How Slow Do You Go?
Old 11-12-2016   #1
sepiareverb
genius and moron
 
sepiareverb's Avatar
 
sepiareverb is offline
Join Date: Feb 2007
Location: St Johnsbury VT
Posts: 8,262
How Slow Do You Go?

I've long been a fan of slow films. I used to shoot Panatomic-X and Agfapan 25 a lot, and these days shoot RPX25, PanF+ and the Rollei Ortho 25. My main gripe with digital is that the lowest speeds on the sensors are too high.

I've just gotten in a 100 foot roll of ORWO Duplicating Film (DP31), and have been running some tests with it. Getting very close to dialing it in, at ISO 6 and developed in FX39 1:14. Was hoping the little extra dilution would give a little bit of compensation, but I will give a try at 1:19 to see if I can tame the contrast a touch more on the next roll.

I used a new (to me) method for figuring out development and ISO, which is quite simple. I cut some 5" strips of the film and punched holes in them. 4 holes in one 5 in the next, on up to 10 holes. I then processed the film in a tray of developer in room light, so complete exposure. Pulled the strip with four holes out at 4 minutes, the 5 hole strip at five minutes, etc.

Stopped, fixed and washed and dried. I read the densities of the various strips to determine my developing time, in this case, with FX39 1:14 I chose 9 minutes. I based this off some density readings of PanF+ that print best here in my darkroom.

Next I loaded up the camera with a roll of DP31 and shot several exposures of each scene, staggering my ISO. I was given a starting ISO of 3 for this film from George at ORWO, so shot at 3 and 6, as a friend thought most duplicating films were closer to ISO 6 in daylight. Just finished running that roll, and 6 does indeed look good (the one pair of frames I shot indoors was much better at ISO3, but that was a 1 second exposure at f1.4). I may try less agitation in an attempt to tame contrast on super sunny days like today, but likely the 1:19 will be a better bet. No prints yet, hoping to have the day to print on Monday.


So, how slow do you go?
  Reply With Quote

Old 11-12-2016   #2
Godfrey
somewhat colored
 
Godfrey's Avatar
 
Godfrey is offline
Join Date: Dec 2011
Posts: 8,959
I recently received my order of "Washi film W" ... ten rolls of orthochromatic emulsion coated on Japanese paper, cut and spooled for 120 format cameras. ISO 25 daylight, ISO 12 in tungsten light.

I haven't had time yet to experiment and shoot any, but that will be coming up.

G
  Reply With Quote

Old 11-12-2016   #3
sepiareverb
genius and moron
 
sepiareverb's Avatar
 
sepiareverb is offline
Join Date: Feb 2007
Location: St Johnsbury VT
Posts: 8,262
I've been curious about that Washi stuff as well. I look forward to seeing what you get!
  Reply With Quote

Old 11-12-2016   #4
Mackinaw
Think Different
 
Mackinaw is offline
Join Date: Mar 2005
Location: One hour south of the Mackinaw Bridge
Posts: 3,505
I've been using Harman Direct Positive photo paper in my 4X5 which has an ISO of 3. I've had my best results shooting at an ISO of 1.6.

Jim B.
__________________
My fancy-schmancy gallery:
http://snowcountryphotography.com

My RFF Gallery:
http://www.rangefinderforum.com/phot...user=1453&sl=m
  Reply With Quote

Old 11-12-2016   #5
gb hill
Registered User
 
gb hill's Avatar
 
gb hill is offline
Join Date: Sep 2006
Location: North Carolina
Age: 59
Posts: 5,872
I love to shoot 100 speed films. Just developed a roll of Pan F now waiting to be scanned. The FPP Store has some really slow films that are already re spooled. I bought a C-41 kit from these guys & in the package came 2 rolls of Kodak Vision 3 35mm motion picture film 50D. Has a rim jet on it but is very east to get off during development.

