Go Back   Rangefinderforum.com > Rangefinder Forum > Photography General Interest

Photography General Interest Neat Photo stuff NOT particularly about Rangefinders.

Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes

A picture of Robert Frank
Old 04-08-2009   #1
Beniliam
Out of the limelight
 
Beniliam's Avatar
 
Beniliam is offline
Join Date: Mar 2005
Location: Madrid - SPAIN
Posts: 337
A picture of Robert Frank

Maybe a less-know picture of him for someone.

Robert Frank at the old Metropolitan Opera, New York, 1955.




This picture was taken by the great Czech photographer Bedrich Grunzweig.


I think that the most curious detail of this picture is see a bow tie in the throat of Robert Frank!! ... He seems left eye too!
Attached Images
File Type: png Imagen 23.png (192.4 KB, 58 views)
__________________

Last edited by Beniliam : 09-03-2009 at 10:15.
  Reply With Quote

Old 04-08-2009   #2
Al Kaplan
Registered User
 
Al Kaplan is offline
Join Date: Dec 2003
Location: Miami, FL
Age: 71
Posts: 4,481
Nothing at all unusual about it. He was dressed for the occasion, wearing a tux to attend the opera. Notice the sheen on the satin lapels? At least he wasn't trying to impress anybody with black paint Leicas. I never realized that he was left eyed! He shot all of his verticals upside down. That must have driven the editors crazy when they looked over his contact sheets.
__________________
RIP

My Gallery

Last edited by Al Kaplan : 04-08-2009 at 19:30.
  Reply With Quote

Old 04-08-2009   #3
Beniliam
Out of the limelight
 
Beniliam's Avatar
 
Beniliam is offline
Join Date: Mar 2005
Location: Madrid - SPAIN
Posts: 337


Al Kaplan, thanks for your comment.

I have always this image in my mind about Robert Frank among the crowd. Its funny the contrast between the two pictures!
__________________
  Reply With Quote

Old 04-08-2009   #4
JohnTF
Registered User
 
JohnTF's Avatar
 
JohnTF is offline
Join Date: Jul 2008
Location: Home is Cleveland, Summers often Europe, Winters often Mexico.
Posts: 2,005
Nice shot by Grunzweig, all my trips to Prague, and still missed his work. ;-)

Thanks for the wake up. ;-)

Regards, John
__________________
To capture some of this -- I suppose that's lyricism.

Josef Sudek
  Reply With Quote

Old 04-08-2009   #5
35mmdelux
fiat lux יְהִי אוֹר
 
35mmdelux's Avatar
 
35mmdelux is offline
Join Date: May 2005
Posts: 4,212
Very interesting, thanks.
__________________
M9 │ 24 f3.8 Asph │ 50 f.2.8 M
  Reply With Quote

Old 04-08-2009   #6
xayraa33
rangefinder user and fancier
 
xayraa33's Avatar
 
xayraa33 is offline
Join Date: Feb 2004
Posts: 4,211
Good photo of Robert Frank with cameras.

I like to play guess the lenses on the cameras.
__________________
My Gallery
  Reply With Quote

Old 04-08-2009   #7
Melvin
Flim Forever!
 
Melvin's Avatar
 
Melvin is offline
Join Date: Nov 2008
Posts: 440
Can anyone identify the lenses? They look like fast 50mms, which makes sense. The cameras look like Leicas.
I just showed "Pull My Daisy" to my painting students and they loved it.
  Reply With Quote

Old 04-08-2009   #8
xayraa33
rangefinder user and fancier
 
xayraa33's Avatar
 
xayraa33 is offline
Join Date: Feb 2004
Posts: 4,211
Quote:
Originally Posted by Melvin View Post
Can anyone identify the lenses? They look like fast 50mms, which makes sense. The cameras look like Leicas.
I just showed "Pull My Daisy" to my painting students and they loved it.
I wish it was a higher quality photo, but my guess would be an 85mm f2 Nikkor and a 50mm f1.4 Nikkor.

maybe the cameras are Tower type 3s ;-))

he got all the gear at Sears !!
__________________
My Gallery

Last edited by xayraa33 : 04-08-2009 at 20:18.
  Reply With Quote

Old 04-08-2009   #9
Al Kaplan
Registered User
 
Al Kaplan is offline
Join Date: Dec 2003
Location: Miami, FL
Age: 71
Posts: 4,481
My thought was 85/2 Nikkor and 50mm Summarit but it might be a 50/1.4 Nikkor, probably on black dial III-f bodies. At the time nobody in the U.S. thought that the Niccas were quality cameras. In the mid 1960's you could still buy used Nicca bodies for $15, and the Tower was a rebranded Nicca.
__________________
RIP

