decent work. He makes a living out of something he loves and I for one respect him for that. Wish I had that kind of balls....
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Old 09-02-2013   #8
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Looks like he makes (made) enough money from his "workshops" ...
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Old 09-02-2013   #9
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That's a pretty ballsy move. I just resolved myself in the opposite direction recently! (That is, not giving away free usage to photos that I have an intent to publish in the future).

Honestly I can't imagine ever actually downloading someone else's photo, printing it, and hanging it on the wall as art. Just seems wrong. It will be interesting to see if this helps or hurts his ability to make a living.
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Old 09-02-2013   #10
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Hmm.. I read the article and the comments. Why does this guy generate so much hate? I think he has some decent work. He makes a living out of something he loves and I for one respect him for that. Wish I had that kind of balls....
i think it's because he is doing what many others would like to be doing.
i have been asked by a few folks over the years to teach 'street' workshops...on my own not through a local establishment...and i always defer...
if i were a bitter man i might be jealous enough to dislike him too.
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Old 09-02-2013   #11
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Hmm.. I read the article and the comments. Why does this guy generate so much hate? I think he has some decent work. He makes a living out of something he loves and I for one respect him for that. Wish I had that kind of balls....
Good question....it's a strange internet phenomenon.
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Old 09-02-2013   #12
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In a way, I think this is a little akin to what is happening in the music industry, ie artists making the pragmatic choice to forego income from record sales, instead focussing on income from live perfomances. Without second guessing his intentions or sincerity, Eric perhaps has made a similar pragmatic choice, opting to forego income and the effort to generate that income from print sales, in favour of other means, in his case, perhaps workshop income.

EDIT: the deeper question here perhaps, is whether the market for one's photography is more viable than the market to simply sell to other photographers. If the latter, that is depressing, although in my opinion, most photographers price their work too high. I think the market can bear more than free, though.
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Old 09-02-2013   #13
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Actually, after giving this some thought, I believe I understand his model. We all love Beethoven and Mozart and Chopin. When you learn to play the piano, you can get this music for free. What you pay for is the lessons on HOW to play the piano.

So if he gives his work away for free, and I think his photos are pretty good, perhaps he is thinking that people will want to come to workshops and learn how to shoot like he does. Maybe he will make his money that way.

In fact, given the absolute flood and torrent of street photos and the deluge of digital street images (most of which are not anywhere near his work) perhaps this is the only model that will work. You can always find something cheaper or free on the internet, but learning something that could truly set you apart is not so easy to find on the net.

For example, go find a sample USDA Feasibility study for a B&I loan. It's quite difficult if not impossible. And learning how to do it is even more difficult to find. Perhaps I should learn something from Eric Kim.
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Old 09-02-2013   #14
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So reading this, it only applies to non-commercial use of the photos. I wonder how many sales to individuals he has has a year. If nothing else, this is permitting what people were probably doing anyway. I may have an overly pessimistic view though.
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Old 09-02-2013   #15
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So reading this, it only applies to non-commercial use of the photos. I wonder how many sales to individuals he has has a year. If nothing else, this is permitting what people were probably doing anyway. I may have an overly pessimistic view though.
I think so too. He seems most interested in teaching photography more than anything. I hardly browse his website/flickr, but has he been trying to sell prints?
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Old 09-02-2013   #16
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A lot of photographers today, even really famous ones, are not making money taking pictures and selling them. They're making money selling dreams to people with the money to take their workshops, who think if they spend the money to study with someone famous that that famous someone will help their career. It doesn't work that way, and the career isn't worth having anymore anyway.

I love photography, and I still make decent money from it, but I make more as a high school English and History teacher than I have ever made as a photographer and I think the days of me making decent money from my photos are numbered. In fact, I make more than most professional photographers...as a second year teacher. People used to say if photography became that devalued that no one would take pictures, and then the value of images would go back up. Problem is, there are enough idiots willing to give it away forever.
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Old 09-02-2013   #17
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Looks like he makes (made) enough money from his "workshops" ...
In the music industry more money is now generated from concerts and pad performances than from single or album sales.
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Old 09-02-2013   #18
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"Open source" usually used in computer programming. In the case of Eric Kim, he probably needs use "Creative Commons".

http://creativecommons.org/
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Old 09-02-2013   #19
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Does this mean we can edit his blog in the spirit of open source? No? How about access the raw files and edit. No? This is nothing more than free press.
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Old 09-02-2013   #20
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Problem is, there are enough idiots willing to give it away forever.
A huge amount of music was always made by people who played for others for free. That's mostly how it was done until the advent of recording. Paid musical careers depended on an aristocracy who could pay others to play. There was a time when music for 99.9999% of the population was played by those same people in a shared, social environment. No formal exchange needed.

