Adobe Lightroom pricing ripoff?

[ChrisN]

I've played with the Lightroom trial software, and was impressed. The 30-day trial is about to expire, and I was prepared to shell out the US$299 for the software. However, when I try to buy online I am directed to a page that is trying to charge me AUD$505, or 48% more than the US price of US$299! There seems to be no easy way around this as my credit card is of course linked to an Australian address, and it won't let me purchase the US product at US$299.

Does this reflect a deliberate policy of charging a stiff premium to non-US customers? I feel like I'm being ripped off - do they think we are stupid?

Does anyone know anything more about this?

Sorry Adobe, you've lost me as a customer.

[Philippe D.]

Originally Posted by ChrisN

Does this reflect a deliberate policy of charging a stiff premium to non-US customers? I feel like I'm being ripped off - do they think we are stupid?

Seem so.

In Europe they're asking 297,80 euro (that's 436,49 US$) for LR.

[Welsh_Italian]

The best thing is to write them an email and let them know of your decision and why you made it. If enough people write in, they might begin to take notice.

As someone involved in selling software across the world, there really is no justifiable reason for them to have this kind of mark-up.

[mfunnell]

Chris,

This seems to be a universal policy of all vendors. (For example some Canon inkjet paper costs 6x more in Oz than the US.) I just order from Adorama and have them ship things (usually 3-4 days). I did this with my most recent Photoshop upgrade. From the US, under the FTA, we can do this up to $(mumble) without being a "proper" importer and under $1,000 there's no GST payable.

Some day soon vendors might realise that globalisation is happening, the internet exists and we can all look up prices in other markets. The real losers are authorised resellers and wholesalers, who get charged more than O/S retail prices - and lose customers accordingly. I was giving a Canon printer rep a nice earbashing the other day re paper and ink.

...Mike

[ClaremontPhoto]

Americans (the US sort) pay a lot less than most of the world.

At one time, not now I think, a return air ticket NYC to London was way cheaper than a return air ticket London to NYC. Same airline same dates.

[nikonhswebmaster]

Adobe is not constantly adjusting their prices for the fluctuation of the dollar, which makes prices in Australia seem nuts right now. They price in the market, mark boxes, write ads etc.

Of course i understand what you what to do, you want to buy in Australia as though you are a tourist buying with AUD in the US.

You can do that but you have to buy in the US with dollars.

Using your method, a retail store in Australia selling a US product, would have to change the prices all through the store each day.

[ChrisN]

What is their justification for charging more in non-US markets?

Cost of delivering the product? (via internet download)

Cost of providing "service" and "customer support"? (via email and web-based "expert" systems)

[ChrisN]

Originally Posted by nikonhswebmaster

Adobe is not constantly adjusting their prices for the fluctuation of the dollar, which makes prices in Australia seem nuts right now. They price in the market, mark boxes, write ads etc.

Of course i understand what you what to do, you want to buy in Australia as though you are a tourist buying with AUD in the US.

You can do that but you have to buy in the US with dollars.

Using your method, a retail store in Australia selling a US product, would have to change the prices all through the store each day.

The price difference has nothing to do with the exchange rates - the Aussie dollar has been well above 70 cents US for two years, and climbing. There is nothing in the exchange rates to justify a 48% premium.

http://finance.yahoo.com/currency/co...USD&amt=1&t=1y

[mfunnell]

Originally Posted by nikonhswebmaster

Adobe is not constantly adjusting their prices for the fluctuation of the dollar, which makes prices in Australia seem nuts right now.

No, its not currency fluctuation - the values are too out-of-kilter and are always in one direction even when currency moves the other way. It happens across many industries. In my own trade there used to be a 25% uplift on all goods for outside-the-US markets and an additional 20% uplift for "Asia-Pacific" markets (which didn't include Japan or China - or the US despite that Pacific coastline). All "global" agreements ended at the US west coast. Etcetera.

That only ended when governments started muttering things like "collusion" and "price-fixing" for high-value products. I strongly suspect something similar is happening here with prices being set on a "what we can get away with" basis. The movie business tried (and mostly failed) to enforce "geographical" pricing with region-encoded DVDs and players.