My Gallery

Last edited by Al Kaplan : 04-08-2009 at 20:36.
  Reply With Quote

Old 04-09-2009   #10
xayraa33
rangefinder user and fancier
 
xayraa33's Avatar
 
xayraa33 is offline
Join Date: Feb 2004
Posts: 4,211
Since the camera to his eye has the vulcanite going around the upper part of the lens mount, it looks to be a Leica III, IIIa, IIIb type, not the IIIc/IIIf.

The Tower/Nicca type 3 was an outright copy of the Leica III.
__________________
My Gallery
  Reply With Quote

Old 04-09-2009   #11
Pickett Wilson
Registered User
 
Pickett Wilson's Avatar
 
Pickett Wilson is offline
Join Date: Jan 2009
Posts: 3,860
So what film is he using?
  Reply With Quote

Old 04-09-2009   #12
xayraa33
rangefinder user and fancier
 
xayraa33's Avatar
 
xayraa33 is offline
Join Date: Feb 2004
Posts: 4,211
Quote:
Originally Posted by Pickett Wilson View Post
So what film is he using?
the proof sheet of the shots he took in Britain, before he came to the states, say Ilford.

Kodak Super XX would be my guess in the states, Tri X was out on the market for a year in 1955.

Note: some of the negs from the Americans show Kodak Plus X
__________________
My Gallery

Last edited by xayraa33 : 04-09-2009 at 04:05.
  Reply With Quote

Old 04-09-2009   #13
xayraa33
rangefinder user and fancier
 
xayraa33's Avatar
 
xayraa33 is offline
Join Date: Feb 2004
Posts: 4,211
__________________
My Gallery
  Reply With Quote

Old 04-09-2009   #14
Al Kaplan
Registered User
 
Al Kaplan is offline
Join Date: Dec 2003
Location: Miami, FL
Age: 71
Posts: 4,481
That book cover shows "blacks riding in the back of the bus". A half a century sure made a big difference. Kerouac's book "The Town And The City" was a literary breakthrough at the time.
__________________
RIP

My Gallery
  Reply With Quote

Old 04-09-2009   #15
Beniliam
Out of the limelight
 
Beniliam's Avatar
 
Beniliam is offline
Join Date: Mar 2005
Location: Madrid - SPAIN
Posts: 337
Thanks for your comments!



Its possible that many photographers used in the 50īs the new film that in 1955 Ilford introduces in rolls, the HPS: "the fastest film in the world". I dont know if in the USA the Ilford films arrived normally...

http://www.photomemorabilia.co.uk/Il...hronology.html


Read this interesting blog entry:

http://eddeasy.blogspot.com/2008/07/...kin-young.html
__________________
  Reply With Quote

Old 04-09-2009   #16
Siluro
Registered User
 
Siluro's Avatar
 
Siluro is offline
Join Date: Jan 2007
Location: Perth, Western Australia
Age: 37
Posts: 39
Quote:
Originally Posted by Melvin View Post
I just showed "Pull My Daisy" to my painting students and they loved it.
When I was a photo student, one of my lecturers showed us Pull My Daisy...brilliant! I like your style Melvin.
  Reply With Quote

Old 04-09-2009   #17
Al Kaplan
Registered User
 
Al Kaplan is offline
Join Date: Dec 2003
Location: Miami, FL
Age: 71
Posts: 4,481
I remember using Ilford HPS in the early 1960's. It was extremely grainy, but not quite as bad as the competition, Agfa Isopan Record. Today they'd be rated ISO 800 for HPS and ISO 1,000 for Record, but Kodak made a still faster film, Royal-X Pan Recording. I think it was about ISO 1,200 and only available in bulk. Using the brand new Acufine developer you could get a decent, but very grainy, negative up to about ISO 3,200.

