Load A Leica Bottom-Loader!

[SteveM(PA)]

I think we should have a little YouTube permalink to some demonstrations of the various methods. I don't have a decent movie camera, nor am I particularly fast at it

[Xmas]

The only problem with any of this is

- the 22, 23 or 24 hole dispute, I'm a 22 person
- the credit card, bus card or Zorki case card or finger on plate may cause damage dont do it...
- the knife or scissors will be confiscated when you fly, I use a swiss army penknife

Noel

[East Ridge]

umm....I'm the new kid in town; where do I find the second post on Leica Bottom Loading instructions? I have loaded before without trimming the film leader, is that not the best way?

[laptoprob]

Just back from Valencia (Fallas) with the IIf and CLE. The IIf did most the work. Because we only took hand luggage on the plane: no scissors. So I tried to load a film without trimming it, no problem. So why does it seem to be necessary anyway?

[tedwhite]

I just bought a IIIf red dial w/self timer yesterday. The guy who sold it to me, a decades long Leica rf owner, demonstrated film loading with a roll of my TriX.

I went right out and shot about 15 frames before I realized the rewind knob wasn't rotating. In his defense, the gentleman is 83 years old and had quite shaky hands.

So I went to the thread on manuals, read the loading portion thoroughly, and got the next roll in properly. I could see the gear teeth had engaged the film properly. I back wound the rewind spool a tad to make sure, then closed up the camera. Rewind knob now rotates when I advance film.

Many thanks to everyone for all the instructions and comments.

My lens on the IIIf is either the cv Color Skopar 35/3.5 or the Canon 50/1.8. Don't have any Leica lenses as yet.

Ted

[nagroth]

I read a website once dealing with reloading film and the person said to remove the lens before doing anything else. Is this only for precaution to not damage the lens?

[tedwhite]

Perhaps, with the lens off, one could reach in and guide the film. But there would then be the risk of curtain damage, I think.

[eia41]

If you live in the UK, contact veteran Leica repairer Malcolm Taylor (see contact details in his Amateur Photographer ads) who will supply you with an excellently made copy- very smooth finish and no sharp edges. He can also supply take-up spools for LTM bodies. Repairs and CLAs of LTM and M bodies, and lenses, are his forte! I bought an M3 from him in the mid 80's which still runs as smoothly as butter.
Regards
eia41

[acolla]

Great!!! I just received my Canon IIb and was wondering how the hell I was going to load the film in it, as it is my very first Leica film loading style camera. Thanks a bunch!

[Trawlerman]

Many thanks for posting this vital information.

I just got a Leica III and would have just gone ahead and tried to load it with a normal roll of film had I not seen this sticky. As it is, I loaded up my first roll of NPC160 in moments qith the aid and advice that I found here.

Many thanks.

BTW, I just scored an ablon from an eBay seller in the US so in future I will be sure that my film trimming is done correctly.

[richard_l]

Originally Posted by laptoprob

Just back from Valencia (Fallas) with the IIf and CLE. The IIf did most the work. Because we only took hand luggage on the plane: no scissors. So I tried to load a film without trimming it, no problem. So why does it seem to be necessary anyway?

There's a kink (or warp) near the beginning of most rolls of film which may prevent the film from being inserted all the way. If for any reason, the film hangs up on the inside edge of the film gate, there's a problem. Although this is a no-no, I just insert a playing card into the slot where the film goes, then insert the film between the card and the pressure plate, then remove the card.

The 'correct' method is to trim the leader, which provides a sort of ramp which makes the film ride up into the correct position as it is advanced. I don't like to do this if the film is being commercially processed, since it could bother someone who is not used to handling film with such a long leader.

The kink in the film is what causes most misloads with Leica LTM and M cameras. I.e., it prevents the film from being inserted correctly.

Richard

[hou baloo]

Originally Posted by tedwhite

I went right out and shot about 15 frames before I realized the rewind knob wasn't rotating.
Ted

Irrespective of the loading technique or even of the camera, I always tension the rewind knob/crank before winding up to frame 1 and watch it turn to make sure the film is engaged on the takeup, a lesson I learned from once taking 45 frames on a 20-exposure roll

[payasam]

Hou Baloo, I do the same. To make it easier, I wind up the film in the cassette before loading.

