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michaelbialecki
08-07-2009, 06:51
I got invited to shoot 100 Thai female bikini models tomorrow night at a VIP pool party...It is being put on by a modeling agency who I know the owner from a social networking site here in Bangkok and she saw that I was a photographer and well, she asked me if I would be interested to shoot some of her models....I think my answer is obvious....so, there are going to be 100 models, 10 photographers (including myself) and a couple of art directors.....She sent me some examples of what she wants.....basically nothing special.....anyways....The photos are to be taken from 4:00 p.m.- 6:00 p.m. and then the party starts at 8:00 (she told me no photos at the party)..just drink and have fun.....anyways...I am pretty sure that most of the other photographers are going to be Thai guys with big DSLR's (they are everywhere here)...so...I feel stupid asking a "what should I bring question"....(I know my gear and know what I like)....I have already decided on this stuff

canon g10 (so small, but I probably wont even use it)
m2 and m6ttl


as far as lenses go..I dont have a whole lot to choose from

the 90mm summicron has to come
definetly a 50mm...(v1 summilux or rigid summicron)
35mm nokton 1.2
28mm elmarit
15mm vc

I am going to be shooting fuji pro 100 (color) the whole day..

Another question that I have is....should I bring my Hasselblad for a couple of rolls...I have an 80mm for it.....

I plan on bringing my flash as well ( a metz ) that works with m6ttl...anyways....any suggestions from you guys...I plan on shooting about 10 rolls but I am going to bring more just in case...what would you bring if you were me....2 hours of shooting in pretty good light....any tips or advice would be appreciated.....thanks...michael

sleepyhead
08-07-2009, 06:55
You lead a tough and miserable life, my friend...

michaelbialecki
08-07-2009, 06:59
You lead a tough and miserable life, my friend...

ha ha ha.....very funny....I know I know...I will admit....I do feel a little lucky..to be honest, I have no idea what to expect....only 100 male guests are allowed to come...I have no idea what that is about...but it should be interesting....

FrankS
08-07-2009, 07:05
Sounds like a lot of gear, but take it with you and if you need it, you will have access to it. You could prpbably shot all of it with one Leica and a 50mm lens, maybe the 35 if the space is tight.

Al Kaplan
08-07-2009, 07:27
Both Leica bodies, set up with a 35 and 90, bring the 15 and just maybe the 50, but you can live without it. Start looking for some smaller lighter weight functional lenses. For that shoot a 90/2.8 and 35/2 would be more than fast enough. You probably won't need a flash but if you take it bring spare cords and batteries. NO Hasselblad.

You're there to take photographs, not to impress other photographers. Clients only care about results, and you could probably get those with a 40 year old Canonet from the thrift store.

http://thepriceofsilver.blogspot.com

elshaneo
08-07-2009, 07:27
Use the Leica M2 with the 35mm Nokton, and the Leica M6TTL with the Summicron 90mm, bring the 50mm Summicron in case you might want to use it ;-)

Don't worry about the other equipments, just shoot, enjoy yourself and have fun !!!

raid
08-07-2009, 07:31
Add a few rolls of ASA400 or ASA800 film just in case the evening suddenly opens up for photography. You need to be prepared for such a possibility.

MatthewThompson
08-07-2009, 07:31
I'd bring only the Hasselblad for the simple reason that you'll (more than likely) be the only one shooting 120. In the wash of 35mm and digital snaps, your exposures will really glow and maybe give you some opportunity to be noticed and remembered.

maddoc
08-07-2009, 07:32
M2 + M6TTL + 35/1.2 + 90/2 and enjoy ! :D

FrankS
08-07-2009, 07:45
50mm, don't leave home without it!

michaelbialecki
08-07-2009, 07:46
hey thanks guys...I just cleaned up my gear and put in my Domke....it is heavy....too heavy...I have to trim it down....lots of good advice above......for some stupid reason, I really want to bring my Hasselblad too.....but maybe not.....and yes, I will throw in a couple of high speed rolls that I have in the fridge....but, I was thinking that was what the g10 would be for..oh..well...any more advice....I appreciate it...

Hey Al, I remember when we said good bye to each other in miami in the parking lot of that coffee shop....do you remember....I wish you could join me on this shoot....I think it is going to be fun.....

historicist
08-07-2009, 07:46
this thread would have been much better had it been called Bangkok bikini models - pictures

michaelbialecki
08-07-2009, 07:49
this thread would have been much better had it been called Bangkok bikini models - pictures

sorry.....I know....I will try to post some photos up when I get everything in order...

pagpow
08-07-2009, 07:53
Important to know if you will be shooting in a crowd, in which case the long lenses and long set up cameras might be pointless and counterproductive (weight, as you said) -- or will the models be set up for photos with clear sight lines -- possible to ask?

michaelbialecki
08-07-2009, 07:58
Important to know if you will be shooting in a crowd, in which case the long lenses and long set up cameras might be pointless and counterproductive (weight, as you said) -- or will the models be set up for photos with clear sight lines -- possible to ask?

I already asked her the other day and I will be allowed to work with the models one on one....there are only going to be the models and the people from the agency during the shoot......I saw the location from photos that she sent me...a big pool on the roof of a building.....lots of light...good light too for those two hours....thanks, it was a good point

kbg32
08-07-2009, 08:02
Don't worry if you forget your film, just enjoy!

MikeL
08-07-2009, 08:10
35mm, 90mm, and Hasselblad, for me.

djonesii
08-07-2009, 08:17
I really like MF, bring the Blad and one M, I'm a normal kind of guy, works great w/ Foot zoom. I would suggest that you shoot Chromes/B&W, that will help to distinguish the photos from the rest of the same old noiseless digital that CanIkon pump out.

Dave

MichaelW
08-07-2009, 08:24
I would definitely take the 28 or 15 wide lens & try to get some shots by standing right back & taking in all the madness. I wouldn't take the Hasselblad but the G10 should be easy enough to carry & will give you an extra option. Actually, I would take the 2 Leicas, one with the 35 & the other with the 15. I'd mostly shoot context shots with them & use the G10 for the glamour close-ups. Take shots to please yourself rather than what you think the promoter is expecting. When you get all your results back choose the 10 or so you like best & send those to them.

FrankS
08-07-2009, 08:29
B+W film for the Hasselblad. That's a no-brainer.

Al Kaplan
08-07-2009, 08:38
By the end of the shoot you'll wish that somebody had stolen your Hasselblad. It doesn't belong on a shoot like that and film cost will kill you, plus reloading time. Then you'll need to carry extra magazines, and it'll be too tempting NOT to take the 50 and 150mm lenses and you're opening a can of worms here. The quality difference is minimal. You're not going there to impress anybody with your gear. Also, a 'blad takes a long time for the noisy mirror to flip up. Some of your subjects might be caught in mid blink because of that. Impress people with your photos.

user237428934
08-07-2009, 08:39
The most important question is: do they know you will be shooting film? What if they exactly expect another guy with a big DSLR so they can get the files just after the event?

ferider
08-07-2009, 08:42
Two Leicas, 35, 90, flash. And your GF to help you. Not kidding.

raid
08-07-2009, 08:53
I already asked her the other day and I will be allowed to work with the models one on one....there are only going to be the models and the people from the agency during the shoot......I saw the location from photos that she sent me...a big pool on the roof of a building.....lots of light...good light too for those two hours....thanks, it was a good point

How much does a return ticket cost from USA to where you are?
I will be your assistant. :D
I am good at carrying around cameras and lenses.

Roger Hicks
08-07-2009, 09:02
Two Leicas

Two lenses

Nothing else (except film and perhaps a meter, and flash if you MUST). Otherwise you're going to be worrying about gear, not pics. Forget the Hasselblad: you're going for quantity here, not studio-lit perfection.

If the GF helps, you can't ask for more. I was photographing a friend's daughter last week and an assistant makes life much easier and (when you're decades older than your model) more comfortable for all parties.

Tashi delek,

R.

SolaresLarrave
08-07-2009, 09:32
Like many others said, the two Leicas, one fitted with a wide lens and the other with the telephoto. I wouldn't take the flash... but then, I'd toss it in the bag (just in case). Also, two types of film, just in case light fades a bit too fast.

