Agfa APX 400 and Rodinal
Old 10-15-2008   #1
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Agfa APX 400 and Rodinal

I know a fair bit has been posted here about Agfa APX 400 - I just picked up 5 rolls of the 35mm film, and remember my last trials with it have been very grainy and unpromising, but I'd like to try again (I'm a big fan of APX 100). I just have HC-110, Diafine and Rodinal, and as much as possible, do not want to buy anymore developers as I lack storage space.

I've seen some nice results with the film pulled to ISO 250 and developed with Rodinal 1+50, but I can't find the developing times anywhere. Digitaltruth seems to have some relevant data but the notes suggest that it is for an older emulsion. Does anyone here know?

Jin
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Old 10-16-2008   #2
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Well, I've got only 9 rolls left... but the rolls are 48.8m bulk rolls

I'm shooting it at EI 250 and developing it with XTOL and it gives nice compromise between sharp edges and relatively nice grain. I'm not a fan of ultra sharp grain though.

I haven't tried it with rodinal. Heck, I haven't ever tried anything in Rodinal!
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Old 10-16-2008   #3
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I've shot a lot of APX400 over the years and have souped it in both Rodinal and HC-100.

In Rodinal I found I got best results rating the film at 200ASA and developing it, either in 1+100 for 16mins or 1+50 for 10mins [examples here]

In HC-110 I generally rate the film at box speed or 320ASA and develop it in dilution e (I'd need to double check the times with my notes at home) - [examples here]

For what it's worth, APX400 and APX100 are very different emultions. I love APX100, but at best I'd say I like the 400.
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Old 10-16-2008   #4
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I shoot APX400 at rated speed, because I only use it when I need the speed, APX100 by far my favorite if I can get enough light.
Anyway, with smaller dilutions (1:50, 1:100) I have found APX400 gets muddy, so I now stick with 20degC, 25:1 for 7 minutes using the Agfa style agitation (continuous first 30secs, then tip once every 30secs)

Incidentally APX100 I like with 50:1, 20degC, 13 minutes using Agfa agitation.
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Old 10-16-2008   #5
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APX400 / Rollei Retro 400 in Rodinal 1+50, 13:00 min at an E.I. of 250 will give you the right results. When you have even a higher light contrast situation you have to make an E.I. of 200.

APX 400 is not a very fine grained film, and certainly not in a para-amino phenol developer like Rodinal. It can withstand high over-exposure and gives a nice grey tonal range.

http://www.flickr.com/photos/fotohuisrovo/2876405994/

Here some more developing information:
http://www.fotohuisrovo.nl/documenta...ei%20films.pdf

Rollei Retro 100/400 is pre-packed APX 100/400 135 micron 35mm material from the latest Agfa Photo production run in 2005. The raw material was bought by the Rollei-Maco company when Agfa went in bankruptcy.

Best regards,

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Old 10-16-2008   #6
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Since you mentioned you have HC-110, I've used Arista II 400 (same as APX 400) in HC-110 Dilution B for about a month. I've shot at 800 and 250 with satisfactory results. I don't know if it's the lens, developing techniques, film or any combination, but my results are very low contrast. Here are some samples:

http://www.flickr.com/photos/chrismi...ristaii400250/

http://www.flickr.com/photos/chrismi...ristaii400800/
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Old 10-16-2008   #7
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The most critical element, I believe, in using Rodinal with APX 400 is agitation.

I think the best results are from gentle agitation, which is a bit different from Kodak films and developers.

I give one two-second inversion every 30 seconds, and that seems to work well in terms of grain and negative density.
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Old 10-16-2008   #8
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I recently ran my first roll of APX400 - EI 400, souped in rodinal 1:50, 13 mins with gentle agitation gave me grainy low contrast negs with pronounced base+fog density. Can't judge from 1 roll, but so far I prefer tri-x, although APX400 has a look that will be perfect for a specific project on my list.

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Old 10-16-2008   #9
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Quote:
Originally Posted by KenD View Post
I recently ran my first roll of APX400 - EI 400, souped in rodinal 1:50, 13 mins with gentle agitation gave me grainy low contrast negs with pronounced base+fog density. Can't judge from 1 roll, but so far I prefer tri-x, although APX400 has a look that will be perfect for a specific project on my list.

KenD
Print the negs before you judge them. Yes, APX 400 negs in rodinal look flat and have high base fog, but they print beautifully.







All shot on 35mm APX 400 exposed at EI 320 and developed in Rodinal 1+50 for 10 minutes at 68 degrees.
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Old 10-17-2008   #10
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These are 35mm APX400 @ I.E. 250 stand developed in Rodinal 1:100 for 1 hour w/2 minutes of agitation at the start and 30 seconds at the half hour mark.

Last edited by ElrodCod : 10-17-2008 at 11:04. Reason: change image size
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Old 10-17-2008   #11
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Gary, those have beautiful tonality and detail.
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Old 10-17-2008   #12
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Chriscrawfordphoto View Post
Gary, those have beautiful tonality and detail.
Thank you. They were taken with a 35/2.5 C Color Skopar Classic on a Bessa R2.

Edited to add: The Skopar Classic has a reputation for being contrasty & I took those at Midday with that in mind to see if the stand developing would tone down the contrast. It seemed to help some but I may try a 1:125 dilution next time.

Last edited by ElrodCod : 10-17-2008 at 14:21.
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Old 10-18-2008   #13
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Gary, may I ask you what is in your opinion the advantage of stand development (Rodinal, also para-amino phenol) with a 35mm negative?
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Old 10-19-2008   #14
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Fotohuis View Post
Gary, may I ask you what is in your opinion the advantage of stand development (Rodinal, also para-amino phenol) with a 35mm negative?
I've only done it the one time and based on that limited experience I'd say that the primary advantage for me (so far) is convenience. No clock watching to agitate every minute....just two minutes at the beginning and a few inversions at 30 minutes. Others get good results without the midpoint agitation. There's plenty of time to mix chemicals, clean up, etc. The reason that I tried it was for the compensating effect on the highlights. The results were encouraging in that regard and calls for further experimentation.
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Old 10-19-2008   #15
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OK, because there is NO advantage in 35mm photography on this type of development.
Rodinal needs slow agitation and preferable a temperature just under 20 degrees C. for the best fine grained results.

About the boring and long development:
http://www.fotohuisrovo.nl/documentatie/TAS_Flyer_D.pdf

Best regards,

Robert
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Old 10-19-2008   #16
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Fotohuis View Post
OK, because there is NO advantage in 35mm photography on this type of development.
Rodinal needs slow agitation and preferable a temperature just under 20 degrees C. for the best fine grained results.

About the boring and long development:
http://www.fotohuisrovo.nl/documentatie/TAS_Flyer_D.pdf

Best regards,

Robert
Robert,
That's a strong statement, If you already "knew" the answer then why did you ask? Tryin' to trick me? The compensating effect, and the forgiving nature of stand developing along with the convenience of developing different film speeds together in the same tank are advantages. If I was concerned about grain size I wouldn't be using APX400 or Rodinal.
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Old 10-19-2008   #17
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Hi Gary,

I am not trying to 'trick' anybody but I thought maybe I missed something... (well almost impossible after over 40 years film development)

Indeed convenience and I can only say: Yes, Rodinal + APX400 is not a fine grained combination but can be beautiful, well look at your pictures yourself
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Old 10-20-2008   #18
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Tonalitywise this combo is OK, but I got way better results with Ilford DDX.
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Old 10-20-2008   #19
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I would use the HC-110... I guess I'm just always happy with the D76-like behavior for 35mm. Rodinal is nice for 6x9 and 4x5".
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