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-   -   Fuji film price hike in the offing (http://www.rangefinderforum.com/forums/showthread.php?t=167752)

brbo 02-26-2019 00:42

Quote:

Originally Posted by Rob-F (Post 2871781)
Maybe they will announce that the March sales were so good, they don't need to raise the price.

Or there will be so little film left at Fuji that they will raise prices much more (they said 30% was MINIMUM increase) to get even more money from die-hard film fans...

Let's wait and see.

css9450 02-26-2019 03:59

Quote:

Originally Posted by Huss (Post 2871754)
Because they know that Instax is used by people to have fun, goof around. They will lose interest in a hurry if prices of Instax are raised.


I'm already of the opinion that Instax is one of the more expensive formats. Well, maybe its not, because you don't have to send it in for processing, but its price has kept me away from it, even just to try it as a novelty.

Rob-F 02-26-2019 04:14

Well, this is bound to help Ektachrome sales, then, if you can't get Velvia or Provia. Good for Kodak. I do prefer the Fuji colors, though.

Ted Striker 02-26-2019 04:21

Quote:

Originally Posted by css9450 (Post 2871804)
I'm already of the opinion that Instax is one of the more expensive formats. Well, maybe its not, because you don't have to send it in for processing, but its price has kept me away from it, even just to try it as a novelty.


Both my kids have INSTAX cameras. They love shooting film.

brbo 02-26-2019 06:08

Quote:

Originally Posted by Rob-F (Post 2871808)
Well, this is bound to help Ektachrome sales, then, if you can't get Velvia or Provia. Good for Kodak. I do prefer the Fuji colors, though.

I'm afraid Kodak might adjust its prices to match Fuji. Or be just a bit bellow (Kodak needs to sell film, Fuji doesn't).

willie_901 02-26-2019 06:50

What's all this talk about low demand?

Don't people regularly post about non-Instax analog photography growing at exponential rates?

Ted Striker 02-26-2019 07:24

Quote:

Originally Posted by brbo (Post 2871835)
I'm afraid Kodak might adjust its prices to match Fuji. Or be just a bit bellow (Kodak needs to sell film, Fuji doesn't).


It would have been nice to attach film's future to a stable healthy company like Fujifilm. That would have been for the best. However, Fujifilm does not have much commitment to film and is clearly heading for the exits. That leaves Kodak for color and E6 film. It's hard to imagine a more unstable company (CEO just left after he sold of the most profitable part of the company), but that's what we have.

jawarden 02-26-2019 07:59

Quote:

Originally Posted by willie_901 (Post 2871841)
What's all this talk about low demand?

Don't people regularly post about non-Instax analog photography growing at exponential rates?

Exponential? I don't know who's saying that. All I've read from manufacturers and fans alike are modest gains after hitting the painful bottom. In Kodak's case the lifeline of new interest is sufficient to reintroduce discontinued products and invest in quality marketing, but not enough for similar news from Fuji, who could be forgiven for wishing to focus on other areas of their business.

When people talk about low demand they're almost always looking to the past for a comparison rather than looking to the future. The correction that happened with digital cams and phones is still happening and the market has no choice but to right-size. Small players like Ferrania might be well suited to the future of film because their cost to produce film is matched to a smaller facility and smaller workforce that produces less product. (Perhaps the right amount of product, but I don't know.)

Fuji and Kodak have a more complex puzzle to solve due to existing facilities and a workforce designed to produce far more volume than is likely to be needed in the future. (Just my opinion.) That can work for a while but when those facilities need upkeep it can be an expensive dealbreaker. I'm hoping the challenges can be met by Fuji and Kodak because it would be a shame to lose all that history and talent those companies hold.

Uncle Bill 02-26-2019 09:24

I'm going to be the contrarian, I think Fujifilm is managing their exit strategy with their film business. Fujifilm Canada no longer lists or carries traditional film stocks in their distribution centre. There is speculation out there that Fujifilm is cruising on master rolls kept in cold storage and have not been making traditional film for some years now.

With the re-introduction of Ektachrome in 35mm and later on 120, I don't really have a reason to buy Fujifilm products and I'm spoiled for choice when it comes to black and white films and I would rather support film manufacturers who in turn support and engage with the film photography community.

roscoetuff 02-26-2019 09:25

"Ted" is close to right, but it's not cost that's driving Fuji so much as desire to kill off the market and profit on its shrinking size the same way cigarette manufacturers did. This is the reverse of product introduction where you cut prices as the market increases. Here, they just ride the curve back up and allow higher prices to shrink demand. It works and it is very profitable, but that doesn't change the objective of exiting this end of the film business.

dourbalistar 02-26-2019 11:44

Quote:

Originally Posted by CharlesDAMorgan (Post 2871782)
Aargh.......

You can groan and Pan F you want, but like the OP said, it's not time for braying like wounded donkeys. We have T-MAXimize and stock up before prices increase!

jawarden 02-26-2019 13:22

Quote:

Originally Posted by Uncle Bill (Post 2871864)
I'm going to be the contrarian, I think Fujifilm is managing their exit strategy with their film business.

