Rollei 40mm f/2.8 Zeiss Sonnar

[snaggs]

I've read some good things about this lens, but information is still scarce. I would have thought this lens would be quite popular with it now being discontinued, and they come with a free Camera at the moment.



Ive read the popular photography blurb

http://www.popphoto.com/article.asp?...ber=1&preview=

a photo.net thread that goes off topic very quickly and one thread here. Does anyone have any more info?

Daniel.

PS. Heres some info on the original lens I found;

http://johnlind.tripod.com/rollei/rolleitext.html

The Sonnar is the best and fastest lens used on the Rollei 35's. It was designed by Carl Zeiss with five elements in four groups and has Rollei's HFT multi-coating. The Sonnar is one of the finest lenses of the 20th Century designed in 1930 by Ludwig Bertele, one of the finest lens designers of the 20th Century. Bertele originally worked for Ernemann, one of the premier German optics houses. When Ernemann was absorbed into the Zeiss-Ikon combine in 1926, Bertele began working for Carl Zeiss. The original was an uncoated f/2 5cm focal length with six elements in three groups specifically created for the Zeiss Ikon Contax. In 1932 it was reformulated for an f/1.5 5cm with seven elements in three groups. At some point after the Zeiss Ikon Contax IIa/IIIa ceased production in 1961, the Sonnar was reformulated into the configuration commonly found now using five elements in four groups for a slower f/2.8 lens. However, its design principles are essentially the same as the original Sonnar. The Carl Zeiss Sonnar has been used as the premier lens on numerous 35mm cameras. As with the Tessar, from the 1960's and beyond it is normally found in the slower f/2.8 five element, four group configuration.

Rollei wanted a faster lens for its top Rollei 35 model and Carl Zeiss reformulated the Sonnar using Rollei's HFT multi-coating resulting in the 40mm f/2.8 with five elements in four groups. It is a stunning lens noted for near zero distortion in its very flat field, very low falloff, exceptional resolution and very high contrast; all the attributes sought for in a superb lens. As with the later Tessar's the Sonnar HFT was manufactured by Rollei under license from Carl Zeiss. Compared to the Tessar, the Sonnar is a better, faster lens but is much more difficult and expensive to manufacture. The Sonnar has extremely tight tolerance requirements for its complex element shapes and their spacing. In spite of the age of its design, it is still a world class lens and holds its own quite easily with the very best of modern lenses.

[snaggs]

Heres a babel fished -> Japanese review...

[Huck Finn]

Daniel, you can find a review of the Rollei 35 Rf & 40 Sonnar lens with picture here:

http://host.fptoday.com/melek/pages/cameras.html

[Huck Finn]

Daniel, I have a little more time now, so I'll share with you my impressions of this lens, which comes with a 2-year warranty:

- Excellent build quality
- Focus ring moves smoothly
- Aperture ring has 1/2 click stops & moves easily into distinct notches
- Very compact
- Wide, concave focus tab, similar to the one found on older versions of the 35 Summicron
- Comes with hood attached
- LTM mount & comes with M-mount adapter included. Since it is LTM, it can be fitted with the adapter of one's choosing to select the preferred frame lines on an automatically indexed camera like the M- series or the Zeiss Ikon.

Optical characteristics:

- Very sharp overall but softer in its resolution of very fine detail
- A little soft in the corners wide open
- Very nice SOFA
- Sharp & even across the entire field when stopped down
- Very resistant to flare
- Lovely rendition of colors, well saturated

This is a lens for shooting people; Rollei calls it a "candid" lens. The combination of sharpness overall with a softer resolution of very fine detail translates into a lens that is kind to people's faces, i.e. it softens the zits & blemishes that many people would prefer not be reproduced quite so clearly.

Popular Photography found there to be some pincushion distortion, although still within acceptable limits. This is probably because the Sonnar design has been compacted to get it down to 40 mm. It was originally designed as a 50 mm lens & is most widely used today at telephoto lengths. Rollei chose this Zeiss design because it could be built compactly & at a reasonably fast speed for the Rollei 35. (The original Rollei 35 was a VERY compact camera.) Frankly, I haven't noticed the distortion, but then I'm not using it to shoot architecture at critical distances & angles. It works well with people.

This lens still retains some of the characteristics of the original Sonnars, which emphasized a sharp center with a smooth transition to soft out-of-focus area. Originally created to attain speeds (f/1.5) unattainable in the days before the availability of coating made double Gauss designs popular & workable on fast lenses, the Sonnar design became valued in the '50s as a portrait lens because of its fingerprint. While the effects are not as dramatic at f/2.8 on a 40 mm lens with greater depth of field than the 50 mm & longer lenses, you still see that smooth transition to out of focus areas & softening as you move away from the center at f/2.8.

