B&W Film Manufacturer's Roundup

[bmattock]

I'm starting a new thread based on the direction it was headed, hope no one minds. We were discussing the relative merits of a particular B&W film, and got a bit side-tracked on who makes what. So I thought that was worthy of it's own thread and here it is:

Originally Posted by Roman

Bill,
Tura films are just respooled Agfa films! I heard rumors, though, that they are closing down their spooling plant.
'alex-photo' occasionally sells Svema film, http://www.retrophotographic.com/ sells Tasma films (they are located in the UK, though).
Roman

Re: Tura - really? Aw, what a shame! I keep thinking that there are more B&W film manufacturers than there really are. Here's what I come up with, in no particular order:

1) Kodak
2) Ilford
3) Agfa (Tura, Orwo, others)
4) Fuji
5) Efke (Adox)
6) Foma
7) Forte
8) Lucky
9) Svema
10) Tasma

Am I missing anyone? I mean, Gigabit, Bergger, Paterson, Rollei, Orwo, and others are just repackagers, yes? I'd count them if they had an emulsion made to their specifications and only sold by them, but I think they just buy / relabel other brands, if I'm not mistaken. Konica-Minolta makes C41 and B&W C41, but no actual B&W, same for Ferrania (Solaris / 3M / Imation in the USA). Mitsubishi supposedly makes color film in the USA, but I haven't seen any of it. I am told that there is another film manufacturer inside China other than Lucky, but I haven't seen anything else about them if that is true.

Now, if we can come with a corrected list of manufacturers of B&W film stock, let's cross-reference that with who repackages what, and if we're feeling really ambitious, the various emulsions sold in various formats from each manufacturer.

If we come up with an up-to-date list that everybody agrees on, I'll make a webpage out of it and try to keep it updated. If anyone thinks that would be worthwhile, that is.

And yes, I know about the Massive Dev Chart and the ACE webpages - useful references, but not focused directly on this. I was thinking more along the lines of the perennial questions - what B&W make/model should I use for portrait/outdoors/indoors/studio/etc/etc? Not that we'd all agree, but some basic information minus the manufacturer's hype would be nice.

Best Regards,

Bill Mattocks

[mtokue]

IT may only be available in Japan, not sure, But Konica-Minolta have two B&W films overhere Konica-Minolta Pan 100 & 400, They also made a very nice IR Pan 750 but unfortunately they stopped production a while back (Nice Film). There is talk of resurecting a B&W IR Film. Both the Pan 100 & Pan 400 is only available in 35mm in 24 & 36 shot.
Links are here for the 100 and here for the 400
Unfortunately I haven't had the pleasure of trying either as yet .
Mike.

[titrisol]

Konica Minolta is missing there I agree

Also is MACO a rebrander/repackager or do they make their own?

Also there used to be a plant owned initially by AGFA and then it became something else in Uruguay... anyone know if they are still in bussiness???

[afaceinthecrowd]

How about Bluefire Police sold at Frugal Photograhper (http://frugalphotographer.com/)? They also have Maco ... but I think that falls under one of the listings above.

dan

[mtokue]

And let's not forget the MINOPAN range of B&W films although they are only for the MINOX .
Mike.

[bmattock]

Originally Posted by mtokue

IT may only be available in Japan, not sure, But Konica-Minolta have two B&W films overhere Konica-Minolta Pan 100 & 400, They also made a very nice IR Pan 750 but unfortunately they stopped production a while back (Nice Film). There is talk of resurecting a B&W IR Film. Both the Pan 100 & Pan 400 is only available in 35mm in 24 & 36 shot.
Links are here for the 100 and here for the 400
Unfortunately I haven't had the pleasure of trying either as yet .
Mike.

Fascinating! Do you know if these are chromogenic (C41) process? I ran the webpage links you provided through babelfish and they translated well, but didn't say specifically if they are 'traditional' B&W or C41 chromogenic. KM does sell a C41 B&W here in the USA. At least, their web page shows it. Haven't seen/tried any of that myself, either.

Best Regards,

Bill Mattocks

[bmattock]

Originally Posted by titrisol

Konica Minolta is missing there I agree

Also is MACO a rebrander/repackager or do they make their own?

Also there used to be a plant owned initially by AGFA and then it became something else in Uruguay... anyone know if they are still in bussiness???

Not sure if Maco makes their own film or not. Seems there is some disagreement. I know it is expensive here in the US - so I'm not too likely to use it. I'd still like to know, though.