...Mike

[nikonhswebmaster]

Originally Posted by ChrisN

The price difference has nothing to do with the exchange rates - the Aussie dollar has been well above 70 cents US for two years, and climbing. There is nothing in the exchange rates to justify a 48% premium.

http://finance.yahoo.com/currency/co...USD&amt=1&t=1y

I have not paid attention, are you saying the exchange rate between USD and AUD has remained exactly the same for 2 years, while the dollar has fallen against most other currency?

[Uncle Bill]

Canadians have been screaming about this issue since our dollar hit parity and for about a month was worth more than the US dollar.

There has been threads initiated about the merits and philosophy of supporting your local retailer versus big internet outlet. I don't think the argument holds a lot of water with this price spread. I shop for the best deal you can, getting fleeced you you can support the local supply chain is plain dumb if pricing does not reflect current realities.

If I were you, I would order from an American retailer and wait for Lightroom to come to you.

[mfunnell]

Originally Posted by nikonhswebmaster

I have not paid attention, are you saying the exchange rate between USD and AUD has remained exactly the same for 2 years, while the dollar has fallen against most other currency?

If the US dollar is falling, then the cost of US goods expressed in foreign-currency-denominated transactions should either fall (for new stock bought with newly-cheap US dollars) or stay the same (for old stock bought for older, more expensive, US dollars).

A falling currency makes imports expensive, and makes exports look cheaper to foreign buyers. Or maybe somebody's changed economics since I last looked.

...Mike

[nikonhswebmaster]

Originally Posted by Uncle Bill

Canadians have been screaming about this issue since our dollar hit parity and for about a month was worth more than the US dollar.

There has been threads initiated about the merits and philosophy of supporting your local retailer versus big internet outlet. I don't think the argument holds a lot of water with this price spread. I shop for the best deal you can, getting fleeced you you can support the local supply chain is plain dumb if pricing does not reflect current realities.

If I were you, I would order from an American retailer and wait for Lightroom to come to you.

Everyone loves gray market, and no one cares about steady prices when it is in your favor. But gray market pricing during the 80's saw the total destruction of local camera dealers at the hands of B&H photo's gray market prices, here in the US. In NYC there is just nothing left except the former gray marketers.

If Australians want to ignore their own retailers and buy everything direct at US prices, they will have to accept that all Australian retail will be forever changed, and they will become permanently tied to Amazon and B&H in the US for everything they buy.

There may be no stopping it. For now companies like Adobe are trying to protect retailers, who have to charge VAT etc, but in the end Global will most likely win, with all sales going to whatever country has the lowest currency.

But

These things change, as US exports increase, the dollar will rise, and someday you will wake up in Australia with a rising US dollar, and no where to buy any photo gear locally. Probably almost too late already I bet?

[Nikon Bob]

Sounds like a ripoff to me. I just checked one Canadian retailers web site and you can get Lightroom V1.0 for $319.99 from them. Still a $20 surcharge considering our dollar in relation to the US dollar but nowhere near the Oz surcharge.

Bob

[nikonhswebmaster]

Clearly Adobe Australia (perhaps part of Adobe US?) is just too expensive.

This has been a complaint about Nikon and Canon USA for years, prices just too high. But one thing is for sure Adobe USA cannot send software into Australia at a lower price than Adobe Australia sets the price at.

This is a local issue.

And one not hard to circumvent, there are zillions of dealers in the US who would be more than pleased to sell you a copy of Lightroom and drop it in the post for you, at US prices.

[mfunnell]

Originally Posted by nikonhswebmaster

But one thing is for sure Adobe USA cannot send software into Australia at a lower price than Adobe Australia sets the price at.

This is a local issue.

No, the locals don't control this. Adobe USA sets the price they will supply to Adobe Australia. It is higher than US retail. Adobe Australia then imposes their own uplift (they have to, to be profitable) then on-sells to their distribution channel etc. When (and its happening right now) people realise they can buy direct from the US, local suppliers suffer as do those at Adobe Australia - who are blamed for the results of head office pricing policy. After the ritual sacrifice of local executives ('cause head office is infallible), a spot of local downsizing and a few ineffective attempts to hold the line (such as not accepting non-US credit cards) somebody might eventually notice that their pricing model doesn't work in the modern world.