Daniel, I think if you re-do your search on photo.net (perhaps leaving out the word Zeiss), you will find a number of threads discussing this lens. It was first announded in the fall of 2002 & received some discussion then in anticipation of its arrival. It came on the market in February, 2003 & received more discussion at that time and off & on since - quite a bit last spring.

I think that the lens did not become popular because it was overpriced when it first came out, because Rollei did a terrible marketing job, & because it was associated with the Rollei 35 RF, which was dismissed as an overpriced Bessa R2 clone. The barrel is built by Cosina & the question was asked why so much money for a relatively slow prime lens when faster Cosina lenses are available at a much lower price.

The biggest impediment to its popularity was its 40 mm focal length. There were no cameras with 40 mm frame lines except old Leica CLs & Minolta CLEs - and their owners were very happy with their Summicrons & Rokkors. No one was going to go out & buy a re-badged Bessa at a much higher price just to mount this lens - well almost no one. I did.

The good news is that the price has come down to where it originally should have been - about 50% of the original asking price. Second, the price of the camera body has also been cut in half. Third, the introduction of the R3A a few months ago means that there are now a couple of reasonably priced options for bodies with 40 mm frame lines & a new demand for 40 mm lenses. Fourth, the introduction of the new Zeiss lenses now makes this the cheapest Zeiss lens on the market for M-mount, holding much the same position in their line-up that the 50 Elmar holds in the Leica line-up. It doesnt seem so expensive when there is another frame of reference besides CV lenses. Having been built at the Rollei factory, it was subject to the same quality control standards that Zeiss introduced at the Cosina factory for its new lens line.

Cheers,
Huck

[furcafe]

Per Huck's latest post, here's a thread from this forum on the same subject (you may have seen it @ the bottom in the "Similar Threads" area):

http://www.rangefinderforum.com/foru...ead.php?t=2373

My overall impressions of the lens are identical to Huck's. I have noticed the pincushion distortion @ times. FWIW, here are some of my shots w/the lens:

http://www.flickr.com/photos/furcafe...lei4028sonnar/

[snaggs]

Thankyou both! The photo gallery is great, looks like 40mm is a nice perspective. What film do you use? With the prices that Robert White has for the kit, its basically lens with free camera, and chrome at that. The Japanese seem to think its a great match for a M6, which is something I can look at in the future.

The final thing that I like, is that this lens is only available as part of the kit, and discontinued now? Given it has a unique signature, it could become hard to find in the future as people get over the fact that Cosina lathes made the barrel!

[DougK]

Nice gallery furcafe, brought back some great memories of my Miami/Key West vacation last year with some of those shots. Good work with that lens, I especially like the shots of the capoeiristas, that's a fun martial art/dance to catch on film. Wouldn't mind picking up this lens/body combo myself... alas, my available funds are devoted to a weekend getaway in Orlando in May.

[furcafe]

Thanks, Doug. One nice thing about all the 40mm lenses (M-Rokkor, CV Nokton, Rollei Sonnar, etc.) is that they're small & relatively lightweight; that, plus the fact that the 40mm focal length is a nice compromise between a wide & a normal field of view, makes them ideal travel/vacation lenses (that particular Miami beach trip was a "40mm vacation"). BTW, Snaggs, all the pix are tagged w/the film, camera, & lens used.

Originally Posted by dkirchge

Nice gallery furcafe, brought back some great memories of my Miami/Key West vacation last year with some of those shots. Good work with that lens, I especially like the shots of the capoeiristas, that's a fun martial art/dance to catch on film. Wouldn't mind picking up this lens/body combo myself... alas, my available funds are devoted to a weekend getaway in Orlando in May.

[Huck Finn]

Originally Posted by snaggs

The final thing that I like, is that this lens is only available as part of the kit, and discontinued now? Given it has a unique signature, it could become hard to find in the future as people get over the fact that Cosina lathes made the barrel!

Daniel, last time I checked, the lens by itself was available as a single item at B&H and Adorama - both in New York. But you are in England?

Re the Cosina-made barrel, there was an upgrade in build quality of Cosina/Voigtlander lenses from the initial series of lenses to the second series. Lenses like the 21/4, 28/3.5, & 50/2.5 are considered to be of excellent build quality. The Rollei Sonnar shares the same basic barrel as the 50 & 28. It is first rate. Stephen Gandy of Camera Quest can give you more information on the build quality of CV lenses if you e-mail him.

The early criticisms of the lens, which dismissed it as Cosina-built, ignore the fact that it is not a Cosina-built lens, although this should not be a problem in & of itself since Cosina makes fine lenses. The problem was price in relation to other Cosina built lenses. Even though they sub-contracted for a lens part - the barrel - from Cosina, this is a Rollei-built lens, made in a Rollei factory in Germany. Rollei uses the same quality control standards as Zeiss when they make lenses. They do not spot check; rather, every item is inspected & tested before it leaves the plant. This is what you get for the higher price as well as a unique lens design & HFT coating. Consumers can decide what they prefer.