They also have some low B&W films I want to try. ISO 6. Nice thing about their store is no set amount you have to buy.

http://filmphotographyproject.com/st...low-iso-1-roll
__________________
Greg
flickr
Bessa R & L
  Reply With Quote

Old 11-12-2016   #6
Pentode
Registered User
 
Pentode's Avatar
 
Pentode is offline
Join Date: Nov 2016
Location: Brooklyn, NY
Posts: 182
I used to shoot Tech Pan a lot, but haven't in a number of years. I always liked it.

I took a few years off from shooting and, when I came back, Pan-X was off the market and I never really tried to find a replacement. I'm fond of slow films, in general, so maybe I should look into finding my 'new' Tech Pan.
  Reply With Quote

Old 11-12-2016   #7
Tom A
RFF Sponsor
 
Tom A's Avatar
 
Tom A is offline
Join Date: Sep 2006
Location: Vancouver, BC, Canada
Age: 75
Posts: 6,074

H 009 #5 M2 and Zeiss Distagon 35mm f1.4 by T&T and Mr B Abrahamsson, on Flickr
Kodak 5369 movie duplicating film. Nominal speed - 0,5 iso!!!. Developed in a homemade Delagi D8 developer for 18 min. Resolution is supposed to be 1000 lp/mm - taxes even the Zeiss Macro Planar 50mm f2.0. Exposure was 120 sec at f22.
  Reply With Quote

Old 11-12-2016   #8
Jerevan
Recycled User
 
Jerevan's Avatar
 
Jerevan is offline
Join Date: Mar 2006
Location: Germany
Posts: 1,118
It sort of depends. It gets a bit funny (to me) doing tripod work with small format. Since you have to schlepp around more equipment, then why not get a bigger size?

Maybe I am just being odd, since in the 1930s, films weren't all that fast. Leicas were a big thing and people got around slow speeds with ... tripods.

Pan F+ is as slow as I go, unless using paper (iso 3). Mostly using Ilford Fp4+ at iso 64-80.
  Reply With Quote

Old 11-12-2016   #9
sepiareverb
genius and moron
 
sepiareverb's Avatar
 
sepiareverb is offline
Join Date: Feb 2007
Location: St Johnsbury VT
Posts: 8,262
I'm shooting this ISO 6 today, on a clear cold sunny day. Exposures are in the f1.8 to 3.5 at 1/60 range. Even at 1/30 I can hand hold without worry, down to 1/8 often if I'm really careful and shoot a few frames as insurance. I stick to inanimate objects tho.

I'm curious to see what this looks like Tom, this stuff is listed as Similar to Eastman 3366, which I've never seen. I'm expecting it to be crazy fine grained.
  Reply With Quote

Old 11-12-2016   #10
sepiareverb
genius and moron
 
sepiareverb's Avatar
 
sepiareverb is offline
Join Date: Feb 2007
Location: St Johnsbury VT
Posts: 8,262
The direct positive paper is great stuff, but as slow as any of us can probably go! I did a lot of cameraless work with it a few years ago, is it back in production finally?

There is the ADOX CMS 2 which seems Tech-Pan like. I just pulled out some of that today as well, will give it a go tomorrow. I tried the first version, but didn't get along with it well. I'm hoping this new developer is as much better as I've heard. I do like supporting ADOX, great papers in their catalog as well as films and chemistry.
  Reply With Quote

Old 11-12-2016   #11
sepiareverb
genius and moron
 
sepiareverb's Avatar
 
sepiareverb is offline
Join Date: Feb 2007
Location: St Johnsbury VT
Posts: 8,262
Forgot about Photography Film Project, thanks for the reminder!
  Reply With Quote

Old 11-12-2016   #12
Bill Clark
Registered User
 
Bill Clark's Avatar
 
Bill Clark is offline
Join Date: Dec 2004
Location: Minnetonka, Minnesota
Age: 71
Posts: 2,500
I like Pan F Plus but I also think TMax 100 is a pretty nice film.

