Hektor 73mm, Thambar, Summarex, what else?

[buzzardkid]

Hello,

I'm looking into longer lenses with 'dreamlike' properties like the Hektor 73mm 1.9 , Thambar 90mm 2.2 or Summarex 85mm 1.5.

These normally cost an arm and a leg in the modern day internet-driven markets so I'm also interested in other brands and models: Komura, Jupiter, Canon, Nikon, everything goes as long as results look (more or less) similar. My focus is on results rather than the 'wow' factor of the lens itself.

Should you like to share any shots with the above Leitz lenses or an alternative, I would be most grateful!?

Also, anyone ever try using a 'center spot' filter on other lenses to approximate the Thambar or Hektor results? Any results to show?

[Bar8barian]

Hello,
Another lens you might look for is the Dallmeyer 85mm F2 Dallac LTM which does turn up now and again at camera fairs in the UK.
I believe that it is a "Biotar" type lens design.

[Bar8barian]

Also consider the LTM lenses produced by Isco,Staeble,Steinheil,and the Dutch optical manufacturer Bouwers (Old Delft factory) which although not produced in large quantities still produced (in the 1950's) medium- telephoto LTM lenses that have been described as "soft".These optical houses might have produced some lenses that would meet your requirements and some of which can be purchased at more reasonable prices.
The Leitz 125mm Hektor(Canadian and Wetzlar production) used on the Visoflex on the LTM Leica cameras are a possibility and I have never seen examples of photo's taken with this lens which was produced by Leitz at the request of Walther Benser.It has the virtually same optical design as the Thambar and costs nowhere near the cost of a Thambar.
Is it a soft lens ?
Any owners and users of the 125mm Hektor on this forum?

[raid]

Summarit on an Ep-2 ...is another possibility for a portarit lens with character.

[buzzardkid]

On the net (just now) I read that apparently the 125mm Hektor is soft all over when wide open. Only excels when stopped down, when it gets real sharp.

Thanks for that list, gives me a starting point. Most of these lenses are hard to find, I reckon.

I've always wondered what a modern Voigtlander 75mm Heliar without any coating would look like, something tells me it would be just perfect...

Anyone ever try a center filter on any lens, or maybe the Summicron 90mm 2.0?

[ferider]

Originally Posted by buzzardkid

I've always wondered what a modern Voigtlander 75mm Heliar without any coating would look like, something tells me it would be just perfect...

If you are talking about the 75/1.8 Heliar, without coating it would be pretty much a 73 Hektor. Per lens diagram at least ....

How much speed do you need ? My only lens that is similar to what you describe is the Helios 40-2, a Biotar based design, but not M-mount (there was a fast/long LTM Biotar at some point. The Dallmeyer lens mentioned above might be a great start).

From your post it sounds like my other fast teles (Komura, Summilux, Nikkor) would be too modern looking.

BTW, the Summarex is not really dream-like wide open. Not more than the Nikkor or Canon 85/1.5 .... Maybe you want to look at those ?

[Luddite Frank]

So, how do you get a "modern" V-lander 75mm with uncoated glass ?


Also, I think I recall reading that the 125mm Hektor was furnished in short-mount-only for use with the Visoflex housing... did someone make a focusing-mount to use it as a regular RF lens ?

[buzzardkid]

The 75/1.8 it would be, yes. I noticed the similarity in lens layout. Would be a bit of a shocker though to have the coating removed from a brand spanking new lens!?

Maybe I should post in the 'Voigtlander - wanted' thread and have Mr. K create me one? EDIT: did that, just now

The 125mm Hektor is a Visoflex lens indeed. I'm getting rid of a Visoflex I housing I got in a deal last weekend, it doesn't do much for me, waay to big to haul around.

[Bar8barian]

Originally Posted by Luddite Frank

Also, I think I recall reading that the 125mm Hektor was furnished in short-mount-only for use with the Visoflex housing... did someone make a focusing-mount to use it as a regular RF lens ?

It is normally used with the Visoflex but it can be mounted directly on the camera using the intermediate collar TZOON which is also used for the 200/400 Telyts but it is not rangefinder coupled.

[Doug]

For modest cost and a new lens with warranty, I'll echo the suggestion for the recent Voigtlander Heliar f/1.8. It seems the intent of its production was to meet your desire for that old-time look, at least at wide apertures. Maybe it's no coincidence that the shapes and arrangement of glass elements appear the same as the Hektor f/1.9.

Sean Reid has a thorough review of this lens in comparison with other 75 mm lenses...

[buzzardkid]

Well maybe I should try using a center spot filter like the Thambar has on that Heliar 75mm 1.8!? See how it behaves then? Interesting idea!

[Vince Lupo]

All of these are shot wide open (more or less):

73 Hektor


73 Hektor


90 Summicron (Type 1 Screw Mount 'SOOZI')


90 Summicron (Type 1 Screw Mount 'SOOZI')


Also depends on how much you want to spend -- a 73 Hektor will run about $600-$800, while a screw mount SOOZI is $2K+.

[Luddite Frank]

Wonderful pictures Vince; thank you for sharing !

Luddite Frank

[Vince Lupo]

I think the 73 Hektor would be your best bet -- for me, I think it gives that 'dreamy' look you're after, while still maintaing a certain 'sharpness', albeit a different kind of sharpness. Plus, I don't think it's too outrageously priced (for a relatively rare Leica LTM lens, that is). Only thing is I think it only close focuses to 1.5m (don't have it in front of me, but I think that's what it is).