I have a Royal-X Pan print hanging in my living room of a girl, Karina, of perhaps 18 or 19 playing guitar. She's sitting inside of a big tent made out of a white cargo parachute illuminated by a small campfire. It's printed full frame on 8x10 paper and dated 1962. I was probably using a Canon II-S with a 35/1.8 Canon lens. I couldn't afford Leicas yet.
__________________
RIP

My Gallery

Last edited by Al Kaplan : 04-09-2009 at 06:31.
  Reply With Quote

Old 04-09-2009   #18
furcafe
Registered User
 
furcafe's Avatar
 
furcafe is offline
Join Date: Oct 2004
Location: Washington, DC, USA
Age: 47
Posts: 4,100
That's not upside down! That's the "correct" way to shoot a vertical, or @ least that's the way I learned to shoot a vertical. And the fact that Robert Frank held his Leicas that way must mean it's the right way.

But seriously, I think it's a more stable hold than having the right hand on top, because as a righty (& right-eyed, too), I prefer to have the camera rest on the stronger hand. I use my right thumb to release the shutter about 1/2 the time. In Zeiss Ikon Contax manuals, this was the recommended vertical hold & it's also shown as an alternative in Leica & other manufacturers's manuals. For extra stability, this hold also lets you press the camera to your forehead.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Al Kaplan View Post
I never realized that he was left eyed! He shot all of his verticals upside down. That must have driven the editors crazy when they looked over his contact sheets.
__________________
Five a Second. Chicago's Bell & Howell Co. (cameras) announced that it would put on sale this fall the world's most expensive still camera. Its "Foton" will take five 35-mm. pictures a second, sell for $700. Bell & Howell, which has found that "families of both low and high incomes now spend over $550" for movie equipment, hopes to sell 20,000 Fotons a year.

--Facts And Figures, Time magazine, Monday, October 4, 1948
My Photoblog

My Flickr stream

My RFF Gallery

Last edited by furcafe : 04-09-2009 at 06:46.
  Reply With Quote

Old 04-09-2009   #19
Al Kaplan
Registered User
 
Al Kaplan is offline
Join Date: Dec 2003
Location: Miami, FL
Age: 71
Posts: 4,481
furcafe, with lever wind rangefinder cameras I often shoot and wind one handed. Sometimes it's because I'm holding a flash off camera with one hand, sometimes I'm holding the camera over my head to shoot over a crowd. The past few years I've been shooting with a 15mm holding the camera off to the side so I'm in the picture too.

When I am shooting the "normal" way I prefer having the camera alongside my nose just like Frank does, but I'm right eyed, hence the cameras is turned the opposite way because it's on the other side of my nose.
__________________
RIP

My Gallery
  Reply With Quote

Old 04-10-2009   #20
Beniliam
Out of the limelight
 
Beniliam's Avatar
 
Beniliam is offline
Join Date: Mar 2005
Location: Madrid - SPAIN
Posts: 337
Al Kaplan, thank you for comment your experiences with the differents films of that time. Do you use sometime the Adox films in the 50īs and the 60īs?

Bruce Davidson remembered the famous shot that he did in the UK in the 50īs. Maybe a repost but interesting know that he use Ilford HPS film ...

http://www.guardian.co.uk/artanddesi...04/photography
__________________
  Reply With Quote

Old 04-10-2009   #21
Al Kaplan
Registered User
 
Al Kaplan is offline
Join Date: Dec 2003
Location: Miami, FL
Age: 71
Posts: 4,481
I first started developing my own film in 1961. Like many newbies I immediately wanted to try every available film in every available developer. Adox KB-14, KB-17, and KB-21 were readily available. The numbers were actually the DIN speed numbers equivalent to ISO 20, 40, and 100. I believe that Adox also made a higher speed film only available in Europe. I tried all three and for a year or two shot a lot of KB-17. I settled on using FR-22 developer. It came in 1 ounce bottles and was a one-shot designed for slow films.

KB-14 didn't seem to have much finer grain. Both Ilford FP3 and Kodak Plus X had finer grain than KB-21. If you enlarged big enough, at least 11x14, you could notice that ISO 20 Agfa Isopan FF and ISO 40 Isopan F seemed to have sharper grain than the Adox film.

If anybody wants to come by, go through my boxes of negatives and contact sheets, and make some sample prints...LOL...I still have all of them. You might even be able to print up some sexy pictures of your wife's grandmother. Just to study the grain of course.