Cute story, I called a friend, in his 90s, asked how things were and he said, "Bill, things are so slow that by the time I get the breakfast dishes washed, I'm ready for lunch!"
__________________
I make photographs as a return ticket to a moment otherwise gone.
  Reply With Quote

Old 11-12-2016   #13
skopar steve
Registered User
 
skopar steve's Avatar
 
skopar steve is offline
Join Date: Oct 2013
Location: New Hampshire
Posts: 389
Pan F + is as slow as I go now. Liked Kodachrome 25 when it was around.
  Reply With Quote

Old 11-14-2016   #14
Fotohuis
Registered User
 
Fotohuis's Avatar
 
Fotohuis is offline
Join Date: Oct 2007
Location: the Netherlands, sometimes Ukraine
Posts: 1,807
Efke 25 / Rollei PAN 25. Then the typical micro films from Agfa Gevaert: CMS 20/ ATP1,1 / Copex. E.I. 10-20. But then you need a suitable low contrast type developer.

Best results with the Fotokemika Efke 25 I had with Beutler or FX-1.
Good results with ATP1.1 I had with Film Low Gamma/Rollei Low Contrast or the ATP-DC (SPUR).



Rollei ATP1,1 in FLG/RLC 1+5 6:30 minutes (20C). Zorki-4K with J-12.
__________________
"De enige beperking in je fotografie ben je zelf"



  Reply With Quote

Old 11-14-2016   #15
BLKRCAT
99% Film
 
BLKRCAT's Avatar
 
BLKRCAT is offline
Join Date: Aug 2012
Location: Toronto
Posts: 1,775
I have gone down to 6iso. Shot a roll of Kodalith of the now removed captain johns seafood boat. Shot with voigtlander 50mm f1.1 at 1.4





__________________
TumblrYoutube
  Reply With Quote

Old 11-14-2016   #16
JoeV
Thin Air, Bright Sun
 
JoeV's Avatar
 
JoeV is offline
Join Date: Sep 2006
Location: Albuquerque, NM, USA
Posts: 1,700
Quote:
Originally Posted by sepiareverb View Post
The direct positive paper is great stuff, but as slow as any of us can probably go! I did a lot of cameraless work with it a few years ago, is it back in production finally?

There is the ADOX CMS 2 which seems Tech-Pan like. I just pulled out some of that today as well, will give it a go tomorrow. I tried the first version, but didn't get along with it well. I'm hoping this new developer is as much better as I've heard. I do like supporting ADOX, great papers in their catalog as well as films and chemistry.
Yes, it's back and good as ever.
__________________
"If your eye is clear, your whole body will be full of light"

Inventor of the Light Pipe Array
My Blog
My latest book
  Reply With Quote

Old 11-14-2016   #17
Tom A
RFF Sponsor
 
Tom A's Avatar
 
Tom A is offline
Join Date: Sep 2006
Location: Vancouver, BC, Canada
Age: 75
Posts: 6,074
[IMG]G377 #2 Orwo TD 21 Rodinal 1:200 by T&T and Mr B Abrahamsson, on Flickr[/IMG]

Orwo Td 21 @ 12 iso in Rodinal 1:200 stand development for 120 min. One "flip" at 60 min. M6 Millennium and Nokton 35mm f1.2 - probably at f1.2 or f1.4.
  Reply With Quote

Old 11-16-2016   #18
sepiareverb
genius and moron
 
sepiareverb's Avatar
 
sepiareverb is offline
Join Date: Feb 2007
Location: St Johnsbury VT
Posts: 8,262
Finally got a print scanned from the DP31.



DP31 at ISO6, run in Adox FX39 1:14. Shot w/M7 and 75/2.0 ASPH
  Reply With Quote

Old 11-16-2016   #19
Ronald M
Registered User
 
Ronald M is offline
Join Date: Aug 2005
Posts: 4,485
Medium speed films reveal the most correct contrast and are a good compromise between speed and grain.