I don't think that's all that contrarian - lots of folks think Fuji is on the way out and Fuji has given plenty of reasons to suspect as much.

Kodak claims they worked on the efficiency of their production line so they could reintroduce Ektachrome (for instance) profitably, and I imagine that took some investment and creativity on their part. If Fuji isn't interested in investing in their lines and if Kodak doesn't follow their pricing lead I don't know how Fuji will be able to continue selling the newly expensive Provia in April. I would think their volume would go through the floor. We'll see.

dourbalistar 02-26-2019 15:48

It's hard to peel apart Fujifilm's intentions. We'll just have to Washi and see. If they exit the film business, Fujifilm users may have to Kodak to the drawing board.

maigo 02-26-2019 17:14

Fuji film price hike in the offing
 
If you are waiting for Fujifilm to develop new film products you should stop and fix your mind on a new supplier.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

dourbalistar 02-26-2019 17:49

We can't dwell on the negative. Maybe Fujifilm will stop the downward slide. We can't count on corporate transparency, but if we are Lucky, there will be a reversal.

pyeh 02-26-2019 19:48

Fuji-sus sake, will you stop it already!

dourbalistar 02-26-2019 20:02

Quote:

Originally Posted by pyeh (Post 2871994)
Fuji-sus sake, will you stop it already!

Haha, good one, I'm Rollei on the floor laughing! Though, come April 1st, I'm afraid the joke will be on us.

Rob-F 02-26-2019 23:55

Well, I think Fuji's plan is an Aberration, and a Distortion of proper marketing. They are Exposing themselves to criticism, and their thinking is Underdeveloped. I think they should Rewind. If they keep this up, they will only sprocket themselves.

DanskDynamit 02-27-2019 00:48

its time to stock up... Kodak and Ilford films. **** fuji.

Rayt 02-27-2019 01:36

Japan is the hardest country in the world to fire employees. Companies can’t lay off people just because a particular unit is unprofitable. So decisions need to be long term because once a company is committed to say another run of a particular product line it needs to ensure its capacities are fully utilised. And people’s jobs can’t be legally liquidated like other assets such as production lines or raw materials. HR is a factor in any business decision.

michaelwj 02-27-2019 01:50

Fujifilm is a huge company, imaging (film and digital) account for 16% of this revenue. Of this, 33% is digital (5% of total) and film is the remaining 67% (11% of the total). Most of that film is instax (and instax cameras), it doesn’t leave much space for traditional film. In fact they don’t even mention film in their financial documents. I doubt they’ve made any for ages, and are just increasing the price as it runs out. Based on all that, they’re not a viable solution for traditional film.

https://www.fujifilmholdings.com/en/...nce/index.html
https://www.fujifilmholdings.com/en/...2018q4_001.pdf

michaelwj 02-27-2019 01:57

Maybe they’re just sick of storing the stuff and want it gone. I can see the board meeting now: “we told them we were going to raise the prices by 20% and they didn’t stock up, let’s tell them we’re going to raise it all by 30% and see if they stock up this time!”

steveyork 02-27-2019 03:17

Seems that when they stopped marketing B&W film they signaled their long term intentions.

Ted Striker 02-27-2019 03:32

Quote:

Originally Posted by steveyork (Post 2872046)
Seems that when they stopped marketing B&W film they signaled their long term intentions.


Yes, absolutely right. The minute Fujifilm started cutting their core product line, I knew that they had lost all commitment to non INSTAX film.


Some think that a new $10 brochure and a web page that took all of a week to make signifies a new commitment to film, but the facts say otherwise.

brbo 02-27-2019 03:59

They didn't even bother to include their patented "Fuji stays fully committed to film" that accompanied their previous announcements of discontinued film products or price increases.

Now, they end their press releases with ominous "Fujifilm will continue to study the market demand, and make adjustments to product assortment...". Since higher prices will inevitably bring lower demand we can begin to speculate what film will get the axe next...

michaelwj 02-27-2019 04:06

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ted Striker (Post 2871811)
Both my kids have INSTAX cameras. They love shooting film.

My daughter too, she burns a pack a week usually and loves it.

I think it’s the perfect camera for kids. She has learned more about composition and lighting in a week than she did in a year shooting with a P&S digital. The developing time makes the feedback almost immediate, with just enough of a delay to get disappointed when it doesn’t work like you imagined and just enough cost to make you do better the next time.

Ted Striker 02-27-2019 04:15

Quote:

Originally Posted by brbo (Post 2872053)
They didn't even bother to include their patented "Fuji stays fully committed to film" that accompanied their previous announcements of discontinued film products or price increases.

Now, they end their press releases with ominous "Fujifilm will continue to study the market demand, and make adjustments to product assortment...". Since higher prices will inevitably bring lower demand we can begin to speculate what film will get the axe next...


I think most people now fully understand that Fujifilm is exiting the traditional film market. Read over at DPR at the comment section for this story. It's 90% or more anti-Fujifilm. People used to think that they stood behind their words and were committed to film. No more.

Ted Striker 02-27-2019 04:15

Quote:

Originally Posted by michaelwj (Post 2872056)
My daughter too, she burns a pack a week usually and loves it.

