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RayPA
01-02-2008, 19:24
New year. Who knew? A new who do you...like better. ;)



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Chris101
01-02-2008, 22:53
Koudelka is too euro-centric for my taste. Nothing wrong with European RF photography, but it's been done to death, hasn't it?

Arbus, Avedon - I really love both their photography - Arbus' ability to make any deep subjec to look like a casual snapshot, Avedon's ability to make even the most incidental moment look like a serious studio shoot - they both were masters of their art. But they're also both dead, so I doubt we'll be seeing anything new from them!

LaChapelle - I became aware of LaChapelle a year or two ago - at first I thought it was the drug influenced, black comedian. But they're not the same person, and I have looked at a couple dozen LaChapelle's since then. He's got now-ness down, he's retro when retro is called for, he's colorful, surreal and fun. And he can be deep and insightful when ... well he thinks so, eh? What's not to like? Of the four listed he's my favorite.

But none of my real faves are there. Where's Ralph Gibson, Greg Crewdons, Jill Greenberg, Timothy Sanders-Greenberg, Sally Mann, Susan Meiselas, ... um, lots more! If you need dead ones, hows about Mapplethorpe, Winogrand, Mortenson, Cunningham, Steichen, ... there's even more of THEM!

Or how about our own Nenad Bojic? He's as European as they come, but he also shoots the new world, and interplays them seemlessly, and with humor, just like we are all humanity. And he even publishes new stuff right here on the RFF.

Yeah, that's who I'm voting for!

payasam
01-03-2008, 00:53
Like two, don't like one, haven't heard of the fourth. Hope that helps.

kbg32
01-04-2008, 17:27
"Koudelka is too euro-centric for my taste. Nothing wrong with European RF photography, but it's been done to death, hasn't it?"

- Chris101

Koudelka is Czech. What else should he be doing, but the culture that he grew up in and is influenced by.

Arbus, Avedon, LaChapelle, aren't they, well, too American? No?

All due respect, this is an absurd statement.

Todd.Hanz
01-04-2008, 18:14
nice work Ray, first Winogrand...now Avedon, you're making this way to easy for me!

Todd

Chris101
01-04-2008, 22:38
... All due respect, this is an absurd statement.Indeed it is. Kinda like a 'this photographer or that photographer' choice, eh?

"Koudelka is too euro-centric for my taste. Nothing wrong with European RF photography, but it's been done to death, hasn't it?"

This is the most self centered ,idiotic sentence I have ever read.
The United states of America is not the center of the universe, there is a whole thriving world beyond your borders. ...Shhhh!!

(I know there are yet unconquered lands beyond our borders, but keep quiet about it will ya? It's an election year!)

I may well be an idiot, but at least I am an absurd one. Perhaps this bit of irony is my way of pointing at the absurdity of pitting the popularity of these four photographers against one another. Four distince photographers who's vision and bodies of work each have something to say. Are they in competition for ranking? Or can they stand on their own merit. Without needing to 'beat' the other three?

Did you read beyond my first statement?

RayPA
01-04-2008, 23:08
Todd, I used to look at a lot of Avedon, and kind of "lost track," until your recent set of photos reawakened that interest. This was a tough one for me, though.

I'm also a huge fan of Arbus, but recently Koudelka has done it for me (my vote).

I keep looking at La Chapelle, but it's not working for me. I appreciated Chris' read.



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RayPA
01-04-2008, 23:27
...

All due respect, this is an absurd statement.

I didn't see it as an absurd statement, Keith. I think I know what Chris means. If anything it shows some lack of familiarity of Koudelka's recent work like Chaos, which unlike his earlier work is more...global. :)


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Nando
01-15-2008, 04:19
I like them all. I like Koudelka and Avedon the most and I'm torn between which one to vote for.

kshapero
01-15-2008, 04:36
I know they are all 4 acomplished but I am a HCB groupie with a few others thrown in. I readily admit to being stupid-centric.

Nando
01-15-2008, 15:11
Ok, I was going to vote for Avedon simply because Koudelka is kicking serious ass in this pole. Must have had a brain fart and somehow voted for Koudelka by accident. RFF should have paper ballots and hand counts like up here in Canada, eh!

RayPA
01-15-2008, 15:36
Ok, I was going to vote for Avedon simply because Koudelka is kicking serious ass in this pole. Must have had a brain fart and somehow voted for Koudelka by accident. RFF should have paper ballots and hand counts like up here in Canada, eh!

A Freudian Click.


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Nando
01-15-2008, 16:16
A Freudian Click.

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Yes, probably.

Perhaps these polls should take on a tournament format matching two photographers at a time with the eventual winner going against HCB in a cage match of the championship. Personally, I'd pay to see a Nan Goldin vs Nobuyoshi Araki match. :D

RayPA
01-15-2008, 16:24
Yes, probably.

Perhaps these polls should take on a tournament format matching two photographers at a time with the eventual winner going against HCB in a cage match of the championship. Personally, I'd pay to see a Nan Goldin vs Nobuyoshi Araki match. :D

We would have to get Rich Silfver back on RFF. Only he could/would be willing to manage that! Remember the Best Looking Camera competition?



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Nando
01-15-2008, 17:27
We would have to get Rich Silfver back on RFF. Only he could/would be willing to manage that! Remember the Best Looking Camera competition?.

I wish Rich was around too. I really enjoyed his posts.

Sisyphus
01-15-2008, 18:00
Koudelka definitely--I admire how he became close and intimate with the gypsies, how worked on this project for approximately for ten years, traveling and living with them between march and november, and processing and printing his film, and living in the Magnum offices between December and February. the sacrifices he made to create such incredible images.

He created two books from this Gypsy of course and Exiles, which was created after the fact through editing but timely and appropriate none the less.

He has gone on to produce several other books, and each book being an incredibly different topic yet with the same photographic genius as gypsy's.

His work nothing less than brilliance and the fact that he is still photographing today also amazes me.