It will be fixed when the executive responsible moves on. (Before then, if the facts don't fit the senior executive's model, then so much the worse for the facts.)

...Mike

[nikonhswebmaster]

Originally Posted by mfunnell

No, the locals don't control this. Adobe USA sets the price they will supply to Adobe Australia. It is higher than US retail. Adobe Australia then imposes their own uplift (they have to, to be profitable) then on-sells to their distribution channel etc. When (and its happening right now) people realise they can buy direct from the US, local suppliers suffer as do those at Adobe Australia - who are blamed for the results of head office pricing policy. After the ritual sacrifice of local executives ('cause head office is infallible), a spot of local downsizing and a few ineffective attempts to hold the line (such as not accepting non-US credit cards) somebody might eventually notice that their pricing model doesn't work in the modern world.

It will be fixed when the executive responsible moves on. (Before then, if the facts don't fit the senior executive's model, then so much the worse for the facts.)

...Mike

All that speculation aside, it is very easy to get a copy much cheaper. The real issue at hand is will it authorize correctly?

[Roger Hicks]

Only tangentially related to regional pricing, but has anyone else noticed that India has asked for a loan from the World Bank to be denominated in rupees, largely because they see their own rupee as a more reliable and predictable currency than the US dollar?

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/south_asia/7133184.stm

Cheers,

R.

[Justin Viiret]

I'm in exactly the same boat as ChrisN -- I'd been getting ready to buy Lightroom for the equivalent of US$299, and it _does_ seem ridiculous to pay a good 50% or so more. I understand the need to support local retailers and distributors for physical products, but this is a different kettle of fish: it's software, distributed by download and serial number (assuming you buy the download, not a shrinkwrapped box).

It appears that Adobe's webservers for handling the store and the download service are all run from their USA webservers, so their different stores are only for localising the currency. Distribution costs and probably transaction costs to Adobe are the same in this case, regardless of where you're buying from. Many, many other companies get global direct sales right -- and I'm sure there are other customers who've balked at the pricetag the same way we have.

I'd be very interested in a statement from Adobe as to exactly how they justify this, actually -- has anyone contacted them?

[Justin Viiret]

Actually, looking around at the Aussie retailers, it seems that you can find the boxed release of Lightroom for AU$375 to 400 fairly easily. So perhaps Adobe's RRP is just behind the times.

[Taqi]

Here in Cayman I can't buy it at all, no matter what price! Cannot enter a Cayman address for credit card...

Crazy, as I would really like to buy it..

[mfunnell]

Originally Posted by nikonhswebmaster

All that speculation aside, it is very easy to get a copy much cheaper. The real issue at hand is will it authorize correctly?

Can't speak to Lightroom, but my PS CS3 upgrade worked fine. Re-installing PS CS2 (to wait for printing to be fixed in CS3) was much harder.

...Mike

[mfunnell]

Originally Posted by Justin Viiret

I'd be very interested in a statement from Adobe as to exactly how they justify this, actually -- has anyone contacted them?

No, I just worked around them. I did have a long conversation this week with a couple of reps from Canon regarding their prices for lenses and inkjet paper and ink (their prices for cameras seem to match international prices if shipping, taxes, currency etc. are factored in; lenses less so; and printer consumables are just shocking). They told me that they've complained - but head office sets the sell price to the local subsidiary and hasn't yet listened. They've gathered screeds from local distributors to feed back and got me to write my views up from a customer perspective.

We (the distributor I was with and I) were able to show examples where the price to the distributor here was substantially higher than the retail price from Adorama or B+H, including FedEx/UPS air shipment from NY to Sydney. The reps will feed that back to Japan and see what happens. Best guess: nothing.

...Mike

[BigSteveG]

On the other hand, most of the world pays far less for prescription medicines then we do here in the US...I wish it were the other around!!

[eric]

I use GIMP. Free. I'm not a professional Desktop guy but GIMP seems to do everything my PS did 3 years ago. I'm not really sure what features I need in full blown CS3 but I do basic photo editing.