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-   -   Modified black Leica ii - question (http://www.rangefinderforum.com/forums/showthread.php?t=170364)

Paulie707 01-06-2020 03:17

Modified black Leica ii - question
 
Hello esteemed RFers,

I am interested to pick up another screw mount Leica. I have consistently gone back to screw mounts whenever I've strayed to other cameras. Most recently, I bought a Leica M4-2 but still am pulled back to the older bodies (maybe like my own...).

Anyway, I've been offered a black paint Leica ii (my favourite), which has no slow speeds (but the circle on the front where they should be) and strap lugs - two ticks in the box there for me.

However, the shutter speed dial has 1/1000 and it also has the flash sync added. Clearly the camera has been modified but all appears in good shape.

My question really is: does having the 1/1000 add any sort of fallibility into the ownership of these old, old beauties? Does having the flash mechanism mean there could be issues where a simple 1/500 plain old Leica ii would not experience anything negative?

For info, I'm not sure I'd use the 1/1000 speed but the camera looks very nice and is a reasonable price.

Thanks!

View Range 01-06-2020 03:31

In itself the addition of flash sync doesn't matter, but it does matter who did it and how well they did the work. A CLA by a trusted repair shop will reveal the true condition of the camera. But any camera of this age really should get a CLA before it is used again.

Dralowid 01-06-2020 04:25

Go to the Leica LTM part of the site and read through the 'Conversions' section. You will find plenty about these cameras.

It sounds like you have a II syn which is normal factory conversion of an older camera.

What is the serial number and could you post a picture in the 'Conversions' section?

These are interesting cameras but most do not command a premium.

Paulie707 01-07-2020 22:42

Thanks for replies. It certainly looks like a pro finish but whatís under the hood, as it were, is unknown. Serial number is 191503. I have already looked up the number. It was really a question whether, in your opinions, adding in the additional speed causes unnecessary problems given that these cameras are generally amazing because of their simplicity.

I donít appear to be able to upload the image via my mobile on the train this morning...!

Paulie707 01-07-2020 22:43

Thanks for replies. It certainly looks like a pro finish but whatís under the hood, as it were, is unknown. Serial number is 191503. I have already looked up the number. It was really a question whether, in your opinions, adding in the additional speed causes unnecessary problems given that these cameras are generally amazing because of their simplicity.

I donít appear to be able to upload the image via my mobile on the train this morning...!

Hari 01-07-2020 23:13

Got a black II unmodified. Mr. Ye CLAed it. My baby.

Dralowid 01-08-2020 01:07

If the flash plug is on the back next to the finder window and the speed dial looks like a IIIf dial with the flash value numbers around the outside then it is most likely to be a factory conversion.

The 1/1000 on ltm cameras can be wishful thinking but I doubt it will have any effect on anything else.

Erik van Straten 01-08-2020 02:28

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dralowid (Post 2933972)
If the flash plug is on the back next to the finder window and the speed dial looks like a IIIf dial with the flash value numbers around the outside then it is most likely to be a factory conversion.

It is better to have a conversion - preferable a III - without the flash synch: 1. it looks better 2. the synch can (and will) cause problems with the high speeds (uneven exposure).

It is better to avoid the conversions altogether. The originals look much better and are very reliable cameras, above all the III.

Erik.

analoged 01-08-2020 08:49

Quote:

Originally Posted by Erik van Straten (Post 2933980)
It is better to have a conversion - preferable a III - without the flash synch: 1. it looks better 2. the synch can (and will) cause problems with the high speeds (uneven exposure).

It is better to avoid the conversions altogether. The originals look much better and are very reliable cameras, above all the III.

Erik.

Something mechanical the III has that the II doesn't Erik? Or is it because the II has slow speeds if one needs that makes it better?

Erik van Straten 01-08-2020 09:26

No, the III is a later design. The III has strap lugs and some body stiffeners built in. It is a much smoother camera all around. The slow speeds of the III need a very low spring tension. If the shutter springs have too much tension, the slow speeds do not work correctly, above all "T" will not work.

The springs of the II are difficult to set. Often you'll have uneven exposure (one side of the image will be too dark or too light). You need to make test shots to find the correct tension of the springs.

Usually the springs of the II are wrongly set and have too much tension. There is however no need for a high tension.

To find the lowest tension, put the camera in the fridge for a few hours and tension the curtains when the camera is still cold. (The camera must also work outside, in the cold!) This is also good when tensioning a III.



Erik.

analoged 01-08-2020 14:35

I asked because I have now a IIc(?) post war conversion from a Ia. Not sure what designation a post war conversion without flash sync would be called! But it has strap lugs! Sold my IIIasync conversion.

Paulie707 01-12-2020 07:56

1 Attachment(s)
Quote:

Originally Posted by Erik van Straten (Post 2934078)
No, the III is a later design. The III has strap lugs and some body stiffeners built in. It is a much smoother camera all around. The slow speeds of the III need a very low spring tension. If the shutter springs have too much tension, the slow speeds do not work correctly, above all "T" will not work.

The springs of the II are difficult to set. Often you'll have uneven exposure (one side of the image will be too dark or too light). You need to make test shots to find the correct tension of the springs.

Usually the springs of the II are wrongly set and have too much tension. There is however no need for a high tension.

To find the lowest tension, put the camera in the fridge for a few hours and tension the curtains when the camera is still cold. (The camera must also work outside, in the cold!) This is also good when tensioning a III.

Erik.

This is helpful, thank you. I have had a standard, a iii a ii and an M4-2. Personally, the iii was the best of the bunch (I do love screw mounts!). I’m tempted by this one as it seems a fair price and has the strap lugs. I’m not a big user of the slow speeds but what you say about the issues with speed as a result of the conversion has be slightly cautious. Also, I notice this doesn’t have the - under the o of ‘No’. I’m still tempted though...!

Erik van Straten 01-12-2020 11:25

Your III is nice, black paint with paint-filled engravings.


Personally I do not like the synch conversions. Conversions without the synch do exist, however.


Erik.

Dralowid 01-12-2020 13:43

Quote:

Originally Posted by Erik van Straten (Post 2935060)
Your III is nice, black paint with paint-filled engravings.


Personally I do not like the synch conversions. Conversions without the synch do exist, however.


Erik.

I have conversions of II and III with and without sync and have never had problems with either. However I think my favourite is a prewar conversion of an early black I to IIIa. It is very, very quiet. (They were all serviced at some point by Peter at CRR, the IIIa was junk when I got it but its provenance justified to me at least the expense of sending it to Peter.)

Erik van Straten 01-12-2020 14:11

Yes, the conversions work good, but I do not like a conversion for flash on a prewar camera. It simply does not look right, in my opinion. But this is a personal matter: I do not like flash, it is as simple as that.


Erik.


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