By today's standards they were all grainy films. Even Kodak dropped Panatomic-X and the motion picture film of the same speed, Eastman XT Pan a few years ago. Faster films had fine enough grain.
__________________
RIP

My Gallery

Last edited by Al Kaplan : 04-10-2009 at 05:48.
  Reply With Quote

Old 04-10-2009   #22
lawrence
Registered User
 
lawrence's Avatar
 
lawrence is offline
Join Date: Nov 2004
Location: London, UK
Age: 62
Posts: 1,236
Quote:
Originally Posted by Beniliam View Post
This picture was taken by the great Czech photographer Bedrich Grunzweig.
That's a great shot, many thanks for sharing it.
  Reply With Quote

Old 04-10-2009   #23
Beniliam
Out of the limelight
 
Beniliam's Avatar
 
Beniliam is offline
Join Date: Mar 2005
Location: Madrid - SPAIN
Posts: 337
Im glad that this topic could be interesting for you.

Al Kaplan, thank you again.

I read many times that photographers like Louis Faurer, Robert Frank, Eugene Smith... developing their films by inspection (using a green bulb for īseeī in milliseconds what density the negative have), I supposed that this method was īcommonī among the photographers in those years. Always intrigued me how this photographers can photography the night in that time without using a tripod.

For example:

-Horacio Coppola (argentinean photographer, more than a century of life and still alive!)




-William Klein




-Eugene Smith (Thelonius Monk band) This Smith serie of portraits and group portraits I think is quite interesting.

__________________

Last edited by Beniliam : 04-10-2009 at 20:55.
  Reply With Quote

Old 04-15-2009   #24
summaron
Registered User
 
summaron is offline
Join Date: Jan 2005
Location: San Francisco
Posts: 117
Anther thank you for posting the Robert Frank photo. He looks so different than he did later on, after the years of living "poor as a churchmouse" on the lower east side.

I remember Agfa being more available than Ilford, at least in California. The guy I used to buy film from recommended it for low light photography--it was 600 ASA or something like that, and TriX was maybe 200. Roaul Coutard liked Ilford so much he spliced 100' rolls together when he was filming Breathless for Godard and so Ilford brought us the first splash of the New Wave. But Frank's existentialism was on plus x or double x, I'd guess, probably whatever was cheapest and/or most consistent from batch to batch.
__________________
<a href='http://www.rangefinderforum.com/photopost/showgallery.php?cat=500&ppuser=1040'>My Gallery</a>
  Reply With Quote

Old 04-16-2009   #25
Al Kaplan
Registered User
 
Al Kaplan is offline
Join Date: Dec 2003
Location: Miami, FL
Age: 71
Posts: 4,481
You're RIGHT, Summaron. Agfa was easier to find than Ilford in Miami, New York and Boston in the early sixties.

Film speeds of the era included Weston, G.E., Scheiner, British Scheiner, DIN (German), Gost (Russian), and ASA (American). The American system included a one stop "safety factor" with faster films, a bit less for more contrasty slower speed films. Everybody knew this, the photo magazines wrote about it: ASA 200 Tri-X was really ASA 400 and Agfa Isopan Record was 1000, not 500....and so on. At some point as we approached the seventies the American Standards Institute confessed and eliminated the "safety factor". Tri-X became labeled as ASA 400!

Some speed scales were arithmetic like ASA and GOST ~ double the number equals double the speed. Others like DIN were logarithmic ~ add 3 and the speed doubled. ASA 100 was 21 degrees DIN and ASA 400 was 27 degrees DIN. When the International Standards Institute, ISO, came along it combined the American and German system numbers seperated by a slash so Tri-X became ISO 400/27. A few years later the DIN number was dropped. Tri-X became just plain 400.

Tri-X developed to a standard gamma (contrast) in a standard developer of the D-76 type was ALWAYS a 400 speed film by our present standards. Over the years it got finer grain and better tonality but it DID NOT BECOME FASTER. This was true of every other film as well.

It used to be common to refer to films like Tri-X as EI 400 with standard development but E.I. 1200 in Acufine. EI or E.I., short for Exposure Index, meant that when using the ASA scale that rating gave you good exposure, but since it didn't always use "standard development" it didn't meet ASA standards for rating the film speed it wouldn't be ASA 1200 in Acufine.
__________________
RIP

My Gallery

Last edited by Al Kaplan : 04-16-2009 at 04:54.
  Reply With Quote
Reply


Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

vB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off



All times are GMT -8. The time now is 10:55.


vBulletin skin developed by: eXtremepixels
Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.6.8
Copyright ©2000 - 2014, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.

All content on this site is Copyright Protected and owned by its respective owner. You may link to content on this site but you may not reproduce any of it in whole or part without written consent from its owner.