Looking at your work (I really admired your earthquake shots), this should be a cinch for you. Enjoy!! :)

michaelbialecki
08-07-2009, 13:24
ok.....lots of good advice.....I think the Hasselblad will stay at home....the m2 and m6 are coming with me...and...well, not so sure about the lenses.....I am going to sleep now and will decide in the morning....after I re-read all these posts again......no assistant....I work better alone.....cheers and thanks to everybody..........cheers...michael

Al Kaplan
08-07-2009, 13:28
Glad to help. Try to keep it to 3 lenses. Bring LOTS of business cards.

leicashot
08-07-2009, 13:36
I got invited to shoot 100 Thai female bikini models tomorrow night at a VIP pool party...It is being put on by a modeling agency who I know the owner from a social networking site here in Bangkok and she saw that I was a photographer and well, she asked me if I would be interested to shoot some of her models....I think my answer is obvious....so, there are going to be 100 models, 10 photographers (including myself) and a couple of art directors.....She sent me some examples of what she wants.....basically nothing special.....anyways....The photos are to be taken from 4:00 p.m.- 6:00 p.m. and then the party starts at 8:00 (she told me no photos at the party)..just drink and have fun.....anyways...I am pretty sure that most of the other photographers are going to be Thai guys with big DSLR's (they are everywhere here)...so...I feel stupid asking a "what should I bring question"....(I know my gear and know what I like)....I have already decided on this stuff

canon g10 (so small, but I probably wont even use it)
m2 and m6ttl


as far as lenses go..I dont have a whole lot to choose from

the 90mm summicron has to come
definetly a 50mm...(v1 summilux or rigid summicron)
35mm nokton 1.2
28mm elmarit
15mm vc

I am going to be shooting fuji pro 100 (color) the whole day..

Another question that I have is....should I bring my Hasselblad for a couple of rolls...I have an 80mm for it.....

I plan on bringing my flash as well ( a metz ) that works with m6ttl...anyways....any suggestions from you guys...I plan on shooting about 10 rolls but I am going to bring more just in case...what would you bring if you were me....2 hours of shooting in pretty good light....any tips or advice would be appreciated.....thanks...michael

Honestly, if you are a photographer, you should probably have the answer to these questions yourself, no?

Other than that, may I suggest you bring some higher speed film than 100ISO. Considering asian weather, the 'good light' may never come, so you need to be prepared. Also, in terms of equipment, you need to decide based on what your client's requirements are, considering you're being paid that is...?

Lastly, keep your kit simple. It doesn't sound like a high end commercial shoot, just a PR event, so have sopme fun with it and keeping your kit simple will mean you spend more time thinking about the photography, and not the kit. Also, in future, if you're not able to answer these questions yourself, it's probably best not to take on the job. A client doesn't usually give second chances, so if you're not prepared, capable, experienced or confident, it will shot in your work and results...and you know where that leads......

Sorry to be so blunt, but this is the way it works. There are too many people calling themselves photographers these days and coming up short on jobs where professionals should be hired. Make sure you're not one of those guys....be prepared and ready...understand your limitations and only accept when you 'know' you can deliver.

mfogiel
08-07-2009, 13:42
I second Roland, 35mm on M6ttl with a fill in flash (wind the flash one stop down respect to the ambient light) for full body portraits. I would also take the 50 and 90 in case you cannot get close or you want a half body shot. No Hasselblad, it will drag you down.

Frank Petronio
08-07-2009, 13:45
The girls won't really matter, the real opportunity is to photograph the other photographers working with the models, those will be the amazing shots as you capture both the photographer and the model working together. Trust me.

Just bring both Leica bodies and two normal lenses that allow you to shoot close. And shoot close. Shoot the girls as close as possible, walk them around and find where the interesting light is, pose them in front of strange backgrounds.

Then step back and shoot the other togs working with their big zooms and the uncomfortable expressions of both parties.

Leave the potato masher and Blad at home.

leicashot
08-07-2009, 13:55
The girls won't really matter, the real opportunity is to photograph the other photographers working with the models, those will be the amazing shots as you capture both the photographer and the model working together. Trust me.

Just bring both Leica bodies and two normal lenses that allow you to shoot close. And shoot close. Shoot the girls as close as possible, walk them around and find where the interesting light is, pose them in front of strange backgrounds.

Then step back and shoot the other togs working with their big zooms and the uncomfortable expressions of both parties.

Leave the potato masher and Blad at home.

I have to disagree here. I say let the guy shoot his own style and let his own eye do the choosing. Most photographers don't like being shot by people they don't know....and I don't see the models have uncomfortable expressions because of big zooms. Most models are used to big zooms and are more likely to react to the Leica M cameras instead.

JohnTF
08-07-2009, 14:04
sorry.....I know....I will try to post some photos up when I get everything in order...


I am asking Stephen now for a one time exemption to the 7 images a day upload limit.

I notice you only gave us one day's notice, I checked and Expedia says no more room on the flights.

35mm-- you may need to work close. ;-)

Regards, John

Keith
08-07-2009, 15:16
Another vote for the two M bodies with 35mm and 90mm lenses ... I really can't see any other option that makes sense!

FrankS
08-07-2009, 15:21
Pleasant dreams, good luck tomorrow!

KenD
08-07-2009, 15:37
If you bring 2 types of film make sure that both are the same speed - this many bikini models will turn into a frenzy. And bring as many take-up spools as you own, with the film already started into the clip, so you can load fast, and pre-load when you go empty. And as Al said, lots of business cards.

If they want digital images the next morning shoot c41, and hit the One Hour for develop and lab scans.

Enjoy.

Frank Petronio
08-07-2009, 15:48
Most photographers don't like being shot by people they don't know

yeah! you don't get great shots by always being comfortable.

Al Kaplan
08-07-2009, 16:04
It's best to use a one-hour where everybody knows you. Let them know ahead of time about when to expect you to bring the film, and when you need the scans. It'd probably be best to drop off thefilm on your way home so they have it overnight, assuming that it's a 24 hr place.

Consider bringing someone along to help with hair and make-up. Now THERE is a situation where some extra shots will pay off. . Any beutician would like some shots of themselves working on models like that, and then hang them on the wall of her shop, with your photo credit.

http://thepriceofsilver.blogspot.com

35mmdelux
08-07-2009, 17:04
The 50mm should be able to do it all; 35mm for group. Keep it simple.

Pablito
08-07-2009, 17:53
Bangkok.

bikini models ("bikini models")

Party "afterwards"

ho-hum.

raid
08-07-2009, 18:02
HIV trap ...?
High Infra-red Visualization trap?

ethics_gradient
08-07-2009, 19:36
I think the pros would give plenty of cred to a Leica shooter, I joined the photo club at my university there and everyone was clustered around the guy with the M7 the first day i showed up, my 5D was second fiddle (as it should be, really).

Hope IQ lab is treating you alright, did they work out for you?

michaelbialecki
08-07-2009, 19:36
oh, thanks again........I have decided to bring two M bodies..the 35, 50 and 90...(and the 15...only because it is so small)...the flash, my meter and a bunch of film....the Hasselblad is going to stay home....to be honest....I said "yes" because I think it will be a fun experience....that's it...

oh, one more thing...I remember a couple of years ago at MOMA in San Francisco, they had this photo show and they had some photos of a "pool party" in Bangkok, and the shots were of these girls standing around looking uncomfortable with these big, fat, old, western guys talking to them and eating hot dogs...I remember the look on the faces of the people....happy guys....uncomfortable girls...the photos were amazing......those images have stuck with me throughout the years....
I think anybody on this forum who has seen my photography, knows I don't shoot "fashion/model shots"...I have no desire to work in that field....my photography is something pretty different....but I sad yes for the experience and I think it will be fun...don't get me wrong, sure, I want to take nice photos of the girls and I want to have nice photos to give to the agency....but, I can't see myself working in this field....as far as photography is concerned, my interests lie elsewhere....thanks again for comments...I appreciate it...cheers, michael

michaelbialecki
08-07-2009, 23:04
ok...guys, i am leaving in an hour to go to the shoot.....wish me luck.....I threw in a couple of rolls of tri-x just in case.....it is my favorite film and I am thinking towards 6:00 p.m., it might come in handy ....I have butterflys in my stomach and a big smile on my face......cheers, michael

amateriat
08-07-2009, 23:19
Whew...!

I'm with Roger, Al and Frank on the gear stuff. Keep it simple, stay loose, and try and catch some interaction between the models and the el serioso photogs. I'm certain the female-pulchritude-and-luminosity quotient will be unbelievably high (I'm trying hard to erase these thoughts, but having a difficult time...), but these things are what you'll want to capture. That you may ne tha only person among the throngs shooting film makes it all the sweeter. Shoot Different.


- Barrett

Simon Larbalestier
08-08-2009, 04:22
Seems like i picked the wrong time to leave Bangkok Michael!
Personally I'd go with one M and 35/1.2.

johannielscom
08-08-2009, 05:05
I think the pros would give plenty of cred to a Leica shooter, I joined the photo club at my university there and everyone was clustered around the guy with the M7 the first day i showed up, my 5D was second fiddle (as it should be, really)...

