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-   Leica M10, 240 family, M-P, M60 (http://www.rangefinderforum.com/forums/forumdisplay.php?f=207)
-   -   "M (Typ 262)" (http://www.rangefinderforum.com/forums/showthread.php?t=153043)

squirrel$$$bandit 11-17-2015 02:59

"M (Typ 262)"
 
FYI:

http://www.mirrorlessrumors.com/new-...nnounced-soon/

robklurfield 11-17-2015 03:53

the writer of that post must have a very accurate crystal ball, making a prediction like this: "it won't be cheap." lol.

jsrockit 11-17-2015 04:32

Cool, a new M.

Dante_Stella 11-17-2015 04:32

Hopefully it will be dimensionally similar to the current Ms so that the same batteries and cases will work. Because, you know, saving $300 after dropping 8 grand is important. :)

My crystal ball tells me that it will not have much more than 24 Mp if it keeps the Leica mechanical rangefinder.

Dante

mfogiel 11-17-2015 04:38

OMG, then will I be forced to upgrade from my Iphone?

squirrel$$$bandit 11-17-2015 05:01

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dante_Stella (Post 2552320)
Hopefully it will be dimensionally similar to the current Ms so that the same batteries and cases will work. Because, you know, saving $300 after dropping 8 grand is important. :)

My crystal ball tells me that it will not have much more than 24 Mp if it keeps the Leica mechanical rangefinder.

Dante

I long for something Q-sized, which is to say, M6-sized, but I doubt I'm gonna get it this go-round...

squirrel$$$bandit 11-19-2015 02:57

http://www.mirrorlessrumors.com/leic...-within-hours/

!!!

jsrockit 11-19-2015 04:54

Hmmm mabelsound, are you going to get your (our!) M6 sized M digital today?

Jan Pedersen 11-19-2015 05:09

5500 Euro, not exactly entry level but no video sounds good.

jsrockit 11-19-2015 05:20

Here it is:

http://en.leica-camera.com/Photograp...EICA-M-Typ-262

http://leicarumors.com/2015/11/19/ne...nnounced.aspx/

$5195 US

ferider 11-19-2015 05:31

No video, no LV, aluminum top plate. That it ?

jsrockit 11-19-2015 05:34

Quote:

Originally Posted by ferider (Post 2553077)
No video, no LV, aluminum top plate. That it ?

and lower price...but no change in size.

squirrel$$$bandit 11-19-2015 05:40

Quote:

Originally Posted by jsrockit (Post 2553079)
and lower price...but no change in size.

yeah, no :(

although, if I were in the market for a new M, this is probably the one I would get.

kshapero 11-19-2015 05:44

Yeah bit at least it includes a new ala carte program.

http://leicarumors.com/2015/11/19/ne...nnounced.aspx/

Sam Kanga 11-19-2015 05:47

Good news, but not "entry level". This is closer to what a Leica "M" should be, no video and other gew gaws. There are many great cameras out there that have video and let you use long lenses easily etc. If I go on I'll just be preaching to the converted! I'm glad the price came down a little, they kept the optical rangefinder, and it seems like it keeps the same large battery of the M240.

splitimageview 11-19-2015 05:51

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sam Kanga (Post 2553087)
Good news, but not "entry level".

Entry level for Leica is all relative. :)

Not sure this will help sell any of these...

http://en.leica-camera.com/Photograp...EICA-M-Typ-262


mfogiel 11-19-2015 06:05

A mirrorless camera without the live view, is like a porn movie theatre without a porn movie.

squirrel$$$bandit 11-19-2015 06:08

We Leica enthusiasts are nothing if not receptacles for obscure, perverse self-abnegation

Dante_Stella 11-19-2015 06:10

This is a graceful way to reduce the price: decontenting via removing video, Live View the frameline preview lever, and the brass top plate (which actually adds a ton of weight and adds no value to black or silver chrome).

Five grand is actually a steal for the kind of quality the sensor delivers, provided that in the 1,000+ you saved, you don't lose something else you wanted. I'm sorry for the people who can't seem to keep their hands off the video or Live View buttons - the loss of the EVF is actually a huge loss in functionality. First, it eliminates your ability to accurately focus super-speed lenses (and any R or other SLR lens, slide copying rig, etc.). Second, you lose three-axis leveling (no optical accessory finder can show you the X-Y level in two different camera orientations), which is a big deal for architectural or landscape photography. Third, you can't use the camera as a tool to calibrate lenses. Finally, it eliminates the backup focusing method when, inevitably, the RF gets knocked out/drifts of alignment. On these last two points, unless you have an EVF to establish the baseline performance of the lens, you might not even know your lens is acting abnormally.

The illustration photos are awesome, particularly the man sleeping on the bench. Thank your lucky stars that this was not taken in the Englischergarten in Munich.

Dante

jsrockit 11-19-2015 06:10

Quote:

Originally Posted by mfogiel (Post 2553093)
A mirrorless camera without the live view, is like a porn movie theatre without a porn movie.

Well, technically it's not mirrorless right?

Dektol Dan 11-19-2015 06:13

Yay!
 
