Is a new EP-1 worth $150?

[Zonan]

Originally Posted by raid

Maybe having an AF lens fixed for the EPL-1 will take of focusing problems with manual lenses.

Raid,

Cameta has a factory demo Olypmus 17mm 2.8 for $219, if a 35mm FOV would be suitable.

Rick

[cosmonaut]

I never was thrilled with the EP-1. The controls are quirky and hard to use, easy to knock settings off and high ISO suffers, so I say no.

[Bingley]

Raid, if you can get a new E-PL1 for $150, buy it! I'll join Ted and Kuzano in saying that it's a great camera, and would be perfect as a back-up. It's compact and gives great jpegs with little need for postprocessing most of the time. I took the E-PL1 with me to Vienna and Salzburg last December, and it performed really well, indoors and out, with the Pany 20/1.7 lens.

I've never used the kit zoom that came w/ mine so I can't comment on that. (I'll lend you that lens if you want to for your Cairo trip, since I'm not using it -- pm me if you're interested). Instead, I use the Pany 20/1.7, the 14/2.5, and vintage Leica and Canon glass. Very happy with this set-up.

[raid]

Thank you Steve.

I should have gotten the Pany 20/1.7, but this is too late now.

[stewmander]

Thanks for some of the clarification guys, so to recap:

IQ is best on the EPL1, and all others after the EPL1 (EPL2, EPM1, EP3, EPL3) have lesser IQ and higher ISO capability instead, is this correct?

What about the AF? is the EPL1 AF slower than the others, or is AF dependent on the version of kit lens? I read that the MSC 14-42 ii lens had faster AF than the original 14-42, can anyone confirm/deny this?

I am also looking at the cameta camera deals, and was tempted by the EPL2, but then saw this thread/photo here

http://www.rangefinderforum.com/foru...light=superior

and thought a EPM1 would be even better - all the ability of the EP3 but about the size of an LX5...but if IQ peaked with the EPL1, thats the version to get since I am not looking for the absolute smallest rig here...

[ampguy]

A year or so ago, a Nikon product manager was interviewed and mentioned that a future high megapixel ff product might not have better high ISO performance than current products (D700?) but could have potentially very much higher resolution.

But a year or so ago, he couldn't have been aware of all the processing stuff that went or will go into D800s and future products. It's not inconceivable that future cameras will just be computers with a sensor in them, running photoshop in them along with office, google maps, etc., and a big fan on the cpu ...

Originally Posted by kuzano

I suspect many other advances in digital have suffered for the race for high ISO. When I shot film, i rarely shot over 400, and I find that on digital, even on indoor shots (family and that) I rarely crank the ISO up to 800.

If I wanted grain (noise), I'd go back to film and shoot 1600 pushed to 3200 so there would be no likelihood of recognizing any artist/musician in the photos.

And when I go to a concert, I'm there for the music and the experience. I am not going to let a camera hamper my dancing with the crowd.

[Al Patterson]

It took me a quick search, but I do see the EPL-1 and lens for $199, but Out of Stock. If I were working, I'd junp on the $149 body only, and use the Summicron-C 40 as the lens.

[raid]

I just bought from cameta camera for $199 a black set of EPL-1 plus 14mm-42mm.
When it says "outdated", it is not really outdated. They have multiple online outlets, and they simple move things around. I chose the factory demo with a one year warranty.

ItemItem NameQty.Price Ea.Ext. Price
1Olympus PEN E-PL1 Micro 4/3 Digital Camera & 14-42mm Lens (Black/Black) - Factory Demo includes Full 1 Year Warranty [262856A]
1$199.95$199.95
Subtotal$199.95
Shipping Cost for FedEx Home/Ground$0.00

Sales Tax$0.00
Total$199.95

[raid]

Originally Posted by Al Patterson

It took me a quick search, but I do see the EPL-1 and lens for $199, but Out of Stock. If I were working, I'd junp on the $149 body only, and use the Summicron-C 40 as the lens.

Al,
The 40mm Summicron-C jumps out as being a great match on the EP-2, with lots of sharpness. It is then a lens with 60mm perspective.

I have the "OK" 17mm/2.8 lens as my moderately wide angle lens, and then I can use the 40mm lens as the long normal lens. The Zeiss 85mm/1.4 is a killer tele lens on the EP-2. Now I can use the EPL-1 with the EP-2.

