Advice for a XTOL newbie

Rhodes · 09-23-2010

Yesterday arrived my latest developer. This time decided to experment with a powder one, and choose XTOL (13,60 €, what do you think of the price?).

By what I have reed, I am think of doing the developer and store in a 5L bottle. In here http://www.covingtoninnovations.com/xtol/ they say to use 1-liter bottles in which to store the prepared developer, is it necessary or can I store in one 5L bottle?

Now about the use, If I use diluted, is like one-shot developer, after using, discard. If I use it in full streng, after the developing, I just put it back in the store bottle?

PS: Going to use destiled water, any disavantages with this?

sevo · 09-23-2010

I store it in 5L bottles, but I use it one-shot and go through a bottle in six to eight weeks. If you are much slower at it or want to re-use it, smaller bottles are advisable.

Distilled water is fine, but if your tap water is not extraordinarily hard or laced with iron or manganese ions, tap water will do as well.

Personally I only use it one shot - it is cheap (indeed almost negligible compared to the cost of film and labour), and when I was still re-using it, it sometimes depleted suddenly and without warning signs. Semi one-shot, with several runs in a day or two before dumping it and starting anew is ok as well, but I prefer not to bother about calculating time factors and dump it after one use. In my experience it is no developer that is safe for long-term (or eternal, replenished) re-use unless you go through pro lab scale film amounts, where volumetric replenishing can account for oxidation.

Freakscene · 09-23-2010

Quote:

Originally Posted by Rhodes

Yesterday arrived my latest developer. This time decided to experment with a powder one, and choose XTOL (13,60 €, what do you think of the price?).

I think I'd be mixing my own developer from scratch.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Rhodes

By what I have reed, I am think of doing the developer and store in a 5L bottle. In here http://www.covingtoninnovations.com/xtol/ they say to use 1-liter bottles in which to store the prepared developer, is it necessary or can I store in one 5L bottle?

If you're going to use all 5L fast a 5L bottle will be okay. If you may take a few months you are much better off putting it into several bottles or risk the whole lot oxidising and becoming useless.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Rhodes

Now about the use, If I use diluted, is like one-shot developer, after using, discard. If I use it in full streng, after the developing, I just put it back in the store bottle?

Dump all used dilute solutions. If you return used full-strength developer to the bottle you need to adjust your times. Go to this document: http://www.kodak.com/global/en/profe.../j109/j109.pdf and see the "Time Compensation for KODAK PROFESSIONAL XTOL Developer" table. I recommend using it dilute and one shot only.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Rhodes

PS: Going to use destiled water, any disavantages with this?

No, but there are significant advantages in stability of the solution.

I wrote a long rant about Xtol here:
http://leica-users.org/v35/msg07982.html

Good luck!

Marty

Arjay · 09-23-2010

This thread is offering further info on how to mix and use XTOL.

Rhodes · 09-23-2010

Thanks! Yes, my tap water is hard.

presspass · 09-23-2010

Are you talking about reusing it or using it as a replenishable developer? Xtol is made to be its own replenisher, and if you follow Kodak's directions, it can be used that way for a year or more. I did that using a hard rubber tank made to develop 4x5 sheet film (with a rack for 35mm reels).

notraces · 09-23-2010

I can't comment on the price, other than it's much higher than US prices - but everything is relative.

The 5L bottle will be fine - that's what I use - a JOBO 5L drum - but I use all my developer in less than 30 days - you'll be fine if you use it up in 90 days - maybe a little longer, but I wouldn't push it beyond that point.

I mix it with distilled water for best results - we have hard water, too - from the lake - which turns every now and again - so using distilled is good for lots of reasons - mainly control and keeping out impurities.

Whether you dilute XTOL or not - use it as a one-shot developer. Dump it - don't re-use. If you want a fun developer for re-use, get TMAX RS - good stuff and much more predictable results.

I love XTOL - I've used it for a long time and have never had an issue with it.

Most of all -- have fun!

Rhodes · 09-23-2010

Quote:

Originally Posted by presspass

Are you talking about reusing it or using it as a replenishable developer? Xtol is made to be its own replenisher, and if you follow Kodak's directions, it can be used that way for a year or more. I did that using a hard rubber tank made to develop 4x5 sheet film (with a rack for 35mm reels).

Well, it is my first powder dev. Please correct me if I am mistaken.
When talked about reusing is this: I use 300ml for developing one roll (patterson or jobo). If I use XTOL with out diluting, I use 300ml of it to develop the film and after put it back to the bottle.

Scenario 2: I decide to use XTOL 1:1 or 1:2, etc. So I use 150ml of dev and 150 of water (in 1:1 case) and then discard it after using!

sevo · 09-23-2010

Quote:

Originally Posted by Rhodes

Well, it is my first powder dev. Please correct me if I am mistaken.
When talked about reusing is this: I use 300ml for developing one roll (patterson or jobo). If I use XTOL with out diluting, I use 300ml of it to develop the film and after put it back to the bottle.

Scenario 2: I decide to use XTOL 1:1 or 1:2, etc. So I use 150ml of dev and 150 of water (in 1:1 case) and then discard it after using!

You should discard it in the former case as well - or put it into a separate bottle and use it within a day or two. XTOL is a less than ideal choice for the "use bottle of stock until depleted" development regime. If you want to develop that way, use D76 or some similar developer - XTOL does not like being run down, and may turn very inconsistent when abused that way. It is much better suited to either one-shot or large lab scale constant replenishment processing.

notraces · 09-23-2010

If you do want to replenish XTOL -- this is a great thread on the subject -- I go with one-shot mainly because I don't stick with just one developer - too much to keep track of --

http://www.apug.org/forums/forum37/2...developer.html

Freakscene · 09-23-2010

There are two different ways you can re-use full strength Xtol. You can replenish it, in which case you season or chemically age the developer and then add more fresh Xtol for each roll you develop. This type of system will be more stable if you have 10L or more of developer. Or you can follow the "Time Compensation for KODAK PROFESSIONAL XTOL Developer instructions" table in the Kodak manual. This allows you to develop 15 rolls/L of full-strength developer by increasing the time you develop rolls 6-10 and 11-15 for. There are no times for starting with 5L of developer, but I found that I could develop 75 rolls in 5L of Xtol if you increase the time as instructed by Kodak after 25 and 50 rolls. But you need to do this in a short space of time. if you use this method to develop 50 rolls then leave the stock lying around for a month it will be dead when you come back to it.

I recommend using Xtol diluted and one-shot. If you'd like an old Kodak .pdf with the times for Xtol 1+2 and 1+3, send me a PM with your email in it and I'll send it to you.

Marty

Rhodes · 09-24-2010

I see. Yes I have read the kodak sheet. Thank you.

Freakscene, I would like that! Will send a pm right way.
Thank you all, let's see how I will do with xtol!

semilog · 09-24-2010

Good advice here. I'd add: make your stock with demineralized or distilled water. This is generally a good idea for stock solutions, but doubly so for XTOL.

venchka · 09-24-2010

Even at European prices, developer is cheap.
Download this information. Print. Translate. Use. It's all good.

http://wwwfr.kodak.com/AT/plugins/ac...Entwickler.pdf

I use Xtol 1:3 in Jobo drums for 135, 120 & 4x5 films. Sometimes all in the same drum. 500ml is always my minimum quantity of Xtol & water for 4x5 sheet film. 700ml minimum for roll films.
Example: 125ml Xtol + 375ml water = 500ml developer in tank. Dump after ONE use.

I store Xtol in a container with no air present. So far, I have had good results with Xtol stored air free for 13 1/2 months.

Xtol is a great developer. Enjoy.