Rumor Mill: Leica C-M
Old 05-29-2018   #1
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Rumor Mill: Leica C-M

https://leicarumors.com/2018/05/28/n...eica-c-m.aspx/

thoughts? speculations?
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Old 05-29-2018   #2
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Crappy-Mirrorless.
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Old 05-29-2018   #3
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Crappy-Mirrorless.
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Old 05-30-2018   #4
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Originally Posted by Ko.Fe. View Post
Crappy-Mirrorless.

"The new full frame camera will be based on a new sensor with outstanding low light high dynamic range capabilities"

If the EVF is better than the one in the CL, and the price is less (much less) than the M10, then Leica will have a winner.
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Old 05-30-2018   #5
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The new full frame camera will be based on a new sensor with outstanding low light high dynamic range capabilities
Technology obsolescence. The sooner they get to "good enough" the better. Maybe this will be it.
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Old 05-30-2018   #6
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Originally Posted by Huss View Post
If the EVF is better than the one in the CL, and the price is less (much less) than the M10, then Leica will have a winner.
Yes …. they finally seem to be heading in the right direction for the market.
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Old 05-30-2018   #7
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i find the use of M lenses through an EVF to be a sluggish procedure and uninspiring overall. through the traditional optical viewfinder, the rangefinder patch is unobtrusive and immediately available. seeing things outside the framelines is also a huge perk. these are quintessential M traits.

if leica can create an incredibly novel hybrid viewfinder that retains these features, i'll be interested.

otherwise, why not just create an interchangeable lens Q with an L mount? autofocus lenses that also have true manual-focus, a detailed focus scale, and hard-stops for those of us that like to zone focus.
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Old 05-30-2018   #8
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Originally Posted by lynnb View Post
Technology obsolescence. The sooner they get to "good enough" the better. Maybe this will be it.
i think several brands have been at "good enough" for quite some time. for example, the Canon 5D2 from 9 years ago is capable of producing fantastic images by 2018 standards.

i also consider the M240 to be a "good enough" camera. the functionality and image quality are excellent. it's a bit too chunky in the hand, so the M10 finally got that right.
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Old 05-30-2018   #9
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i think several brands have been at "good enough" for quite some time. for example, the Canon 5D2 from 9 years ago is capable of producing fantastic images by 2018 standards.

i also consider the M240 to be a "good enough" camera. the functionality and image quality are excellent. it's a bit too chunky in the hand, so the M10 finally got that right.
Agree 100%. I think if they created a Q with L mount and smaller lenses it would be a big hit.
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Old 05-30-2018   #10
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I would be interested.
At the weekend I lost many images as I did not notice the polarizing filter I put on the 75mm summicron , to help cut through the haze, had somehow obtained a grease film all over the inner facing surface. The contrast was so low the results look like they are from a plastic holga lens.
With close up wide angle framing, longer lenses and polarizing filters - the rangefinder is not best : but those tiny lenses are all I would want to carrry.
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Old 05-30-2018   #11
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i find the use of M lenses through an EVF to be a sluggish procedure and uninspiring overall.
I am not very impressed with adapted lenses on mirrorless cameras in general. Focusing for me is too iffy to feel confident. And focus peaking is sort of dodgy. I tend to think it only works because DOF covers focus errors. Maybe with the SL with its best in class viewfinder it is different. Or maybe the next round of Sonys with its new UXGA EVF will be the ones to use. If Leica wants this new mirrorless camera to be successful, it needs to do something different with AF lenses. The SL lenses are gargantuan and hideously expensive.
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Old 05-30-2018   #12
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This should be a very interesting effort from Leica.
The attempted bifurcation of the M product line. What the heck is this thing going to look like?? Presumably there will be 'rangefinder' design cues, more than just the placement of the EVF. Egad, an M type thang with an integrated grip?? There'll be riots! lol
Large autofocus (SL) lenses on an M sized body doesn't make sense.
...spitballing... Didn't Nikon place the autofocus motor inside of one of their cameras? It could also be used, via an adapter, to autofocus m lenses.
Anyway, should be interesting to see what Leica/Panasonic has come up with this time, given the design parameters.
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Old 05-30-2018   #13
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i’d prefer an m10 where they replaced the reverse galilean viewfinder with an evf, articulated the lcd, and added ibis. basically an improved fuji x-e3.
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Old 05-30-2018   #14
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ko.Fe. View Post
Crappy-Mirrorless.
I would think it'll be closer to a an over-priced, but brilliant mirrorless camera than crappy. BUT I'm not biased against mirrorless.
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Old 05-30-2018   #15
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Originally Posted by aizan View Post
i’d prefer an m10 where they replaced the reverse galilean viewfinder with an evf, articulated the lcd, and added ibis. basically an improved fuji x-e3.
no, no, and no.
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Old 05-30-2018   #16
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Originally Posted by aizan View Post
i’d prefer an m10 where they replaced the reverse galilean viewfinder with an evf, articulated the lcd, and added ibis. basically an improved fuji x-e3.
You can buy that from Sony since several years and use any (M) lens you want.