[rparmar]

Originally Posted by stewmander

IQ is best on the EPL1, and all others after the EPL1 (EPL2, EPM1, EP3, EPL3) have lesser IQ and higher ISO capability instead, is this correct?

No, I don't think so. My understanding, derived from a great deal of reading at the various MFT sites, plus ownership of three different Olympus PEN models, is that the weak AA filter was carried forward into all future models as well. At least, this is the consensus of those intimately familiar with MFT.

I've performed my own IQ comparison test between the E-P2 and the E-PL2. The latter clearly shows the effects of the weaker AA. The difference between the original stronger AA models and the later weaker AA models is small but significant. The difference between models which have a weak AA would be minuscule indeed.

Originally Posted by stewmander

What about the AF? is the EPL1 AF slower than the others, or is AF dependent on the version of kit lens? I read that the MSC 14-42 ii lens had faster AF than the original 14-42, can anyone confirm/deny this?

AF depends on the specific lens and the camera body, but the most important factor is the lens. For example, the Panasonic 20mm is slow compared to the silent and blindingly fast Panasonic 14mm. Yes, the revised kit zoom is supposed to be faster (and quieter) than the original. Though I own both, I can't be bothered to use a zoom and so I can't confirm this first-hand.

I have written up an Overview of the Olympus PEN range, since it is surely confusing! If you want the fastest AF, most responsive camera, best burst rate, etc. then you should target the E-PM1 or E-PL3. (The E-P3 has most but not all of the same advantages. It has always seemed over-priced to me.)

Originally Posted by stewmander

a EPM1 would be even better - all the ability of the EP3 but about the size of an LX5...but if IQ peaked with the EPL1, thats the version to get since I am not looking for the absolute smallest rig here...

The E-PL1 has several disadvantages compared to other PEN models. It is limited to 1/2000 shutter, cannot use a wired shutter release, and has a rather poor plastic build. Instead consider the E-PL2, which can also be obtained inexpensively. It has none of those drawbacks, plus gives you twice the LCD resolution and a sizeable grip (that's a big deal to me).

The E-PM1 is another animal entirely; the ergonomics are much more like a point'n'shoot. Many would consider the size, lack of controls, lack of grip, and overall form factor as negative factors.

[rparmar]

I see my message is now out-dated. I am a long-time lurker who joined up specifically to reply to you. It took me a while to get approved, hence the tardy response due to a stale browser page. Sorry about that!

[raid]

Thanks for taking the time, and it is OK that I spent $199 on the EPL-1. I will use it with the AF lens, so I don't need high resolution LCD screen. I get your points. Oh well ...

[dfatty]

Originally Posted by rparmar

No, I don't think so. My understanding, derived from a great deal of reading at the various MFT sites, plus ownership of three different Olympus PEN models, is that the weak AA filter was carried forward into all future models as well.

Good info, thanks. Just to clarify, you mean the weak AA filter was carried forward into future "E-PLx" models (not "all" other future models), correct? That would seem to be the case based on your comparison between the E-PL2 and E-P2.

[rparmar]

No, I mean the other thing: all future models have the weaker AA filter. Only the E-P1 and E-P2 didn't. While I don't have enough cameras to test this myself (ha!), those that own them state this to be true. Basically, the sensor and pipeline remained mostly unchanged from the E-PL1 right through to the E-P3.

[krackmonkey]

Originally Posted by raid

Al,
The 40mm Summicron-C jumps out as being a great match on the EP-2, with lots of sharpness. It is then a lens with 60mm perspective.

Actually you need to keep in mind it's a full 2x crop factor, so the 40mm 'cron becomes an 80mm.

I wish it was only 1.5x, I'd looooooooove my already amazing 1.4 DG Summilux to be a 35-37mm focal length lens. I mean, it's a FANTASTIC 50, but as a 35-ish, it would be truly unmatched.

[dfatty]

Originally Posted by rparmar

No, I mean the other thing: all future models have the weaker AA filter. Only the E-P1 and E-P2 didn't. While I don't have enough cameras to test this myself (ha!), those that own them state this to be true. Basically, the sensor and pipeline remained mostly unchanged from the E-PL1 right through to the E-P3.

Oh, okay, thanks for clearing that up! I could definitely see a difference in the comparison you posted above.

