My first RF. need your opinions.

multivitamins · 10-02-2009

Hi guys,

Im shifting to RF coming from dslrdom. Been reading RF stuffs and somehow have an idea how RF works. Im thinking of getting bessa R3M but I really really like leica and wanted to get one as much as possible. But my prob is, I can only afford to spend $1200 - $1500. With this budget, do you think I can get a leica with 35-50mm fast lens? I don't mind using voigt lens on leica body.

Ken Ford · 10-02-2009

Hi, and welcome!

If you're willing to go unmetered and shop carefully, depending what you personally consider to be fast no problem at all meeting your budget even with Leica glass. Metered, you should be able to pull it off with either a Leica Summicron 40/2 or a wide choice of C-V lenses.

multivitamins · 10-02-2009

What lieca would you recommend?

Ken Ford · 10-02-2009

Bang for the buck, IMO it's hard to beat an M4-2 or M4-P for an unmetered body or an M6 Classic for metered.

abumac · 10-02-2009

If you look arround you should find a M6 classic and a Summicron 2/50 for 1600 or so. Go for a metered body, it is more fun.

multivitamins · 10-02-2009

Quote:

Originally Posted by abumac

If you look arround you should find a M6 classic and a Summicron 2/50 for 1600 or so. Go for a metered body, it is more fun.

Hopefully... Ebay would not be a good place to find a cheap M6. Hopefully one will pop in the classifieds. If I cn't find one by Nov. I might get a bessa. But leica... will be just a dream for now.

@Ken - Someone is selling an M4-P for $1200 with free watameter. Is that a good price?

Ken Ford · 10-02-2009

Seems really steep to me considering one sold in the classifieds here for $650 recently and that KEH has a bargain grade M6 for $1035 right now.

multivitamins · 10-02-2009

uh.. $650.... bad luck for me... Guess I need to watch out the classified. Been looking for some meter for m4. Hehe, they are also expensive... Is there an alternative meter for m4? Like 3rd party?

snausages · 10-02-2009

M6 + 40mm Summicron-c (or Rokkor). Get the Leica and worry about budgeting for lenses later.

multivitamins · 10-02-2009

Quote:

Originally Posted by snausages2000

M6 + 40mm Summicron-c (or Rokkor). Get the Leica and worry about budgeting for lenses later.

Yeah... Good advice. Hopefully I can find a cheap, in good condition m6. can't wait.

thanks.

coelacanth · 10-02-2009

There were at least two M4s went for $800 on classified in past two days, including mine in excellent condition.

And I scored a CLA'd SS M3 marked as "user" but turned out to be excellent condition for $600 there as well.

So yeah, definitely watch out the classifieds here. I find I can trust people here and what they are selling way way more than ebay or pretty much anywhere else on the interwebz.

For metered M, I'd recommend M6 Classic with Elmar 50mm 2.8 (first version) You can get BGN grade (which is usually EX+ grade elsewhere) for $299 from KEH.

multivitamins · 10-02-2009

Quote:

Originally Posted by coelacanth

There were at least two M4s went for $800 on classified in past two days, including mine in excellent condition.

And I scored a CLA'd SS M3 marked as "user" but turned out to be excellent condition for $600 there as well.

So yeah, definitely watch out the classifieds here. I find I can trust people here and what they are selling way way more than ebay or pretty much anywhere else on the interwebz.

For metered M, I'd recommend M6 Classic with Elmar 50mm 2.8 (first version) You can get BGN grade (which is usually EX+ grade elsewhere) for $299 from KEH.

Thanks. Im looking at KEH website now. Shipping price is also my prob. Im kinda in Asia. so I expect a $100+ shipping cost. Im really like the M6. I think I can wait until december and watch out for the classifieds. But.. I will not shoot for 2 months... Damn, I will use my cp camera again.

multivitamins · 10-02-2009

Just found an M3 body in EX cond. 449...

Ken Ford · 10-02-2009

A nice M3 is a thing of beauty...

payasam · 10-02-2009

Now that you have an M3, all you need is a lens or lenses -- and a meter which gives both incident and reflected readings. With the M3 you cannot use a 35mm (or wider) lens without an external finder.

rpsawin · 10-02-2009

Quote:

Originally Posted by multivitamins

uh.. $650.... bad luck for me... Guess I need to watch out the classified. Been looking for some meter for m4. Hehe, they are also expensive... Is there an alternative meter for m4? Like 3rd party?

Multi,

http://cameraquest.com/voivcmet2.htm

This is an excellent meter that can be used on an unmetered body.

Good luck!

Bob

SimonSawSunlight · 10-02-2009

M2 + lens of your choice and enough cash left for a CLA if needed

multivitamins · 10-02-2009

Guys. I did not buy the M3 yet. Still deciding. I really like the M6. but the M3 is also good with ext. meter on it.

coelacanth · 10-02-2009

As Ken said, well maintained M3 is such a joy to use. My 53 years young M3 is as smooth and silky as you can ever expect from any device.

Just be sure to get one with recent CLA or add $80+shipping for Youxin's CLA, then you have a beautiful picture taking machine.

Do you have a link to the M3 you found?

snausages · 10-02-2009

Workflow is subjective, but I find I use my unmetered cameras less than my M6. Little extra steps add up, whether it's an external view finder or an external meter. And, for me at least, film loading with the M6 'tulip' is easier/quicker than an M3. Can't really go wrong with any of these options, and I don't know what your shooting style is so I'll shut up now...

wgerrard · 10-02-2009

Multi, not to throw a wrench into this, but have you had a chance to actually hold and use a Bessa or a Leica? I own a Bessa and, until last week, an M3 for a short time. I find the Bessa more comfortable to carry and use. Not that the M3 was uncomfortable. But, if someone ran a blind test on me, and I didn't know which camera was which, I'd pick the Bessa as the one that fits my hands better.

burninfilm · 10-02-2009

You should easily be able to accomodate a Leica M-mount body and a good 35 or 50mm lens for around $1200-$1500. Patience helps, too. I have picked up a user-condition M3, 50mm Summicron, and 90mm Summicron, and the total investment will be less than $800.