Well, enjoy that while it lasts, The Netherlands have a very high percentage digi-cam shooters and virtually no-one recognizes a Leica anymore here.

johannielscom
08-08-2009, 05:15
Michael,

I'd leave the Hassy and the flash at home, but would bring faster films in case the evening does open up for shooting.

And if it turns out as suggested here with the 100 bikini-models vs. 100 guys party, an M2 with faster film and 35mm lens might be pleasant for some stealth shooting too!

Enjoy your shoot!

35mmdelux
08-08-2009, 05:34
Is the party still on?

michaelbialecki
08-08-2009, 11:17
ok...I just got back from the party and it was crazy....so crazy...I dont even know where to begin.....it was so much fun....crazy...I love Bangkok.....I think that I took lots of good photos....I will have them developed tomorrow and hopefully have some scans to share tomorrow night.....seriously, the girls were amazing and I had a lot of fun....I used the 35mm nokton 80% of the time....the 50mm got used a little and the 90mm and 15mm got used for for just a couple of shots.....oh my god....I still cant believe it....good times, good times....I love this city....

oh...yes, the Leica's were very popular...I was surprised how many people commented about them

BillBingham2
08-08-2009, 12:01
Good choice on lenses. Not surprised the 35 was the main player. I think the 'blad would have been fun, but only if you could get a secure place to put her down for most of the time. A TLR would have been better (less weight) but it sounds like you have a most excellent time.

B2 (;->

topoxforddoc
08-08-2009, 12:19
Sounds like you had a ball! Better swab everything down now!

Looking forward to seeing your scans

Charlie

michaelbialecki
08-08-2009, 12:52
Yeah, the Hasselblad would of been fun for about 10% of the night...but, the 35mm 1.2 was my go to lens....and it was stuck on the m6ttl for most of the night becasue I did use my flash occasionaly.....I am so excited to go to the lab first thing in the morning....i cant wait to post some photos up here for you guys to see.......you guys aren't going to believe this but one of the models asked me about my Leica and we started to talk about f-stops and lenses and cameras...she is a photographer...it was crazy....she wants to come and use my darkroom.... ..she is hot..hot... hot..there I was talking to this Thai model in a bikini about Leicas...I cant even begin to explain what happened when I was taking her photos.... it was so crazy....
...cheers, michael

Al Kaplan
08-08-2009, 12:57
Tell her that she can use my darkroom too, if she decides on a Miami trip.

Renzsu
08-08-2009, 13:02
This thread is a fun read, can't wait to see your results man. I love your work, I'm sure the photo's will rock!

NathanJD
08-08-2009, 13:42
she wants to come and use my darkroom.... ..she is hot..hot... hot

you took her number then?? excellent mate, i've been following this thread! can't wait to see the results ;)

Spider67
08-08-2009, 14:03
.......on the other hand I have this feeling that it's the real michael b's nephew who visits his uncle in Bangkok and just has hijacked michael's account.....

michaelbialecki
08-08-2009, 14:51
...ok.....so I was the first to arrive at the pool , there weren't any photographers or models yet, just a bunch of workers setting up the lights and tables and stuff....I asked around and realized that all the models were on the 4th floor in the agency filming something...

...as i was checking out the location with a light meter and checking flash settings, some of the Thai photographers arrived...they looked like a punk rock/art band...they were young and pretty cool.....I had both my leicas put away in my domke and we talked for about 10 minutes about cameras, photography and Bangkok while we were waiting for the models to come up to the pool....they all had Canon DSLR's...one guy had a crazy ring flash attached to his camera.

One guy had a small portfolio of his work and he wanted me to look at his photos....good stuff, but not my stlye....anyways, one of the guys said something to the other guy about my light meter (sekonic 358) in Thai, and I was able to understand most of what he said.... we were talking for about 10 minutes and I noticed that they kept looking at my Domke bag..they had LowePro bags....well, I got up to go shoot the first model that had arrived ...I just wanted to take a couple of quick shots and I also wanted to talk to her about where the other models were.......

I think the Thai photographers must of been watching me take pictures of this girl because when I came back to the place that we were sitting, they were staring at my Leica, and one guy pointed at it and said "Robert Capa"...I didn't understand him....at first, I didn't know if he was speaking Thai or English to me...then he walked over to me and pointed right at my camera and said...Robert Capa...I still didn't understand him...then one his friends said "Robert Capa...Magnum....good...good" ...then I obviously got it...they asked me what model it was, I was surprised that they knew about Leicas.

They all wanted to hold it and look at it....it was funny...good guys..most of them had only been shooting for a year or two....so, as the models started to arrive I could tell that some of the girls were a little nervous because they were new at this and there was the Thai staff putting the tables and food out and the girls were shy because of them...as I started to talk to them and make them feel comfortable.....the ball started rolling and once the other girls saw me shooting their friends, they all wantd me to shoot them......I was able to shoot a lot of models one on one...and I got along good with all of them...they were friendly and outgoing...it helps that i can tell jokes in Thai, it makes them laugh....

While I was shooting them they would ask me for my number and email...I told them, that we can exchange info at the party later on, I need to shoot photos now while the light is still good.....so, once the party got started, and drinks started going down...I approached a table with about 9 models that I recognized from earlier that I had shot....well, I decided to have them write down their info for me, so I can email them..

The next thing I know....word got around that i was collecting contact info from the girls that i had shot and all these girls came over and gave me their numbers and emails and it was crazy.....I had to make notes on who was who so I could identify them later when I look at the photos....you should see my notes..."the one that has*&%$#" ...... "the one that told me %&^%88"...the one that showed me her &*%$&....crazy stuff....well, I now have about 15 girls emails and numbers.....but little did I know....by the end of the night, I had about 10 other girls numbers and emails as well.

As the night went on we had gotton a lot friendlier and some girls who I did not shoot earlier wanted me to shoot them now....I think they were jealous that i didn't shoot them earlier...but to be honest there were so many girls to choose from, it was crazy..I remember I was shooting this one girl, and I was thinking, how did I not see her earlier by the pool with the other girls, she was amazing...she told me she arrived late.

Some serious one on one photography went down in a well lit room that I happened to find that nobody went in....one by one, the girls would come in and have me photograph them in complete privacy.....they were telling their friends and then their friends would come and ask me to take them to the room to take photos....now this was late into the night and a lot of flirtation had gone down before then, and now they wanted me to take photos of them in this room..it was crazy...I am excited to see the results....the girls that I shot were all really cool and friendly and most of them had a really good command of the English language....

It was a very good night....I will post some photos up asap...probably tomorrow night....
ok, I just counted my rolls and ..I shot 11 rolls of fuji 100, 2 rolls of xp2 (the girls in the room late at night) and 2 rolls of fuji 400 color.........I was going to shoot ti x...but I decided against it because when I had to decide to use tri x or xp2 I was pretty sure that I would be meeting some of these girls again for some more photos in the next week or two....we got along good and I think once they see their photos...they are going to be happy....

It was one girls first time modeling (she was one of the prettiest) and we had so much fun together....she would look at other girls posing and copy it and get crazy with me....so much fun.....alright....hey, thanks everybody for the coments and suggestions....at one point tonight when I was shooting I thought to myself..."dude, if the guys from rff could see me now"...hahahah....cheers, michael

michaelbialecki
08-08-2009, 14:52
.......on the other hand I have this feeling that it's the real michael b's nephew who visits his uncle in Bangkok and just is hijacked michael's account.....

dude, that would be crazy...my nephew is 3 years old and lives in Miami...

....but seriously, I have no idea what this means....

35mmdelux
08-08-2009, 15:10
Sounds like a Girls Gone Wild gig..

rondo
08-08-2009, 15:11
ok, seems like you are going through from one trauma to another. just visited your flickr page, and i think you deserved this pool party after the delhi bomb blast...

michaelbialecki
08-08-2009, 15:23
Sounds like a Girls Gone Wild gig..

i dont know why but that's really funny.....

bhop73
08-08-2009, 15:30
...ok.....so I was the first to arrive at the pool , there weren't any photographers or models yet...etc.

That sounds like a dream I had once... only a dream.. :(

Silva Lining
08-08-2009, 15:32
Hey, Michael, don't pinch yourself, you might wake up :)

Sounds like great fun - looking forward to the photos Naturellement! ;)

Roger Hicks
08-08-2009, 15:34
Dear Michael,

Could you possibly break your long post into paragraphs? I find it VERY hard to read a huge unbroken blob of text, and I'm sure I'm not the only one. I tried several times and kept giving up. Using 'anyways' as a repeated link makes it especially hard to follow, because if you glance away, you can't tell which 'anyways' you were last looking at.

