voigtlander 25mm skopar - "color skopar " vs "snapshot skopar" - differences?

yelofngr · 07-11-2010

i posted this in the new version of the site, but it isnt here now, so i apologize if this is happening for the second time.

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i am curious about hearing user experiences for the voigtlander 25mm skopar.

what are the differences between the new "color skopar" m-mount version and the older LTM screw mount "snapshot skopar" version?

does the newer rangefinder-coupled "color skopar" version also have the focus half stops for quick shooting?

also, at this focus length, is the new range-coupled version really necessary?

what do you guys think?

Bob Michaels · 07-11-2010

I cannot tell you about the new M-mount RF coupled 25mm one as I only have the older LTM version. But I love it enough to see no reason to change.

Optically, it is better than 99.99% of us are photographers.

And, I have never missed the RF coupling because I find zone focusing with the click stops at 1M 1.5M and 3M to be perfectly adequate. If you can drive a car or walk down steps, you can also determine distance enough to zone focus a 25mm f4 lens.

BTW, when the older Snapshot Skopar was still available at Camera Quest, Stephen Gandy said something to the effect that it was a ridiculously cheap price for a lens that good. I am glad I believed him and bought one.

Leigh Youdale · 07-11-2010

I have both versions. Not sure if I'll only keep one long term.
In answer to your specific question, no, the M mount version does not have the 'click' stop focus arrangement of the LTM version..

Doug · 07-11-2010

I too have both versions. I got the new coupled one to use on the Bessa R4a (which has 25mm framelines) so that as I focus I have parallax correction as well. It could be preferred on the M8 for the same reason.

The Snapshot Skopar rests on the Bessa L, an excellent home for it, and the focus detents are very helpful.

f16sunshine · 07-12-2010

I just got the m mount version to replace my snap shot. So far on the m8 the iq looks identical. Honestly in use I miss and would prefer the click stops of the older lens. It was just so easy to prefocus. What a nice way to shoot.

yelofngr · 07-12-2010

seems like many of you enjoy both models and shooting styles.

i am also intrigued by the click stops, esp for daytime street shooting, plus i think the snapshot is a bit smaller and looks cooler.

are there many situations you face where using the rangefinder to focus is absolutely helpful or even critical? maybe indoors, low light?

it only goes to f/4 so estimating the pre-focus should be good enough to catch everything in focus right?

Doug · 07-12-2010

I think its mainly a matter of different conveniences. Indoor wide-open focusing does put more of a premium on one's ability to accurately guage distance. But that's ok, really, just takes some practice.

pvdhaar · 07-13-2010

Quote:

Originally Posted by yelofngr

are there many situations you face where using the rangefinder to focus is absolutely helpful or even critical? maybe indoors, low light?

it only goes to f/4 so estimating the pre-focus should be good enough to catch everything in focus right?

Like Doug said, indoors requires building some guesstimation skills. But that's not only because you need to shoot wide open, it is also because subjects tend to be closer by. That means that DOF is shallower, and at f4 you can't get away with just using the click stops at 1m and 1.5m.

robertcambab · 08-14-2012

Hi I have the old snapshot and I too listened to Stephen (droll) Gandy when he told me it was a ridiculously low price. Bought it and have loved it ever since. It is Leica quality optics and the focus stops are great for no brainier shooting. There is no need to couple this.

leica M2 fan · 08-14-2012

I got the 25 in Nikon RF mount which is coupled but the way I usually shoot I just zone focus. Its rendition is superb but I'm glad I got it if I had to focus.

Bob Michaels · 08-14-2012

Quote:

Originally Posted by Pikapig

Sorry for digging this old thread out, but if there is any of you guys letting go a copy of this lens...preferably the coupled one...do let me know..thanks

Given the choice between the RF coupled one and the first model with focusing click stops, I would choose the first model with focusing click stops again. Do not be constrained by a preconceived mindset.

Cosina Voigtlander has consistently been very good about first making a model that makes sense and is logical. Then they will introduce a later version to match the general public's wish list even if not as logical as the first model.

jsrockit · 08-15-2012

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bob Michaels

Cosina Voigtlander has consistently been very good about first making a model that makes sense and is logical. Then they will introduce a later version to match the general public's wish list even if not as logical as the first model.

Are you saying that guessing focus is more valid than using a mechanical RF as a focusing aid?

Bob Michaels · 08-15-2012

Quote:
Originally Posted by Bob Michaels

Cosina Voigtlander has consistently been very good about first making a model that makes sense and is logical. Then they will introduce a later version to match the general public's wish list even if not as logical as the first model.

Quote:

Originally Posted by jsrockit

Are you saying that guessing focus is more valid than using a mechanical RF as a focusing aid?

