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-   -   ORWO N75 - new update to N74+ (http://www.rangefinderforum.com/forums/showthread.php?t=169568)

dourbalistar 09-24-2019 11:32

ORWO N75 - new update to N74+
 
Guy Pinhas, Valdas, and CharlesDAMorgan found that ORWO has a new update to their N74+ film, which is now discontinued. N75 is the new version, and has an additional anti-halation undercoat (AHU), and a ISO 320 speed.

I think Guy and Valdas both have some on order from FilmoTec. Please feel free to share image samples and experiences with the new N75 here!

Guy Pinhas 09-24-2019 11:47

I actually got a 400ft bulk of N74 so count me out. That said, I am going to load it soon and see what gives. Will post in the appropriate thread.

CharlesDAMorgan 09-24-2019 11:48

No idea of arrival date from Germany, but we'll see!

valdas 09-24-2019 11:49

I plan to shoot some N75 this weekend (if it arrives on time), so I might be sharing my first results next week.

dourbalistar 09-25-2019 10:32

Quote:

Originally Posted by Guy Pinhas (Post 2914288)
I actually got a 400ft bulk of N74 so count me out. That said, I am going to load it soon and see what gives. Will post in the appropriate thread.

400 feet is a lot of N74! I'm near the end of my first 100-foot bulk roll. Look forward to see your images in the other thread.

Quote:

Originally Posted by CharlesDAMorgan (Post 2914289)
No idea of arrival date from Germany, but we'll see!

Quote:

Originally Posted by valdas (Post 2914290)
I plan to shoot some N75 this weekend (if it arrives on time), so I might be sharing my first results next week.

Charles and Valdas, happy shooting and let us know how you get along with the new N75!

p.s. Somebody, anybody, should try to shoot some ORWO N75 in a Nikon N75. :p

valdas 09-26-2019 10:44

Well, it is funny, it's still iso 400 on the box...


CharlesDAMorgan 09-26-2019 11:45

So it's printed on, so can't be some labelling hangover from the last cans. How funny!

dourbalistar 09-26-2019 11:56

Interesting, thanks, Valdas! The Technical Information datasheet that Guy sent me specifically notes ISO 320:

Quote:

Exposure index: ISO 320 / 26 - The speed value refers to a developed N75 average gradient of 0.65. The exact exposure index depends on the prevailing shooting and processing conditions. Special feature of light meters, shooting conditions, planned artistic effects and deliberate processing changes are to be taken into account in setting the lens aperture. Rehearsal screen tests are recommended.
I guess it's time for rehearsal screen tests by our forum members here! Or maybe they just took the average of the daylight and tungsten ratings. :D

valdas 09-26-2019 12:51

Quote:

Originally Posted by dourbalistar (Post 2914631)
Interesting, thanks, Valdas! The Technical Information datasheet that Guy sent me specifically notes ISO 320:



I guess it's time for rehearsal screen tests by our forum members here! Or maybe they just took the average of the daylight and tungsten ratings. :D

Yes, I have the datasheet, it says 320. It’s probably mistake on the box... but... time to shoot and test it!

CharlesDAMorgan 10-07-2019 02:29

After going all round the country my N75 has just started its return journey to Germany without ever hitting my mail box.

The importer is clearly running things in an amateur way, not giving tracking numbers and taking days to reply to queries so I'm canning this experiment pro tem. A shame but there we are.

Guy Pinhas 10-07-2019 03:37

Man, that's too bad :(

valdas 10-07-2019 06:02

I have now shot and developed two rolls. There is really nothing to show so far :) I developed the first roll in xtol stock, but it seems the development time was a bit too short (7.30 min). The second one I shot in the bracketing mode (-1/+1 EV) and developed for 9 min. I guess it was a bit too long (maybe 8.30 is the way forward), but shots from both under and over exposures were quite usable.

Guy Pinhas 10-07-2019 07:21

Quote:

Originally Posted by valdas (Post 2916760)
I have now shot and developed two rolls. There is really nothing to show so far :) I developed the first roll in xtol stock, but it seems the development time was a bit too short (7.30 min). The second one I shot in the bracketing mode (-1/+1 EV) and developed for 9 min. I guess it was a bit too long (maybe 8.30 is the way forward), but shots from both under and over exposures were quite usable.

Could you post one of each? Just super curious, that's all :)

valdas 10-07-2019 07:48

Quote:

Originally Posted by Guy Pinhas (Post 2916772)
Could you post one of each? Just super curious, that's all :)

I will post some test photos tonight.

valdas 10-07-2019 11:01

As promised, posting some first images from ORWO N75 test roll. I already mentioned that first two rolls were a bit of failure. I guess my second roll was overdeveloped, so contrast/grain was not what I hoped for. On the other hand, the shooting was in quite high contrast light conditions which did not help. But I will keep on experimenting fine-tuning developing techniques, maybe will try another developer. Those three shots below were shot in bracketing mode - at box speed, + and - 1EV. Canon eos300, 40mm/2.8 lens. Xtol stock. 9 min.