100 is my choice unless I need more speed.
  Reply With Quote

Old 11-16-2016   #20
helenhill
Chasing Shadows ... Light
 
helenhill's Avatar
 
helenhill is offline
Join Date: May 2008
Location: New Yawk
Posts: 5,483
Never went slower than 50 ...
Efke 50 hard to develop for me , seems to scratch easily
Pan F 50 yummy good
__________________
Flickr.

________________________
  Reply With Quote

Old 11-16-2016   #21
giganova
Registered User
 
giganova is offline
Join Date: May 2015
Location: Washington, DC
Posts: 1,322
6 ISO? What can you shoot with this? Nuclear bomb explosions, the interior of the Sun??
  Reply With Quote

Old 11-17-2016   #22
sepiareverb
genius and moron
 
sepiareverb's Avatar
 
sepiareverb is offline
Join Date: Feb 2007
Location: St Johnsbury VT
Posts: 8,262
Quote:
Originally Posted by giganova View Post
6 ISO? What can you shoot with this? Nuclear bomb explosions, the interior of the Sun??
Always good to be prepared.

Actually, it is quite usable on a sunny day. 6 is the 'base' ISO on a film M meter.


Quote:
Originally Posted by helenhill View Post
Pan F 50 yummy good
Indeed!
  Reply With Quote

Old 11-17-2016   #23
Fotohuis
Registered User
 
Fotohuis's Avatar
 
Fotohuis is offline
Join Date: Oct 2007
Location: the Netherlands, sometimes Ukraine
Posts: 1,807
Quote:
Efke 50 hard to develop for me , seems to scratch easily
Like Efke 25: Orthopan (Red not very sensible). In regular films that Efke 25 E.I. 32 in Beutler/FX-1 was my top combination.



Printed on Fomabrom Variant 111.
__________________
"De enige beperking in je fotografie ben je zelf"



  Reply With Quote

Old 11-17-2016   #24
Michael Markey
Registered User
 
Michael Markey's Avatar
 
Michael Markey is offline
Join Date: Dec 2008
Location: Blackpool ,England
Age: 68
Posts: 4,046
The slowest film I`ve used was Kodachrome 25.
  Reply With Quote

Old 11-20-2016   #25
GarageBoy
Registered User
 
GarageBoy is offline
Join Date: May 2013
Posts: 751
Ektar 25 for me and I was too young to remember what it looked like
  Reply With Quote

Old 11-20-2016   #26
Greyscale
Registered User
 
Greyscale's Avatar
 
Greyscale is offline
Join Date: Jul 2010
Location: Fort Dodge Iowa
Age: 59
Posts: 4,560
Quote:
Originally Posted by GarageBoy View Post
Ektar 25 for me and I was too young to remember what it looked like
I just shot a roll of that last week, expired in 1979. Rated it at 12 and it is lovely.

__________________
my flickr

My RFF Gallery
  Reply With Quote

Old 11-20-2016   #27
sepiareverb
genius and moron
 
sepiareverb's Avatar
 
sepiareverb is offline
Join Date: Feb 2007
Location: St Johnsbury VT
Posts: 8,262
Ektar 25! Forgot about that one. I almost remember shooting a little of that - 1989?
__________________
-Bob
  Reply With Quote

Old 11-21-2016   #28
Greyscale
Registered User
 
Greyscale's Avatar
 
Greyscale is offline
Join Date: Jul 2010
Location: Fort Dodge Iowa
Age: 59
Posts: 4,560
The Ektar 25 that I used above expired in 1998. and not 1979. My apologies.
__________________
my flickr

My RFF Gallery
  Reply With Quote

Old 11-21-2016   #29
sepiareverb
genius and moron
 
sepiareverb's Avatar
 
sepiareverb is offline
Join Date: Feb 2007
Location: St Johnsbury VT
Posts: 8,262
That was quite a film, had what I'd describe as a digital look today, back then it I thought it was hyper clean.
__________________
-Bob
  Reply With Quote

Old 11-23-2016   #30
Murray Kelly
Registered User
 
Murray Kelly's Avatar
 
Murray Kelly is offline
Join Date: Jan 2007
Location: Brisbane, Australia
Posts: 512
Quote:
Originally Posted by sepiareverb View Post
The direct positive paper is great stuff, but as slow as any of us can probably go! I did a lot of cameraless work with it a few years ago, is it back in production finally?

