Sony RX1
Old 12-04-2012   #1
Dralowid
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Sony RX1

So folks, is this finally it?

Is this the arrival of the full frame compact that will ultimately lead to something with an EVF and maybe even interchangeable lenses?

Has the world turned full circle and we are back where we started and where the traditionalists wanted to be all along?

....runs for cover as M9 prices plummet...
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Old 12-04-2012   #2
lam
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Prepare for galleries to be full of bokeh'd Christmas lights.

I also predict resale value will.. be.. interesting.

EVF and interchangeable I don't see happening for a little bit. Too busy making NEX 8 9 10f 11e 12c

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Old 12-04-2012   #3
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i predict it will stay 'as is' for a long run...
i think it will sell better than most predict...
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Old 12-04-2012   #4
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I know a lot of people are moaning about it not having a EVF, but I think it's great. I think by excluding the EVF, they're actually adding to the lifespan of the camera. I feel like EVFs are not going to age well, and cameras that otherwise have great image quality are going to be abandoned because of finnicky EVF (or at least percieved finniciness in the face of better viewfinder coming out down the line). The RX1 is offering two things: an absolutely crackin' sensor with a delicious piece of zeiss glass in front of it. In my favourite focal length no less. I can't say I really need anything other than that.

I use two cameras: a Leica M4 w/ 35mm Ultron and a Ricoh GR1. I always figured the only thing that will bring me back to digital would be a full frame sensor, wide angle lens and compact like a leica without the $8,000 price tag. I thought I would be waiting for at least a decade before anything like that would arrive. After shooting with a meterless Leica, I don't want any nonsense in the viewfinder, just framelines and physical dials for shutterspeed and aperture. After shooting with a GR1 I can appreciate pocketability and automatic exposure/focus.

The RX1 is like a hybrid of these two cameras. I would just turn on centre-point autofocus, lock focus on my subject and then frame the photo the way I do with a rangefinder. Because I no longer need the rangefinder patch, I can live with an external optical viewfinder. This, for me, eliminates all the nonsense that companies cram into viewfinders these days anyways, which puts it above EVF cameras. If I need to double check exposure while shooting on manual, I would almost just use the back LCD like I would a lightmeter.

This is the first digital camera that has a really high appeal to me. Now to wait a while for people to buy it and offload it a few months later for $1000 cheaper than retail! I've been waiting long enough for a camera like this, and considering I didn't think it was going to be possible for a while yet, I'm more than willing to wait another few months to pick one up on the cheap.
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Old 12-04-2012   #5
CaptZoom
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I have to admit I'm extremely curious about the RX1. It's going to bring about some serious changes to photography in the next few years. I'd trade the built in EVF for a swivel screen.
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Old 12-04-2012   #6
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Substitute an M4p w/35mm Summicron and everything in apodeictic's post applies to me as well.

Since it's coming out of a mass market company I expect I'll wait to see where the price settles 6 months down the line and grab one at a discount from a major retailer having a silly sale or someone on here who gets bored with it.
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Old 12-04-2012   #7
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My expectation is that the RX1 will still be selling at or near its introductory price of $2,800 USD six months to a year from now.

If there are price decreases, it seems logical they'll first happen in Europe and in other geographies where the camera is priced relatively higher to the U.S. market even taking out value added taxes.

I also don't think an interchangeable lens version - not necessarily a RX series or NEX series camera - is anywhere on the horizon, although even if it were, prices would still stay relatively high.

They packed enough tech and heavy-duty build into this camera that it can stand on its own for quite some time. Only a competitor bringing out a very similarly equipped camera for much less might push price down hard, and there's no takers on that front I'd be willing to wager.

It looks and feels like a classic - durable enough to last. Could be the last camera some would ever buy. Maybe this time for real!

I won't have mine until ~ Dec 19th ish.
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Old 12-04-2012   #8
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Dralowid View Post
So folks, is this finally it?

Is this the arrival of the full frame compact that will ultimately lead to something with an EVF and maybe even interchangeable lenses?

Has the world turned full circle and we are back where we started and where the traditionalists wanted to be all along?

....runs for cover as M9 prices plummet...

I think the thing that will make M9 prices plummet will be the M10 or whatever you want to call it. Though I am amazed at how little chat/speculation there has been lately about the upcoming replecement for the M9.

The Sony sounds great but it can't be denied that it is damned expensive!
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Old 12-04-2012   #9
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i still want one...just don't have the $$ for it...
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Old 12-04-2012   #10
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If I didn't have an M9, I'd be super attracted to this camera. But I do, and I'm not. $2800 can buy some sweet glass for the M9.
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Old 12-04-2012   #11
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Brought home one of these to play around with, can't wait to get it fired up and shooting.
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Old 12-04-2012   #12
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First thoughts - Fly by wire lens design feels fine, but isn't as nice as good manual lens. Picture quality looks really good up to about ISO 6400 but the noise reduction is horrendous, it basically destroys your fine details. Detents on all adjustments feel really positive. Rear wheel is easy to turn, but still offers a firm detent. Lens looks to be really damned sharp, even at f/2. There's a focus limit adjustment on the lens, 0.2m to 0.35m or 0.35m to infinity. Doesn't look like there's a raw-development option in the camera like the X-Pro1 or the Nikon D600, which I have come to really enjoy. OOC Jpeg files look great!