I think a new Leica has to be more than a metoo-mirrorless. Although it sems to be a fullframe. Let´s see what is coming here
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Old 05-30-2018   #17
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You can buy that from Sony since several years and use any (M) lens you want.
Really, Sony has an M10 shaped mirrorless camera?
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Old 05-30-2018   #18
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You can buy that from Sony since several years and use any (M) lens you want.
As long as you are not picky about image quality as Sony uses much thicker sensor cover glass than Leica.
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Old 05-30-2018   #19
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After my Q experience I will never buy a digital Leica.
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Old 05-30-2018   #20
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Nikon and Canon will release a full frame mirrorless too.. its getting interesting.
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Old 05-30-2018   #21
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Really, Sony has an M10 shaped mirrorless camera?
Smaller and lighter!
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Old 05-30-2018   #22
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i’d prefer an m10 where they replaced the reverse galilean viewfinder with an evf, articulated the lcd, and added ibis. basically an improved fuji x-e3.
yes, yes, and yes well, okay. i could do without ibis.

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Originally Posted by splitimageview View Post
After my Q experience I will never buy a digital Leica.
After my Q experience I would buy a 50mm version in a heartbeat.

Quote:
Originally Posted by ptpdprinter View Post
I am not very impressed with adapted lenses on mirrorless cameras in general. Focusing for me is too iffy to feel confident. And focus peaking is sort of dodgy.
My experience with M-system 35mm through 75mm lenses on the new CL is positive. Higher in-focus rates at close-to-mid distance wide open (f/1.4 to f/2) with the CL versus rangefinder. I feel the focus peaking implementation on the CL is quite good, whereas the FP on my Fuji X bodies and the Sony A bodies I've tried made me unhappy. Generally, focus peaking for me works best for normal to tele length lenses shooting wide open or nearly so. Focus peaking with wide lenses stopped down is frustrating. Better to use zone or hyperfocal focus methods with wides, turning off FP.
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Old 05-30-2018   #23
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After my Q experience I would buy a 50mm version in a heartbeat.
With the 50mm SL lens on it?
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Old 05-30-2018   #24
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An M body with AF sounds wonderful to me. Now if they could just figure out how to put an OVF in with that EVF. They could call it a "hybrid" and....

Oh. Never mind.
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Old 05-30-2018   #25
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With the 50mm SL lens on it?
No, no, no - that thing is a beast and priced beyond me anyway. My wish is for a Q II with a fixed compact 50, say f/1.7 or f/1.8, kind of a twin to the Lux 28/1.7 on the current Q.
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Old 05-30-2018   #26
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No, no, no - that thing is a beast and priced beyond me anyway. My wish is for a Q II with a fixed compact 50, say f/1.7 or f/1.8, kind of a twin to the Lux 28/1.7 on the current Q.
Then Leica has some work to do.
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Old 05-30-2018   #27
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Then Leica has some work to do.
Exactly right. And why for me it's nothing but a wish. I'm old. I am fond of those fixed lens RFs from 40+ years ago. Still have one. Twin Q cameras, one 28 and one 50, and I'm real good for a whole lot of stuff I shoot. From the Q wide open in New Orleans:


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Old 05-30-2018   #28
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As long as you are not picky about image quality as Sony uses much thicker sensor cover glass than Leica.
bingo. sony is not interested in meeting the requirements of rangefinder lenses.

a more compact l-mount body that has a rangefinder-style evf and a range of smaller lenses would be nice, but it'll never be quite as nice as a similar m-mount body.
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Old 05-30-2018   #29
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Agree 100%. I think if they created a Q with L mount and smaller lenses it would be a big hit.
Not according to Jono Slack … and he should know

https://www.l-camera-forum.com/topic...ent/?p=3528463

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Old 05-31-2018   #30
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As long as you are not picky about image quality as Sony uses much thicker sensor cover glass than Leica.

Goodness …. I mustn`t be picky then.
I was shooting at a low light event with an A7 and ZM C Sonnar this week …. a friend had a 10 and a Noct.
The A7 did more than ok.

I`d be interested in seeing what Leica come up with though with this new model.
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Old 05-31-2018   #31
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Goodness …. I mustn`t be picky then.
I was shooting at a low light event with an A7 and ZM C Sonnar this week …. a friend had a 10 and a Noct.
The A7 did more than ok.

I`d be interested in seeing what Leica come up with though with this new model.
Nice combo, A7 and ZM Sonnar. How did you set up the Sony's EVF for manual focus? Work well for you?

It's the wide lenses that generally have IQ problems due to the thicker sensor cover glass, and more in the corners than center, I've read. Depending on subject, may not be an issue.
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Old 05-31-2018   #32
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Not according to Jono Slack … and he should know

https://www.l-camera-forum.com/topic...ent/?p=3528463

dunk


… and more of Jono's wisdom

https://www.l-camera-forum.com/topic...ent/?p=3528909

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Old 05-31-2018   #33
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I don't know who Jono Slack is and why he's relevant to this conversation. It looks like another old guy speculating behind a computer screen.
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Old 05-31-2018   #34
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Just a couple of personal notes:

1st: I love my M10
2nd: no more gear budget available

robert

PS: but nice and interesting to see Leica active, let's see what comes, as already someone said hopefully not a "see too" camera
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Old 05-31-2018   #35
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digital G2 ( Contax ) will be perfect !
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Old 05-31-2018   #36
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I don't know who Jono Slack is and why he's relevant to this conversation. It looks like another old guy speculating behind a computer screen.
Jono is a beta tester for Leica and very well connected at Leica
He is well respected in the Leica world, and given his credentials, what he has to say is more than relevant to this conversation
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Old 06-01-2018   #37
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Jono is a beta tester for Leica and very well connected at Leica
He is well respected in the Leica world, and given his credentials, what he has to say is more than relevant to this conversation
I’m a beta tester for Apple and have friends that work at the Apple store and I don’t get invited to iOS developement meetings. My point being, he is a beta tester. He is not a market analyst for them. He tests equipment for them that THEY think will do well.
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Old 06-01-2018   #38
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is anyone else hoping that the c-m turns out to be a beautiful little bar of soap like the original cm? it could be the new contax t3. it could be what the x should have been: a full frame sensor compact with a 35mm f/2.8 fully retractable lens, fixed evf, sleek design. forget the interchangeable lens stuff!
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Old 06-01-2018   #39
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is anyone else hoping that the c-m turns out to be a beautiful little bar of soap like the original cm? it could be the new contax t3. it could be what the x should have been: a full frame sensor compact with a 35mm f/2.8 fully retractable lens, fixed evf, sleek design. forget the interchangeable lens stuff!
I would throw my money at Leica so fast for this camera.
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Old 06-01-2018   #40
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I would throw my money at Leica so fast for this camera.
i'd throw it harder and faster if it shot film.
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