Cheers,

Roger

michaelbialecki
08-08-2009, 15:54
Sorry Roger...you're right...thanks for letting me know....cheers, michael

rondo
08-08-2009, 15:55
Dear Michael,

Could you possibly break your long post into paragraphs? I find it VERY hard to read a huge unbroken blob of text, and I'm sure I'm not the only one. I tried several times and kept giving up. Using 'anyways' as a repeated link makes it especially hard to follow, because if you glance away, you can't tell which 'anyways' you were last looking at.

Cheers,

Roger

The guy has just went through a traumatic experience. Please be more understanding.

Abbazz
08-08-2009, 17:57
Definitely not the kind of party likely to happen here in Brunei...

I had to make notes on who was who so I could identify them later when I look at the photos....you should see my notes..."the one that has*&%$#" ......
...black hair?

"the one that told me %&^%88"...
...I want to improve my English?

the one that showed me her &*%$&....
...her purse? :D

Cheers!

Abbazz

raid
08-08-2009, 21:19
How was bokeh that night?
Must have been tiring for the eyes after all these close-ups.

JohnTF
08-08-2009, 22:11
How was bokeh that night?
Must have been tiring for the eyes after all these close-ups.

I knew you would steal my Bokeh line. ;-)

NathanJD
08-09-2009, 02:00
I just wanted to say i feel really sorry for you. it's a shame that as a photographer sometimes you have to do things you never want to do. don't worry - it will get better soon and you'll get some work that you will be able to enjoy! :p

michaelbialecki
08-09-2009, 02:26
ok, here are some photos from last night....I have a problem....on some of the negatives/prints, there are some spots (chemical residue) that I can't brush off with an anti static brush...I fear that the negatives are marked (not really scratched)

I am going to need to learn some quick photo shop skills...I probably only have about 4 or 5 pictures that are good that I want to send to the agency and the girls that need touching up because some of the marks on the negative are on parts of the girls bodies in the photos..all the other negatives and photos seem to be "mark free".

I have enough good photos that i can scan tonight and send to the girls and I should be able to buy myself a couple of days time to put together their pictures and send them off to them...in that time, I hope I can correct the 4 or 5 pictures that are good and need correcting....one thing is for sure...I definetly want to shoot some of them again.....in a better setting with controlled light.

http://www.rangefinderforum.com/forums/attachment.php?attachmentid=72191&d=1249809514

http://www.rangefinderforum.com/forums/attachment.php?attachmentid=72190&d=1249809433

http://www.rangefinderforum.com/forums/attachment.php?attachmentid=72192&d=1249809654
cheers, michael
72192 72190 72191

Roger Hicks
08-09-2009, 02:38
Sorry Roger...you're right...thanks for letting me know....cheers, michael

Dear Michael,

Thanks very much indeed. I've now read it all for the first time. Fascinating! Congratulations!

And I look forward to more pics.

Cheers,

Roger

michaelbialecki
08-09-2009, 02:38
ok, here are some more......
these girls were my drinking and dancing friends...I hung out with them most of the night...
http://www.rangefinderforum.com/forums/attachment.php?attachmentid=72194&d=1249810310

http://www.rangefinderforum.com/forums/attachment.php?attachmentid=72195&d=1249810392

http://www.rangefinderforum.com/forums/attachment.php?attachmentid=72193&d=1249810221
cheers, michael


7219372194
72195

flip
08-09-2009, 02:43
Good work if you can find it.

Renzsu
08-09-2009, 02:46
Can't really comment on the marks, just that I usually get rid of dust / spots / marks in Lightroom with one of those clone like brushes.. in Photoshop you can probably use the healing brush or one of the other brushes underneath that button.

Anyways, these look great :) Hope you'll post up a couple more! Enjoyed reading your story as well, what a great experience!
edit: you just did, haha, excellent :)

michaelbialecki
08-09-2009, 02:49
This was the table that I was sitting at....it was an excellent table to say the least
http://www.rangefinderforum.com/forums/attachment.php?attachmentid=72197&d=1249810883

http://www.rangefinderforum.com/forums/attachment.php?attachmentid=72196&d=1249810814

this one is of me...obviously I did not take it and yes, it is out of focus...but I think you guys can see how happy I am
http://www.rangefinderforum.com/forums/attachment.php?attachmentid=72198&d=1249810924

cheers, michael

7219672197
72198

ustedalen
08-09-2009, 03:01
Wow, I'm jealous. Seems like you've had a lot of fun.

Were you actually able to concentrate on photography while you were there? ;)

michaelbialecki
08-09-2009, 03:02
This photo has some crazy lighting going on
http://www.rangefinderforum.com/forums/attachment.php?attachmentid=72199&d=1249811554

http://www.rangefinderforum.com/forums/attachment.php?attachmentid=72201&d=1249811965

http://www.rangefinderforum.com/forums/attachment.php?attachmentid=72200&d=1249811891
cheers, michael


72201

leicashot
08-09-2009, 03:06
my god, one of those girls is a friend of mine, haha, looked like fun.

michaelbialecki
08-09-2009, 03:10
alright, that's it for now....I am going to get busy scanning some more and email the girls tonight....I want them to see their pictures....I am definitely going to re-shoot some of these girls in a better environment...perhaps meet some of them this week for lunch and give them some prints and arrange another shoot........I love Bangkok....cheers, michael

topoxforddoc
08-09-2009, 03:15
Michael,

It looks like you had a great time. Seems like you'll be even busier after you send all those emails.

Charlie

michaelbialecki
08-09-2009, 03:15
my god, one of those girls is a friend of mine, haha, looked like fun.

are you serious....that is so funny

leicashot
08-09-2009, 03:17
Yep, better not say which one, but I sent her the link to the pics, so I'm sure she'll be pleased.

michaelbialecki
08-09-2009, 03:23
Yep, better not say which one, but I sent her the link to the pics, so I'm sure she'll be pleased.

that is so cool....wow, do you live in Bangkok....pm me if you get a chance..I am curious to know which one, because it can help me tonight when I scan the images.....cheers, michael

BTW, you are lucky...you have some cool friends....all the girls in the pictures above were so cool...they were very fun to hang out with.....and they all spoke good English too....

Oscar Levant
08-09-2009, 03:27
If you go to the Eden Club, Sukhumvit Soi 7/1, you'll find you can barfine most of your "models" there.

michaelbialecki
08-09-2009, 03:36
If you go to the Eden Club, Sukhumvit Soi 7/1, you'll find you can barfine most of your "models" there.


WOW...I don't agree with you...I know the Eden Club and I am positive these girls don't work there...that's just not true at all....I am aware of what you are talking about but...I think that is a big misconception about Bangkok....not all Thai girls are like that...

michaelbialecki
08-09-2009, 04:45
Hey thanks Double Negative......I love living in Thailand....This country has lots of great places to travel and photograph...and its location makes it ideal to travel to neighboring countries that have some interesting "probelms" going on....I love going to Myanmar, Laos and Cambodia when I have tme to work on projects....but honestly, living in Bangkok is awsome.....thanks a lot.....cheers, michael.....

craygc
08-09-2009, 05:10
If you go to the Eden Club, Sukhumvit Soi 7/1, you'll find you can barfine most of your "models" there.


Left or right side of the yellow line :D

oscroft
08-09-2009, 06:01
I love living in Thailand....This country has lots of great places to travel and photograph...and its location makes it ideal to travel to neighboring countries that have some interesting "probelms" going on....I love going to Myanmar, Laos and Cambodia when I have tme to work on projects....but honestly, living in Bangkok is awsome.....thanks a lot.....cheers, michael.....
Hi Michael,

I certainly agree with that - I usually spend about half the year there (though various things have kept me away since last November). We live down Sukhumvit 77, which seems to me to be quite a nice location.

I should be heading back there within the next month - maybe we should arrange a BKK RF meet?