Huck

[Doug]

Originally Posted by Huck Finn

Optical characteristics:
...
- Very nice SOFA

Thanks Huck for your interesting commentary! So, what does "SOFA" mean?

[Huck Finn]

SOFA is the new RFF term for Bokeh. "Soft Off Focus Area" (See eparate thread.) I like it . . . . .kinda cute.

[snaggs]

Its not the new RFF term for Bokeh, most people have voted against it

[tom_f77]

Originally Posted by snaggs

Its not the new RFF term for Bokeh, most people have voted against it

Rangefinder devotees should be well aware of the dangers of the tyrrany of the majority. I propose a SOFA sit in.

Tom

[snaggs]

Lets not hijack this thread into Bokeh vs *the term no one has heard of before*.

I've almost got spousal approval for this lens. When I get it (and my first rangefinder with it), Ill post a proper review comparing the package to my F65 w/50mm f/1.4.

Daniel.

[awilder]

Having recently purchased the 40/2.8 Sonnar from Robert White, I thought I'd share a few observations. The lens shortly developed a little play in the focusing action noticable when turning the focusing tab back and forth with rapid focusing. Secondly, the actual optical focus was a little off compared to the rangefinder focus setting. Rather than return it to the dealer, I simply sent the lens to DAG who fixed both problems in short order. Once repaired, the lens performs nicely with the only criticism being persistant softness in the extreme corner of the image until about f/8 or smaller. This appears to be normal for this lens based on Rollei's own MTF graph inwhich contrast sharply rolls off beyond an image radius of 18mm. I think the problems I encountered with the lens has more to do with the subcontracting out of the focusing mount assembly to Cosina as opposed to complete manufacture by one company from start to finish.

[Huck Finn]

Originally Posted by awilder

the actual optical focus was a little off compared to the rangefinder focus setting.

How did you test for this?

[awilder]

I tested it using USAF resolution chart from Modern Photography and bracketed focus in small increments to determine best focus. The focus error was confirmed and corrected by DAG camera repair.

[Huck Finn]

Thanks, AW. Much appreciated. Do you know the issue that the chart was published in?

[awilder]

These charts were sold through the mail over 10 or 15 years ago by Modern Photography as a service to those who wanted to test their own lenses. Since they are no longer in publication, you'll need to go elsewhere to find them. It's a fairly common test pattern that goes back to 1953 from the USAF. This and other test patterns are readily available if you search the web. Norman Koran has a web site that allows you to download an MTF test pattern that if printed on a high quality printer allows you to estimate within 10% the MTF performance of a lens. I've tried it and it works OK.

[peter_n]

Huck PM me your email address and I will send you the USAF chart as a PDF attachment.

[pshinkaw]

The complete Modern Photography test kit can be downloaded here:

http://members.cox.net/lenstestr1/lenstest.htm

[awilder]

The trick to getting good results with reolution charts is to elliminate any shutter vibration or it may look like you have some astigmatic blur or some other form of image degredation. I always use the slowest film possible, expose with the shutter locked open @ B or T and adjust exposure time by use of the light switch. This way your testing pure lens performance.

[Huck Finn]

Originally Posted by awilder

The trick to getting good results with reolution charts is to elliminate any shutter vibration or it may look like you have some astigmatic blur or some other form of image degredation. I always use the slowest film possible, expose with the shutter locked open @ B or T and adjust exposure time by use of the light switch. This way your testing pure lens performance.

Thanks for the tip, AW. Much appreciated.

Huck

[ZeissFan]

I've had this lens for a couple of years, attached to the Rollei camera. At that time, money was not an issue.

Anyway, I've always been very pleased with the performance of this lens. Very sharp, nice color rendition and very well made.

One thing you'll notice is that it's significantly heavier than you would expect. I expect that it's because of the use of brass within the mount. By the way, it's a LTM lens that comes with an M-mount adapter.

The lens uses a tab to focus, and in use the helical is very smooth -- much smoother than other lenses you may have used. There is a built-in lens shade, which is so tiny that I wonder if it's actually useful. Quality of construction is excellent.

The camera itself is a true Bessa-R2 clone with different markings, color scheme and body covering. The viewfinder, as you might expect, is very good although with a narrow base. rangefinder.

[bennyng]

Originally Posted by ZeissFan

There is a built-in lens shade, which is so tiny that I wonder if it's actually useful.

Rollei actually did sell a separate hood/lens shade as well as a 40mm viewfinder for this lens. Both items have Voigtlander counterparts for a lot less money. Not the most popular of accessories, given the price point they were asking for.

Cheers,