[buzzardkid]

Vince, I would be happy with a 600 to 800 USD Hektor, all I see are on eBay and they run up to EUR 1200

At the moment I have no cash to burn on a lens anyway, but one can always wish and dream, right?

[Luddite Frank]

Originally Posted by Vince Lupo

All of these are shot wide open (more or less):

73 Hektor


73 Hektor


90 Summicron (Type 1 Screw Mount 'SOOZI')


90 Summicron (Type 1 Screw Mount 'SOOZI')


Also depends on how much you want to spend -- a 73 Hektor will run about $600-$800, while a screw mount SOOZI is $2K+.

Vince - what body were these shots taken with ? Did you focus using the integral RF or use a Viso ?

Thanks...

Frank

[buzzardkid]

Vince, I get really excited over those Hektor shots, every time I see them!

The cat shot seems almost surreal, as if both foreground and background are out of sync. The OOF areas on that lens have a very specific look to them.

[Vince Lupo]

Originally Posted by Luddite Frank

Vince - what body were these shots taken with ? Did you focus using the integral RF or use a Viso ?

Thanks...

Frank

The ol' M9!

[Vince Lupo]

Originally Posted by buzzardkid

Vince, I get really excited over those Hektor shots, every time I see them!

The cat shot seems almost surreal, as if both foreground and background are out of sync. The OOF areas on that lens have a very specific look to them.

That's why I think that the 73 Hektor would be the one to get. I think the only other lens that comes close would be the Thambar, but that's really expensive! The 90mm SOOZI gives you that tack-sharp image, but completely throws out the background, and here again, is really expensive.

Keep an eye on LeicaShop's website, MW Classic, or even Koh's camera. Sometimes they come up with the 73's and aren't too outrageously priced. In particular, LeicaShop regularly gets the good stuff, and their prices are really pretty fair, and they'll bargain with you a bit too. If I come across one in my online travels, I'll let you know.

[Vince Lupo]

Another guy you could try would be my good friend Sam Shoshan ( www.classicconnection.com ). I didn't see one on his site, but you could certainly ask him to keep an eye out for one. He's a good guy.

[Vince Lupo]

An old (film) shot with the Hektor, scanned from the print.

[buzzardkid]

Thanks Vince!

Your friend actually does have a Hektor for sale, it's in the 'Rare and Collectables' section. It's too rich for my blood though...!

Let's hope I bump into something cheaper someday...

[Vince Lupo]

You could bid on one of these!
http://www.westlicht-auction.com/ind...set=1&_ssl=off

[Ronald M]

My 125 2.5 is a little soft full open, and becomes sharp at 4.0.

Contrast is on the low side at 2.5 and 2.8.

Bokeh is beautiful. Image is more beautiful than uncoated 73 mm or uncoated 90 or 135 mm Leitz lenses. Consider uncoated 90 4.0 or 135 4.5 Leitz if you are RF only and on a budget.

125 mm image is hard to focus perfectly 100% of the time on viso wide open. I used to use it on a viso 1 ,2, or 3, then the Leica R with M>R adapter and that gave a split image focus I never missed, and now the m viso set up goes on Nikon Digital with Camera Quest adapter. The Nikon digitals are full frame and one is equipped with the Katz Eye Split image.

Summilux.net may still have samples of 90 mm Thambar posted. They are another uncoated old lens, although i did meet on person who had his coated. It is a hard lens to use in that you need to know in advance the effects it gives by different aperture and with/with out the center disc. Best you read French for Summilux.com. I will try a link. I really am not that impressed.
There was a short mount to put it on a viso, but I have never seen one or known anyone to own it.

If you want soft focus, 20/30 years back there was a 120 mm Rodenstock Imagon made in T-Mount. 3 disks were furnished that the do the same thing they do on large format Imagons. I could not afford one new and waited 10 years to find one for sale and paid $1000.
This is a true soft focus lens for 35 mm and the best I ever used.
It was purchased for Leica R, and I changed T mount for Nikon so it works on my Nikon D3 and D700.

Image is soft and glowy with #1 disk fully open, plain soft with peripheral disk holes closed. Buy the time you use the #3 disk, the image is fairly sharp with peripheral holes open with just a touch of glow, to almost sharp and no glow with them closed.
There is no diaphragm as the disks provide light control, H 5.6 to H 11. Contrast is more in keeping with a 1980 lens.
This is the true soft focus lens for 35 mm and better than anything else. Good luck finding one. Bokeh is of course superb as the almost sharp image melts into out of focus. The one defect is Kuhn Bugs, specular reflections of bright objects. Use Google.

Should you find one, buy it, then find a camera to use it on. Leica R is best for film, Nikon D3 or D700 for full frame digital.

http://harrysproshop.com/Imagon/imagon.html

http://images.search.yahoo.com/image...mb=vI9sNtERFXM


http://images.search.yahoo.com/image...mb=vI9sNtERFXM

http://shutterbug.com/equipmentrevie...sic/index.html

http://photo.net/leica-rangefinders-...0Este?start=10

Typical Thambar Pic


http://forums.dpreview.com/forums/re...ssage=36017791

[Brian Legge]

I've got a beat up Summarit 50mm, 1.5 which could almost quality :


http://www.flickr.com/photos/cannelbrae/4800562503/


http://www.flickr.com/photos/cannelbrae/4764935986/

I've almost put it up on ebay a few times as I just don't use it enough. The look is interesting but I rarely shoot subjects where it makes sense. I'd rather sell in the classifieds here.