The quicker you want it, the more you'll pay for it. Just be sure to watch the classifieds sections at this site. In the past few weeks, several great deals have been posted for sale: a fully functional $900 M6 "Classic", several $800 M4s, a recently CLA'd $650 M4-P, etc. There have also been many good deals on lenses. Heck, there's a really nice 50mm f2.8 M-mount Elmar for sale for $325. If you can work with the f2.8 max aperture, that'd be a great lens option, and it's being sold by a reliable, well reputed seller.

coelacanth · 10-02-2009

What burninfilm said. I have no personal connection with the seller, but that Elmar 50/2.8 is a fantastic lens. And with a rangefinder like Ms, you can shoot 1/4 sec speed with pretty decent results. That's quite difficult with DSLRs because of mirror shock. (sure, those anti-shaky thing is one thing, but still) So don't be afraid of F2.8.

multivitamins · 10-03-2009

Quote:

Originally Posted by coelacanth

As Ken said, well maintained M3 is such a joy to use. My 53 years young M3 is as smooth and silky as you can ever expect from any device.

Just be sure to get one with recent CLA or add $80+shipping for Youxin's CLA, then you have a beautiful picture taking machine.

Do you have a link to the M3 you found?

I found it at KEH.com. As much as possible I want to purchase my first RF here in RF Forum. Members are too nice and can be trusted. Unlike Ebay, I was cheated for about 3x. Luckly what I bougth were not expensive.

Quote:

Originally Posted by snausages2000

Workflow is subjective, but I find I use my unmetered cameras less than my M6. Little extra steps add up, whether it's an external view finder or an external meter. And, for me at least, film loading with the M6 'tulip' is easier/quicker than an M3. Can't really go wrong with any of these options, and I don't know what your shooting style is so I'll shut up now...

I do mostly portraits using my dslr and got into wedding and photojournalism. Now Im gettin tired using an SLR and wanted to explore RF and have fun. What I use now is a cheap Konica C35 that has a zone focus mech. Sharp lil cam. But recently the metering died and Im really having a hard time using it.

I really prefer the M6 over the M3. but as long as the M3 has a good and accurate external meter I think Its ok for me.

Quote:

Originally Posted by wgerrard

Multi, not to throw a wrench into this, but have you had a chance to actually hold and use a Bessa or a Leica? I own a Bessa and, until last week, an M3 for a short time. I find the Bessa more comfortable to carry and use. Not that the M3 was uncomfortable. But, if someone ran a blind test on me, and I didn't know which camera was which, I'd pick the Bessa as the one that fits my hands better.

No chance here in our country to try a bessa or leica. They don't sell it here. Stores here mostly sell DSLR and point & shoot.
Second-hand shops sell zorki, but I don't really like the zorki in my hands.

What made me decide to choose M6 over Bessa? My favorite wedding photographer uses M6. But Bessa would be my next alternative if my funds does not permit me to buy an M6.

Quote:

Originally Posted by burninfilm

You should easily be able to accomodate a Leica M-mount body and a good 35 or 50mm lens for around $1200-$1500. Patience helps, too. I have picked up a user-condition M3, 50mm Summicron, and 90mm Summicron, and the total investment will be less than $800.

The quicker you want it, the more you'll pay for it. Just be sure to watch the classifieds sections at this site. In the past few weeks, several great deals have been posted for sale: a fully functional $900 M6 "Classic", several $800 M4s, a recently CLA'd $650 M4-P, etc. There have also been many good deals on lenses. Heck, there's a really nice 50mm f2.8 M-mount Elmar for sale for $325. If you can work with the f2.8 max aperture, that'd be a great lens option, and it's being sold by a reliable, well reputed seller.

Woh! Good deal indeed! M3+50+90 for $800?! Such a nice deal. I really like to get a fast lens like 1.2 to 2. I'll be using it to practice for wedding shots. I'll check out the reviews of this lens and see if I like the bokeh. I mostly select my fast lenses based on the bokeh that the lens can produce.

Do you have any experience with this lens in low light?

Quote:

Originally Posted by coelacanth

What burninfilm said. I have no personal connection with the seller, but that Elmar 50/2.8 is a fantastic lens. And with a rangefinder like Ms, you can shoot 1/4 sec speed with pretty decent results. That's quite difficult with DSLRs because of mirror shock. (sure, those anti-shaky thing is one thing, but still) So don't be afraid of F2.8.

Yeah. at 2.8, dslr needs to have atleast iso 800-1600 to get decent shots (sharp) in low light - which most likely will produce evil noise unless your dslr has good high ISO results.

I'll check the review of Elmar 50/2.8. Looks like a great deal. Do you have any experience with this lens in low light?

Thanks.

I

David Hughes · 10-03-2009

Quote:

Originally Posted by SimonSawSunlight

M2 + lens of your choice and enough cash left for a CLA if needed

I'll second that. The line up of 35 - 50 -90 is great and leaving out the 50 gives a good two lens kit. M2's should be CLA'd - usually (just to be safe) unless you know the history and see the receipts for the last service.

I always think the meter should match the camera; you can get Westons of the right vintage for a pound or two and, again, a CLA for a Weston will work wonders. Once on the slippery slope you'll be looking for an elderly screw thread model and the old Westons have the right speeds and apertures on the dials for anything.

Regards, David