A camera for the skilled photographer!!

squirrel$$$bandit 11-19-2015 06:13

I would love the live view if it came as part of a hybrid viewfinder, la the X-Pro1, but the giant accessory EVF looks and feels awkward to me on an M. Content to use an A7 when live view is needed and save the Leicas for the pure, unadulterated, intentionally compromised pleasures of 1953.

NazgulKing 11-19-2015 06:20

So people are happy that they slapped on an inaccurate rangefinder onto a camera and removed the EVF with enough pixels to tell you whether you are off-focused or not? Might as well go back to the 18MP M instead.

squirrel$$$bandit 11-19-2015 06:25

Quote:

Originally Posted by NazgulKing (Post 2553104)
So people are happy that they slapped on an inaccurate rangefinder onto a camera and removed the EVF with enough pixels to tell you whether you are off-focused or not? Might as well go back to the 18MP M instead.

I think the primary advantage over the M9/M-E would be high-ISO shooting.

jsrockit 11-19-2015 06:30

Quote:

Originally Posted by NazgulKing (Post 2553104)
So people are happy that they slapped on an inaccurate rangefinder onto a camera and removed the EVF with enough pixels to tell you whether you are off-focused or not? Might as well go back to the 18MP M instead.

Well, we are on the rangefinderforum...

aizan 11-19-2015 06:36

i wonder if a software hack could add or activate live view, or if there is a hardware change that precludes that possibility....

splitimageview 11-19-2015 06:38

So...machining a top plate out of aluminum and using different firmware reduces the price by $2755.

k__43 11-19-2015 06:42

More a reduced M240 than a CMOS-fied M9
I do have to say I miss the frameline illumination window

bobby_novatron 11-19-2015 06:51

+1 what Dante_Stella said. Losing LV isn't a bonus, IMHO. For me, using legacy glass on the M 240 is creative and interesting -- without LV the M 262 will be less versatile than the M 240. How else can you focus a wobbly $30 Jupiter-8 on a $5000 camera? :)

johannielscom 11-19-2015 07:00

'Entry level, like the ME'... :eek:

Me262, careful now Leitz... :p :p :p

robert blu 11-19-2015 07:08

Not sure how much I'm interested in this camera but to have a cheaper simpler alternative to the 240 type for the ones (me? maybe) enjoying RF photography is not bad.

Of course LV and EVF are very useful if you plan to use other lenses, in this case the 240 is your camera.

Just thinking, now the price delta could be a little bit more...:)

robert

icebear 11-19-2015 07:10

I just got a Q and LV is definitely a very useful tool when your can't comfortably get behind the RF. Who needed video anyway ...

rogazilla 11-19-2015 07:13

If I didn't already have a M240, this is the one to go with.

I have always thought that Leica does not want to produce a more pure camera below M240, because they know, photographers who just want a 'camera' will flock to this lower price point version instead of the one with video and other functionality.

Imagine the special edition without LCD and without video and sell for 4000. I think most people who currently uses rangefinder or coming from film will be more than happy to pick that up and spend less money.

Out to Lunch 11-19-2015 07:16

Reading the above, I think my recent $ 4,000 investment in a new M-E was a good one. It has, more or less the same features, except for the smaller screen.

Dpingr1 11-19-2015 07:30

Quote:

Originally Posted by johannielscom (Post 2553121)
'Entry level, like the ME'... :eek:

Me262, careful now Leitz... :p :p :p

Good catch, Johan. The first ever jet-powered Leica? I'd buy one.

ray*j*gun 11-19-2015 07:49

It has an aluminum body? Is that right?

robert blu 11-19-2015 07:57

Color space sRGB only? no Adobe RGB?

rob

rogazilla 11-19-2015 08:11

So this is ME v2. Does that mean a new M is coming soon?

jsrockit 11-19-2015 08:28

Quote:

Originally Posted by ray*j*gun (Post 2553152)
It has an aluminum body? Is that right?

No, top plate.

uhoh7 11-19-2015 08:45

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dante_Stella (Post 2553096)
This is a graceful way to reduce the price: decontenting via removing video, Live View the frameline preview lever, and the brass top plate (which actually adds a ton of weight and adds no value to black or silver chrome).
Dante

Exactly. And you are right about the EVF, too.

The real question is when will Leica muster the courage and vision to make a move like they did going from Barnack to M?

It's time to throw out the M design as a M6 look-alike and make a modern camera with the same priorites as the lenses, which are really the only reason Leica is still going. The lenses are as small as possible and even sacrifice performance to some degree, to this end.

Many of us want the smallest, lightest body possible. The Sony A7 is thinner than the M6 at the LCD. Forget the squareness. Make some humps where you need to, but try to make them ergonomic, small and light.

Next get this: RF is not about tradition, for many of us. We like RF because of performance: it's clear, it's fast, and you see alot. So give us that with a EVF alongside, built in. Inboard.

So you, Leica, make three basic cameras:

1)M6 knockoff, with 240 features but smaller and lighter.
2) the MN. N is for new, and this is the camera I describe above.
3) same as above but without RF, EVF only, but a really good one. This is the interchangeable Q.

Oh Charlie, you say, too many models, you are dreaming!

Count the models today. Three options for M is fine and you add monochrome versions at least for one.

Oh and one more thing: when you make the MN add the potential to control an AF lens. Then make some. Not for me. But others like them.


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