There is the ADOX CMS 2 which seems Tech-Pan like. I just pulled out some of that today as well, will give it a go tomorrow. I tried the first version, but didn't get along with it well. I'm hoping this new developer is as much better as I've heard. I do like supporting ADOX, great papers in their catalog as well as films and chemistry.
Kodak's progression from Techpan was Imagelink and comes as a slow -HQ and a faster version. There is still the challenge of development to get pictorial tones, however. Like any of the slow film offerings. really. If you don't mind loosing a bit more speed you can try SPUR's specialist developers for this kind of film. Pricey, but. Results can be spectacular - at enormous enlargement. Otherwise, why bother?
  Reply With Quote

Old 11-23-2016   #31
telenous
Registered User
 
telenous is offline
Join Date: Jan 2006
Posts: 1,574
The slowest I've ever tried were a few rolls each of Kodachrome 25 and APX 25. I liked them and even have some photos of personal importance but in truth I preferred faster versions of either (KL200 and APX 100 respectively). Other slowish films I tried for a few rolls and which are no longer around: Agfa Ultra 50, ADOX 50 (I forget which) and a single roll of Tech Pan. During summers I still use some PanF 50. Great film.

.
__________________
- Alkis

flickr
instagram
  Reply With Quote

Old 09-30-2017   #32
sepiareverb
genius and moron
 
sepiareverb's Avatar
 
sepiareverb is offline
Join Date: Feb 2007
Location: St Johnsbury VT
Posts: 8,262
Been playing around with some Washi-S lately, these at 50 & 32, but I'm going softer with it next time – I think 32 in a compensating developer will get me what I'm after. Waiting for some ID3 & Beutler fixings to come in. Will give the ORWO DP3 a run in these as well.



M5 / 50/1.4 ASPH / yellow filter.
ISO 50, developed in Microphen 1:1




MP / 3.5cm/3.5 Elmar LTM
ISO 32, developed in Perceptol 1:1

I really like the look of this film with the old Elmar, especially on a foggy morning!
__________________
-Bob
  Reply With Quote

KODAK 5302 6asa ,Rodinal,v700. Olympus om2n ,50mm f 1.8.
Old 09-30-2017   #33
Dayrell bishop
Registered User
 
Dayrell bishop is offline
Join Date: Oct 2012
Location: Essex England
Age: 62
Posts: 879
KODAK 5302 6asa ,Rodinal,v700. Olympus om2n ,50mm f 1.8.

Looks very retro , had to use a tipod.
  Reply With Quote

Old 09-30-2017   #34
css9450
Registered User
 
css9450's Avatar
 
css9450 is offline
Join Date: Mar 2007
Location: Chicago
Posts: 1,843
I grew up on Kodachrome 25 and 64, and later Provia 100. When I started dabbling in B&W with classic cameras, Ilford XP2 seemed a good choice because I could get it processed easily. However, at ASA 400 it seemed right at the far end of what many of my old cameras were able to shoot at, and even then, sometimes it was cumbersome to do so. Ever try finding f16 on something like a Jupiter-12?

So my best option was to return to my H.S. days of developing film at home, something I hadn't done since 1980. Now I use Delta 100, and I can shoot at apertures more toward the middle of each lens' range. Heck, I can even make the background go out of focus now! That was something which required a LOT of stops off of Sunny 16 to do with XP2...

