Who will be the next camera company to release a monochrome digi?

[Sejanus.Aelianus]

nemjo, that's a really very bad B&W conversion... I do not see the point you are trying to make.

It started out as colour and ended up as gray-scale. Could you define "bad" in this context?

[BobYIL]

I hope to not disappoint many but for real B&W, one of the most important characteristics of a sensor is the dynamic range so it would "capture" the tones in the nature with relatively close sensitivity to that of a fine B&W film and we will also have plenty of "play room" while PP.

I think some new sensors like the one on the D800/E, or APS-C sensors (Sony) on the K5 or D7000 with a small modification can turn into excellent B&W sensors, all are 14 Ev sensors... Who can do these the best? Fujifilm.. as they have more experience with film than the rest of the industry. Their color film emulations are exemplary. (Also the bodies to modify are ready!)

[gilpen123]

Digital has come of age, DR and high ISO capabilities are no longer a big issue. Even the OMD with a smallish sensor now has very good DR.

[gb hill]

The only reason Leica came out with this M9M is because Leica has a cult following. Who's going to buy this camera? Only collectors & Leica glue sniffers who have so much money they can't spend it all. Of course you have a few who every time a new product comes out they have to be the 1st to buy one so to say "look at me." BTW there also the 1st to post threads on the internet bi***ing why it doesn't work & has to send it back. If Nikon & Canon were ever to come out with a DRF it would put Leica out of business, but they won't because there is no market for a DRF amongst the masses.

There is already good software such as Silver Effex Pro to convert a fabulous B&W image, besides if a company like Ricoh were to come out with a B&W only sensor the web would post threads like why it wasn't a FF sensor & the such.

[btgc]

Originally Posted by nemjo

It's a joke to produce something with less possibility, by less cost and sell more expensive.

Well, I'm just guessing not relying on facts.....Sometimes lesser cars or fixed gear bikes cost more than packed family sedans or MTB's. Who has released such camera before? Does it means only removing primary color filter? I do not know. Sure some additional work, including testing, were needed. How much does it cost? Who knows, but Leica has set heir price tag. Think it's too high? Some think also their M8 and M9 cost a bit over what they cost to manufacture. They aren't exactly budget priced, right. I think with this model company is gambling as this is not camera for everyone, even not for those who normally buy new Leica model because it's new model.

[nemjo]

Originally Posted by btgc

Well, I'm just guessing not relying on facts.....Sometimes lesser cars or fixed gear bikes cost more than packed family sedans or MTB's. Who has released such camera before? Does it means only removing primary color filter? I do not know. Sure some additional work, including testing, were needed. How much does it cost? Who knows, but Leica has set heir price tag. Think it's too high? Some think also their M8 and M9 cost a bit over what they cost to manufacture. They aren't exactly budget priced, right. I think with this model company is gambling as this is not camera for everyone, even not for those who normally buy new Leica model because it's new model.

In short: as it seems now, the MM is basically an M9 with a monochrome sensor. A monochrome sensor exists in every color sensor. But the method is not to remove the primary color filter, instead not to build on it.
I meant that it's a joke that MM is more expensive than M9, not any other (color) camera.

nemjo

[bwcolor]

In order of likelyhood .. Won't happen .. Fuji/Ricoh tie.

[gb hill]

Originally Posted by nemjo

In short: as it seems now, the MM is basically an M9 with a monochrome sensor. A monochrome sensor exists in every color sensor. But the method is not to remove the primary color filter, instead not to build on it.
I meant that it's a joke that MM is more expensive than M9, not any other (color) camera.

nemjo

& the way it looks the M10 will basicly be an M9 with video capibilities! This company is totally existing on name recognition.

[btgc]

Originally Posted by nemjo

I meant that it's a joke that MM is more expensive than M9, not any other (color) camera.