Cheers,

michaelbialecki
08-09-2009, 06:53
Hey Alan....I live on Ramakamhang...which is pretty close to you....I am on Sukhumvit 71 almost everyday.....yeah, lets hook up when you get back in town...I will ask Mitch and Simon to come as well....cheers, michael

michaelbialecki
08-09-2009, 07:11
Here are a couple more that I like....

http://www.rangefinderforum.com/forums/attachment.php?attachmentid=72209&d=1249826776

http://www.rangefinderforum.com/forums/attachment.php?attachmentid=72208&d=1249826531

http://www.rangefinderforum.com/forums/attachment.php?attachmentid=72207&d=1249826448

cheers, michael


72209

Krosya
08-09-2009, 07:19
Great photos! Beautiful girls and great use of the CV 35/1.2 lens! You should post these on the Bokeh discussion threads! ;)

oscroft
08-09-2009, 07:23
Hey Alan....I live on Ramakamhang...which is pretty close to you....I am on Sukhumvit 71 almost everyday.....yeah, lets hook up when you get back in town...I will ask Mitch and Simon to come as well....cheers, michael
Sounds cool. If you mean Simon Larbalestier, isn't he back in the UK now? (I really must drop him a line)

michaelbialecki
08-09-2009, 07:30
Yeah, I think you are right...Simon is back in the U.K...he mentioned it somewhere in this thread...not so sure when he comes back...I was going to email him and Mitch...you come back in about a month, huh?...I wonder if those guys will be in town....it would be cool if they were.....alright, drop me a pm when you are back...we can hook up....cheers, michael

michaelbialecki
08-09-2009, 10:22
here is one more......
http://www.rangefinderforum.com/forums/attachment.php?attachmentid=72216&d=1249838480

72216

fixbones
08-10-2009, 03:49
lucky lucky man. pretty pretty girls!!!
Like the overall look of the photos. It has this classic/retro look and feel to it.

michaelbialecki
08-10-2009, 04:02
lucky lucky man. pretty pretty girls!!!
Like the overall look of the photos. It has this classic/retro look and feel to it.

hey thanks....I appreciate that...I emailed some of the models last night some of their photos and I have been getting excellent responses back all day.....I am going to be shooting a lot of them again in a more controlled environment....I have spent the last 2 days scanning and sending emails out....the ones that have emailed me back are so happy with what they see.....I can't wait to shoot some of them again...they were a lot of fun to work with....cheers....michael

fixbones
08-10-2009, 06:21
It'll be hard to believe if they didn't like the pictures.
Looking forward to more from you.

michaelbialecki
08-10-2009, 08:56
Here a couple of more...

http://www.rangefinderforum.com/forums/attachment.php?attachmentid=72261&d=1249919326

http://www.rangefinderforum.com/forums/attachment.php?attachmentid=72260&d=1249919237
cheers, michael

72261

pesphoto
08-10-2009, 08:59
Thud! Thats it, Im moving in with you!

michaelbialecki
08-10-2009, 09:02
Here are two that I think you guys might like

http://www.rangefinderforum.com/forums/attachment.php?attachmentid=72263&d=1249920056

http://www.rangefinderforum.com/forums/attachment.php?attachmentid=72262&d=1249919987

cheers, michael



72263

FrankS
08-10-2009, 09:04
The girls are certainly pretty, but the photos somehow don't grab me. Maybe it's just the style? Don't know, but don't worry, you can't please everyone, and as long as the important people are pleased, that's what matters. Perhaps under conditions you can control to your liking, results will be different. I see distracting shadows and colour casts from mixed lighting sources in what has been posted so far. Can't tell from a small computer screen (netbook) but I wonder if sharpness is all there as well. (Sorry to be a bit negative.)

michaelbialecki
08-10-2009, 09:09
Hey Frank...no problem...thanks for saying something....I aprreciate it...cheers, michael

BillBingham2
08-10-2009, 09:11
My gut tells me they are trying to get the girls used to working with photographers. There is something to understanding how to interact, take directions that some beautiful girls never get.

So our friend MB is taking one for the team, way to go.

I have to admit while they are fun to look at, they are not my style. Not sure how I would shot the same, intersting path to traverse though.

B2 (;->

FrankS
08-10-2009, 09:25
Yes. Very interesting journey. Lucky guy.

arseniii
08-10-2009, 09:46
good! But I expected to see more journalistic(unstaged) approach... Wonderful photos anyway!

Olsen
08-10-2009, 09:50
!! Poor girls...!

michaelbialecki
08-10-2009, 09:57
poor Olsen

Jonas
08-10-2009, 10:05
Nice work. Seems like a hard day at work :D

Seems like the girls where enjoying themselfs so dont get Olsen´s comment though...

Oscar Levant
08-10-2009, 11:06
I'd say you got a bunch of snapshots of some somewhat below average to slightly above average Thai bargirls, with a number of Kathoeys in the mix. One or two are fairly attractive, the rest are decidedly only average.

None are top model quality, nor are they intended to be, this "party" was a look-see for "clients".

High class girls from upper class Thai families would never be tattooed or parade in bikinis at night. I don't see any stunners.

A good number of them are recently arrived Issan farm girls who have been heavily made-up.

I used to spend a good amount of time in Thailand. Enjoy it and have fun, but this is certainly not something to get yourself worked up into a frenzy over.

You have to open your eyes to what you're looking at. You may not be familiar with genuine "model" agencies.

Just what Milan fashion designer is expected to hire these "models" to strut down a catwalk wearing haute coutre?

Pablito
08-10-2009, 11:13
Oscar speaks the truth.

Well, mostly. Re which ones are kathoey, I honestly can't tell.

Oscar Levant
08-10-2009, 11:18
On your Flickr page, you devote a large amount of space to your "ex-girlfriend". Why is she now an "ex"?

Oscar Levant
08-10-2009, 11:26
Sometimes it's hard to tell, especially at night through a haze of alcohol, but after a while in BKK you develop a pretty reliable "sixth sense".

Some of the post op ones are so real it's frightening.


Oscar speaks the truth.

Well, mostly. Re which ones are kathoey, I honestly can't tell.

sevo
08-10-2009, 11:33
On your Flickr page, you devote a large amount of space to your "ex-girlfriend". Why is she now an "ex"?

Unfair question, and quite beside the point - obviously not because he's been hanging out too much in Thai whorehouses, or he'd know the girls and even more so the not-quite-girls by sight...

Sevo

Roger Hicks
08-10-2009, 12:20
The problem is, there are several strands at work here simultaneously:

1 Jammy ***, being in Thailand instead of cold, rainy, miserable [fill in space]

2 Jammy ***, being invited to this sort of thing

3 Gorgeous girls!

4 What equipment to take? (genuine question)

5 How to get better next time? (The real question for Michael now)

The point is that we can all see what we did wrong last time, e.g. messy backgrounds, awkward shadows. I've just faced the same thing, and here are a couple of examples (friends' daughters when they and their parents came to stay for 10 days):

Aaargh: pics follow in post 126. Oh, the wonders of computers! (I hit the wrong combination of buttons early on and had to try to keep editing).

Cheers,

R.

Roger Hicks
08-10-2009, 12:29
Pics from post #125:

Claudia 'long legs' shot (24 Summilux): messy background, pony-tail lost

Ellen with gun (C-Sonnar 50): saucepan behind head.

We can ALWAYS see how to get better -- and I'm sure Michael can too. (Or if we can't, we're arrogant, stupid or maybe just lucky.)

Cheers,

R.

FrankS
08-10-2009, 12:33
Roger, WHAT are you teaching that child (with the gun)?

She is using the wrong eye!

:)

Roger Hicks
08-10-2009, 12:37
Roger, WHAT are you teaching that child (with the gun)?

She is using the wrong eye!

:)
Dear Frank

Don't think so. Frances shoots (mostly) left-eyed; I shoot (mostly) right eyed. Guns and cameras. I also fence with either hand (or used to, anyway)

The alarming-looking pistol is actually a .22 Weinrauch HW 45 air pistol which Ellen is too weak to cock.

Cheers,

R.

kermaier
08-10-2009, 12:55
Don't think so. Frances shoots (mostly) left-eyed; I shoot (mostly) right eyed.

My father told me a story from when he was in basic training (US Army) in 1972. His first day on the rifle range with his M-16, he was squinting down the barrel at the target and, though he held the rifle right-handed, found that he could see better with his left eye. As he was getting ready to shoot, the instructor said "Kermaier, go ahead and pull that trigger, then head down to the aid station to get your broken nose set." :)

::Ari

Roger Hicks
08-10-2009, 13:02
My father told me a story from when he was in basic training (US Army) in 1972. His first day on the rifle range with his M-16, he was squinting down the barrel at the target and, though he held the rifle right-handed, found that he could see better with his left eye. As he was getting ready to shoot, the instructor said "Kermaier, go ahead and pull that trigger, then head down to the aid station to get your broken nose set." :)

::Ari

Dear Ari,

Dunno. Being strongly right-eyed I ALWAYS shoot long guns that way. But although Frances was well surprised the first time she fired the .44 magnum (arms straight up with the recoil) she's never hurt herself with a pistol or indeed with long guns. What's the current or at least recent .223 military issue long gun? She even held that one left handed (though maybe that protects the nose).

Note: this is NOT thread hijacking. Whether you're shooting pistol, rifle, rangefinder or even (holds nose, shudders) SLR, you need to be aware of a lot more than just the target in the middle of your sights.

Tashi delek,

R.

elmer3.5
08-10-2009, 13:04
What a lucky man!

These girls are soooooo beautiful, those tiny sweet little bikinis..... it aches to see those shots. I was to answer some bokeh thread but with this one.....

By the way nice shots also, hahaha!

What else can i say!

