Silence, please

ggirino · 02-23-2007

Hello everyone,

I've recently joined here and this is my first post.

I'd like to hear your opinion as to which is the M mount RF with the most silent shutter (hence the title). I would have posted this to the polls but i'm afraid I wouldn't be able to compile the list of possible answers.

As for myself, I shoot for fun in medium format with a Mamiya Super 23 rangefinder and in 35mm with a Contax RTSII reflex.

Thanks all those who'll take the time to answer.

Lino

Keith · 02-23-2007

Welcome to the forum Lino ... I can only judge by the M's that I actually own but for me it's my M7 with my M2 not far behind. The M7 does have a definite 'clack' but it's a quiet clack. The M2 is a softer more subtle sound ... mind you neither are as quiet as my Contax II!

robin a · 02-23-2007

Hi,no Leica here,but welcome to the forum.Ask anything you like,these guys will give you good info...........Robin

ggirino · 02-23-2007

Thanks Keith, I've recently had the occasion to hold an M2 and thought it wasn't so quiet, after all, but there I can only compare to my Super 23 leaf shutter which might not be a good/fair comparison. From another thread, http://tinyurl.com/2bhcm8, I also learn that having the shutter serviced makes a difference. I've read somewhere that the MP is supposed to have been made as quiet as possible.

Thanks Robin, I didn't mean just Leica M cameras (there is a similar thread on them
http://tinyurl.com/2bhcm8) but any M mount like Voigtlaender, Zeiss Ikon and whatever.

Lino

rover · 02-23-2007

Lino, I don't think there is any doubt a Leica M is pretty quite, none are silent though. Ultimately the answer may be the M with the most recent service. My M3 was CLA'd just prior to my buying it, so it is quieter than my M6, but that is just a comparison of my two cameras.

Welcome to the forum.

iml · 02-23-2007

All the film Ms I've handled are quiet enough for it not to be something worth worrying about, IME. My M6 is quiet enough for shutter noise never to be an issue. Bessas are a little noisier, but still pretty quiet. The quietest RF I own is the Olympus 35 RC, which is near-silent, but that's a fixed lens (and has a max speed of 1/500). Both the M8 and the R-D1 seem a bit louder than film M-bodies I have used.

Ian

amoz · 02-23-2007

Hi Lino,

You will get some varying answers here, although most will agree that any (recently serviced) M is pretty quiet.

I just want to add that using a tight-fit camera body case (like Stehphen Gandy from Cameraquest, or Luigi sell) will significantly mute the shutter sound. Almost like putting a silencer on a handgun.

Personally, I can compare the Bessa R with the R2A, of which the latter is quite a bit quieter IMO -- but this is not very relevant since the R is not a native M-mount camera.

ggirino · 02-23-2007

Quote:

Originally Posted by amoz

using a tight-fit camera body case (like Stehphen Gandy from Cameraquest, or Luigi sell) will significantly mute the shutter sound

This is a good suggestion, thanks Amoz

Quote:

I can compare the Bessa R with the R2A, of which the latter is quite a bit quieter

The R3A is on my watch list: very affordable, 1x viewfinder, A mode. I wonder what it sounds like.

Quote:

this is not very relevant since the R is not a native M-mount camera.

there might be something I don't know here. Do you mean it's not a Leica (I'm considering all brands' M-mount cameras) or is there any issue about not being "M-mount native"?

Lino

lushd · 02-23-2007

The Bessa R has 39mm screw thread lens mount. The R2A has an M mount.

Ash · 02-23-2007

Welcome!

I find a Contax II (or Kiev 4a) to be the quietest, followed by the M2, then the Leica Standard.

I don't have much experience with M bodies having only recently bought my M2. I think any of them will be silent after a good CLA. In a crowded room I wouldn't be able to hear the M2, and in a theater I bet I'd be hard pushed to get enough sound from the thing to annoy the other audience members. The noisest part is the winding on.

c.poulton · 02-23-2007

Lino

I would not call the R3a quiet. Used in quiet environments such as churches, mine always seems to attract attention. Apart from that, it's a fine camera!

The quietest camera I own is my Yashica GT, with my Leica IIIf coming a very close second.

Brian Sweeney · 02-23-2007

I find my CLA'd Leica M3 single-stroke to be the most silent of my focal plane cameras. It is quieter than my Retina IIIS with a Compur shutter. I use it in an original Leica case, bought for $10. This is the case made to fit the camera with the "summaron with eyes", and is more heavily padded than the smaller M cases.

rover · 02-23-2007

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ash

Welcome!

I find a Contax II (or Kiev 4a) to be the quietest, followed by the M2, then the Leica Standard.

I don't have much experience with M bodies having only recently bought my M2. I think any of them will be silent after a good CLA. In a crowded room I wouldn't be able to hear the M2, and in a theater I bet I'd be hard pushed to get enough sound from the thing to annoy the other audience members. The noisest part is the winding on.