I see your point. But let's see this other way - one shot in the pub costs close to whole bottle, if you shop in store. Those who go to pub are prepared for this, so are mature Leica customers. Money doesn't reflect real costs, neither in capitalist or in communism economies.

[bwcolor]

Originally Posted by gb hill

& the way it looks the M10 will basicly be an M9 with video capibilities! This company is totally existing on name recognition.

Where does this information come from? If true, does this mean CMOS?

[gb hill]

Originally Posted by bwcolor

Where does this information come from? If true, does this mean CMOS?

BJP has an article.

http://www.bjp-online.com/british-jo...s-upcoming-m10

[Alberti]

Originally Posted by gb hill

BJP has an article.

http://www.bjp-online.com/british-jo...s-upcoming-m10

There is a clear conjecture in this article:

He added: "HD video is interesting, and a lot of photographers would love to have it [in an M body]."

This implies: he could as well have been talking X2.

[bwcolor]

Originally Posted by Alberti

There is a clear conjecture in this article:


This implies: he could as well have been talking X2.

or

The promised compact M-interchangeable lens camera will probably be CMOS. It should be announced in September.

[Alberti]

Originally Posted by bwcolor

or

The promised compact M-interchangeable lens camera will probably be CMOS. It should be announced in September.

Evil, for sure, out there in the recesses of the development department

[gb hill]

Originally Posted by Alberti

There is a clear conjecture in this article:


This implies: he could as well have been talking X2.

Doesn't matter, It's speculation all over the internet that it will come out with video. Video in camera is a hot seller now. Leica is all about money. People have been bashing Chris Crawford for standing against Leica's outrageous pricing but he is 100% correct. I put Leica in the same catigory with owning a Rolex.

If Leica made a deal with Apple to put their red dot on the next iphone & Apple charge over $1000 for the phone it would sell out in no time!

[celluloidprop]

Going to say no one in the 35mm/APS/etc. market. Leica can do it because they'll sell as status goods no matter what. No one else has that cachet.

[seanbonner]

I agree the price is insane, and I'm sorry to say that but when you buy a digital camera you know that cash is basically gone and 5-10 years from now that camera will be a paperweight. So you can always argue about cost. Which isn't what I was asking. If you look at the press surrounding the M9M release, it's clear that at least some people think there is merit to this idea, and for whatever reason - to use, to collect, whatever - Leica will sell some of these.

So, with positive press and some sales for a $8K camera, my question is not so much if, but who will be the first digital camera company to do that math. There's lots of interest from people who won't spent $8K on a digital camera, and if it's just changing out a sensor on an existing product then the cost to produce isn't that much. A company already making and selling digital cameras should reasonably be able to release a monochrome version of any of their cameras for about the same price point as whatever they are already selling theirs for.

I mean, really, if Fuji or Ricoh released a digicam with a monochrom sensor for under $1K plenty of people would pick it up out of curiosity alone.

[Roger Hicks]

Who's holding their breath untill there's an answer to this question?

Cheers,

R.

[135format]

No one, only Leica buyers could be convinced it's a good idea

[seanbonner]

Originally Posted by 135format

No one, only Leica buyers could be convinced it's a good idea

That's actually why I'm thinking about this, I've never seen *so much* discussion about a Leica camera by non-Leica buyers. This move, right or wrong, just got a ton of attention from people who will never buy a Leica, I'd guess another company will see that as a potential market.

[Archlich]

Refer to the monochrome Kodak DSLRs for past reference.

As sensor technology progress no one need that anymore, except "Leica users"...which is a term I'm too lazy to care about proper defining.

[DougFord]

Perhaps the B&W sensor will find its market at the opposite ends of the spectrum. Maybe there's a market for a fixed lens, hipster affordable variant with a rotating ring on the lens labeled Y,O,R that moves a chunk of colored glass of the designated color into the light path. Along with a number of available firmware 'art' effects.
...not really a 'novelty' camera though.
Any manufacturer really, it's just important to be the first and only. Before the 'not a novelty' wears off