Keep your good luck!

Elmer

Al Patterson
08-10-2009, 13:26
The girls are certainly pretty, but the photos somehow don't grab me. Maybe it's just the style? Don't know, but don't worry, you can't please everyone, and as long as the important people are pleased, that's what matters. Perhaps under conditions you can control to your liking, results will be different. I see distracting shadows and colour casts from mixed lighting sources in what has been posted so far. Can't tell from a small computer screen (netbook) but I wonder if sharpness is all there as well. (Sorry to be a bit negative.)

I like the various composition of some of the shots, but the lighting is a tad harsh. Some of those models look whiter than I do in some shots.

It would be interesting to see what he could do in an environment where he had control over the lighting.

George S.
08-10-2009, 13:44
You guys are being too harsh. Yes, there are some confusing backgrounds or mixed lighting, but there was probably too many models and it was probably like turning a 5 year old loose in a toy store....sure, he'll grab a bunch of toys but will he think carefully about it?

And a couple of the girls are certainly pretty IMO.

Roger Hicks
08-10-2009, 14:00
You guys are being too harsh. Yes, there are some confusing backgrounds or mixed lighting, but there was probably too many models and it was probably like turning a 5 year old loose in a toy store....sure, he'll grab a bunch of toys but will he think carefully about it?

And a couple of the girls are certainly pretty IMO.

No, not harsh at all. If you can't see (from your previous pics) how to take even better pics next time, you might as well give up photography.

And if you can't think about how to take better pics, at least some of the time, you can't really call yourself a photographer. Do you know the expression, "Lead on Dick, and I'll follow"?

I very much look forward to pics of the same girls, with more experience on the photographers's part, and less pressure. He has indicated that this is going to happen. Good luck, I say!

Cheers,

R.

antiquark
08-10-2009, 14:07
... the rest are decidedly only average....

...None are top model quality...

... I don't see any stunners.

A good number of them are recently arrived Issan farm girls who have been heavily made-up.


Wow, what a nasty case of "sour grapes" you've got! :D

kermaier
08-10-2009, 14:25
Dear Ari,

Dunno. Being strongly right-eyed I ALWAYS shoot long guns that way. But although Frances was well surprised the first time she fired the .44 magnum (arms straight up with the recoil) she's never hurt herself with a pistol or indeed with long guns. What's the current or at least recent .223 military issue long gun? She even held that one left handed (though maybe that protects the nose).

Note: this is NOT thread hijacking. Whether you're shooting pistol, rifle, rangefinder or even (holds nose, shudders) SLR, you need to be aware of a lot more than just the target in the middle of your sights.

Tashi delek,

R.

Well, clearly it's different for a long gun vs. a pistol. If the cheekpiece on the stock puts your nose not far aft of the receiver, then you'd better match handedness to eyedness, unless your shooting stance is rock-solid w.r.t. head/hand/shoulder position during recoil. You probably also need to take into account whether the bolt/slide is internal to the receiver or external. For example, if you mix eye and hand orientation, most bolt-action rifles would hit your nose when you cycle the bolt unless you move your head out of shooting position to do so.

A friend of mine constantly complains about shooting his Leica M7 left-eyed, because his nose keeps moving the ISO dial. :)

::Ari

Chriscrawfordphoto
08-10-2009, 14:32
What's kathoey? I've seen some people in the thread calling some of the models that.

functus
08-10-2009, 14:36
What's kathoey? I've seen some people in the thread calling some of the models that.

Otherwise known as transgendered (perhaps or perhaps not post-operatively).

Roger Hicks
08-10-2009, 14:45
Well, clearly it's different for a long gun vs. a pistol. If the cheekpiece on the stock puts your nose not far aft of the receiver, then you'd better match handedness to eyedness, unless your shooting stance is rock-solid w.r.t. head/hand/shoulder position during recoil. You probably also need to take into account whether the bolt/slide is internal to the receiver or external. For example, if you mix eye and hand orientation, most bolt-action rifles would hit your nose when you cycle the bolt unless you move your head out of shooting position to do so.

A friend of mine constantly complains about shooting his Leica M7 left-eyed, because his nose keeps moving the ISO dial. :)

::Ari

Dear Ari,

Hmmm... Have to get hold of Lee Enfield .303 and check this (the only rifle I really want to own, and on which I was trained in the 60s). The only full-bore rifle I actually do own is a 30-06 inherited from my late father in law (I don't' count .22) but it and I are 5000 miles apart.

Then there were the falling-block (Winchester-action) rifles I also tried in the 60s. It's all so long ago. You no doubt know the saying, "If you remember the 1960s, you weren't there."

Yet again, not entirely thread hijacking. South-East Asia... 1960s... Guns... Oh, dear. Glad I was living in the UK and Bermuda. Too many of my friends went to Vietnam. The whole of South-East Asia was shaped by that epoch. Do you know the war photographer, Tim Page? The only man I know who has been pronounced DOA twice (at two different hospitals). Bar girls or models: it's a lot better than my 'teens and 20s...

Cheers,

R.

functus
08-10-2009, 16:00
You just have to go to the right bars ....

Pablito
08-10-2009, 16:03
You just have to go to the right bars ....

...just about anywhere in the world...

Chriscrawfordphoto
08-10-2009, 16:49
Dear Fred,

Or the UK or Bermuda or California or France or indeed most of Europe. I had to look this up too. Perhaps they are common in New York but not elsewhere (at least outside Thailand).

Tashi delek,

R.

Yeah, I had never heard that term anywhere either and I'm pretty well read. I've never been to Thailand, and have no interest in ever doing so.

michaelbialecki
08-10-2009, 16:51
what happened to this thread?

antiquark
08-10-2009, 16:55
what happened to this thread?

The trolls took over.

maddoc
08-10-2009, 16:55
what happened to this thread?

This is RFF, you know ... :eek::D;)

Some very nice shots, BTW !

chippy
08-10-2009, 17:07
Dear Frank

Don't think so. Frances shoots (mostly) left-eyed; I shoot (mostly) right eyed. Guns and cameras. I also fence with either hand (or used to, anyway)

The alarming-looking pistol is actually a .22 Weinrauch HW 45 air pistol which Ellen is too weak to cock.

Cheers,

R.

Roger,
I actually thought Frank was referring to what might be considered correct by the way of the stance, leading hand/grip being for right handedness shooting but using left eye..using the left eye, shouldn't these (leading hand/grip ) things be reversed. just as with your fencing example, if you swapped to left hand then you would also change your stance and your leading hand/arm...it would be a bit odd to fence from a right handed stance holding the foil in the left hand would it not?

Krosya
08-10-2009, 17:10
what happened to this thread?

Dont worry about it - just post some more pics! ;)

chippy
08-10-2009, 17:27
Pics from post #125:

Claudia 'long legs' shot (24 Summilux): messy background, pony-tail lost

Ellen with gun (C-Sonnar 50): saucepan behind head.

We can ALWAYS see how to get better -- and I'm sure Michael can too. (Or if we can't, we're arrogant, stupid or maybe just lucky.)

Cheers,

R.
Dear Roger,

i do agree with the message you have been communicating that we all learn (must learn) and improve from critically looking at our (and others) previous efforts...seeing how you posted those pics illustrating a couple of faults i hope you dont mind me adding, that one of the first things i noticed with the Claudia shot was the hands and open fingers, in portraiture that is what we often refer to a the 'claw look' to be avoided generally.

SolaresLarrave
08-10-2009, 17:42
Michael, I think you did reasonably well, considering that this type of photography isn't your cup of tea. I too have seen your more journalistic work (and admired it too) in Flickr, so you didn't do too poorly here. Here, the light was beyond your control, and so were the models, as you didn't pick them and didn't know them either.

I don't think I'd be approached for that kind of gig... and if I did, I simply couldn't pull it off like you did. :)

pesphoto
08-10-2009, 17:56
any more pics :)

JSU
08-10-2009, 17:59
what happened to this thread?

Trolls or maybe just sour grapes. Regardless of gender orientation (clearly some of these WOMEN are lacking Adam's Apples) this was a reasonable opportunity to make images and refine technique. Don't stop, keep shooting!

Your images look rushed, maybe you had too much going on around you.

With the 35/1.2 wide open you should have been able to isolate the subject a bit better. I also think you have some issues with your scans as too many highlights are blown out.

Otherwise, not bad, not great, but not bad at all.

chippy
08-10-2009, 18:39
ok, here are some photos from last night....I have a problem....on some of the negatives/prints, there are some spots (chemical residue) that I can't brush off with an anti static brush...I fear that the negatives are marked (not really scratched)

I am going to need to learn some quick photo shop skills...I probably only have about 4 or 5 pictures that are good that I want to send to the agency and the girls that need touching up because some of the marks on the negative are on parts of the girls bodies in the photos..all the other negatives and photos seem to be "mark free".