Hey, actually I did have a very very quite Keiv 4a too.

rpsawin · 02-23-2007

Lino,

Check the archives on this site. I think someone actually posted some wav files of various 35mm rf shutters.

FWIW...since I had my m2 cla'd it is very quiet. The rf I use that is absolutely the most quiet is my Mamiya 7II....it's not an M mount and it's 6x7.

Bob

ddutchison · 02-23-2007

My guess is that a very well used and freshly overhauled M2 or M3 is going to be close to the top of the silence list, but not the absolute peak. Even a not so freshly overhauled M2 is quiet enough that most people will never notice the sound, even in a quiet room. I have a nearly newM6-TTL and it's noticeably louder than my M2 that's screaming for an overhaul. They just don't make 'em like they used to!

I'm not so sure the Kiev is really quieter, mine wasn't, and it was new (bought it in '74 and compared to my English teachers M3). Kiev and Contax shutters do sound different from any other however - smoother (The Leica was after all, the poor-mans Contax for a long time), and they sound nothing like what the modern ear would associate with a camera shutter. That's important when it comes to not disturbing the wild life, which is what the silence thing is really all about.

The pre-Cosina Voigtlander Prominent (made by the real Voigtlander, the one that was founded in 1756!), was an interchangeable lens 35mm with a leaf-shutter, so I'm willing to bet it's at least as quiet as an M, in theory it should be quieter.

some (all?) of the Kodak Retina folding 35 cameras had interchangable front lens elements and are reported to be nearly silent.

If you can live without a range finder, a Nikon Nikkonis (designed for underwater use) really is silent (unless pressed hard against the ear), and if you can live without lens-interchangeability, but with one of the best 35 f2's ever made (somewhere between the pre-ASPH and the ASPH Summicron, by all accounts), then the Konica Hexar AF in "Silent Mode" has the absence of auditory annoyance you seek, pretty suave camera too, as long as the batteries hold out.

Xmas · 02-23-2007

David

Kievs do vary a low in sound levels, they are noisy if the preload on the shutter is high. few kievs get the TLC that leicas get.

Noel

Ash · 02-23-2007

Having mentioned non-leica non-contax cameras, maybe look at folding cameras. I forgot to mention that the two folding cams I have (6x9 and 6x4.5) can outperform my 35mm's on negative size and often definition - see the post about chinese new year and the Zeiss Nettar..

I think you could probably find a coupled rangefinder Zeiss, and the leaf shutter is about as silent as it gets. Quieter than dropping a paperclip onto a cold hard desk.

projectbluebird · 02-23-2007

Of the rangefinders I own the quietest by far is my Old Voigtlander Vitessa, but it has a leaf shutter. (And a fixed lens) The only M-Mount camera I have is an old M3 which is also very quiet, and quieter than any other focal plane shutter camera I have compared it to. (Including an M6, an M7, and a Bessa R)

Keith · 02-23-2007

I have just gone and fired the shutters of a few various cameras to confirm my thoughts about my M2 and M7 ... however ... the quietest rangefinder by far is my 1936 Super Ikonta. It's incredibly quiet even allowing for the fact it does have a leaf shutter ... if the rangefinder wasn't so difficult to use it would be the ultimate stealth camera!

ddutchison · 02-24-2007

Quote:

Originally Posted by Xmas

David

Kievs do vary a low in sound levels, ... few kievs get the TLC that leicas get.

Noel

That is very true .

Also a kiev like I had, made in'74, would not be as well made as one from the 50's or 60's.

StuartR · 02-24-2007

I have a number of M's, and the two quietest are the M3 and the M7. They are about equal, but the M7 has the advantage of making no buzzing sounds from 1s to 1/30th, while the M3 (and all other M Leicas) have a mechanical buzzing sound at these slow speeds. Overall, all the M's are quiet, the Zeiss Ikon is pretty good, and the Voigtlanders and Hexar RF are still good compared to SLR's. The quietest Leica M-like camera is the Hexar AF with the fixed 35/2 and stealth mode. It is truly a silent camera, being only a fraction as loud as the already very quiet M cameras.

ggirino · 03-06-2007

I just wished to thank all those whoh took their time to answer me.

I didn't even know of the existance of the Hexar AF which seems to be the quietest af all. Too bad it's fixed lens.

It also appears that the Voigtlaender, the R3A in particular, is not so quiet. Pity, it has attractive features and price.

As for the Leicas, I think I'd be too shy to use one without exposure metering; the newer ones cost really much.

Thanks again,
Lino

ggirino · 03-20-2007

Just found this: http://elekm.net/zeiss_ikon/pages/body.html
At the bottom of the page are a few .wav samples of shutter sounds

Lino