I think itís the perfect camera for kids. She has learned more about composition and lighting in a week than she did in a year shooting with a P&S digital. The developing time makes the feedback almost immediate, with just enough of a delay to get disappointed when it doesnít work like you imagined and just enough cost to make you do better the next time.


100% agreed!

Larry Cloetta 02-27-2019 04:49

Quote:

Originally Posted by michaelwj (Post 2872030)
............... In fact they donít even mention film in their financial documents. I doubt theyíve made any for ages, and are just increasing the price as it runs out. Based on all that, theyíre not a viable solution for traditional film.

https://www.fujifilmholdings.com/en/...nce/index.html
https://www.fujifilmholdings.com/en/...2018q4_001.pdf

It would seem to me that itís a personal decision whether or not Fuji is a viable solution for film, a decision which should be based upon whether we prefer a Fuji film stock to any of the alternatives or not. And not a decision based on raw emotion (vide ď**** Fuji!Ē If I prefer a Fuji emulsion to any available alternative, itís the only viable solution for me.

I loved ACROS, and bought all I could afford and froze it. But, there are a couple of other available, quite different, emulsions I enjoy using as well, so I wonít quit shooting B&W when all my ACROS is gone. On the other hand, there is no digital sensor equivalent, nor is there a film emulation equivalent for either Velvia or Provia (imo, not going to argue about it here). Nor have I been that thrilled with my results from the new Ektachrome so far. So, if I want the ďlookĒ of Velvia or Provia, itís Ektachrome and digital color which are not ďviableĒ. (I am not saying I donít think digital color renditions can be excellent, only saying that, if you like Fuji reversal films, they are the only game in town, as even the Fuji digital emulations of same donít come very close at all. At this point, anyway.)

As much as I love Fuji transparency films as a tool, Iíve got a price point at which I will probably give up transparency film and default mostly to digital color, with a smattering of Ektar and 400H here and there, about both of which Iím ambivalent as digital emulations of these two are pretty close.

A 30% price hike is a toll I am unlikely to pay, love or no love. Thereís a limit, and thatís likely it, for me.
So, I just bought as much Velvia and Provia as I could afford, which in 4x5 wasnít that much, and will fill the freezer. When itís gone, itís gone. sic transit gloria mundi. Far from any desire on my part to ď**** Fuji!Ē, I thank them for giving me the opportunity to use this film, while it lasted:)

johannielscom 02-27-2019 05:06

Seems now is about the right time to put my 50 Fujifilm 120 and 220 rolls up for trade in the classifieds... ;)


Edit: DONE!

AgBrPeter 02-27-2019 05:35

Quote:

Originally Posted by jawarden (Post 2871920)
I don't think that's all that contrarian - lots of folks think Fuji is on the way out and Fuji has given plenty of reasons to suspect as much

Will this also mean that no colour paper will be available to consumers in the future?

Ted Striker 02-27-2019 05:45

Quote:

Originally Posted by AgBrPeter (Post 2872081)
Will this also mean that no colour paper will be available to consumers in the future?


Color paper will be the last survivor in the Fujifilm product line I suspect.

brbo 02-27-2019 06:03

Quote:

Originally Posted by johannielscom (Post 2872074)
Seems now is about the right time to put my 50 Fujifilm 120 and 220 rolls up for trade in the classifieds... ;)


Edit: DONE!

Now is pretty much the worse time. Wait at least till new prices kick in...

edit: Unless your intentions are purely philanthropic in which case why wouldn't you just donate the film? Preferably to me ;)

dourbalistar 02-27-2019 09:22

Quote:

Originally Posted by Rob-F (Post 2872018)
Well, I think Fuji's plan is an Aberration, and a Distortion of proper marketing. They are Exposing themselves to criticism, and their thinking is Underdeveloped. I think they should Rewind. If they keep this up, they will only sprocket themselves.

We can only hope. But the way things are doing, Fujifilm will probably just keep raising prices until they are standing instax of cash.

PaulCooper 02-27-2019 11:26

I've read it here and decided to buy a brick of 35mm Velvia 50. Found the best price (plus shipping) at Unique Photo (USD ~15 a roll. UPS shipping)
Anyway, I himk the days of wanton shooting are over. Not too long ago I had paid $7.00 a roll., or $100 for 100 ft. roll.

dourbalistar 02-27-2019 11:46

Yes, no need to get emulsional, what with rabid Foma at the mouth invectives of **** Fuji. Just go stock up before the price increases.

pyeh 02-27-2019 12:45

We must all Tri-X times harder to encourage Fuji and other manufacturers to keep on producing film. That way we will have a Pan-opoly of choice.

dourbalistar 02-27-2019 13:03

Perhaps current prices are bellow profitability. Digital cameras and smartphones have created a big tilt and shift in the market. Prices may rise and fall as a result.

dourbalistar 02-28-2019 10:24

With all the film discontinuations and price hikes, Fujifilm has done a lot of Harman damage to their name. I know they are a diversified company, but if their film manufacturing division dyes off, they should consider changing their name to simply Fuji.

pyeh 02-28-2019 12:10

We should give Fujifilm greater exposure. ISO want them to keep making film.


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