Next step on this slippery slope will be to try some Pan F at ASA 50!
__________________
Nikon S2, S3, F, F2, F3, FM2, FA, N90S, D80, D7000, D750, Sony a6000, Canon IIf, Leica CL, Tower type 3, Zorki 4, Vito B, Perkeo II, Rollei 35....
  Reply With Quote

Old 09-30-2017   #35
sepiareverb
genius and moron
 
sepiareverb's Avatar
 
sepiareverb is offline
Join Date: Feb 2007
Location: St Johnsbury VT
Posts: 8,262
Was gonna ask about a tripod Dayrell.

Kodachrome 25 was a favorite of mine too.
__________________
-Bob
  Reply With Quote

Old 09-30-2017   #36
Doug
Moderator
 
Doug's Avatar
 
Doug is offline
Join Date: Sep 2003
Location: Pacific NW, USA
Posts: 12,930
Quote:
Originally Posted by css9450 View Post
When I started dabbling in B&W with classic cameras, Ilford XP2 seemed a good choice because I could get it processed easily. However, at ASA 400 it seemed right at the far end of what many of my old cameras were able to shoot at, and even then, sometimes it was cumbersome to do so.
Shooting XP2 at EI 400 is "pushing it" in my experience, on the ragged edge of underexposure. I favored running it at 250 for better shadow detail and contrast, but it's entirely usable at 100 as well. That could ease your usage inconvenience...
__________________
Doug’s Gallery
RFF on Facebook
  Reply With Quote

Old 09-30-2017   #37
Nokton48
Registered User
 
Nokton48's Avatar
 
Nokton48 is offline
Join Date: Dec 2006
Posts: 5,178
I bought a case of 120 Ilford Pan F+ years ago, from Jim Andracki at Midwest Photo. I was in the basement and he offered it to me for buck a roll which seemed like a great deal at the time. It's still in my deep freeze in the studio.
  Reply With Quote

Old 09-30-2017   #38
sepiareverb
genius and moron
 
sepiareverb's Avatar
 
sepiareverb is offline
Join Date: Feb 2007
Location: St Johnsbury VT
Posts: 8,262
Quote:
Originally Posted by Nokton48 View Post
I bought a case of 120 Ilford Pan F+ years ago, from Jim Andracki at Midwest Photo. I was in the basement and he offered it to me for buck a roll which seemed like a great deal at the time. It's still in my deep freeze in the studio.
So 100 or higher for you eh?

I've never thought of 100 as slow, that's normal in my bag. 400? That's that fast stuff
__________________
-Bob
  Reply With Quote

Old 09-30-2017   #39
Ko.Fe.
Kostya Fedot
 
Ko.Fe.'s Avatar
 
Ko.Fe. is offline
Join Date: Jul 2013
Location: MiltON.ONtario
Posts: 7,099
...

ISO five. Details here:

Summicron, Leica. by Kostya Fedot, on Flickr

ISO 12.5 on film:


Random Canadians. by Kostya Fedot, on Flickr
  Reply With Quote

Old 09-30-2017   #40
Rob-F
Likes Leicas
 
Rob-F's Avatar
 
Rob-F is offline
Join Date: Mar 2007
Location: The Show Me state
Age: 78
Posts: 5,883
Currently, ISO 100, with Plus-X (I still have some); Ilford Delta 100; and I am trying out some Ilford FP4 in the Hasselblad. I used some Panatomic-X when it was available, but haven't thought to try the Ilford equivalent, Pan F. I'm shakier than I used to be, and so the faster shutter speeds permitted by faster films are more important than they used to be. ISO 100 allows 1/250. 1/500, and faster with reasonable apertures. And the grain stays at or below the threshold of visibility even in an 11 x 14.
__________________
May the light be with you.
  Reply With Quote
Reply


Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

vB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off



All times are GMT -8. The time now is 23:02.


vBulletin skin developed by: eXtremepixels
Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.6.8
Copyright ©2000 - 2019, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.

All content on this site is Copyright Protected and owned by its respective owner. You may link to content on this site but you may not reproduce any of it in whole or part without written consent from its owner.