[raid]

Originally Posted by krackmonkey

Actually you need to keep in mind it's a full 2x crop factor, so the 40mm 'cron becomes an 80mm.

I wish it was only 1.5x, I'd looooooooove my already amazing 1.4 DG Summilux to be a 35-37mm focal length lens. I mean, it's a FANTASTIC 50, but as a 35-ish, it would be truly unmatched.

Of course! That was an error. The 40mm lens beomes like an 80mm lens. This is correct. The DOF is like that of a 40mm lens.

[gavinlg]

$150 for a brand new e-p1? I'd buy it.
They're a very good little camera.

[raid]

I favored a factory reurbished camer with one year warranty and. Lens.

[Thardy]

Originally Posted by raid

I just bought from cameta camera for $199 a black set of EPL-1 plus 14mm-42mm.
When it says "outdated", it is not really outdated. They have multiple online outlets, and they simple move things around. I chose the factory demo with a one year warranty.

ItemItem NameQty.Price Ea.Ext. Price
1Olympus PEN E-PL1 Micro 4/3 Digital Camera & 14-42mm Lens (Black/Black) - Factory Demo includes Full 1 Year Warranty [262856A]
1$199.95$199.95
Subtotal$199.95
Shipping Cost for FedEx Home/Ground$0.00

Sales Tax$0.00
Total$199.95

Hi Raid, where did you look to get your EPL-1 kit? BTW, congratulations.

[raid]

Hi Thomas,
Cameta Cameta sells online. Go to their store directly to get zero tax and zero shipping.

Thanks.

[Dave Jenkins]

I bought the E-PL1 almost two years ago, and while I hate the menu system, I love the photos I get from the camera.

If you like, click on the link to the Blurb online version of my book Georgia: A Backroads Portrait in the links below. Most of the photos in the book were made before I got my E-PL1, but the wedding photo on page 25 was made with that camera. The mill on page 46 was chosen over a 5D shot of the same scene, and the tree on page 127 was picked over a Rolleicord Vb shot. The full-page photos are 12x12 in the book.

All of these were made with the original version of the kit zoom. I think most photographers will find the AF fast enough for just about anything except sports and maybe small children at play.

At $150 for a body, the E-PL1 represents just about the most picture-taking potential for the least money of any camera I know of.

I must confess, though, that I'm not going to get another one. I'm saving up for an OM-D, probably with the 12-50 zoom

[Thardy]

Originally Posted by raid

Hi Thomas,
Cameta Cameta sells online. Go totnrir store directly to get zero tax and zero shipping.

Thanks.

I'm getting "out of stock" messages on all of the low priced factory demos. I was looking for the EPL2 for $279. I do see one for $349 though. I think your EPL-1 w lens is "out of stock" now too. Oh well.

[raid]

Originally Posted by Thardy

I'm getting "out of stock" messages on all of the low priced factory demos. I was looking for the EPL2 for $279. I do see one for $349 though. I think your EPL-1 w lens is "out of stock" now too. Oh well.

I emailed them about the "out of stock", and they replied that I should call them. They have multiple online outlets. I told them that they have in stock the camera and they have in stock the lens, but the set was out of stock. It took 3 minutes to buy the set.

[Thardy]

Originally Posted by Dave Jenkins

I bought the E-PL1 almost two years ago, and while I hate the menu system, I love the photos I get from the camera.

If you like, click on the link to the Blurb online version of my book Georgia: A Backroads Portrait in the links below. Most of the photos in the book were made before I got my E-PL1, but the wedding photo on page 25 was made with that camera. The mill on page 46 was chosen over a 5D shot of the same scene, and the tree on page 127 was picked over a Rolleicord Vb shot. The full-page photos are 12x12 in the book.

All of these were made with the original version of the kit zoom. I think most photographers will find the AF fast enough for just about anything except sports and maybe small children at play.

At $150 for a body, the E-PL1 represents just about the most picture-taking potential for the least money of any camera I know of.

I must confess, though, that I'm not going to get another one. I'm saving up for an OM-D, probably with the 12-50 zoom

The photos in that book are very nice. I see scenes like that all the time while driving back roads and fail to pull over and photograph them, though you make them look much better than what I see.

Did you have those Rock City barns in Georgia? I see them less frequently today.