Can you define a P&S?

[dave lackey]

Can we get a concensus on what exactly is a "Point and Shoot"?

Four cameras in four days. A Nikon 990, 995, 5400 and a Canon Sureshot A720is. These were the four cameras I used extensively for four consecutive days last week.

I find the Canon handy for taking snapshots and don't really want to be bothered with photography...rare but true. The Nikons are quite interesting with the 5400 being the best as far as being consistent and closer to what I am used to. I am getting some character images from the 990 and 995 that I did not expect. So, I will continue working with them in anticipation of making them available for my photography classes.

The 5400...is good enough to earn backup status in my bag. Not good enough for first string, but good enough to CMA for the time being as well as shoot the kids.

Would I classify these as P&S? Absolutely because they are not easy to use manually. Not at all. Menus are typically screwed up as with all Nikon digitals that I have used with too many menus and choices. Simplicity went out the window with Nikon years ago. But, set them up with P and sometimes Automatic, shoot away and you go away with decent images. Not the IQ I am used to but okay.

But the question is...what defines a P&S camera anyway? Any DSLR can be used as a P&S albeit a bear to lug around, etc. Is there a real definition or is it the urban myth by DSLR users that anything else is a P&S?

My first prerequisite for a NON-P&S is ease of use in manual modes.

[ronnies]

My personal definition of a 'point & shoot' camera would be any camera that gives you no control over the exposure or focus settings. If you can take control then the camera is not a 'point & shoot' even though it may have that mode.

Ronnie

[__hh]

"a camera that is inferior to my standards, but I am so good that even/only I can make superior photos with it"

[Sparrow]

[jsrockit]

It starts with cameras that have no manual controls whatsoever and then gets increasingly difficult to classify after that.

[Aristophanes]

P&S is a function of a camera, not necessarily a type of camera.

At its simplest, it is automated focus (point) exposure (shoot).

My DSLR has a P&S setting and it works quite nicely. Program Mode is a type of P&S automation and it is the user's choice to do so at the expense of manual focus and exposure.

[bjornkeizers]

I consider it a P&S if it fits in my pocket, has a non-interchangable lens and does autofocus & autoexposure.

It does get tricky on occasion. The Minox 35 is small, fixed lens, auto-exposure but... manual focus. However, if you were to set the appropriate aperture and focus range, you wouldn't need that anyway.

[Sparrow]

geez ... it's a camera one can use when drunk

[Corto]

"My first prerequisite for a NON-P&S is ease of use in manual modes."

Yeah, To a point I agree.
But while somewhat cumbersome I have shot a Nikon 995 manually for years.

[semilog]

A P&S is any relatively simple camera designed after 1980 (usually a camera that has AF) that a Leicaphile wishes to denigrate.

;-)

[coelacanth]

Originally Posted by Sparrow

geez ... it's a camera one can use when drunk

+1.

I have a designated "drunk camera" for drinking situations I know I can't trust myself with more "serious" cameras. My current drunk camera is XA. Although it has Aperture priority, +1.5 compensation and even rangefinder focusing, I'd say XA is a P&S, and it's a certified drunk-ready camera.

[dave lackey]

Originally Posted by coelacanth

+1.

I have a designated "drunk camera" for drinking situations I know I can't trust myself with more "serious" cameras. My current drunk camera is XA. Although it has Aperture priority, +1.5 compensation and even rangefinder focusing, I'd say XA is a P&S, and it's a certified drunk-ready camera.

Sug, that is the best answer yet....certified drunk-ready camera! Or in my case, dumb-ass proof.

[dave lackey]

Originally Posted by Corto

"My first prerequisite for a NON-P&S is ease of use in manual modes."

Yeah, To a point I agree.
But while somewhat cumbersome I have shot a Nikon 995 manually for years.

Yeah, been having fun with the 995 and my business partner carried one everyday while I had the D2H...

I am finding it an interesting experience along with the 990. And the 5400.

[Aristophanes]

Originally Posted by dave lackey

Sug, that is the best answer yet....certified drunk-ready camera! Or in my case, dumb-ass proof.

Browsing Lomography photos, a lot of people appear to be drunk and using cheap, plastic manual something-or-other cameras.

Maybe not drunk enough?

[Gabriel M.A.]

Can we define what "define" means?

[Sparrow]

Originally Posted by coelacanth

+1.

I have a designated "drunk camera" for drinking situations I know I can't trust myself with more "serious" cameras. My current drunk camera is XA. Although it has Aperture priority, +1.5 compensation and even rangefinder focusing, I'd say XA is a P&S, and it's a certified drunk-ready camera.

... there we go

[pagpow]

Originally Posted by Gabriel M.A.

Can we define what "define" means?

Well, OK, I'll try, I think "define" means to ....

[dave lackey]

Originally Posted by Gabriel M.A.

Can we define what "define" means?

Easy...is an X100 a point and shoot? Is a Leica D Lux 5 a point and shoot? Is a Nikon 1 a point and shoot? Is a D4 a point and shoot?

If so or if not, why? Even this very forum is a category of point and shoot cameras but which ones are to be in this category?

[bugmenot]

I think of a "point and shoot" camera as any fixed lens camera that has an "auto" mode of some form. You point, perhaps compose, and shoot. Everything else is done for you. This applies whether it is digital or film. All other options are just that, options.

On this forum, the only "point and shoot" that due to some mysterious reason received its own forum is the X100.

[Terry Christian]

Originally Posted by Gabriel M.A.

Can we define what "define" means?

Comment est-ce qu'on dit define?

A point-and-shoot camera is a camera that has almost no user controls except to point it at a subject and to shoot -- except to perhaps focus and to set the flash. No aperture control, no shutter control, few exposure controls, and no capability to add filters, larger flash units, or other accessories.

[SausalitoDog]

Originally Posted by Terry Christian

Comment est-ce qu'on dit define?

A point-and-shoot camera is a camera that has almost no user controls except to point it at a subject and to shoot -- except to perhaps focus and to set the flash. No aperture control, no shutter control, few exposure controls, and no capability to add filters, larger flash units, or other accessories.

Add to that an observation that they generally have no viewfinder, relatively poor build and very small sensors...they might make great snapshots but leave you little room to crop and adjust for larger prints.

Clearly the lines are blurring but the concept remains - like pornography - something you usually "just know." :-)

[bugmenot]

Originally Posted by SausalitoDog

Add to that an observation that they generally have no viewfinder, relatively poor build and very small sensors...they might make great snapshots but leave you little room to crop and adjust for larger prints.

Clearly the lines are blurring but the concept remains - like pornography - something you usually "just know." :-)

That applies to digital point and shoots. Also a LCD is an electronic viewfinder.

[David Hughes]

HI,

I'll go along with just point and shoot, meaning no control over the things beyond that.

But most of them let you turn off the flash, so do any exist in reality?

Regards, David

PS No How are we defining reality comments please. This thread is running in a big enough loop already </;-)

[Bill Clark]

It depends who is working the camera.

[SausalitoDog]

Originally Posted by bugmenot

That applies to digital point and shoots. Also an LCD is an electronic viewfinder.

That's true about the viewfinder, but the concept that goes wrong with the LCD is that you hold the camera at arm's length and it is always going to be less stable (sharp) than if you held it against your forehead for stability, in my thoughts, one of the biggest advantages of the viewfinder :-)