Best Regards,

Bill Mattocks

[mtokue]

It's one of those very strange situations. These two are "Propper" B&W but for some obscure reason Konica Minolta do not sell the C41B&W overhere in Japan!!
I believe Fuji also has a C41 B&W film abroad but not in Japan.
The only C41 B&W available overhere is the Ilford XP2Super and the Kodak BWC400
Strange!!
Mike.

[bmattock]

Originally Posted by afaceinthecrowd

How about Bluefire Police sold at Frugal Photograhper (http://frugalphotographer.com/)? They also have Maco ... but I think that falls under one of the listings above.

dan

I could be wrong - but I believe Bluefire is made by Adox, which makes it actually Efke. ???

Best Regards,

Bill Mattocks

[Roman]

I think you should count the Rollei R3 in - sure, it was originally developed by Maco, but is specifically made for Rollei in a Berlin based coating plant that used to make x-ray films.
BTW, Maco themselves should also be taken into the list - sure, some of their stuff is just relabeled (eg. Efke), but they do have some original material like the IR820c infrared film or their PO100c.
And if you want to count in glass negatives, there is Wephota in Germany -http://www.wephota.de/wephota/filmix.htm - who still sells these, I don't know any other manufacturere making these; other Wephota films are relabeld Forte and Foma.
And Orwo ist just sold from left-over Ilford (not Agfa!) stock, the company went bankrupt, IIRC.
FotoImpex sells ClassicPan 100 Eco, which is not relabeled Forte like the rest of the Fortes, but rumoured to be made in China, though not by Lucky (possibly by Era?).
Oh, and I think Azopan is still produced in Romania, and Era in China.
And the Mass. Dev. Chart lists a film by Oriental, too.
Some other additions:

1) Kodak
2) Ilford (Adox CHM, Maco, Arista)
3) Agfa (Tura, others)
4) Fuji
5) Efke (Adox CHS, Maco, Wephota, Jessops?)
6) Foma (Wephota, Paterson?)
7) Forte (Bergger, Classic Pan, Wephota)
8) Lucky
9) Svema
10) Tasma
11) Maco
12) Rollei
13) Classic Pan
14) Wephota
15) Azopan
16) Oriental?
17) Era
18) Konica

Here is a Swiss site that tried to list all films, but was not updated for a few years:
http://www.fotoline.ch/FOTOintern/98-18/sw-tab.htm

Roman

[bmattock]

Originally Posted by mtokue

It's one of those very strange situations. These two are "Propper" B&W but for some obscure reason Konica Minolta do not sell the C41B&W overhere in Japan!!
I believe Fuji also has a C41 B&W film abroad but not in Japan.
The only C41 B&W available overhere is the Ilford XP2Super and the Kodak BWC400
Strange!!
Mike.

Yes, that is surpassing strange. Someone like JandC or Freestyle should try to negotiate a conex box of it and sell it here, see if anyone likes it.

The translated page for the 400 says it can be pushed to 3200 without consequence. Pretty cool if true.

Best Regards,

Bill Mattocks

[BJ Bignell]

I dunno if MACO makes film or is just a reseller (I think they're mfgrs, though), but they have a new ISO400 IR film available. Bulk packs of 30 rolls only:

http://www.photo.net/bboard/q-and-a-...bB&unified_p=1

[titrisol]

The Konicas used to be standard BW films. They also made (once a year) a near IR film (IR 820) which is a very interesting film

Originally Posted by bmattock

Fascinating! Do you know if these are chromogenic (C41) process? I ran the webpage links you provided through babelfish and they translated well, but didn't say specifically if they are 'traditional' B&W or C41 chromogenic. KM does sell a C41 B&W here in the USA. At least, their web page shows it. Haven't seen/tried any of that myself, either.

Best Regards,


Bill Mattocks

[BJ Bignell]

My German is poor, can anyone translate?

http://www.mahn.net - MACO company home page
http://www.mahn.net/Wer.htm - MACO company info page

[mtokue]

Hey Bill,
Let me know if you want to try some
Best
Mike.

