Digitial Film

[Will]

Chinese Digitial Film shown in photokina:

http://www.pcpop.com/doc/0/124/124149_2.shtml

http://www.pcpop.com/doc/0/124/124149_3.shtml

http://www.pcpop.com/doc/0/124/124149_4.shtml

RMB 600~800, 2MP, Shutter on B or T only. (Digicam stuff?)

Cheers





Will

[Will]

Company Website (in simplified chinese)

http://www.isi.com.cn/Product/efilmnews.htm

[MP Guy]

cool. when will we see it in stores?

[bmattock]

Originally Posted by Will

Chinese Digitial Film shown in photokina:

http://www.pcpop.com/doc/0/124/124149_2.shtml

http://www.pcpop.com/doc/0/124/124149_3.shtml

http://www.pcpop.com/doc/0/124/124149_4.shtml

RMB 600~800, 2MP, Shutter on B or T only. (Digicam stuff?)

Cheers

Will

Looks interesting. I note that the sensor seems very small. Shutter on B or T? Seems like maybe a problem with sensing when the shutter is open or closed. I don't want to seem negative (hehehe), but something similar was announced here years ago - nothing came of it. I'd like to see it, but I have some doubts.

Best Regards,

Bill Mattocks

[paulfitz]

probably never.

I can't read Chinese, but marketing logic says this will be problematic, unless the company has enough capital to completely change the way things are.

Film companies would never make it - drastically reduced film sales
Camera companies would never make it - all the old cameras on ebay immediately flood the market.

What would work is if a BATTERY company made it, around a special propritary battery. When the battery dies, you have to buy a new one or get a replacement factory service.

That model would work.

This will probably spark another big film vs. digital argument!

[bmattock]

Originally Posted by paulfitz

probably never.

I can't read Chinese, but marketing logic says this will be problematic, unless the company has enough capital to completely change the way things are.

Film companies would never make it - drastically reduced film sales
Camera companies would never make it - all the old cameras on ebay immediately flood the market.

What would work is if a BATTERY company made it, around a special propritary battery. When the battery dies, you have to buy a new one or get a replacement factory service.

That model would work.

This will probably spark another big film vs. digital argument!

Excellent points. We sometimes confuse what we want with what others might want to make - what would it benefit them to do so? This model might have worked when many camera companies were still struggling to move from film cameras to digital models - they could have 'fought back' a bit. But I think your points are very good.

Best Regards,

Bill Mattocks

[jlw]

It appears they're saying it will go on sale (somewhere) on May 1!

A translation from Google's beta-version simplified Chinese translator:

Digital roll film, patent product!
Patent number: 012339172; 033679258

One, may see from the above chart, the digital roll film contour and the size and the ordinary 135 roll films same, may cause the majority tradition the photographic camera not to do any modification, all may directly use the digital roll film photography clear bright Li digital photograph, lets your traditional photographic camera ????, immediately becomes the digital camera!
Note: In May 1 goes on the market the digital roll film is aims at these has the center upscale camera which the B gate, the T gate and fixed time photographs. (Has some cameras when use numerical code roll film, roll film sheeting needs to download)

Two, digital roll film characteristic:
1, the digital roll film uses is in sole possession of the ultra thin CMOS sensor, its thickness only has 0.7mm

Is the ordinary CMOS sensor 1/3, ??? traditional 135 lists reflections camera.
Note: The CMOS photosensitivity size is 1/2 inch, in other words photographs the picture only is selects a scene the window center one part. For example: The original 35mm lens may illuminate the whole body picture in 3 meter about distance, the digital roll film only may illuminate the half-length picture in 3 meter about distance. But wanted to illuminate one prospect numerical code roll film is able to develop one's ability to the full, she was allowed to cause 35mm to decide the burnt camera photographs about 180mm the long burnt effect.

2, the digital roll film uses general durable CR2 may imitate ??? (photographic camera special-purpose battery) does the power source, allows you to photograph the photograph several dried bean curd, reminds in the digital roll film you does not have the electricity time, but also can for you again photograph several ten clear bright Li digital photograph! This only can work several ten minutes digital cameras with one battery compares, appears specially durably. Again also needs not to worry in the travel on the way, because of the photographic camera battery electricity, the regrettable aspect which but cannot photograph.
Note: Stochastically matches delivers the charge number of times is bigger than 800 time may imitate battery one.

3, the patent product digital roll film brings own the liquid crystal display monitor, may through the traditional photographic camera ?? above roll film material demonstration window, promptly examine the digital roll film the active status;

4, the digital roll film special-purpose picture multiplies software, may multiply the digital roll film photography photograph picture element by 10 time of percentages (for example: After 2100000 picture elements multiply may achieve 21000000 picture elements), after multiply the picture can clearer bright Li. (Here is picture multiplies in mathematics is called interpolation)
Note: Any digital photograph all may multiply software through the picture multiplies, after the process multiplies the picture enlarges to 1: 1 looks, can feel fuzzily. This after is because multiplies the picture only can increase the picture element, cannot increase the clarity. But digital roll film like 1 states, the photography picture only is selects a scene the window center one part, we all know one photograph ???? is clearest. Therefore, after the digital roll film photography picture process multiplies the picture enlarges to 1: 1 looks the feeling can good be very many.

5, the digital roll film uses general USB, may conveniently with the computer, the printer, or the digital image equipment connects.