Here's one out the window from my drive home (f/2.8, 1/800 @ ASA 800):


The Long Road Home -- San Mateo Bridge, California, CA by kzamani, on Flickr

(Full Size is on the flickr page.)
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Old 12-05-2012   #13
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I've changed my mind and don't think the EVF would be necessary. The optical viewfinder is perhaps more in keeping. Looking forward to playing with one.
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Old 12-05-2012   #14
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Quote:
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I have to admit I'm extremely curious about the RX1. It's going to bring about some serious changes to photography in the next few years.
To photography or to camera making?
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Old 12-05-2012   #15
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Trying to see beyond the marketing; it appears to be a full-frame X2...?

.
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Old 12-05-2012   #16
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Not for me, even if I did shoot digital, I could think of better things to spend that sort of money on. If it holds it's value it'll probably be the first digital compact that has, so I don't expect to hold any better than the X100 or Leica X1. For those pennies I'd get a Leica 8.2 plus lens, the 8.2 won't go too much further down in the near term, and the lens will hold value just fine.

Just too many lovely cameras out there for this to get a look in for me.
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Old 12-05-2012   #17
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The presumed retention of value assumes Sony does not get the itch to release a new model 6 months from now, which it often does.
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Old 12-05-2012   #18
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Quote:
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To photography or to camera making?
I stand corrected.
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Old 12-05-2012   #19
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So now, 30 years later, we basically can have the digital Contax fixed lens point and shoot in our pocket. Once the RX1 line goes down to the price of the Yashica T4, I'll buy one.
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Old 12-05-2012   #20
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35mm? I didn't expect this from Sony. Do market needs another 35/2 lensed compact? There's X100 already.
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Old 12-05-2012   #21
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I almost bought the camera a few weeks ago, but I simply haven't been impressed by the images from it, either on the web or when I tried it in the store. I think Fuji renders images much nicer, and I prefer the images coming from the Xpro1, and even from the X100. RX1 images have that sony look, the digitallest of digital. They just lack atmosphere. I am sure some if it can be fixed in post with all the MP and Low light sensitivity headroom, but haven't seen much examples of that yet.

The big lens also ruins the size of the camera.

My X100 is more pocketable. And maybe full frame with a 35mm lens at 2.0 is simply not that impressive image wise. I think the reasons to shoot 35mm have little to do with the reasons to shoot full frame, because it is such an subject/story focussed focal length. For purely visually stunning images it is probably more effective to put either a much shorter or longer lens on a camera like the Xpro or nex.
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Old 12-05-2012   #22
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35mm? I didn't expect this from Sony. Do market needs another 35/2 lensed compact? There's X100 already.
What did you expect instead though?
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Old 12-05-2012   #23
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Quote:
Originally Posted by CaptZoom View Post
I have to admit I'm extremely curious about the RX1. It's going to bring about some serious changes to photography in the next few years. I'd trade the built in EVF for a swivel screen.
I'm not interested in the RX1 itself, but as you say, I think it will have a major impact on the cameras we'll see coming out in the next few years.

For example, the XF mount Fujinon lenses (for the X-Pro1 and X-E1) project a FF-sized image. I'd love to see the RX1 begin to drive other manufacturers (such as Fujifilm) to produce commercially viable FF systems that are compatible with existing lenses.

That said, I have no really issue with APS-C. But it certainly would be nice to have access to true wide angles, and to be able to adapt M-mount glass without a crop penalty.
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Old 12-05-2012   #24
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Quote:
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What did you expect instead though?
well, fast 24-45mm (maybe even up to 70mm if one would insist, but 45 is enough for me) zoom would be more logical step. I see, a lot of people would like to see it as a 24mm fixed focal length and I can agree that would be terrific alternative to 35mm.

Probably I simply can't recover from using 35mm for years. Not that I hate it. But it's neither there or here. It's a pasta or pizza. RX1 will be loved by people who like pasta or pizza.
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Old 12-05-2012   #25
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I think the RX1 looks great. It will indeed be interesting to see how the full frame, its big USP, balances out against a good viewfinder, the X100's USP.

I've messed around long enough with the GF1 and an separate finder. It's like going back to the 30s, and is too much of a compromise for me. Even using centre focus, you'll simply get too many mis-focused shots - and what's the point of having full frame quality when your subject is not in focus?


Nonetheless, it's great the RX1 is here and I look forward to the next iteration from Sony, or another rival.

Incidentally, Fuji look to have backtracked on the "statement" that their existing lenses are full-frame.
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