Guy Pinhas 10-07-2019 11:12

Thank you!

dourbalistar 10-10-2019 15:39

Interesting results, Valdas, thanks for sharing! Look forward to seeing some more results.

Perhaps in related news, Lomography is launching pre-orders for their Berlin Kino "2019 Edition". Any bets that it's re-badged N75? Their development chart lists an oddly specific development time of 8 minutes and 7 seconds for HC-110(B).

https://shop.lomography.com/en/lomog...ack?country=us
https://kosmofoto.com/2019/10/lomogr...lin-kino-film/
https://www.dpreview.com/news/665356...9-edition-film

Freakscene 10-10-2019 20:58

Quote:

Originally Posted by dourbalistar (Post 2917529)
Interesting results, Valdas, thanks for sharing! Look forward to seeing some more results.

Perhaps in related news, Lomography is launching pre-orders for their Berlin Kino "2019 Edition". Any bets that it's re-badged N75? Their development chart lists an oddly specific development time of 8 minutes and 7 seconds for HC-110(B).

https://shop.lomography.com/en/lomog...ack?country=us
https://kosmofoto.com/2019/10/lomogr...lin-kino-film/
https://www.dpreview.com/news/665356...9-edition-film

That’s a guaranteed typo. 8’07” is not functionally different compared to 8’00”.

Marty

dourbalistar 10-10-2019 21:26

1 Attachment(s)
Quote:

Originally Posted by Freakscene (Post 2917559)
That’s a guaranteed typo. 8’07” is not functionally different compared to 8’00”.

Marty

Seeing as it's Lomography, it might be a typo or it might not be. Just like the film, who knows? ;) They also call "distillation" instead of "dilution"...

https://microsites.lomography.com/do...19_formula.pdf

ChrisPlatt 10-11-2019 01:19

Seems like an odd degree of precision for a crowd that sandpapers their lenses...

Chris

valdas 10-11-2019 01:24

Oh, now I am pretty sure my poor results are due to the lack of this precision :)

Mats 10-29-2019 03:16

How do you order from Filmotec? I looked at the site and there is no obvious way, do you just email Hr Frank Böhme?

Maybe the 8' 7" is just recalculated D76 times (or D96) with some kind of formula? I noticed it too, I wonder what made them publish that.

valdas 10-29-2019 03:21

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mats (Post 2920799)
How do you order from Filmotec? I looked at the site and there is no obvious way, do you just email Hr Frank Böhme?

Maybe the 8' 7" is just recalculated D76 times (or D96) with some kind of formula? I noticed it too, I wonder what made them publish that.

Just email them to the general mail address. That’s what I did. They will send you the price list and invoice once you confirm what you want. The payment is to their bank account. It’s fast and free of charge in SEPA area.

Mugn 10-30-2019 09:23

What are the prices on the films?

valdas 10-30-2019 11:15

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mugn (Post 2921053)
What are the prices on the films?

N75 35mm/122m 213,02 EUR/roll

N75 35mm/30,5m 58,58 EUR/roll

Plus VAT plus shipping.

valdas 11-07-2019 10:57

some more tests, this time shot with MF camera GA645, in artificial light (xtol stock, 8min 30 sec):


dourbalistar 11-07-2019 11:51

Quote:

Originally Posted by valdas (Post 2922525)
some more tests, this time shot with MF camera GA645, in artificial light (xtol stock, 8min 30 sec):

Wow, thanks for posting that sample, Valdas! The grain looks very clean on that, dare I say minimal. Personally, I found N74+ to be quite a grainy for an ISO 400 film. Also interesting that there are no edge markings.

valdas 11-07-2019 12:08

Quote:

Originally Posted by dourbalistar (Post 2922531)
Wow, thanks for posting that sample, Valdas! The grain looks very clean on that, dare I say minimal. Personally, I found N74+ to be quite a grainy for an ISO 400 film. Also interesting that there are no edge markings.


I can tell you one thing regarding the grain - it’s because of a scanner. This one is scanned with the Epson V700 and for some reason (because of lower resolution?) flatbed scanner gives less pronounced grain compared to my dedicated Coolscan. Edge markings - it’s there, but not visible on every frame because edges are also exposed and markings “disappear”.

dourbalistar 11-07-2019 12:58

Quote:

Originally Posted by valdas (Post 2922535)
I can tell you one thing regarding the grain - it’s because of a scanner. This one is scanned with the Epson V700 and for some reason (because of lower resolution?) flatbed scanner gives less pronounced grain compared to my dedicated Coolscan. Edge markings - it’s there, but not visible on every frame because edges are also exposed and markings “disappear”.

Ah, yes, that makes sense. When I used to scan with a flatbed (CanoScan 8800F), I did find the grain to be less apparent, probably because it "mushed out" with the lower resolution. Now I "scan" using an APS-C digicam, and the grain seems more apparent because it much resolves more clearly compared to a flatbed.