[350D_user]

Originally Posted by hou baloo

Irrespective of the loading technique or even of the camera, I always tension the rewind knob/crank before winding up to frame 1 and watch it turn to make sure the film is engaged on the takeup, a lesson I learned from once taking 45 frames on a 20-exposure roll

If the sprockets miss the holes though, winding the film too tightly will cause framing issues.

... the voice of experience!

[cmedin]

Thanks for this thread. I just loaded my IIf with what appears to be successful results (the rewind knob turning). Trimmed 22 holes back, used the rewind knob to tighten the cassette up, put the bottom plate on and advanced two frames, knob was turning just fine. Of course the real test will be whether I get any pictures out of it...

[shadowfox]

Timely thread! I often wondered why we bother with cameras that needs this much effort to load. But on a camera show recently, I handled a IIc. What a smooth piece of machinery. So I'm willing to give it a try.

If the time I spend shooting with these bottom loaders is enjoyable plus the result is good to excellent, I'll keep using them.

Now I just need to find one I can justify buying

[rxmd]

Originally Posted by richard_l

I don't like to do this if the film is being commercially processed, since it could bother someone who is not used to handling film with such a long leader.

Film lengths are standardised for automatic processing. I used to use an automatic Mafina processor at home where 135 film was spooled diagonally on a drum about 40 cm in diameter. If the film length wasn't right, the film didn't fit. One film that I had problems with was Fomapan 100, which is slightly longer because its predecessor film used to be shipped with a Leica leader. Foma just changed the leader and kept the length. I regularly had problems developing Fomapan 100 because it didn't fit on the drum. In the end I had to trim the film constantly by hand before spooling it on the machine.

[ibrando]

Originally Posted by shadowfox

If the time I spend shooting with these bottom loaders is enjoyable plus the result is good to excellent, I'll keep using them.

Now I just need to find one I can justify buying

I suggest an M4-2, I just recently acquired one and it's much easier to load than the M3 I tried long ago.

Cheers,
B.

[Paul C. Perkins, MD]

In fact - I find loading my M-2 far easier than the M-4. On more than one occasion I've had to make multiple attempts to get the film to positively engage on that silly-*ss triple sproket. I have the manual - and it yields no clever insight on how this can be accomplished.

Paul

[Solinar]

On my M3, I found that trimming the leader as you would for a bottom loader makes loading much easier. Back in the 1950's 35mm film had longer leaders than what we're using today.

[landsknechte]

Out of curiosity, were the long leaders universal originally, or are our modern shorter leaders just the one style that caught on?

BTW, the best real world test to see if you've mastered this process it to shoot HIE.

[PHOTOEIL]

Step #2 is not needed with a M5, just slide in the straight film-end, no cutting, just to make you a little jealous...

[Vince Lupo]

No need to trim the film leader to load a Leica TM. Here's how I do it, for anyone who's interested: Set the main shutter dial on 1/20 (if it's a short-bodied), and then set the slow speed dial to 'T'. Next, trip the shutter to open it. Remove the lens. Remove the bottom plate. Feed the film tongue onto the takeup spool, then guide the film down the slot and into position (if the edge of the film gets caught by the edge of the shutter opening, just push it in with your finger). Rewind the film slowly until the tension is taken up. Close the shutter by turning the slow speed dial. Replace the bottom and the lens. Advance the film and you're golden. I've been doing it this way for 20 years - even with a MOOLY motor and a transmission arm. The only issue is that if you're on the move you have to juggle a lens, bottom plate and the film. But, I just shot 20 rolls in Europe using a black Leica III, and a IIIa with a MOOLY and it didn't pose a problem. So put your scissors away!

[rtphotos]

Thank you, doubs43 for posting your instructions and the photos! I just received a Leica IIf from Igor Reznik and loaded the film correctly on my first try.

As one with 3 thumbs and who took hours to load his first roll of bl&wh film on a spiral, I am relieved.

Now off to test this wonderful looking camera (w/summitar and sbooi) with correctly loaded film!

all the best,
rt

[ray*j*gun]

I have had mu tiny Swiss Army Knife also taken from me by the airlines so heads up!!