I have enough good photos that i can scan tonight and send to the girls and I should be able to buy myself a couple of days time to put together their pictures and send them off to them...in that time, I hope I can correct the 4 or 5 pictures that are good and need correcting....one thing is for sure...I definetly want to shoot some of them again.....in a better setting with controlled light.

http://www.rangefinderforum.com/forums/attachment.php?attachmentid=72191&d=1249809514

http://www.rangefinderforum.com/forums/attachment.php?attachmentid=72190&d=1249809433

http://www.rangefinderforum.com/forums/attachment.php?attachmentid=72192&d=1249809654
cheers, michael
72192 72190 72191

Michael,
thanks for this thread posting the pics of your experience, you relayed your excitement from before it started which flowed through, trepidation because it was not the sort of photography you are accustomed too and of course how much you enjoyed the experience and the networking opportunities that opened up, to be able to shoot the girls in a more controlled environment at a later date is very rewarding. I have enjoyed the thread and i would certainly like to see more and also from your later controlled shoots with the models (i would agree they are in no way practiced models though, in the sense of the word/profession), with your particular style shown here it would have been good if you allowed to shoot pics at the party afterwards (looks like a few were?), this/your style may have been more suited to that.

I realise you had a great experience, and from this you will have the opportunity to continue with some of the models, so you are indeed in front and have(will) benefited, which is fantastic. There has been some criticism, if not taken personally then reasonably constructive i think, i.e frank, roger, some on mixed lighting etc, even Oscars even though it may come across bluntly is relevant.

But I am wondering though what your own thoughts might be and just how satisfied you are yourself with the shots overall, because I noticed you said that the agency sent you some sample shots of what they wanted, but it appears that you say you only have 4-5 pictures to send them out of 15 rolls shot.

In hindsight would it be fair to say that you might of teetered between shooting styes of fashion/glamour and candid or reportage.

most enjoyable seeing all this though and some of the girls are attractive, hope you post more!

FrankS
08-10-2009, 18:57
I totally agree with Andrew. A very engaging thread that takes us through the whole process with you. I hesitated to post anything negative, but felt emotionally committed enough to do so. I'm happy it was taken well. The situation would certainly be an intimidating one to be thrown into, and the second time around, things are much easier. The experience gained was valuable. Another shoot like this will be "old hat" for you.

Simon Larbalestier
08-11-2009, 00:26
I think their gender, class status or which part of Thailand they came from is irrelevant in the context of the validity the photos themselves - what matters is what Michael got out if it. If anything it was a great source for making contacts and the chance to make further photos in an environment he can control himself. I look forward to seeing what Michael shoots once he's had chance to arrange some new venues.

Roger Hicks
08-11-2009, 00:57
Dear Roger,

i do agree with the message you have been communicating that we all learn (must learn) and improve from critically looking at our (and others) previous efforts...seeing how you posted those pics illustrating a couple of faults i hope you dont mind me adding, that one of the first things i noticed with the Claudia shot was the hands and open fingers, in portraiture that is what we often refer to a the 'claw look' to be avoided generally.

Dear Andrew,

No, I don't mind at all. It's an expression I'd heard before, though I have to say it doesn't worry me all that much in that picture.

It was the classic problem of concentrating on one thing -- I wanted to try the 'pointed toes to avoid big feet' -- with the result that I didn't pay enough attention to others.

Cheers,

R.

Cheers,

R.

elshaneo
08-11-2009, 01:01
Thanks Michael for posting the photos. I do find some of the ladies to be very pretty indeed. I remember that long time ago when I went to Thailand for holidays, the people there were very friendly, it's great to see that the girls were indeed very warm and friendly to you ;-)

sevo
08-11-2009, 01:02
I think their gender, class status or which part of Thailand they came from is irrelevant in the context of the validity the photos themselves

Well, the subject does not exactly lend itself to the creation of abstract art - and photographic essays without any context would be pointless indeed.

As demonstrated by his published work, Michael is a absolutely first class reporter. But in this case he acted as a naive participant, i.e. a kid in a candy shop rather than a reporter. And the pictures show it - none of them put their subject into context or tell a story. Which is a pity, as every bar girl or ladyboy (and as far as I know even high-fashion supermodels) would have a story to tell, and Michael has already done pretty fine social reportage - I'd have loved to see something more substantial from him...

Sevo

michaelbialecki
08-11-2009, 01:23
where do I even begin?

Keith
08-11-2009, 01:33
I was recently asked if I could photograph some 'hair models' at a function at some high flying nightclub here in Brisbane in a few weeks. It seemed like a good idea initially but on the advice of a good friend who takes a keen interest in my photography I declined. He gave me very specific reasons for staying clear of it which I won't go into but I believe he was correct in his estimation that it wasn't something I needed to do!

I personally feel that Michael could have done the same and possibly should have .... the photos, as pleasant as they may be, are not something I would want in my portfolio! (if I had one! :p)

Michael's milage may vary of course. :)

chippy
08-11-2009, 01:49
a bit cryptic Keith, not knowing exactly what you mean i would say, do it if it interests you, no harm no fowl, it doesnt have to end up in your portfolio ...if you had one ;)

leicashot
08-11-2009, 01:49
Guys, this event is a common place for photography nuts. Basically this is the scenario: A Publicist or promoter will hold a small time event. They can't get any major press coverage so they invite friends and 'photography nuts' (no offense there guys) to cover the event in hope that they provide images at the end for promotional, and sometimes commercial usage, with no royalties to the photographer. It's as simple as that....and with so many people interested in photography these days, it ain't hard to find capable people with cameras that are interested in shooting models poolside!

Heck, if I was Mike, or an old dirty man, I'd jump at the opportunity for the experience...and if I declined, they'd have another 100 ready to take my place.

sevo
08-11-2009, 02:19
where do I even begin?

You made contacts, collected names and telephone numbers? Use them to get at the people themselves. It will probably mean interviewing the girls in full dress, though...

Oscar Levant
08-11-2009, 02:27
Santa Fe is no better than Indiana.

"Anywhere outside of New York is Cleveland"

- W. C. Fields


Fred, You're preaching to the choir here. I'm stuck here unless I want to give my son back to his mentally ill mother. The split second he turns 18, we're heading back to Santa Fe.

michaelbialecki
08-11-2009, 02:32
"where do I even begin?"

You made contacts, collected names and telephone numbers? Use them to get at the people themselves. It will probably mean interviewing the girls in full dress, though...

that's not what I meant.....I was commenting on what happened to this thread.....but thanks anyways.....

Simon Larbalestier
08-11-2009, 02:40
Well, the subject does not exactly lend itself to the creation of abstract art - and photographic essays without any context would be pointless indeed.

As demonstrated by his published work, Michael is a absolutely first class reporter. But in this case he acted as a naive participant, i.e. a kid in a candy shop rather than a reporter. And the pictures show it - none of them put their subject into context or tell a story. Which is a pity, as every bar girl or ladyboy (and as far as I know even high-fashion supermodels) would have a story to tell, and Michael has already done pretty fine social reportage - I'd have loved to see something more substantial from him...

Sevo

Unless i'm mistaken it was a poolparty event and Michael posted a note asking for some advice re what equipment to take, the thread built interest and he showed some of the pics from the event as requested. Calling him a "naive participant" seems somewhat unfair. Sure there's plenty of potential material for a deeper social story regarding their backgrounds and life style should Michael choose to follow that up but that's a well trodden path in SE Asia so that's really up to him. Like i said the point is he met new people and made contacts - and in the context of that evening and event - everyone involved seems to be happy. So job done.

michaelbialecki
08-11-2009, 02:43
thanks Simon.....

leicashot
08-11-2009, 02:48
Everyone's just somewhat jealous...and as usual, think they can do better. Good on Michael for putting his camera where his mouth is!

Oscar Levant
08-11-2009, 02:49
It's a fine thing to be young and to be in Bangkok. Photography is definitely secondary.

michaelbialecki
08-11-2009, 02:50
just forget it...they dont get it..this thread is dead!.....some people here have some issues.....

craygc
08-11-2009, 03:19
The one thing that's true about Bangkok, or Thailand in general for that matter, is that it's never what most people see or think it is. There are the obvious aspects of the place but even those underlie something completely different. Having lived and worked in Bangkok myself, and I thoroughly enjoy the place, I resign myself to never really understanding the Thai physce...

Simon Larbalestier
08-11-2009, 03:24
Fred thanks that's very kind of you to say - I have recently signed with a gallery in LA - it's selling early work mostly - the SE Asian images will take longer to get into circulation as I have to sort out the print editions and find a more reliable paper supplier. There's a lot of social documentary projects from Cambodia that have lain dormant since my agency Anarchy Images folded last year. Selling these types of images as prints in a gallery isn't right for me but I think few galleries would show them unless they could sell them. So for now they're unseen.