Photography and a substantial amount of music are going that way again. This may not be a bad thing for people to make their own photos and music and other works of art.
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Old 09-02-2013   #21
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Winogrand spent his later years teaching photography "seminars" to college students. Kim's approach is similar, but without institutional support. I'm happy to see people like Kim make bold moves to skirt the establishment.
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Old 09-02-2013   #22
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"Open source" usually used in computer programming. In the case of Eric Kim, he probably needs use "Creative Commons".

http://creativecommons.org/
Yeah,I sort of expected an article on switching from Adobe or other expensive software to open source editing software like GIMP...
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Old 09-02-2013   #23
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it might be free press and brand development for 51 so-so jpegs, but at least he has good intentions. out of the bazillions of forgettable, derivative street photographers/stealthy, killer ninjas at least he's making a living out of it and is creating the chance to make artistic headway. envy much?
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Old 09-02-2013   #24
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A lot of photographers today, even really famous ones, are not making money taking pictures and selling them. They're making money selling dreams to people with the money to take their workshops, who think if they spend the money to study with someone famous that that famous someone will help their career. It doesn't work that way, and the career isn't worth having anymore anyway.

I love photography, and I still make decent money from it, but I make more as a high school English and History teacher than I have ever made as a photographer and I think the days of me making decent money from my photos are numbered. In fact, I make more than most professional photographers...as a second year teacher. People used to say if photography became that devalued that no one would take pictures, and then the value of images would go back up. Problem is, there are enough idiots willing to give it away forever.
count yourself lucky Chris..you have two worthwhile careers. I get our point though but don`t become bitter about it.
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Old 09-02-2013   #25
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it might be free press and brand development for 51 so-so jpegs, but at least he has good intentions. out of the bazillions of forgettable, derivative street photographers/stealthy, killer ninjas at least he's making a living out of it and is creating the chance to make artistic headway. envy much?
Envy? Hell, I'd never heard of the guy until I read this thread. He is not important as an individual. He's one of many drops of rain that made the flood.
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Old 09-02-2013   #26
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So Eric Kim is doing something hundreds of thousands of photographers on flickr already do. Where's the news?
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Old 09-02-2013   #27
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So Eric Kim is doing something hundreds of thousands of photographers on flickr already do. Where's the news?
I guess the news is that like KR we're talking about him and probably generating traffic that will grease his wheels!
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Old 09-02-2013   #28
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good for him.
If a musician was giving away his music to promote his art and make a living from his concerts, what's wrong with that? or with the opposite model? or with giving away his/her music AND concerts and making a living from ringtones?

On another note, I knew the guy from his gear review never took him too seriously, but I actually like some of his images quite a bit, which means that he may have a thing or two to teach his students.

[edit] the "blood thirsty capitalist vampire" thing is moronic. I hope all he meant was that he's doing ok and asking for more would have been greedy of him.
Selling a print doesn't turns you into count Dracula just yet...
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Smart bizznazz!
Old 09-02-2013   #29
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Smart bizznazz!

The reality is that "street photography" love it or hate it does not sell images compared to other photography genres.
EK is giving away what he is not selling. Good for him! He's just being a smart entrepreneur by steering the direction his revenue machine is going to go. You know.. not fighting the tide.
I'm sure most of the folks who go to his workshops just want a bit of attention on Flickr and other online Social Media venues.
Getting a story done about the matter is simply...Loud Noises!

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Old 09-02-2013   #30
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I think he should stop now ... the world has more than enough street photographers!
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Old 09-02-2013   #31
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... I love photography, and I still make decent money from it, but I make more as a high school English and History teacher than I have ever made as a photographer and I think the days of me making decent money from my photos are numbered. In fact, I make more than most professional photographers...as a second year teacher. ...
A couple of years ago now, when I was considering a career change, I came across the National Bureau of Labor Statistics and looked up photographers. The national average annual salary for a full-time working photographer was listed as $29,000, plus or minus a couple thou.

That's outstripped by many many other creative entry-level positions.

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Old 09-02-2013   #32
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The Photographic coverage of the world is now by the masses snapping away, and falls within the bounds of the 'infinite monkey theorem'.

Occasionally great photos bubble to the top, but not so many Shakespeares hitting hard with lasting works.
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Old 09-02-2013   #33
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Not sure how he will make his "enough to get buy on" or to afford some of the latest gear or nice plane trips to exotic locations to talk with people like Alamby.
He doesn't make money on his images does he? It's just his blog ad/click thru and sponsors etc, + his courses where he gets his income ... who really will download and print these images ... just to generate more clicks and buzz like here
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Old 09-02-2013   #34
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I think he should stop now ... the world has more than enough street photographers!
Yes, we need more Sigma Merrill photographers
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Old 09-03-2013   #35
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Yes, we need more Sigma Merrill photographers

No ... we need people who just take photos without obsessing about the genre they've chosen or the gear they've chosen to shoot with.
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Old 09-03-2013   #36
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I think he should stop now ... the world has more than enough street photographers!
Even in Canada ?
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Old 09-03-2013   #37
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Even in Canada ?
Particularly Canada!
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Old 09-03-2013   #38
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So reading this, it only applies to non-commercial use of the photos. I wonder how many sales to individuals he has has a year. If nothing else, this is permitting what people were probably doing anyway. I may have an overly pessimistic view though.
I had the same view...
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Old 09-03-2013   #39
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Eric Kim is living proof that it's a marketer's world out there.
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Old 09-03-2013   #40
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yeah, nothing to see here, he's not selling them anyway. this story is just free advertising to send more traffic to his site
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