[Roman]

Ah, while I was compiling my post, many answers came; here a few additions:

Maco is a big German trading company - they sell chemicals made by Labor Partner (I think they bought that formerly independent company), paper (used to be Ilford, now it is Agfa, though they also have papers that can't be found in the Agfa range), and different films: relabeled Efke (their UP25+ - which is said to be replaced by their own improved version soon; Up100+), they have a proprietary IR film (IR820c, which was derived from Efke 100), they sell Ilford HP5+ emulsion coated on their own base material (UP400+), they have a few unique products like their orthochromatic films, they have their own CUBE 400, the helped develop the Rollei film, which, as I said, is made by an x-ray film company in Berlin - really confusing.
Gigabitfilm is Agfa Copex.
Bluefire is neither made by Adox (which is only a trade name, anyway), nor by Efke, but is some kind of trafic surveillance film (Agfa or Kodak).
About Adox: the copyright to their name expired; Bluefire used it for a while, but did not register it; Mirko Boeddecker from FotoImpex did register it, though, and is now selling Ilford and Efke films (as well as paper, chemicals, etc.) under that name.

Roman

[bmattock]

Originally Posted by Roman

I think you should count the Rollei R3 in - sure, it was originally developed by Maco, but is specifically made for Rollei in a Berlin based coating plant that used to make x-ray films.

Anybody know that for sure, or is that still an internet rumor?

BTW, Maco themselves should also be taken into the list - sure, some of their stuff is just relabeled (eg. Efke), but they do have some original material like the IR820c infrared film or their PO100c.

Made just for them by someone else, or do they still coat film?

And if you want to count in glass negatives, there is Wephota in Germany -http://www.wephota.de/wephota/filmix.htm - who still sells these, I don't know any other manufacturere making these; other Wephota films are relabeld Forte and Foma.

http://www.slavich.ru/ I believe they make glass plates, but that's just what their website says. I think. I don't read Russian.

Best Regards,

Bill Mattocks

[bmattock]

Originally Posted by BJ Bignell

My German is poor, can anyone translate?

http://www.mahn.net - MACO company home page
http://www.mahn.net/Wer.htm - MACO company info page

This is a good resource for this sort of thing:

http://babelfish.altavista.com

Just plug in the URL and tell it what language to translate from/to. Works pretty well, actually.

Best Regards,

Bill Mattocks

[Roman]

Originally Posted by BJ Bignell

http://www.mahn.net/Wer.htm - MACO company info page

Well the page says that Maco is the photo division of the Hans O. Mahn company. They are distributor for Oriental paper (New Seagull).
Most of the products Maco sells, they have made exclusively for them by different manufacturers.
Maco is exclusive distributor of Labor Partner chemistry.
Maco is specialised on Black & White photo products: pan- & orthochromatic flm, IR film, FB and RC papers, liquid photo emulsion, photo chemistry, FB paper dryers.
And there is the usual blah about their high quality, and there exclusiveness and uniqueness that sets them apart from the mass market.
They mention that they have 'test sets' for their stuff, and there is an info hotline.

Roman

[Roman]

Originally Posted by bmattock

Anybody know that for sure, or is that still an internet rumor?


- Well, there is no official confirmation, but even the name of that x-ray company is known (I would have to look it up in some German forums, though), someone from another forum called that company, and they did not deny it but said they were not allowed to give more info.


Made just for them by someone else, or do they still coat film?


- I don't know for sure, a lot is made for them, but they do have some unique products.

http://www.slavich.ru/ I believe they make glass plates, but that's just what their website says. I think. I don't read Russian.


-Retrophotographic in the UK sells Slavich papers, don't know about glass plates.


Best Regards,

Bill Mattocks

Roman (who spent too much time on a German photolab forum before discovering RFF)

[Roman]

I just remembered one more film - Polypan F, which is sold only in 35mm format in bulk rolls, very inexpensive, rumored to be based on a movie film emulsion, but I don't know the manufacturer.

Roman

[Roman]

Originally Posted by mtokue

And let's not forget the MINOPAN range of B&W films although they are only for the MINOX .
Mike.

Isn't Minopan Agfa APX100?

Roman

[bmattock]

Originally Posted by mtokue

Hey Bill,
Let me know if you want to try some
Best
Mike.

Yes, please! I'll be happy to reimburse you for whatever the film & mailing it to me would cost!

And THANK YOU!

Best Regards,

Bill Mattocks

[mtokue]

Originally Posted by Roman

Isn't Minopan Agfa APX100?

Roman

Hi Roman,
Could very well be!, Not sure. I just use it! It comes as Minopan 25, 100 and 400
Mike.

Bill, am sending you a PM.

[Pherdinand]

As far as i know, Azomures in Romania stopped producing film (azopan) as well as paper and chemicals. Still does produce lots of chemicals, but not for photography. Either it's gone or they sold the branch to someone else. Anyway, in Romania I didn't see lately any Azopan for sale. Not even old stock.

The azomures website also does not say anything about their photographic chemical product line.