6, the digital roll film has the dynamic photograph function, for has the B gate or the T gate traditional camera increases one digital camera the function, causes your traditional camera to stand Engraves becomes one digital camera, transcribes the digital image for you;

7, the digital roll film has moves the U plate the function, may like one moves the U plate same, downloads for you preserves some data materials.

8, the patent product digital roll film gathers the dynamic photograph, the static photography, moves the U plate and so on, three kind of products functions, one kind of product price this is the digital roll film unequalled, the advantageous superiority!

...All of which is a little puzzling. The pictures show what looks like a C-size sensor (smaller than APS-size; typical of compact digicams) which would certainly limit its real-world usability, and although they claim the CMOS sensor is only 0.7mm thick, the package looks thick enough that I wonder how well it would fit in a lot of cameras.

Still, if the price weren't too outrageous and it worked at least SORT of decently, I'll bet a lot of us would be interested -- if only as a convenient way to test the functionality of old cameras and lenses!

[paulfitz]

Interesting points:

the thin CMOS sensor - film cameras are designed around a photosensitve element that is only usually .0045 inches (at most) that's .11mm but most pressure plates could deal with this difference, and

it's designed around a CR2 battery, which are not cheap, don't last very long and I don't think have rechargeable equivalents.

hmmm, don't care for the crop factor though!

here we do go again!

[popitz]

I hope some Japanese company takes an interest in this and develops it. They're good at miniaturizing, anyway. Now if only they'd use a bigger sensor with low noise, selectable film characteristics (Digital Provia, anyone? ), switchable ISO and a dust reduction or dust protection mechanism, who would need a digital body? Our dreams of a Digital Kiev will come true! Oh wait, that wouldn't be right. The digital film should also be FSU-made to make it an authentic Digital Kiev. Maybe the Ukrainians can clone the digital film?

[Will]

Originally Posted by bmattock

Looks interesting. I note that the sensor seems very small. Shutter on B or T? Seems like maybe a problem with sensing when the shutter is open or closed. I don't want to seem negative (hehehe), but something similar was announced here years ago - nothing came of it. I'd like to see it, but I have some doubts.

Best Regards,

Bill Mattocks

Bill,

I think(guess) it is base on Digicam CCD and graphic engine etc...

Originally Posted by paulfitz

Interesting points:

the thin CMOS sensor - film cameras are designed around a photosensitve element that is only usually .0045 inches (at most) that's .11mm but most pressure plates could deal with this difference, and

it's designed around a CR2 battery, which are not cheap, don't last very long and I don't think have rechargeable equivalents.

hmmm, don't care for the crop factor though!

here we do go again!

Paul,

Without going into the techical details, let's just take it as entertainment.

Chinese version of the digital film, might operate like the US one...

...venture capital!

Cheers





Will

[kmack]

Originally Posted by Will

Chinese Digitial Film shown in photokina:

RMB 600~800, 2MP, Shutter on B or T only. (Digicam stuff?)

Will

Only 2MP? I'll get one to play with If it costs under $50, otherwise I can get a used 4MP p&s for under $100.

[lubitel]

So I guess its a good time to stack up on some classic film cameras as long as they are cheap.

[VinceC]

>>Film companies would never make it - drastically reduced film sales
Camera companies would never make it - all the old cameras on ebay immediately flood the market.
What would work is if a BATTERY company made it, around a special propritary battery<<

I don't know that you need a film company or camera company to make your electronic doohickies. A Chinese electronics company could make it.
Last time I looked, most low-end and many middle-end consumer electronics are made in China already. They have a pretty robust ability to do things like send astronauts into orbit and invade our children's playrooms with electronic toys made in China.

I think there's a market for one if they can keep the crop factor within savage reason. A proprietary battery would kill it from the get go. It's got to be changeable on the fly.

[varjag]

I agree, as long as there's a market to sell and technology to implement it, such things will appear, sooner or later.

[titrisol]

I don't see the advantage of these....
canister (35mm)could be used for battery and USB connection and memory.
So you could carry 2 or 3 with different ISo settings and keep shooting.
But in some cameras that "feel" ifthe film is being wound what would happen.

[grapejohnson]

This is a really cool idea, and as others said, for cheap I'd try it. It definitely needs some work, but is a kind of good solution for the "oh my god what do we with our super expensive film cameras if they stop manufacturing film?" problem. Make it full frame and not long exposure and I'd be highly interested.

[hepcat]

Hmmm.... can someone explain to me why the shutter needs to be on B or T? It looks like the sensor actually fits into the shutter opening? So, how does it know when to make the exposure? Doesn't it need a shutter? How does it couple to the shutter release? What am I missing here?

[bensyverson]

You guys realize this is a thread from 2006, right?

[CNNY]

Originally Posted by grapejohnson

This is a really cool idea, and as others said, for cheap I'd try it. It definitely needs some work, but is a kind of good solution for the "oh my god what do we with our super expensive film cameras if they stop manufacturing film?" problem. Make it full frame and not long exposure and I'd be highly interested.

Look at the date of the original post, and ask yourself why it doesn't already exist. The answer will be that it is neither practical, nor economical to produce or use. My guess is that this kind of solution will not be on the market for the foreseeable future.

[jsrockit]

7 years with no news and you guys are wondering how it works?

[CliveC]

Man, this thread really got my hopes up for a second. I thought somebody already realized Nikon's patent.