Compared to N74+, do you find the grain to be finer with N75?

valdas 11-07-2019 13:20

Quote:

Originally Posted by dourbalistar (Post 2922549)
Ah, yes, that makes sense. When I used to scan with a flatbed (CanoScan 8800F), I did find the grain to be less apparent, probably because it "mushed out" with the lower resolution. Now I "scan" using an APS-C digicam, and the grain seems more apparent because it much resolves more clearly compared to a flatbed.

Compared to N74+, do you find the grain to be finer with N75?

Well, I did not have a chance to shoot on N74+ so I can’t really compare.

valdas 11-24-2019 06:51

Some more tests with ORWO N75: xtol stock 8.30, Yashica 24mm lens. This is small size file, but even scanned with Nikon Coolscan grain looks very reasonable:


Freakscene 11-24-2019 13:28

Quote:

Originally Posted by valdas (Post 2925726)
Some more tests with ORWO N75: xtol stock 8.30, Yashica 24mm lens. This is small size file, but even scanned with Nikon Coolscan grain looks very reasonable:

It looks good. Is this the new ‘made in the USA’ Xtol or the old ‘made in Germany’ product?

Marty

valdas 11-24-2019 13:52

Quote:

Originally Posted by Freakscene (Post 2925762)
It looks good. Is this the new ‘made in the USA’ Xtol or the old ‘made in Germany’ product?

Marty

I am still using the old one and have quite a lot of it in my inventory :)

Freakscene 11-24-2019 14:36

Quote:

Originally Posted by valdas (Post 2925765)
I am still using the old one and have quite a lot of it in my inventory :)

Ok, thanks, I do too, just interested.

Marty

valdas 12-04-2019 10:26

It seems to me that the grain of this new ORWO is really reasonable - if exposure, developer, temperature, agitation are right, it can give quite OK grain. And I did not try any fine grain developers yet...

Rollei 35 S, xtol stock 8:[email protected] 20C


dourbalistar 12-04-2019 19:02

Quote:

Originally Posted by valdas (Post 2927479)
It seems to me that the grain of this new ORWO is really reasonable - if exposure, developer, temperature, agitation are right, it can give quite OK grain. And I did not try any fine grain developers yet...

Rollei 35 S, xtol stock 8:[email protected] 20C

Looks great, Valdas!

On a side note, are you noticing problems with scratches on your negatives? I think I see one running vertically along the right third of the frame, starting above the handkerchief. I ask because I had scratches on a lot of my N74+ negatives, except mine showed up as black on my scans. It's not camera related, because I used multiple cameras. I suspected my bulk loader, but I haven't seen scratches in subsequent bulk rolls put through the same loader (and same reusable film cassettes). :(

valdas 12-04-2019 22:50

Quote:

Originally Posted by dourbalistar (Post 2927557)
Looks great, Valdas!

On a side note, are you noticing problems with scratches on your negatives? I think I see one running vertically along the right third of the frame, starting above the handkerchief. I ask because I had scratches on a lot of my N74+ negatives, except mine showed up as black on my scans. It's not camera related, because I used multiple cameras. I suspected my bulk loader, but I haven't seen scratches in subsequent bulk rolls put through the same loader (and same reusable film cassettes). :(

Scratches - I surely see them :) I did not do the proper postprocessing on this frame. But. At this stage I would not blame the film. It was new to me Rollei 35S (first roll), so it could be camera. Bulk loader is another possible issue and then reusable cassettes). I would need to inspect all this, but I doubt the film itself is at fault.

Konstantin V. 02-01-2020 01:29

Hi, today I've requested a data sheet for the new N75. ORWO was so kind to send it to me, but they have yet to upload it themselves. SO I put it online here: https://drive.google.com/file/d/0B1M...4R2hpNDRBQTBn/

While to my eye ISO change means nothing, the other changes are significant:

* different spectral curve
* base fog is higher
* latitude is lower
* same two layers, means the same grain

What I don't like about bergger pancro 400 (n74+) is darker green (grass and trees), rough grain and also low pushability. Not sure about greens now.

HHPhoto 02-01-2020 04:19

Quote:

Originally Posted by Konstantin V. (Post 2939359)
Hi, today I've requested a data sheet for the new N75. ORWO was so kind to send it to me, but they have yet to upload it themselves. SO I put it online here: https://drive.google.com/file/d/0B1M...4R2hpNDRBQTBn/

While to my eye ISO change means nothing, the other changes are significant:

* different spectral curve
* base fog is higher
* latitude is lower
* same two layers, means the same grain

What I don't like about bergger pancro 400 (n74+) is darker green (grass and trees), rough grain and also low pushability. Not sure about greens now.

Thanks for the update!

Just one important additional information: Bergger Pancro 400 is not Filmotec/ORWO N74+.
The former Bergger BRF 400 film was repackaged N74+.
But the current Bergger Pancro 400 is produced by German film manufacturer Inoviscoat for Bergger (Bergger is just a distribution company with no own production facilities at all).

Cheers, Jan

CharlesDAMorgan 02-01-2020 04:23

I thought there was no connection. I much prefer Orwo N74 nowadays, but I've happily pushed Pancro 400 to 3200 without any real drama.


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