Yes. I am saying that zone focusing with a 25mm lens with its large DOF, while knowing the lens is at 3m, 1.5m or 1m, will result in consistently better photos than manually focusing each using an RF. I am not saying the focus is more accurate but one can get it consistently close enough to it makes no difference. And one cannot beat the speed.

Bob Michaels · 08-15-2012

Here is a "hail mary" of Jazz Musician Billy Ding's second line or jazz funeral march on Frenchman street in New Orleans. I was using the Snapshot Scopar. Could I have made this photo with the RF coupled model? Technically, yes. Realistically, no because I would have been thinking about focusing with the RF. I was accustomed to not thinking about focus so just raised the camera overhead and shot.

jsrockit · 08-15-2012

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bob Michaels

Yes. I am saying that zone focusing with a 25mm lens with its large DOF, while knowing the lens is at 3m, 1.5m or 1m, will result in consistently better photos than manually focusing each using an RF. I am not saying the focus is more accurate but one can get it consistently close enough to it makes no difference. And one cannot beat the speed.

I would think it depends on the person and what they are used to. I mean, it's not like you can't zone focus the m mount version... it just doesn't have clicks.

Bob Michaels · 08-15-2012

Quote:

Originally Posted by jsrockit

I would think it depends on the person and what they are used to. I mean, it's not like you can't zone focus the m mount version... it just doesn't have clicks.

That is exactly what I was attempting to say with Could I have made this photo with the RF coupled model? Technically, yes. Realistically, no because I would have been thinking about focusing with the RF. I was accustomed to not thinking about focus so just raised the camera overhead and shot. Apparently, I did not convey my thinking very well.

Pikapig · 08-17-2012

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bob Michaels

Given the choice between the RF coupled one and the first model with focusing click stops, I would choose the first model with focusing click stops again. Do not be constrained by a preconceived mindset.

Cosina Voigtlander has consistently been very good about first making a model that makes sense and is logical. Then they will introduce a later version to match the general public's wish list even if not as logical as the first model.

Just a question from a lazy person like me who don wish to google and do my own calculation....

on a 25mm at f8..am i basically covering almost everything from 1m to infinity? Do i set my focus on 1m or infinity? does it matter?

Brian Legge · 08-17-2012

Buy the 21mm LTM COlor skopar - coupled and click stops?

I lucked into one locally at a great price. To be honest I picked it up with the intent of selling it here as I'd struggled with a 24mm Nikon SLR lens previously due to my habit of framing subjects in the edges of the frame. For some reason I didn't do this with the 21mm ltm lens can almost instantly fell in love with it.

Bob Michaels · 08-17-2012

Quote:

Originally Posted by Pikapig

........................ on a 25mm at f8..am i basically covering almost everything from 1m to infinity? Do i set my focus on 1m or infinity? does it matter?

Yes, it does matter where you focus. With the focus set at 3 meters at f8, you DOF will cover from 1.3 meters to infinity. This is based on a circle of confusion of 30 microns.

taffy · 08-17-2012

Can the non coupled version take filters? I use an M8 and I'm wondering if the snapshot skopar is a good option (for reasons more than just the price).

Pikapig · 08-20-2012

taffy: Yes it can take filters. there is a good deal on rff right now, i would have picked this if i didnt grab an equivalent good offer on my country sales...

Thanks Bob for the guide, guess im a little too adventurous and went pretty near to my subject, end up didnt get them on my focus range...

I think im still a little fast in arms movment from shots and somehow caused some motion blurness...well but it looks pleasant too...

I shot mainly from f8 to f11 on colorplus 200 and mostly are when im walking

The better ones here

Pikapig · 08-20-2012

Part of the reason i bought this lens is for landscape shots...so here's one

can find more of the pics here camerani.blogspot.com

k__43 · 08-21-2012

I'm with Bob Michaels on the focusing argument. By the time you focused using an RF patch and realigned your eye to the auxiliary finder the situation is gone. with the click stops you focus the lens while you are moving the camera to your eye, take a peek thru the finder and press the release button.
I was stupid enough to sell mine to finance a Leica Elmarit 28mm (VIII) which gives me only little advantage over the 25mm (but had cost me more than 3 times of what I got for the 25). The skopar also takes 39mm filters which is convenient when you also carry an older leica 50ie or 35 (or as I do a CV35/2.5)

rxmd · 08-21-2012

Quote:

Originally Posted by Brian Legge

Buy the 21mm LTM COlor skopar - coupled and click stops?

Not for the focusing, unless yours is different from mine.

I'd love it if the 21mm, in addition to the RF coupling, had click stops at 1, 1.5 and 3m like the 25/f4. It really is that useful.

newspaperguy · 08-21-2012

Love that jazz band shot, Bob.

Add me to the list of SS (Snapshot Skopar) lovers, and YES, clickstop focus fans.

In the working world, it can be a lifesaver.

What a wonderful, if unconventional, way to go!