Simon Larbalestier
08-11-2009, 03:29
The one thing that's true about Bangkok, or Thailand in general for that matter, is that is never what most people see or think it is. There are the obvious aspects of the place but even those underlie something completely different. Having lived and worked in Bangkok myself, and I thoroughly enjoy the place, I resign myself to never really understanding the Thai physce...

Words that are very wise Craig and I feel the same way about the Khmer's - Phomn Penh as a city is changing very fast - there's a big interest in photography there now which is great as it takes the focus off Siem Reap a place that's changed in size and it's original character, out of all proportion.

Oscar Levant
08-11-2009, 04:10
Beautiful girls in BKK, ain't they?

http://farm1.static.flickr.com/99/298812028_9021502814.jpg

Al Patterson
08-11-2009, 04:32
just forget it...they dont get it..this thread is dead!.....some people here have some issues.....

Thanks for sharing your work. Don't let those with issues get you down.

BillBingham2
08-11-2009, 05:31
Michael,

One of the things to remember is that every time you pick up a camera it's a chance to learn and grow. Doesn't have to happen, for many it does not, but for some on a good day it does. For good photographers growing can happen in many ways. Making better pictures, learning more about people, improving the way you communicate with subjects, uncovering a new angle, just a few of the many things you might learn.

I think one of the challenges for some people is to learn how to work through their feelings. Be it a very positive attraction or an ubber negative repulsion finding it within yourself to take the best picture you can. Something you are happy with and in this case your subjects and host are happy with.

You've made some people very happy with your work and with the way you acted, with respect and interest. The impression you left was positive and positive enough that some of your subjects wanted to see the work and perhaps ask you to shoot some more.

At the end of the day you did great all around.

Hang in there and please ignore the trolls. Some times, one of the pains of freedom is it's best point, it's for everyone.

Keep sharing and thanks.

B2 (;->

ethics_gradient
08-11-2009, 06:21
, and sometimes commercial usage, with no royalties to the photographer.

It's not as if they're taking bread off his table, foreigners aren't permitted to work as photographers in Thailand.

Oscar Levant
08-11-2009, 06:28
Nobody was "trolling" him.

"Educating" him perhaps, but not trolling.

He had fun, he mingled with a bunch of bikini-clad "girls" and he played around with his old cameras. He gave a bunch of gawking, late middle-aged internet lurkers a bit of a vicarious thrill.

I'd probably go and do the same. But it's best to know what you're looking at, and maybe he learned something.

Al Kaplan
08-11-2009, 06:45
Maybe you'll be fortunate enough to run into some of these sexy young girls again in thirty or forty years and shoot some "after" photos.

Krosya
08-11-2009, 07:11
Nobody was "trolling" him.

"Educating" him perhaps, but not trolling.

He had fun, he mingled with a bunch of bikini-clad "girls" and he played around with his old cameras. He gave a bunch of gawking, late middle-aged internet lurkers a bit of a vicarious thrill.

I'd probably go and do the same. But it's best to know what you're looking at, and maybe he learned something.

Geez, isnt it time to let it go? After all these comments why would anyone post thier stories/photos? WHat matters is that Michael had a great time, took some photos that he is happy with, wanted to share with others and now will probably never post again. Who are you doing service with this "educating"?

Oscar Levant
08-11-2009, 07:14
Fine. I really liked the cool photos he took with his classic gear. The girls were super-hot and sexy. I hope u invite me to the next one! You are so lucky!!

Krosya
08-11-2009, 07:22
“One always speaks badly when one has nothing to say”

Voltaire

Oscar Levant
08-11-2009, 07:26
"Optimism is the madness of insisting that all is well when we are miserable. "

Voltaire

oscroft
08-11-2009, 07:34
It's a fine thing to be young and to be in Bangkok
Well, I reckon one out of two ain't bad ;)

gabrioladude
08-11-2009, 08:14
let me say at the outset that I have nothing insightful to add to this thread
however I wanted to thank Michael for the time and effort he has put into this thread including making the effort to post the pictures.

I tune into RFF for the knowledge and entertainment which can be gleaned here

this thread has been very high on the entertainment quotient and not so high on the knowledge quotient, but that's ok...I've enjoyed it...

George S.
08-11-2009, 08:55
Yes, Roger. Given the context of the event, some are being harsh. You don't get it, I'm afraid. It was a party, also a free-for-all and not a very structured shoot and Michael did not have control over a lot of things- backgrounds, lighting, outfits, make-up etc. He cannot be held 100% responsible if the shots don't meet your high standards... Kind of like if I went to a classic car show and began snapping shots under mixed lighting. I would fully expect most of the shots to be average or so-so. If the sponsors of the car show later on would express interest in 5 or 6 of my shots, then I'd consider that a plus. I wouldn't expect my competency as a photographer to be judged on this one event. I believe he posted them here in the same vein that the evening was- for fun. He certainly did not post them as any sort of resume. I'm certain he is astute enough to realize what went right and what went wrong.

George S.

No, not harsh at all. If you can't see (from your previous pics) how to take even better pics next time, you might as well give up photography.

And if you can't think about how to take better pics, at least some of the time, you can't really call yourself a photographer. Do you know the expression, "Lead on Dick, and I'll follow"?

I very much look forward to pics of the same girls, with more experience on the photographers's part, and less pressure. He has indicated that this is going to happen. Good luck, I say!

Cheers,

R.

ferider
08-11-2009, 09:59
I recommend to have a look at Michael's flickr stream:

http://www.flickr.com/photos/[email protected]

Some really great stuff in there.

Dave Wilkinson
08-11-2009, 11:43
Looks to me like someone should buy those 'girls' a few good 'square meals':eek:
Dave.

danwilly
08-11-2009, 13:27
maybe a one-use disposable camera from the drugstore would do it.

nzeeman
08-11-2009, 13:40
i dont understand why transgender persons would not be tolerated - they dont do anything bad. and those girls were pretty and with good bodies no matter if they were girls or transgender...

nzeeman
08-11-2009, 13:49
in serbia people are even less tolerant -they beat people on gay pride parade. :S
i simply dont understand why people are so upset about sex - there are so many things that people do in bed but only gay stuff is observed as sick... but this is way offtopic sorry...

Roger Hicks
08-11-2009, 14:06
My generation was pretty much brought up to be homophobic but I think that most of us have grown out of it, at least if we've given it more than a few seconds' thought. My own view is that homosexuality is like football: I understand that there are those who enjoy it, and the very best of luck to them, but personally, I don't want to try it and I can't see much pleasure in watching it or reading about it. Nor can I say I'd fancy a ladyboy myself but then I've never fancied straight whores either. Perhaps aficionados can distinguish between girls and 'girls' but I can't get excited either way -- except perhaps with anger that some of them are so tiny because of a poor childhood diet, which, although obvious, had not occurred to me before.

Cheers,

Roger

nzeeman
08-11-2009, 14:12
My own view is that homosexuality is like football: I understand that there are those who enjoy it, and the very best of luck to them, but personally, I can't see much pleasure in watching it or reading about it.

i always asked myself why people in US call that sport football when it is played mostly with hands...

peter_n
08-11-2009, 14:43
Yes it is rather odd. Personally I think it should be called "throwball". :D

flessas
08-11-2009, 15:16
This thread is totally bizarre..

Started with a provocative title and a question of what camera M. can use...
We read an enthusiastic text about the wonderful girls from M.

We show same overexposed, burn from the flash, with distracting shadows photos....
OK model shooting is maybe not the strength of M.
Whereas the photos from New Delhi, Calcutta and Pakistan are splendid!!!!
I believe Michael is doing a very good job as a photo journalist.:)
Then we show some weird photos of little girls shooting with air guns. :eek:We learned about .22 and .44 guns.??!!!Wow....very interesting indeed..:rolleyes:
Big boys got jealous of not being in Bangkok and be able to speak with bikini girls....
And lately the discussion turns about tolerance and transgenders ...
Only from the looks of the girls some “boys” got exited and without having met them, called them names such as transgenders, ladyboys or what not.
Interesting to notice the different opinions about tolerance and sex in both sides of the Atlantic once again....

Totally bizarre, but interesting.......

BillBingham2
08-11-2009, 15:30
Yup, one more twist and we will become the official mold outline for the next bendi-straw (kids over here used to purchase silly straws all twisted together and watch milk flow through making funny shapes) from the As Seen On TV folks.

The work on Flicker is very good.

B2 (;->

back alley
08-11-2009, 15:38
photo forum...remember folks?